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Anonymous
1:23 PM
I didn't get the Google phone call yesterday... Here's hoping I get it today, before I lose the little sanity I have left after this 2-month-long interview process.
 
Nothing like waiting by the phone :/
Hmm. Today's xkcd looks an awful lot like Automation...
 
Anonymous
It's a common problem for us programmers :P
 
Anonymous
My cat is begging me to go in the living room and play video games so that she can cuddle with me, instead of working in the office
 
Did @Dennis just @ himself? o_O
 
@Mego Ha, my dog likes to do the same.
 
1:31 PM
My cat isn't a lap cat yet.
 
Anonymous
It's good that you acknowledge that all-important "yet"
 
Anonymous
The fate of all cats is to become lap cats
 
afaik a newline is considered to be whitespace, I found your description confusing at first — Florian Castellane 37 mins ago
 
Anonymous
My mom has a 22-pound tabby cat that you would think is half-jaguar based on his size. He tries to be a lap cat.
 
Is this really a problem? Should I edit?
 
Anonymous
1:34 PM
Nah
 
It's the "I love you" challenge...
 
The output makes it pretty clear that the whitespace in question is a space char
 
Anonymous
Newlines are technically whitespace, but it's immediately clear to most reasonable people that you mean the spaces between the bits
 
Might as well edit for better clarity if you only intend spaces, because there's always a chance that someone might see newlines as golfier in a language
 
They won't get the required output with newlines though :) Still, doesn't hurt to clarify
 
1:37 PM
@Yodle yes
@betseg like me
 
@Mego i hope that 2 months was more than just phone interviews...
 
@Mego A friend's parents had a malamute several years ago that insisted on being a lap dog. Super fluffy and absolutely sweet, but 150lbs is not a lap dog.
 
Anonymous
@Poke 1 invitiation to foobar, 3 levels of foobar challenges, 1 phone call with the recruiter, 1 phone interview, 1 trip to California for 5 interviews, and 1 trip to Austin for 2 more interviews.
 
@Sp3000 Edited...
 
@Mego So pretty lax then. Got it.
 
1:39 PM
@Mego You only finished the tree mandatory foobar levels? o_o
 
Anonymous
If you call that lax... The whole interview process kicked off because Google decided I was a good programmer based off of my search history.
 
Was yolk. Personally I think seven in-person interviews is a bit pretentious, even for Google.
 
That seems overly intense :\ For my current job after everything was said and done there was 1 phone interview and 1 on-site interview
and i heard back within a week
 
Oh, did you get that popup or whatever while searching
 
@Yodle Yes.
 
Anonymous
1:41 PM
Well the first 5 interviews were standard for Google. The extra 2 interviews in Austin were because I was going to be working in Austin and thus needed to interview with that team, but the Austin office isn't equipped to do full 5-round interviews.
 
@Mego That's not creepy in the slightest.
 
Anonymous
@Yodle Yep
 
Anonymous
I still have yet to do levels 4 and 5
 
Anonymous
Maybe doing those will shorten the time needed to get a phone call :P
 
s/5/5 and 6/
 
1:42 PM
well good luck. the fact that you're interviewing with individual teams is probably a good sign
 
Ha, I can just see the hiring manager watching a feed, just waiting for you to complete the later levels before calling.
 
yesterday, by Fatalize
What if he doesn't get a call?
 
that would reflect poorly on google
they should at least tell you "no"
honestly after 2 months you could even reach out to them
 
Anonymous
I've been in constant communication with them during this whole process
 
gotcha
 
Anonymous
1:45 PM
I last talked to my recruiter on Friday
 
ah ok, that's reasonable i guess
 
Anonymous
They will tell me either yes or no - I just don't know when to expect the answer other than "this week". On Friday, the recruiter said it would probably be Monday or Tuesday. It's Wednesday, so if I don't hear anything towards the end of the day, I'm going to call my recruiter again.
 
Wohoo... Gold badge in ... If only my 877 question points counted...
 
Anonymous
Heh, I have 873/1000 of the answer points needed for code-gold
 
916/1000 but I still need 25 answers…
 
Anonymous
1:50 PM
I'd easily have the badge if question scores counted
 
I need 4 rep for bronze badge
 
Anonymous
I swear, half of my life is trying to keep my cat from attacking things she shouldn't...
 
solution: just let her
 
@Mego are you expecting one? Password reset or something?
 
Anonymous
@AshwinGupta Something like that...
 
1:57 PM
@Mego s/cat/dog/; s/she/he/
;_;
 
@Mego job confirmation?
 
I interviewed for a position at NASA, then couldn't get a response back from them for more than a month... then once they called me, they wanted me to start later that week.
patience and perseverance....
 
I've got an open job offer at the company I interned at over the summer, kinda the opposite boat. They're waiting for me since I'm at a different company now and have one more semester of school left.
 
Anonymous
I've been underemployed for the better part of a year... I'm familiar with patience and perseverance :P
 
Anonymous
@Yodle I would never in a million years go back to the company where I worked during college. They did so many things wrong with their development processes, you'd think they had a checklist of bad practices.
 
2:03 PM
Ah, I've enjoyed both the places I've been
 
Depending on what you're expecting you're going to see that in a lot of places
Industry is never like school
probably shouldn't use an absolute
but you get it
 
And I'm here still don't know if I want to study computing or astronomy.
 
find something that incorporates both?
 
Anonymous
@Poke There's a difference between "idealistic is not realistic" and "this company is only still afloat because of panic-driven development"
 
Astrophysics really interested me, but was a lot more mathy than computer science which I also was interested in.
 
2:05 PM
@Mego ha, yes that's true
 
@Poke programming rovers?
@Yodle i love maths
 
rovers makes a heck of a lot more sense than rivers >.<
i was reading your message like.... "wut"
 
That didn't happen.
 
oh of course
 
I totally wrote rovers.
 
2:06 PM
but if you had typed rivers
i would have been stumped
 
I don't dislike math, but some of the trig/calc stuff later on started to confuse me. I got all A's up until trig in highschool, went downhill from there despite being introduced to it in like 6th grade by an awesome teacher.
 
Anonymous
Their order entry program is a conglomeration of code written over the past 40 years that nobody really knows how it works anymore. If something goes wrong, it takes weeks to find the issue and resolve it at best. At worst, it's ignored and they hope the company doesn't suffer too much.
 
Nope, i love all kinds of maths.
 
@Yodle try approaching it from the physics side of things; it might help since you get into a lot of the same stuff but from a different perspective
 
Anonymous
80k lines of legacy code (Alpha BASIC) that somehow form a cohesive, somewhat-functioning program
 
2:07 PM
wowsers
 
wow
 
Wow, Alpha basic? That's some serious legacy right there.
 
@Poke I could've done that, but you convinced me to take chemistry, remember? :P
 
Anonymous
It's disgusting
 
that's because the physics track was not fun
and the chem professor was a boss
although you didn't get her :|
 
Anonymous
2:09 PM
For the entire 2 years I was there, there was constant talk about upgrading order entry to a modern (VB.NET) code base. According to one of the more senior devs there, that talk has been around for about 10 years, with no progress being made because nobody actually understands all of the business logic in the legacy program well enough to re-write it in modern code.
 
Honestly, I'm surprised that anything old enough to run AlphaBASIC has the memory to run 80k lines of code ... hah.
 
@Mego no one at the company knows/has tried to learn alpha basic?
 
Anonymous
@TimmyD It was running on a CentOS server under a AS600 VM that was somehow able to have 64 GB of memory.
 
Woot
 
in 10 years someone should have owned the project and taught other people
what do they do at work when no one understands the codebase
 
2:11 PM
Maybe nobody was a programming and a businessman so nobody could understand how they worked together
 
Anonymous
@Poke Oh no, people knew it. It's not hard to learn. But deciphering the poorly-written code (from across 4 decades) was impossible. It was the Gordian knot of programming.
 
that's really sad
 
Anonymous
@Poke That's the key problem: nobody was able to step up and take charge of cleaning up the code base because everybody was too busy constantly putting out fires.
 
@Mego Maybe that's why they wanted to hire you :P
 
a quick licensing question
 
2:12 PM
-1 not quick enough
3
 
if I use a commercial product, A, which uses another product, B, which is under CC attribution 3.0 .
 
Anonymous
@Yodle I was just there as a part-time dev during college. They said they would be open to considering hiring me full-time after I graduated, but I had no desire to stay in that town, much less that company.
 
and product A is attributing product B on their website and all.
do I also need to attribute B in my product?
 
@Mego it's a real shame, though. explains modern emphasis of documentation in school (though it still doesn't happen as much as it should)
 
@Geobits quick part was for answer. which people are failing to anyways.
 
2:14 PM
I try to document everything I write as I'm writing it, or if not then when I'm done with certain parts.
 
Anonymous
@Optimizer As long as the attribution notice from A to B is somewhere in the project, and you properly attribute A, it should be fine. You don't need to directly attribute B, because your project already attributes B via attributing A.
 
@Optimizer I don't think you need to, but...
 
@Optimizer going off of nothing tangible i would say no
 
@Mego what if A's license requires no attribution as its commercial ?
 
I don't think "A" can do that >.>
 
2:15 PM
and CCA3.0 allows commercial usage of its products (use it however clause)
 
Is there any reason not to attribute, just to be on the safe side?
 
The way I see it, most game engines, frameworks, etc all use something that should be attributed somewhere. They take care of the attribution for that, and you just make sure you attribute what you're using.
 
we are not open source.
 
Anonymous
@Optimizer Pretty sure that's a licensing problem then, because if you use A (which uses B) without attribution, you're not giving attribution to B, which is required by CC-BY-SA 3.0.
 
That's a problem for A though, not you imo.
 
2:16 PM
@Optimizer rms disapproves
 
@Mego ok, lets say we attribute A. But people wont be able to see.
 
Anonymous
If you give attribution to A, then you are also (indirectly) attributing B
 
but how will anyone know we give attribution?
 
Anonymous
@Optimizer The attribution notice should be publicly visible.
 
Anonymous
Include it in your licensing terms
 
2:17 PM
Yeah, attribution hidden in source isn't really attribution >_>
 
but A's license says we are fine unless we do not change their product.
A in question is MaxMind.
B is Geonames
 
Anonymous
I would still publicly attribute A just to be on the safe side. You don't lose anything by attributing it, and you CYA.
 
In my mind A should be a black box. You shouldn't have to know what they use and they could even change what they use in a future update
Your stuff should not rely on what A uses
 
yeah, and if A does not have attribution based license, then we are good to not attribute, right ?
 
Anonymous
2:19 PM
@Poke That's how it should be, ideally, but legally it's a bit murky.
 
> You have the right to modify the Named MaxMind Products and redistribute the software with the changes; however, any such changes must be relayed back to MaxMind, and copyright in them assigned to MaxMind.
 
Anonymous
The best option is always to CYA - attribute anything you use.
 
I thought CC was a viral license?
 
@Mego so how many levels deep? do you attribute 1000+ authors in your node based application?
@Geobits "only if u modify their product or brand"
 
Morning everyone :) hows it going?
 
2:20 PM
Yeah... still an odd clause to my mind.
 
Anonymous
@Optimizer If you use A, and A uses B, you don't need to attribute B, because you don't use B (A does, and should attribute B). Just attribute A.
 
> b.Each time You distribute or publicly digitally perform a Derivative Work, Licensor offers to the recipient a license to the original Work on the same terms and conditions as the license granted to You under this License.
 
but then again, A's license is closed and commercial
@TimmyD i cannot english
 
That's from which CC version?
 
@Geobits CC-BY 3.0 US
 
Anonymous
2:22 PM
@TimmyD All that means is, since A distributes B, even if they distributed it under a different license, they are legally required to also include B under CC-BY-SA 3.0. It has nothing to do with the licensing terms of A.
 
but what does that mean in my context. that's what's hard to understand
@Mego so A is already doing that in this case..
 
@Optimizer yup, pretty quick.
 
@Mego Right, but if you take A and use it to create Z, you need to provide attribution to B
Because you received B under the same licensing that A did
 
If you're distributing A along with Z, then B is already covered within A's distribution.
And if you're not distributing A, then you're not distributing B either.
 
Anonymous
@TimmyD Hmm... That is reasonable, I think. This is a good question for Zizouz's legion over at opensource.stackexchange.com
 
2:24 PM
distributing - no. providing services based on the product - yes.
so i guess that is distributing anyways.
i'll ask on opensource..
 
@Optimizer Link it back here when you do. I'd be curious to follow it and see what others think.
 
sure. doubly linked question
 
Anonymous
The main issue here is that someone decided to use CC-BY for code instead of a software license like MIT :P
 
You don't stand on a street corner and sing Python code to random passers-by?
 
@TimmyD I prefer to just spit some dank binary
 
Anonymous
2:31 PM
@TimmyD Only once. I got lots of funny looks, and one person was certain that itertools was an insult.
 
01100100 01100001 01101110 01101011
 
dank
 
Singing python always trips me up when I get to the "x if y else z" verses.
 
Anonymous
Psh, y and x or z is better
 
Singing in python would probably be one of the easier languages to understand what someone was saying
 
Anonymous
2:32 PM
Or [z,x][y]
 
imagine singing in Jelly or something
 
my favorite part of singing python is the fact that you lose scoping definitions
yay pythonnnnnnnnn
 
not if you say tab a lot
 
No, tabs are the guitar strums
 
0
Q: Multi level license attribution problem

OptimizerConsider a scenario with three products. X, A and B. X belongs to my company and is not open source. A is also not open source, but they have free version and paid version with different licenses. B is under CC by 3.0 US A uses B, and thus, it has to attribute B, which they do on their website...

 
2:33 PM
pshaw python style guide is to use spaces and not tabs iirc
 
pshaw style guide
 
Nice
 
@TimmyD print football_march
 
Anonymous
That's what I imagine Jelly to sound like
 
2:34 PM
Much too long though :P
 
print "moment of truth"
 
diva langusomethingna?
that movie is fantastic. if you haven't seen it cough @Yodle cough, you should
 
Either way, singing python or jelly still beats yelling Ook! at strangers.
2
 
No one? Tabs? Guitar strums? Bah.
 
Anonymous
Diva Plavalaguna
 
2:36 PM
close enough
 
@TimmyD I use tabs more for lead/solo parts, so I didn't even catch that :P
 
@TimmyD I was riled up on tabs versus spaces but i got the joke :[
 
Anonymous
For rhythm parts, tabs are unnecessary. Just chord names and durations/timing :P
 
@mınxomaτ thanks for help with DO yesterday, I think I got most of my files and stuff sorted out :D
 
wrong button
 
2:52 PM
Heyyyy I got my first answer on my question.
 
@Downgoat Have you done any benchmarks of Cheddar yet?
Also is there a way to easily use V8 snapshots with Node
 
3:15 PM
I feel like stuff always seems to go down in this chat room while I'm away.
3
 
@quartata no benchmarks yet. It'll take me some time to make a benchmark engine (not too long but long enough I can't do it in an hour).
@quartata no idea
Seems like you could with node gyp
 
3:31 PM
were chat bans given out?
 
Anonymous
Woohoo, just found a way to shave off a byte on my binary heart solution :)
 
Anonymous
There are few greater pleasures in programming than finding a clever way to remove a single byte
 
I like refactoring :)
 
I like typing messy code and then let eclipse format it all. Its awkwardly pleasant
 
I can one up that: I like letting PHPStorm reformat :)
 
3:37 PM
The phrase I was looking for is "oddly satisfying"
 
They're really stretching the definition of Puzzle recently o_O
 
@PhiNotPi I get that feeling often as well.
 
@HelkaHomba the Üs in my surname should be pronounced like en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Close_front_rounded_vowel.ogg
 
@Geobits CMC calculate fractal dimension
 
3:49 PM
I think I know what you're asking, but it would take a googling to be sure :P
 
hey webdevelopers: how would you identify what javascript script is causing a redirect?
 
@PhiNotPi Since 0 and 1 dimensional fractals are boring, and I don't ascribe to string theory (yet), this is obviously only of dimensions 2, 3, or 4. ;-)
@NathanMerrill Noscript and allow them one at a time?
 
@TimmyD lol, there's a gazillion of them, and not allowing one of them may break a different one
 
Oh.
 
I don't actually know how the scripts interact, as I didn't write them
I think I found it actually: "window.addEventListener("beforeunload", function() { debugger; }, false)"
 
Anonymous
3:54 PM
For giggles, I added the manually-compiled Python 3 version of my Actually code to my binary heart solution
 
bah, it doesn't provide the stack trace
I have no idea who's calling it
 
Hmm. Well, it's tedious, but could you just run a search through the scripts for common redirect "keywords"?
 
yeah, I may have to. The biggest problem is that the redirection is happening to the same url, so I can't search for a portion of the url
 
4:11 PM
Unfortunately this will get closed before I can come up with an underhanded homework-ready solution...
-3
Q: java code for playing in words order

frankwould like to add four words system.in.println after adding these four words need the program give me diffrent order for thse four words system.out.println first word , second word , third word , fourth word // first line third word, and fourth word // second line and repeat the two line one m...

 
@NathanMerrill How do you know that you are being redirected?
And how do you know that you are being redirected in JavaScript?
 
I don't actually know its Javascript, but I'm pretty sure it is
Like, I hit a page, and after 4 or 5 seconds I get redirected
but on the second time I hit the page, its no longer valid
so I don't get redirected again
 
You could be getting redirected on the server
 
why would that happen after the page is already loaded, and after a delayed period of time?
better question, how would that happen?
 
You can set a timeout in JavaScript, and you can cause a post in JavaScript. Therefore you can cause a post after a few seconds.
 
4:20 PM
@PhiNotPi I'm gonna go with log(3)/log(2) + log(2)/log(4) = log(3)/log(2) + 1/2. Three copies scaled down by a factor of two, and two copies scaled down by a factor of four.
 
oh, you're saying that JS is starting the query, but that the redirect command is coming from the server
yeah, its possible
 
I don't actually know for sure though. Just an educated guess.
 
onLoad() {
whateverTheFunctionIsThatWaits(clickAButtonThatCausesAPostback, 5000 milliseconds);
}
 
that said, I've managed to stop the redirect call, and I have it open in chrome dev tools. Is it possible for me to see if it was a server redirect or not?
 
-6
Q: java code for playing in words order

frankwould like to add four words system.in.println after adding these four words need the program give me diffrent order for thse four words system.out.println first word , second word , third word , fourth word // first line third word, and fourth word // second line and repeat the two line one m...

 
4:26 PM
@El'endiaStarman yeah I was wondering about the way to combine copies that are scaled by different amounts, although intuition tells be that it has a dimension greater than the Sierpinski triangle (log(3)/log(2)) but less than 2 (a normal square).
 
Wat. Get-MailPublicFolder "foo" results in error Foo is not a mail-enabled Public Folder. ... Get-MailPublicFolder -ResultSize Unlimited | Where-Object{$_.Name-like"*foo*"} returns the result ...
 
@PhiNotPi (Sorry for the extra ping, realized that I had a - where I needed a +.)
 
lol, you pinged him again about an extra ping?
 
@NathanMerrill >_> ....yes.
 
4:31 PM
@PhiNotPi Hmm, shoot, log(3)/log(2) + 1/2 seems to be greater than 2. To be more precise, it's just a bit less than 2.085.
 
@Optimizer it appears quite apparent that they were aiming for the black
oh, lol, I get it
 
@NathanMerrill yes. that's not the tricky part
 
I thought you were implying that police have terrible aim
-.-
 
the aim is perfect
actually
uniformly distributed. no partiality or biasness.
 
maybe.
 
5:15 PM
@Downgoat Hm. I'm wondering if serializing the CST will speed anything up when you run it a second time
Obviously JSON serializing wouldn't help but something like a dumped core (would be the fastest but least portable) or protobuf (a little slower but portable) could do it
I'm assuming that startup (which can be fixed with V8 snapshots) and parsing (which can be fixed by parsing ahead of time) are the slowest
 
5:26 PM
@NathanMerrill could be a meta refresh
 
Some of the points in this video just messed with my mind. Like the fact that no matter how hard or thoroughly you stir your <insert favorite drink here>, there will always be some point that ends up at the same place it started in. Or that there's an infinity so large that it is the number of infinities smaller than it.
 
Python's regex engine is really painfully stupid.
 
@El'endiaStarman What if I stir it so vigorously that all of it ends up on the floor?
 
@PhiNotPi Then you've violated the condition that it remain in the original bounded space. :P
 
5:42 PM
...but even if you don't stir it, none of it will be in the same place it started in - we are on a planet moving around a star moving around a galaxy, moving around...
 
Well, obviously, the movement of the space is not considered.
 
@Poke I doubt that, based on how the page is supposed to work, but I didn't even realize that was a thing, so thanks!
@El'endiaStarman Its the 1 infinity. There's only 1 infinity smaller than it, the 0 infinity
 
@NathanMerrill No, because the 1 infinity is infinite.
 
Just like Immovable Rods in D&D -- they're fixed relative to the three-dimensional space around them.
Great fun is to give one to the party, but don't let them know it's fixed-fixed, and watch them panic as it quickly whizzes past and starts burying itself through the floor.
 
Has anyone here worked with the Java Persistence API?
 
5:57 PM
@TimmyD lol. The random crap you can do in D&D always makes me laugh
Like that one greentext about the bear
 
Sir Bearington
 
(Sorry for mobile link)
 
the problem with feats
Although I suppose in this case it turned into something funny
 
Too bad the game itself isn't that fun. I tried playing it once, and it was miserable.
 
It's only as fun as a) the group you're with, and b) the GM you've got running the show.
 
6:05 PM
That was probably the problem then. I was playing with a bunch of meat-heads that didn't listen to the (very new) GM.
 
Looking up Microsoft documentation ... find the property I'm curious about ...
 
@TimmyD It's a thing with Java, not Dandy.
 
> isValid | Gets a value that indicates whether the object is valid.
Gee, thanks Microsoft. :-/
@zyabin101 What?
 
You said something about DnD, where I only saw quartata ask a problem about Java.
To whom exactly did you reply? :/
 
What are you even talking about?
 
6:17 PM
@zyabin101 I've been conversing with DJMcMayhem.
Do you have them ignored?
 
PowerShellAssemblyLoadContextInitializer.InitializeAndCallEntryMethod()
Ms is verbose
 
Yes
 
@TimmyD Seems like. :/
Uh oh.
 
That truly deeply hurts.
I'm gonna go cry into a bowl of ice cream now
 
@DJMcMayhem Pistachio? That seems to be the go-to flavor around here.
 
6:22 PM
Nope. Chocolate and peanut butter.
Sadly I don't actually have any ice cream right now.
 
Peanut butter flavored ice cream? The future is here mate.
@DJMcMayhem :(
 
Peanut butter flavored ice cream has been around a while.
At least here in the States.
 
7:14 PM
I'm so much tempted to fill this silence somehow, but I might be hated for.
 
Hey @Mego, did the p bug get fixed yet?
 
@Sherlock9 That's a funny bug.
 
How so?
 
Like, (I can't understand how it could determine that 25 is prime) funny ... "funny" as in "odd", not "comedic"
 
Ah. After looking at the recent commits Mego made, it seems to be an off by one error with the ranges.
And the bug seems to be fixed, so Dennis just needs to pull Actually
 
7:29 PM
From chat history, looks like the 20th was the last request
 
The commits on prime function bugs here and here were on the 25th
 
> Actually, Dennis just needs to pull
Is that Yoda speak, or not? I can't tell with the name
 
Actually, needs to pull, Dennis does.
MmmHhhmmmmMmmmm
 
@zyabin101 Yeah, it's really not necessary to fill silence. Silence is nice sometimes.
 
Also, @Dennis ^^^, because we haven't actually pinged him yet, so he'll have no idea.
 
7:43 PM
@DJMcMayhem I hope you were kidding
Tears don't go good with ice cream
 
Maybe that's how they get the salt in salted caramel.
 
Ooh, that would be a great way to get someone off salted caramel. Just tell them the salt comes from the tears of third-world children
Thanks
 
No problem, it's what I do.
 
Delicious, delicious tears.
 
Yeah, I didn't figure it would work on everyone...
Every now and then I feel bad about a comment, but I'm on the fence with this one:
This doesn't seem answerable in a concrete way. In what unit do you measure "power"? I mean, you could use watts, but I don't think that's what you're going for, and even that would have to be a rough estimation. — Geobits 47 secs ago
 
7:52 PM
@Geobits Oooh, that may be hertzful...
 
I could have amped it up a little, but...
 
To be honest, I think your comment is fine as it currently is.
 
Thanks. It's good to know it's not too shocking.
 
Obviously they would be on the low-end wattage-wise...
 
Hey guys, I've been inactive for a while, but I've looked some recent questions and it looks like things are going well. I just have one question:
Have we graduated yet?
 
7:59 PM
Kinda. Depends on who you ask ;)
 
! It's Eridan!
 
@ANerd-I Yes.
 

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