English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

May 14 '12 at 15:23, by RegDwight ΒВBẞ8

> I carefully filed it with other movies I will watch when they introduce the 8-day week. Then I was told I must see it. I began. I was enchanted. I was swept away. I was smiling from one end of the film to the other. It is astonishingly original. It brings together four entirely separate elements and combines them into a great whimsical chord. How did [its creator's] mind work?

May 14 '12 at 15:23, by RegDwight ΒВBẞ8

Roger Ebert on Sita Sings the Blues.

What other, err—film do you know that is an animated musical myth-cum-debate?

Tom and Jerry: The Movie.

imdb.com/title/tt0105616

Who will debate, and what?

Everyone, everything about it.

12:26 PM

they will debate their survival with hammers

No.

See, that's the thing.

Are Tom and Jerry even qualified to debate anything?

It's a movie where they don't use a single hammer on each other.

oh dear

It's a movie in which they talk and sing about being friends. And then save an orphan child from an evil stepmom. Who sings, too.

12:27 PM

does a house fall into the flow of magma?

or is there some sort of fire?

There's a butler and a talking dog, too. A whole gang of singing dogs. And the orphan child turns out to have a father who's a helicopter pilot who saves her from the fire. Leaving Tom and Jerry to burn in it.

KitFox

What? You are crazy.

@RegDwighт And on what myth is it based?

They're only animals, after all

They are barely ever on screen, and when they are they either sing about being friends of burn to death.

12:28 PM

Sounds more like a fable.

based on the myth of hercules, obvs

@KitFox I wish!

►

Based on WWII, if that is a myth...

Save yourself and your children the trouble.

It has a 3.9 rating for a reason.

I gave it a 1.

lunches

12:29 PM

The Tommies and the Jerries, or whatever they were called.

@RegDwighт That's more than 0.

@MattЭллен I want some!

You can't give a 0.

Ah.

I'm playing Annette Hanshaw now.

I'd give it a −10 if I could.

It really is a rape.

Animated childhood rape.

And Rama is a dick.

So yeah. Back on topic.

12:31 PM

@RegDwighт Another creative genre!

You saw Sita Sings the Blues?

I am excited.

Heh.

It's nice.

The lesson: men are dicks?

I've been trying for years to get everyone in this room to watch it.

I also read about Adam's Bridge, or Rama's Bridge.

@Cerberus perhaps. But the fun is you don't have to take a lesson from it.

12:32 PM

Adam's Bridge

Adam's Bridge (Tamil: '), also known as Rama's Bridge or Rama Setu (Tamil: ', Sanskrit: , '), is a chain of limestone shoals, between Pamban Island, also known as Rameswaram Island, off the southeastern coast of Tamil Nadu, India, and Mannar Island, off the northwestern coast of Sri Lanka. Geological evidence suggests that this bridge is a former land connection between India and Sri Lanka. The bridge is 18 miles (30 km) long and separates the Gulf of Mannar (southwest) from the Palk Strait (northeast). Some of the sandbanks are dry and the sea in the area is very shallow, being...

@RegDwighт I had it in a tab for like 3 months.

makes notes on how long it takes Cerb to revisit an open tab

Essential knowledge. However, I still have many more tabs to the left of where Sita was than to the right.

You can drag and drop them.

But that would be...wrong!

Nobody would know except you, and you'd forget in a minute.

It'd be the perfect crime.

12:38 PM

But the idea is that they are ordered in time.

It cannot be otherwise.

It's either close or let be.

Time only exists in your head.

I think the commentary actually adds something to the myth/legend.

Yes, yes.

It's very lively, spontaneous and above all contemporary.

It's what actual people actually take away from it.

Yeah, I would expect it to be actually spontaneous, not scripted.

Is it true?

It is. They were laymen.

12:41 PM

OK.

And she was on a shoe-string budget.

So she basically put up a mic and let them talk.

Yeah, I imagined it must be real.

I think they were a bunch of friends, or a friend and two friends of his, something like that.

That's certainly what it sounds like.

They are not always easy to understand.

Did you feel that the modern couple were necessary?

sentence-patterns structure conjunctions grammaticality pronouns

I dunno. I also didn't like that animation style much. But it adds yet another dimension, plus without that (autobiographical) story she wouldn't have created the whole thing in the first place.

And yeah, like or no like, it was done professionally. The lady knows what she's doing.

5th

9 2

This guy really is on a mission.

He must really hate "just because... doesn't mean".

12:48 PM

@RegDwighт Oh! I had no idea it was autobiographical.

Well I thought it was pretty obvious when I first watched it.

And then I looked it up and sure enough it was.

Why did you think so?

I knew nothing about the author, except that she was an American woman.

I knew nothing at all. But that she must be a woman became apparent as it became apparent that the story was autobiographical, and vice versa.

I didn't realise.

I don't remember the details. But it just wasn't the type of story that you'd tell.

12:51 PM

Such things happen to many men and women...

It was the type of story that life writes.

It did seem a bit odd.

So the odd style kind of fit well.

Yeah.

I just had no idea it was autobiographical. Didn't think of it.

It sort of makes sense.

respond-to-able 8-)

user19161

1:09 PM

@MattЭллен I saw that question. It seems a bit rhetorical.

It's certainly only worth it for the answer

@MattЭллен I was thinking about something like that.

user19161

In other news, I am changing my steelblue to blue now.

Also, just saw "you're like to get" in Barrie's answer and wanted to correct it as a typo only to learn that people actually say that.

user19161

Really? Never heard of.

1:11 PM

I think I only ever used "you're likely to get" myself.

user19161

Barrie lives in Old England!

But Google is full of "you're like to get some mighty strange looks" etc.

user19161

Oh I see, might be a typo then.

user19161

Google is crap. Use it for secondary info, not primary.

I don't know. it's an odd one. I suppose it's fine colloquially.

1:13 PM

60 million is quite a number.

user19161

There are 60 billion typos online.

The kind of number I don't even bother firing up COCA after seeing.

But I guess it would make for a nice question.

user19161

But there are very few in this chat, because I correct almost all of them.

user19161

You can ask it then.

user19161

If you don't in a few days, I might.

user19161

1:15 PM

Overt et haut !

@RegDwighт I have heard this, and I think it is a modern mal-back-formation of likely when the sentence structure resembles a copula.

> You are apt to... => you are like to...

I think it was used in older times to mean "resembling", not "likely".

> You are like to a man who has lost all hope.

Or maybe it has always been used in Barrie's way, but seldom.

1:31 PM

Zero hits in COCA.

For what?

any hits on BNC?

For "you are like to get".

google.com/…

@Cerberus uh, thank you but Google is what it all started with.

1:32 PM

But books.

But Google books.

Some good, decent instances there.

Now I must away.

Bai!

For "you are like to", 1 COCA hit, 2 on BNC.

@Cerberus cu

1:33 PM

> Still so frozen! You are like to die in any event, if you will not look after yourself better!

> ... keep the major portion of your money also depends upon what additional services you are like to require from your' bank'.

> Yet there he sat, awaiting my reply. "You are-you like to read?"

Hah.

The last one doesn't count, me hearties.

And that's the only hit on COCA.

So, BNC 2, COCA 0.

A: "Something suffices the condition that" vs. "it suffices that something"

the British win!

tchrist

Must commute.

How could you all have let poor Tai’s quite simple question languish for three long hours, unrequited? I am so disappoint! And thus did pity delay my departure:

0

No, you cannot say that “it suffices the condition”. That is not English. The author is saying that “it is enough that f(z) have a primitive in a region Ω” for such and such a thing to be satisfied or hold true or apply. Something like that. Note that we have moved into the hypothetical haven...

But now I am gone.

Q: "You are likely to [verb]" vs. "you are like to [verb]"

2:20 PM

0

In a recent answer to another question, a fellow poster just used the following turn of phrase: The nearest you’re like to get is [word][.] I only ever saw and used "you’re likely to..." myself, but something told me it wasn't a typo. So I started looking around and sure enough it wasn't. A...

word-choice adjectives word-usage american-english suffixes

I am like to ask question.

user19161

3:16 PM

@RegDwighт Plus one, just for you!

Hooray.

user19161

Now you know what to do...

I already repaid the favor by quoting you in the question body.

You'll be famous! Famous!

user19161

I don't see me being quoted!

user19161

It's just a stupid link to chat!

3:18 PM

As a German would reply, "he who can read has a clear advantage".

> The quick straw poll in chat produced reactions ranging from "Really? Never heard of." through "It's an odd one. I suppose it's fine colloquially." to "I have heard this, and I think it is a modern mal-back-formation of likely when the sentence structure resembles a copula."

That's Cerberus, Matt, and yourself, and you come first.

user19161

Bullshit!

user19161

Now they will come in here and see my bullshit as well!

2 hours ago, by Jason Bourne

Really? Never heard of.

I quoted you as accurately as was humanly possible at that time and with the limited resources at my disposal.

user19161

Ah, I am famous!

3:38 PM

@RegDwighт: I'm sure your "like to" construction has been in American colloquial English at least since the 19th century: "We were like to die from the heat" is something I heard my grandmother say.

Ah interesting.

I'll post that.

user19161

Ah more rep whoring now.

That's quite a compliment cuming from the ultimate rep ho.

pot, kettle => ?

user19161

3:40 PM

Now we use shorthand?

pot, kettle => tea

That's Objective J

Matt is just using a literal value instead of a variable there. He likes to hard-code values like that.

user19161

Oh, I did a search and actually found this cougar dating site, interesting.

user19161

I did not know there were such things.

I am the hard coded criminal

3:41 PM

What kind of cattle?

@MattЭллен Ain't no other motherfucker hard like you.

:D

user19161

It seems that whatever we can imagine, there is something like it on the internet.

Gah, my gay colleague is listening to the title music from The Gollum Girls. Er, The Golden Girls.

There oughta be a law.

user19161

3:42 PM

The internet has everything!

Okay now it's Dallas.

user19161

@RegDwighт Tell him to use headphones.

And now Magnum. That kind of makes up a bit.

@JasonBourne No pictures of you in your Manties—yet.

user19161

@Robusto I was about to look up manties when I realised what it means.

3:44 PM

Oh dear, what have I done? That was written in error, because it's not what I would say, and I have now changed it! Nevertheless, I acknowledge that it's a form others might use. — Barrie England 40 secs ago

Muwahahahahaha.

:D

user19161

Whoa, this question will become hot!

user19161

Partly because of my comment.

Not until my other hot question is down.

@RegDwighт Wha?

3:45 PM

I have an MC subscription these days.

@Robusto exactly.

user19161

But I am starting to think that all occurrences of "like" are just mistakes.

Or, as they say, "too little, too late".

@JasonBourne When they say "I like you, Jasper" they are mistakes? OK.

Good thing you'd never say that.

No one would.

user19161

3:46 PM

I just looked up the dictionary, also no such use of "like".

You should write your own dictionary.

Should have looked up "like" and not "the dictionary"!

2

And then sell it for money. And cheese.

And butter pie.

mmmm, cheese

user19161

3:47 PM

Thanks to me, R gets a star.

No, thanks to me.

user19161

See, though I don't get many stars, I inspire many of them in this chat.

You're both wrong. It was thanks to me.

Your statement is like saying "Thanks to a hunk of marble, Leonardo da Vinci became a star."

We are all star. Also, dust.

3:48 PM

Thank you, Moby.

user19161

Remember not to call asterisk star.

Thanks to the properties of hydrogen, canis majoris became a star

►

♪ Why does my fart smell so bad? ♪

because of all the brussel sprouts you ate

3:50 PM

> Everyone likes the smell of their own farts. —Anonymous

@MattЭллен Careful, lest I ask about the British usage of "your ate".

:D

you should ask about the American use of "carefully crated"

@MattЭллен 2 hits in COCA, 1 in BNC. Count me in.

27k Google hits.

I changed it to crafted but he might have meant created as well.

Yeah the other way round for me.

Thought it was created but Google suggested crafted.

3:53 PM

It's more common to use carefully with crafted.

Q: I want to know something about santa can you help?

Meanwhile on planet Jupiter,

0

hey theres something about santa I want to know. im not sure if this can be answered though... my question is "how do we know what santa looks like?" Has someone seen him before because I don't know. I tried to google it but still nothing. I tried on answers and still nothing. I hope that I can...

question

No, not Jupiter. From the North Pole, dummy.

or not, since he's not seen Santa

No one does.

They hunt them in Finland

3:55 PM

Actually I have a great answer to this. In Russian. — RegDwighт 5 secs ago

Santa is more elusive than the Higgs Bo'sun, but the math points to evidence that he must exist. Someone is putting all those presents under all those trees. QED

►

Is b considered a vowel in Russian? Sometimes I think everything in Russian is a vowel.

Nah. Ten vowels out of 33 is enough.