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12:03 AM
@Shads0 The bits weren't the right bits to get you the other bits.
oh wait no, just gotta wait for the day to end :)
It's late, brain is fried. If I have a question for spawning a chroot'd shell from Expect, that's over in StackOverflow, right?
@AdrianK Nah, wordpress.stackexchange.com would be your best bet.
@WesleyDavid Perhaps I'm missing something, but what would PHP folks know about Tcl and Expect?
12:12 AM
Ah. Yeah. We've had a couple Drupal coders around here. They're thankfully a fair bit better.
Meh. Under-caffeinated and over-sober is no way to go through life. Time to call it a day. This PITA jail script can wait until tomorrow.
3 hours later…
3:22 AM
Apr 21 at 17:21, by Holocryptic
I like how girls locker rooms smell. It's pretty.
4:05 AM
@ChrisS . . . gigglesnort . . . stars
4:18 AM
haha, but it's so true
Ah the wonders of everything being perfectly preserved for posterity.
Indeed. Strangely enough, I'm not really embarrassed by most of it.
4:31 AM
@Holocryptic I'm just wondering what kind of research you've done on this?
@Holocryptic Except that one time you confessed to giving your neighbor's dog mononucleosis.
I said most motherfucker
@WesleyDavid The bitch was asking for it
4:48 AM
Anyone remember Sifl and Olly? en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Sifl_and_Olly_Show
Those were the days.
Nope. But I'd bet that @pauska does
Off to bed now
3 hours later…
7:46 AM
Hi @KennyRasschaert
8:20 AM
8:48 AM
I need a really good RSS reader for all of the blogs that I'm trying to follow if anyone has any suggestions today
Sorry, Win 7
Or web based if it'll e-mail me or something
Not overly impressed with Google Reader
No idea then :)
Haha, no probs
Problem is, RSS is probably on the way out - but there's still a few blogs that don't have real subscriptions
9:04 AM
I can tell RSS is on the way out - one of my managers asked me about implementing it on something here.
it's true. And they get angry when I talk about using twitter & social media.
@Dan I wrote one myself, I was so disillusioned with all the others out there
Don't know if it falls into your criteria of "Really good"
I find it useful though
Well, given that everything else has set the bar so terribly low - I reckon it's worth a shot :D
9:16 AM
Hey guys. I
Is this a general chat for all stack sites_
No - this is ServerFault
@Dan - be interested in what you think. Expect bugs, and general weirdness. Also, potential UX fail.
I'm really selling it here.
@EmilS I don't think there IS a chat for all the sites, except possibly "Tavern on the Meta" (chat.meta.stackoverflow.com). Each area has their own rooms.
Ah I see. Found a very inactive room for the web masters exchange
Yeah there are different levels of activity from one room to another and some rooms are more active at certain times of the day too
9:22 AM
Since you are server guys. What do you think I should look for when trying to determine if a web hosting/cloud hosting is reliable? It's so easy to choose Amazon or Rackspace since they are the big players... but there are a lot of smaller "clouds"
This is NOT a place for 'Live Support', ask questions on the main site.
It's more of a discussion than a question
That's actually not bad. I'll be honest and say it's not *quite* what I'm looking for as, ideally, I want notifications when new stuff comes in (I don't watch super active blogs) but in lieu of an alternative (And, believe me, I've tried!) I'll stick to it.

On a serious note, if there was a little taskbar notification when a new article came in I'd be sold!
@Dan I've got a commitment to myself to get an actual release version out of the door by the end of the year. Re: notification, are you looking for a balloontip, or some other form of toaster popup? I'm thinking notifications should be selectable per feed - ie some feeds notify, others don't.
Actually, I'm not sure what I want (Difficult customer) but either would suffice - I don't mind just having a title and then having to click to read if it interests me. Kind of like the desktop notifications for Outlook, if you like - enough to say "Ooh, I need to read that".

And yes, I totally agree on a per feed basis
9:44 AM
I'm well pleased, some of you might recall the difficulties we went through with integrating LDAP login into our vCenter Operations Enterprise rollout - well VMWare sent me an update this morning with loads of changes and it just works, first time - really happy about that, good customer service I reckon
Q: A plan to mitigate PDU failures?

ewwhiteA client just experienced a complete failure of an APC AP7911A switched/metered rack power distribution unit. This obviously took all of the connected equipment down with it. The equipment is fine, as well as the UPS unit. In situations where it may not be possible to balance devices across mult...

But now that I looked into the situation, I realized that the server (DL580 G7) had all of its power supplies connected to one PDU...
but either way, do people plan for PDU failures, or is that paranoid?
Define plan I suppose - all installs I've ever done have had dual PSUs in anything remotely important, with one PSU going to the UPS (Via a PDU) and the other PSU going directly to the mains
Other than that, I guess it's a case of mitigating risk where you can - carrying spares and so on. I've never written a formal plan for a PDU failure though, I must admit
9:55 AM
In data centers, I have the luxury of A+B feeds and build-out accordingly. This was a server room in a small office... and I think a bad decision was made to run everything (4 PSU) on one PDU.
@ewwhite we plan for complete riser failures
@ewwhite but that depends on how many power feeds you've got coming into the building, as you say :)
@ewwhite So long as the supply can take it, there should be no problem in running the UPS off one circuit and having another PDU to bypass it. I've done this in even the worst of 'server rooms'
So yeah, you're right - I'd say that's the root cause in essence
Right. Just diversity, correct?
@ewwhite Is that to me, sorry?
9:58 AM
@ewwhite nice, a question in my ballpark :)
What do you mean?
me? I meant I liked his question
@dan - it makes sense to have power diversity. So use UPS and a bypass. Or multiple power feeds. Some way to leverage the multiple PSUs. In this case, the client had a multi-hour outage essentially because of a power strip failure.
No - I meant what did he mean by diversity!
@ewwhite Yeah, exactly. As Chopper posts - its nice to have redundant UPSes, but that just won't happen in some places. I mean, I've put in server rooms into schools - where they use a domestic style power feed. I just plug the UPS into one plug, and a PDU into another. If the UPS goes they get power still - if the building power goes they have a UPS to shut everything down
You have to watch your current draw a little - but there comes a point where you just have to tell them that they need to improve their infrastructure
I didn't install this particular server, but I built large portions of the room... 3 x UPS units... 2 x 110V, and 1 x 208V, which originally had the PDU in place to feed a Proliant DL740 server that required high-line power.
a new contractor was brought in and plugged a new server, DL580 G7, and all of its PSUs into the single 208V PDU
10:03 AM
Yeah - that feels like a lazy Friday afternoon job to me
so maybe it's just a fluke... but it got me thinking about the failure rate of these devices
Well, if you plan to lose the entire UPS 'sector' (So, the plug that the UPS goes into fails, along with the UPS and the PDUs and all PSUs attached to it etc) and can still maintain power then you're not going to go far wrong. A PDU failing would be no different to a UPS failing, from a power point of view.

But yeah - it's definitely easy for people to overlook these things.
getting more details... it was an A/C failure in the room...
apc.com/resource/include/… specced for 20 blades o.O
insanely big.
When I see UPS I just think "Looks heavy!"
@Chopper3 A little on the large side. n.n
It's the kind of kit I've seen, but never ever touched
Oh, that's gonna come back to you, Chopper!
reckon I care?
10:10 AM
Though I won't lie - I read the question and had to double check you hadn't linked me another SE site :D
@Chopper3 I think it's hilarious
just had to pay a big bill for all the fence panels that got ruined in the storm on Tuesday night, so took it out on that clot
It's not even a question you could make a start on if I you were so inclined
@Chopper3 I came down to find my garage had somehow 'blown' open. It wasn't wide open, but it was a horrible moment peering in expecting to see a vast emptiness where my camper and tools were
I'm not sure it's right for SU
Haha, shit - did you see the pre edit version?
@Chopper3 a short "it's off-topic here, you are unlikely to get useful answers" would have sufficed.
10:13 AM
I do SO many of those every single day of the year - that one was offensively bad
@Chopper3 Instant Upvote.
I don't know if anyone saw "Black Mirror" on C4. But there's a scene where the Prime Minister turns around in a rage shouting "Fucking internet". I desperately need to image macro it
Many of them are insulting intelligence, I'd simply deal with it by leaving a short note and ignoring otherwise
Anything else is asking for trouble - you never know who takes offense
@Dan I'm an old b3tan so used to hang around with CB in his tvgh days, he's a talented dude
@syneticondj that's nice for you, try doing that, and all the other spam we get, and sorting out fights, complaints, flags etc. for years, while having a job to do without once losing your temper with idiots
@Chopper3 I heard about it and didn't think I'd like it, but somehow the humour really worked. It's worth a watch!
10:17 AM
I've seen them all
he didn't write the next one though iirc
work in telly don't forget :)
My girlfriend was less impressed, so I'm waiting for the next time my mate comes around
Ah, yes - of course!
@Chopper3 that's a burden of every public office, I am afraid.
@Chopper3 do you know what changed yesterday with freeview to make all the Humax PVRs die ?
what makes you think it's a public office? get off your high horse, it's not like you germans are well known for your ability to manage your own tempers now is it
@Iain some analogue services were switched off and there was a DTT update
No reason to become offended really - no offense meant.
but a community moderator of a community site is definitely a public office
10:25 AM
Personally, and I can only ever speak for me, I far prefer communities where the moderators are also seen as members - with real opinions
As you'd know from my comment on that stupid question it's been a hard week for me and the other mods, lots of critisicm from every angle, this isn't a paid job, we do it because we were asked (in my case) or volunteered, it takes a lot of our time and we get literally fuck all back for it but abuse from those who choose to do nothing and have proven nothing of their own ability to do this either. Take a walk in someone else's shoes before having a go at them.
@syneticondj are you trying to annoy me? because it's working
laters guys - this is all going a bit ott
@syneticondj By the way, we don't allow users to push their own products or services via their username - can you change it
I am not taking a go at you - I just expressed my concern that someone probably will. I consider your work necessary and valuable and would not like to see it all turning bad just because someone feels like having a power struggle - and there always is one.
@Chopper3 it's just my OpenID really - nothing pushing anything.
yet you expect us to be totally even-handed, emotionless automatons, never tiring of the waves of bullshit we get every day - well I'm a human, one with literally decades of experience in what we do and I sometimes get offended when idiots make no attempt to even look at the site to see if their latest brainfart is appropriate.
we don't allow users to promote their products and services in their username, it happens a lot, I'd missed yours, until now
@syneticondj Does the comment on this question meet your cold, efficient, automated requirements; serverfault.com/q/341155/1435 - maybe we could get moderator actions automatically sent to you for approval first?
10:38 AM
A: Company Name In Username

sysadmin1138The greater Stack Exchange community has agreed that such names are to be allowed. http://meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/100860/are-user-names-that-represent-domains-allowed The accepted answer on that one is what the SE policy is on this topic. The identity you choose is a personal thing...

I do not expect this, since I know how hard this can be. The problem is with a couple of others who do. And who will not rest until they've buried any accomplishment in dirt. I do not want to see this happen really.
@phwd wasn't aware of that - fair enough, quite new news
@Chopper3 as polite as only the English can be. I'd like to ask you not to take offense, as I said, I consider your work both necessary and valuable.
And at least the "valuable" part also applies to your comment in question.
10:47 AM
@syneticondj, and yet you've done quite the opposite, you've made me realise that I shouldn't be doing this work at all, because no matter how many thousands of moderator actions I've taken over the years I'm still a target for the likes of you to come along pointing out the sub-1% 'failures' you see as I'm not a clinical emotionless humourless machine as you feel you need us to be.
Well you win, I'm going to ask to be removed from the mod list, then we can have another election, you can stand and, if you win, prove your superiority - good luck with that.
Oh come on, you are over-reacting really... And I have pointed out multiple times that I do not consider this a "failure". I am not aspiring for a moderator's office BTW.
"public office" - who does that for free? you're sniping from the sidelines with nothing to lose, no skin in the game, well you can do what you like, but you've had your effect.
It was also not me who pointed at it, you've posted a message in the chat asking for opinions. I've just told you mine.
YOU. MISSED. THAT. IT. WAS. DONE. WITH. HUMOUR. fancy that eh, who'd have guessed
I really did. If you ask for opinions but don't mean it, I can't possibly know.
10:56 AM
well thanks for pointing out this is has all been a pointless waste of my time, I thank you for that, I'll get on with my imperfect little life elsewhere and leave you to it.
@Chopper3 I am sorry my message did not get to you. I took the effort to deliver it because I care, not because I want to piss you off.
/kickban @syneticondj
name a reason please
-blink- woaaah.
Chopper is probably our most active mods so loosing him (as a mod) would not be in the best interests of the site. Yes, he might come across badly sometimes but as he and I have both said we both get annoyed with people joining the site and asking unrelated/off-topic/complete wrong/out of scope questions.
Has anyone ever discussed the notion of silent moderator-approved questions from first-timers?
Or is there value in having OT questions posted, and then closed by a mod for all to see?
I guess both requires mod review, so not sure it's such a sensible idea actually. Hmm.
11:04 AM
I think it should be 'harder' to post your first question, somehow
@growse I'd like the idea but there's a lot of new questions from first-timers each day.
The unforseen consequences of making it harder is a bunch of people whining about how difficult the site is to use
The flipside of hiding first questions until approved is a bunch of people whining about why they can't see their question
@TomOConnor Without getting in the middle of this, I did a quick look on your meta and the about section of this chatroom there are no policies for kicking a user based on opinion. So no one is getting kicked from this chatroom.
@phwd I think that was meant as a joke.
yesterday, by tombull89
Even better (but probably not quite fair) would be to have a semi-technical question that they have to answer before being able to ask. Even if it's instantly Google-able it shows that they can use google and research something.
@tombull89 Yeah, I remember us talking about that
11:06 AM
@phwd I also rather have rather seen it as the expression of his opinion
@growse the whole premise of SX is that asking a question should be as easy as possible
@phwd You've evidently not spent enough time in IRC. Never mistake online chat with a democracy.
jeez this does not look like the usual happy place it normally is :-(
@Iain well, on SO now you have to be registered to ask (but not to answer).
/mode TomOconnor +o
11:08 AM
@tombull89 I thought it was just SO
@tombull89 yes, yes it does
@tombull89 Needs more Cowbell.
@Iain Sorry, yes it is just SO.
@tombull89 and I think they thought long and hard about that too
WTF? apache directory studio doesn't support "NULL" as a baseDN string for global catalog searches ...
11:10 AM
I've opped a number of IRC channels. I tend to think of kicking people with weird views and opinions as Signal To Noise ratio adjustment.
@TomOConnor if the normal drivel in here is signal I'd hate to see it get noisy
If Chopper is really going to resign, can we nominate TomTom as a new mod? That'd make Chopper's comments look like rainbows and kittens.
"weird" opinions? What's weird about "don't do that it is likely to get you into trouble"?
11:28 AM
user image
I'm bloody starving
Oh What the Fuck...
11:42 AM
yes, that's what I said.
Is it too early for lunch?
@Dan Hell no, I just had lunch
GMT+1 tho...
Yeah, it's not even 12:00 yet
Fuck it - I'm off to make soup. By the time I'm up it'll be close enough!
there's soup in the canteen here :) stroll on 12:30
I don't think I'm going to be asked to be the student newspaper's "Agony Uncle" any time soon.
Apparently "I'm trying to pay my mortgage, tell me again why its not fair that fashion costs so much" isn't sympathetic enough
@RobMoir Haha :D
(Kettle was boiled and ready - rapidly reducing my soup making time!)
"Dan likes this"
Haha, I've just checked my bank - I can't see anything for Google 10p app purchases
must be a new sysadmin though.
Q: Listing TCP/UDP process from an organically grown application

graham.reedsI've been asked to compile a list of TCP/UDP and ports they use for the collection of application that comprise our product for a client who wants the information for their firewall. So I fired up TCPView some of the processes are so short lived that I can't register the information fast enough ...

Gonna have to trace the transcript later...looks like Chopper3 had some fun.
I am not quite sure he considered it fun
I don't know. I haven't read it yet.
I'm also tired as hell so I'm feeling a little punch drunk.
He's been a respected op here for...geez, at least a year.
Probably close to back around SF's launch.
I've been on over a year and don't remember when he first appeared.
I'll have to look at the transcripts to see what happened this time. But he's been one of the go-to's when there's a problem requiring moderation. Probably someone took offense to his brusque manner and got all irritated at it.
Whoever was mad it wasn't anywhere near as bad as having tomtom go after them, I bet. REBOOT ALL THE CELLPHONES!
Q: Chat - a plea for moderation

IainI’ve been a member of the SF chat room for quite some time. Whilst it was never the most learned place to be, at one time it was at least safe for work. Right now it’s an open to google sewer where swearing is becoming the norm rather than the exception and rallying the pack to pile on the cluele...

12:18 PM
Just read the transcript
What the F...
12:40 PM
Lists "1 post"
but nothing shows up
I saw @Iain's post and though "ohhh crap." Then I read the transcript and saw that I wasn't in it. phew
@MarkM Likewise
yeah its all hit the fan :-(
Honestly though, what's wrong with this transcript?
There are at least one billion things that could have been linked to that were worse than the transcript that got posted
@MarkM I honestly don't know... I thougt there where going to be boobies or something...
12:50 PM
There are a few f bombs here and there, but as long as it's not every word I don't think profanity should be moderated
I swear too much - sorry :(
This is conversational. I say fuck at work, I say fuck here. As long as you're not saying it for the sake of saying it what's the big deal?
well besides people badgering chopper you mean? Some of the language earlier on is a bit strong. God knows I'm in **no**# position to criticise others for that and I don't see it as a problem but its there, I guess.
I assumed the transcript was the permalink to me filling the chat box with the f bomb
You have no idea how relieved I was when I saw that it wasnt.
that's kinda how I feel mark. There's a big difference between "I've had a fucking awful day" and "Fuck you (someone's name)"
imho anyway
12:52 PM
whats wrong with chopper - what happened?
@RobMoir Indeed
scroll up to about 10:00 pfo and read from there
i think he'd had a crappy day already anyway and someone picked the wrong time to get on his case about some mod stuff here
You're in the star list, @MarkM!
Honestly, I'm pretty dumb. Profanity is the only way I'll get on the star wall. If they take that away from me I'll have nothing.
Hmmm. I guess I'll have to tone it down with the ponies...
12:58 PM
@markm there's always pony pictures if you want on the wall
poor chopper
But if I tone down the ponies, I'll have nothing
I'd send him BJs and coke to make it up, but the shipping is going to be expensive :P
g'day bitches
@Holocryptic pictures of guns with split barrels?
1:03 PM
@Shads0 Oh....dude!
what's wrong with profanity btw? I don't get it...
Your hilarious
I need to call the doc today in fact
Nor I, but I'm happy to accept my views are not always accepted. I just don't see it as offensive among adult (As in, we're adults) banter and chat
hey i've had kidney stones 3 times now. You have to find something to laugh about in it to take the edge off the pain
Have they figured out your treatment yet?
1:06 PM
@Dan agreed
We're sysadmins. We're bitter, twisted, cynical and irritable by design.
No. I need to call today to figure out what to do next before I run out of meds
and cynics.
And irritable
1:07 PM
they need to get their fingers out
@tombull89 "by default" implies the ability to change. I'd go so far to say "by design".
@syneticondj Good point, well made.
There must be a reason the bastard operator from hell is not a truck driver or a police officer
@Dan duuuuuuuuuuuuuuude
@Shads0 It was just the irony of the conversation coupled with your entrance
Made me giggle
1:11 PM
Yeah, I read the convo. I do agree that it seemed like chopper overreacted, but at the same time, eh has been really on edge lately so as a person with a short temper and whos also not afraid to curse out a person to their face, I can understand fully.
Also, so the chat has become flooded with ponies, memes, and boobies....WHAT IS SO WRONG WITH THAT =D
Good talk. So are we all gonna have a good cry and hug it out?
What? We're sysadmins - hell no. I'm going to log on to your exchange server and send an e-mail to your boss.
sure, chopper is helluva guy and i think that with all his rep and his knowledge of this site and our biz in general he should be allowed to loose his temper every now and then
We should all change our avatars to Paddington Bears again, to cheer him up xD
1:15 PM
I'm down
What a con

The diamond in that ring is worth a max of ~£500. You reckon that platinum ring is worth >£2000
@Dan are you getting one of those for your lady?
Not that one!
I was just proviing a point - considering buying a diamond seperately, which I'm told by some is a little unromantic (Though I disagree) and my point is that she'll end up with a far better, and personal ring
I would think of this as an option if I were a goldsmith. Or how are you going to fasten the diamond to the ring - sticky tape?
It would be personal indeed, but a bit short-living :)
Responded to the meta question on chat, I don't think that's too bad a summary, from my few months here.
1:27 PM
While I take your joke - I have a friend who works IT in the jewellery trade so as long as I can source a nice ring (Which could be the sticking point in this whole thing) then I can get a proper jeweller to pair them up
@pfo Read my blog. I lose my temper frequently. It's all cool.
I'd lose my temper more often here if it wasn't for A) my low rep and B) my inability to actually know more than the people here ;)
I'm not all for an extra room
I think it's fine as it is imo
Another room would divide the few people that are in here...
I figured after that I had to suggest some kind of comprimise. Maybe there's a secret mod chat and they're thinking @holocryptic @shads0 and @bartdevos need to burn, lets ban them from chat forever, or provide a permanant blog link for @barsilverstrim ;)
@Shads0 I hope people will not start flagging random shit as offensive.
We've seen it happen before
random kicks/bans all around
1:37 PM
@BartDeVos flagged as offensive
@Holocryptic Fuck
@BartDeVos now THAT would take the fun out of it. I would rather a split chat than being banned from it by someone who took offense to, say, my Free Shrugs image above.
Though, to anyone actually taking offense, I refer them to a little dialogue by steven hughes about being offended.
@Shads0 I consider chat, like you said, like my workplace
People are to easily offended these days...
@BartDeVos I don't even consider it that, it is essentially a water cooler if you need that analogy ;)
@Shads0 Haha, true
1:40 PM
How to improve chat, in 3 easy steps. 1) Remember it is not a democracy. 2) We are not picking on you, we pick on all assholes alike. 3) If you don't like it, Fuck Off.
Well, there's got to be at least one room for people to join and say "HAI I WANT TO BUILD THE NEXT FLICKUR I has £10,000 a month from my parents I has no IT expereince and I has no coding expereince and what do I nee-oh, wait. TCR is for that.
Also. I want Chopper3 back. I liked him. sadface
^ what tom said. x100
@tombull89 No, that's for the main SF site.. Then we VTC them, and I post a link to tomoconnor.eu/blogish/dedicated-dedicated on the same article.
End of.
chopper for president \o/
1:47 PM
@TomOConnor did you know about this little episode that came up yesterday morning? The guy wanted to build a Flicker-killer, given money by his parents to do it, but had no idea how to do it.
@tombull89 That was a nice on...
that was fun
actually that talk was a great example of how this chat room is actually quite good. Despite being off topic, despite not knowing what to ask, I thought we actually did well for that guy and gave him good advice and all
@RobMoir If he actually took the advice though, that's another thing...
I remember thinking I knew it all at that age too.
didn't we all?
1:49 PM
@tombull89 I wish I was there. Sadface
@RobMoir @syneticondj still does.
This should be all the evidence we need that TCR is "A Good Thing":
Dec 2 at 17:04, by Peter Grace
I came here to bitch, and came out with an answer. Awesome.
Hell, when new users pop into here (myself, @basil, and general newbies that don't stick around and chat a lot) they get told to talk about boobs if nothing else and they just generally accept and enjoy the chat
@TomOConnor I don't see your problem. And I don't want it to become my problem. End of discussion for me.
@syneticondj You drove Chopper3 away.
1:56 PM
Can't tell if serious, or trolling.
@syneticondj A bit easy... Starting a mess, then walking away...
badp has frozen this room.
Oh, I wanted to put a timeout but I guess that works too.
badp has unfrozen this room.
@badp: Please don't go freeze other rooms when you don't know the context
Highly inappropriate
1:58 PM
@BartDeVos What's inappropriate is what I was seeing
It does, I still feel cold
OK. This is ridiculous.
looks like someone's throwing flags about...
I wanted to put the room in timeout for sixty seconds and I clicked the wrong button and froze it. I then unfroze it for 60 seconds.
@tombull89 Yup.
1:59 PM
@Holocryptic It is, take action on people, not a whole room
I apologize for the misclick, but I feel the room totally needed a timeout, things were degenerating fast.

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