English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room - 2013-12-19 (page 7 of 7)

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11:00 PM

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@hwlau OK cool, that is probably enough information, you have greatly helped someone on Cooking.Stackexchange.com.

3

Q: Help wanted to identify this food item (oriental)

I found this item at a Chinese supermarket. Hints: It was in a fridge It was humid (almost wet) and fresh The "slices" were 2-3 mmm thick I googled for "Chopin", "Chopin food", "Chopin Chinese", etc. to no avail. Too many music related hits returned!

food-identification

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See what I mean? We’re worth two of them. :)

@hwlau If you want to earn some points, you could answer this question in a few lines. ^

@Marthaª Just upvoted Eureka! for you. :)

Anonymous

@RegDwigнt vote cast'ed.

11:04 PM

Яфя!

I mean, yay!

Yaphya?

And now the system suggest us to go to chat room. NOOOOOOO. I will stay here! — hwlau 10 mins ago

@Cerberus No, thanks. You can answer that. I am just not sure which type of leave vegetable it is. The picture is not quite clear the same as as the description.

Wrong copypasta.

@RegDwigнt Oops

Should I post here instead?

11:07 PM

No I mean I copypasted the wrong thing.

You are fine.

@hwlau Heh OK. I have posted your lines to the person concerned. He does say, though, that the "leaves" have no visible nervations at all.

It's a hint for others.

1

A: wooden, golden, oaken - Genitive?

In most cases, they are not. English has at least a half-dozen completely different -en suffixes. The one you are thinking of is the one that the OED says is added to noun-stems to form adjs. with sense ‘pertaining to, of the nature of’. In Teut. the adjs. so formed chiefly indicate the m...

If you turn a noun into an adjective, have you genitivized it?

A man of wood is a wooden man or even a woodsman.

No. I almost closed it as gen-ref with an etymonline link.

But then I left it up so you could deliver.

This is why the Romans rejects the idea of having adjectives.

11:10 PM

And so I couldn't upvote you today.

Them and their casus belli.

The still call that second word a noun, but in the genitive.

Belli and whistli.

And now I know where Swiss comes from.

Holes.

@tchrist No...

No, Latin.

11:11 PM

@RegDwigнt C.H.

There is a very deep and clear difference between an adjective and a noun in the genitive.

Cheeseratio Helvetica.

Woohoo! Just got my unicorn hat!

If the woods had a man, then would the woods’ man be adjectivally modified?

Sometimes one can substitute for another, but they are formally distinct.

11:13 PM

What, with a morning coat and everything?

446 behind Web Apps.

@tchrist There are different kinds of attributes. One is an adjective, another is a genitive, a third is a prepositional phrase.

@tchrist *coat

We'll see again in 47 minutes.

Or just a wood man or a steel man or a tin man or a plastic man or a space man or a man man.

@Cerberus oh, I know, I know! "What are some things Ursula LeGuin knows of but George R. R. Martin does not?"

11:15 PM

@RegDwigнt fears gifted Greeks

Twas a nice essay BTW @tchrist. Except it ended very abruptly.

Thanks, yeah.

I was sort of only just getting the hang of it, and then bam! it was over.

Same.

There is an “elevated” tone in the more literary works.

I got the pointy hat!!! :P

11:16 PM

@RegDwigнt Heh. I'm sure that will be correct.

That borrows the devices of classical poetry.

Or rather, of oratory.

@AmericanLuke Yay!

@AmericanLuke yw

How did you get Eureka?

I wonder how I can get hats back in chat.

No idea

11:16 PM

Maybe I should reboot Safari.

*boot

As in give the boot to.

I'm always wearing a different hat next to the compose-message window than next to the posted messages.

Basically it's always Milliner down here.

Never updates.

have you tried a hard refresh?

@RegDwigнt For me it takes a Ctrl-F5.

Still no hats.

11:18 PM

@AmericanLuke yeah no I guess it will work but I'm lazy.

Which in my browser is a "force refresh".

Use the refresh, Luke.

Force the lick, Luke.

Luke, I am your milliner!

lol

Does nohat hate hats?

11:21 PM

No.

He has a hat.

Last year it took some convincing.

This time he put it on before it was cool.

Which reminds me.

I thought those were just appearing because they're automatically awarded when wb started

How do I get the scarf?

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@AmericanLuke but he is actually wearing one. That doesn't happen automatically.

11:23 PM

Ah. So, Sim is the hate-hating mod

Or else Sim would have one.

Oh. Right. Where's sim?

No, I think she fell into the Marianas Trench.

And where's her hats?

She has but three.

Must be something going on in her life.

11:24 PM

Feb 25 '11 at 11:53, by RegDwight

"It is currently estimated to be up to deep. The trench is about long but has a mean width of only."

Poor thing.

Feb 25 '11 at 11:53, by RegDwight

Feb 7 at 15:17, by RegDwight

The Mariana Trench is the deepest part of the world's oceans, and the lowest elevation of the surface of the Earth's crust. It is currently estimated to be up to deep. It is located in the western Pacific Ocean, to the east of the Mariana Islands. The trench is about long but has a mean width of only . It reaches a maximum-known depth of about at the Vityaz-1 Deep and about at the Challenger Deep, a small slot-shaped valley in its floor, at its southern end. If Mount Everest, the highest mountain on Earth at , were set in the deepest part of the Mariana Trench, there would be of ...

Penalty box.

Somebody has put Wimpypedia in the Penalty Box.

You see, if you finally switched to Metric, there'd be no need for those stupid Wikipedia conversion templates, and the text would be perfectly readable even oneboxed here.

Am I still wearing my lightbulb?

11:26 PM

@AmericanLuke Unicorn for me.

good

And on Genealogy, too.

let's see if I can get pointy-hat on History

0

Q: Has anyone gotten "I see your point"?

Everyone loves pointy unicorns, but I don't think I've seen anyone earn one yet here. So, in the spirit of the Winterbash, let's take a show of hands for pointy hats. This should work... P.s. If you hate hats, ignore this post.

discussion winterbash friday

@tchrist: That's very interesting. The Greek/Latin suffix was definitely not a genitive ending in the classical age, at least. And I don't believe there was ever an -n- in any Proto-Indo-European genitive, at least not in the singular. So I am inclined to say that the suffix was never originally genitival. It is possible, however, that the Germanic genitive ending -en came from the same suffix, evolving from an adjectival suffix into a case ending; it is said that all inflection originates in suffixes, which again originate in enclitics, and separate words (possibly of an adverbial nature). — Cerberus 9 secs ago

Déjà lu.

@AmericanLuke Accepted answer on meta?

11:28 PM

Ah, si vite!

Sí.

Oder oui.

Bah, every time we're wanking in the ELU office, you can trust Cerberus and tchrist to spoil it with some serious linguinisticalic discussion.

@RegDwigнt He just likes expounding on genits.

Wir reisen gen Italien.

Is all I have to say.

Wanking??

"Gen"?

11:31 PM

It's hilarious.

And has been posted here OVER 7 times.

@Cerberus towards.

A tad archaic.

Lord God I need 3 more questions.

Futile.

And you will need five more questions still next year.

@tchrist eh?

Who do you think you are, a question machine?

Questionable.

@AmericanLuke Seeking your eek a formula.

11:34 PM

But it is also very well possible, and perhaps more likely, that Germanic genitive -en came from a different suffix entirely. Consider also, @Emanuel, that German words like Herr and Student have -(e)n in many other cases, and that adjectives that come after dem/den/etc. also get -en. There are a ton of different (and possibly unrelated) suffixes -(e)n in the Germanic languages... — Cerberus 1 min ago

nope. the only activity on meta during that time was editng a cw post

@RegDwigнt Ah! The same as yon, probably?

And jener?

Possibly.

@Cerberus that I do not know.

Way down yonder in the pawpaw patch.

Dutch gene zijde = "the other side".

Dutch ginder = "yonder".

11:36 PM

@Cerberus I can see you haven’t had a good vowel-movement in a long time.

Dutch degene = "derjenige" (right?).

@tchrist It's all cropped up inside of me.

So this is quite interesting. Something like [gen] and/or [jen] meaning "there, with the other person" is apparently common Germanic.

Can I think of other potential cognates...

Well.

I don't think well is a cognate.

We don’t really have three grades of deictics, howsoever far you press here/there/yonder into service thereof.

But perhaps we did in the days of...yore.

11:40 PM

ES example of 3 grades: 1st person esto = cerca de mí; 2nd person eso = cerca de ti; 3rd person aquello = cerca ni de mí ni de ti

Ah.

They correspond to the three persons.

It was not really consistently used in Latin.

english is just here, there, and way over there. Really only two, imho

The issue is that there can be nearby or far away.

Over there, over there, ...

11:43 PM

> [OE. ¼eon adj. (rare), corresp., with variation of vowel, to OFris. iêna, gêna (ienn-, inn-), WFris. jinge, OHG. jenêr, MHG., G. jener,

There you have it. "Yon".

@Cerberus What the hell is ¼ doing?

Your encoding is gebusted.

I propose that the number of hats be multiplied with the number of months one's been active for SE.

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jealous of their hats :P

@AmericanLuke no. I will get those soon enough.

My point is they should be jealous of my age.

You're an entire 8 hats behind manish

11:48 PM

I have a life.

And a wife.

Are you mocking us minors?

Haha.

Though manish isn't technically a minor anymore

We had a minor on our mod team. I think he isn't technically a minor anymore, either.

Time flies like a banana.

I was the youngest mod for a month or two, but then some young upstart robbed me of the title

11:51 PM

That's how they roll.

Kids these days.

I hear you still play legos?

I used to, but then I grew up :P

I don't play. I build.

When you really grow up you will go back, too.

It's called the Dark Ages.

Everyone has those.

@Cerberus You need an insular g there. Your encoding is screwed up.

Etymology: OE. ᵹeon adj. (rare), corresp., with variation of vowel, to OFris. iêna, gêna (ienn-, inn-), WFris. jinge, OHG. jenêr, MHG., G. jener, also OHG., MHG. enêr, G. dial. ene(r, ONor. enn, inn, hinn, def. art. (Sw., Da. hin), Goth. jains that. The Teut. bases underlying these forms, or other variants of them, are represented also in OHG. ennân, MHG. enne(n from there, hither, OHG. en(n)ônt, MHG. en(n)ent yonder, G. dial. jenntak, jennabend yesterday, Goth. jainar there; Dutch and LG. show forms with initial guttural, viz. MDutch ghene, gone, göne (Dutch gene) that, LG. gunnen that, th…

@tchrist I always get weird characters when I copy from the OED.

Yeah, I have about a dozen collectors models sitting on the shelf above my head gathering dust

11:54 PM

@tchrist Yes.

@AmericanLuke Oh, which ones?

@Cerberus That’s because Microsoft doesn’t understand encodings.

So now I am absolutely fascinated by again and against.

Mostly megablocks

Haha.

11:54 PM

Are they related to yonder?

Legos are too expensive these days

Okay.

Wut.

@tchrist I am tempted to ask a Question on Linguistics or ELU.

@RegDwigнt Nigerian scam.

LEGO is exceptionally cheap in your area.

I pay twice the price.

Australia pays twice mine.

11:55 PM

eh?

Yeah.

@AmericanLuke Legos have always been expensive. That's why my sister and I never had any until we got jobs and bought them for ourselves.

@Marthaª I never took you for a Legolas.

My niece, on the other hand, has more Legos (well, Duplos) than she knows what to do with.

I used to get them as gifts, but not anymore

11:56 PM

Germany is their main market, so they milk it like there's no tomorrow. America is still considered an emerging market, so they are giving their stuff away basically for free.

@AmericanLuke Nobody gave Legos as gifts to girls. Stupid people.

@tchrist Dutch tegen(s) "against" comes from te-jegen(s), which is related to yonder and the Germanic root *jen- as discussed earlier. But is English against directly related to tegen(s)? (If so, again and gain must also be related.)

@RegDwigнt We prefer the term "poor country".

I once bought two huge tubs of a few thousand bricks for twenty dollars at a garage sale.

Etymology:
1. OE. like the cogn. langs. shows two forms: (1) onᵹeán, earlier *onᵹeaᵹn, onᵹeæᵹn, ongægn, *ongagn, OHG. in gagan, cf. ONor. gagn sb., gagn- adv. pref.; (2) onᵹén, earlier onᵹeᵹn, ongegn, OS. angegin, OHG. in gegin, in gegini (MHG, engegene, engein, mod.G. entgegen), ONor. i gegn (Sw. igen, Dan. igjen); f. on, in + (1) gagn, (2) gegn, best explained as:-*gag(a)na, *gag(a)ni, variant o- and i- stems of gag(a)n. Not found in Gothic. From onᵹén came the various southern forms of which ayen was the type; from the earlier ongegn, onᵹeᵹn, the type ayein; from aᵹeán, the southern and …

I also found stale candy corn and fifteen dollars in change inside

11:57 PM

I can't imagine buying used LEGO. Much less used MegaBloks.

@Cerberus That’s again.

I would never buy megabloks used

It was most all lego in there (with a few monopoly tokens)

@tchrist Yes, so entgegen strongly suggests a relation with tegen/te-jegen.

0

Q: What civilization was designer of moai heads?

Moai heads are really interesting, i don't know why but i really feels good when i look at them. What civilization was designer of Moai heads? why they design those heads? i feel somehow, Moai statues have been pillars of a temple Moai

ancient-history

@AmericanLuke That should have made you very allegro.

11:58 PM

> Moai heads are really interesting, i don't know why but i really feels good when i look at them.

Lol :P

And "The primary meaning of gagn, gegn seems to have been ‘direct, straight ..., whence on-gegn ‘in a direct line with, opposite, facing locally,’" seems compatible with the semantic field of "yonder".

By the way, my proposed LEGO set could still use a couple votes.

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