English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

So in the first example that you gave, the " / 3 " was hanging on to the side with the a more loosely than anything else. So you get rid of it by doing the opposite (x 3 ).

Mahnax

@SonicTheHedgehog NOPE.

Sonic The Hedgehog

@Mah ...how?

David Wallace

Then, there was a + 3 hanging on, so you get rid of it by doing - 3 on both sides.

Mahnax

@SonicTheHedgehog I'm Canadian, so I use British spellings.

David Wallace

In UK spelling, practise is a verb and practice is a noun. Either would have fitted Mahnax's comment.

Mahnax

5:18 AM

@DavidWallace I intended for it to be a verb.

Sonic The Hedgehog

....?

Aw, come on...

I wanted this feeling of correcting someone else..

Mahnax

:D

Sonic The Hedgehog

Why does British and American English have to be different anyway?

David Wallace

Americans can't afford to preach spelling to non-Americans.

Mahnax

@SonicTheHedgehog Woah, hey. You should say, "Why is it that English and American English are different?"

David Wallace

5:20 AM

"American English" sounds to me like an oxymoron.

Mahnax

Technically, English originated in England, so British English should be called English, and American English can be called American English.

David Wallace

I removed my star after Sonic edited the comment.

Mahnax

Or, you can call them BrE and AmE.

David Wallace

It ceased to be star-worthy.

Sonic The Hedgehog

╚(•⌂•)╝

Mahnax

5:23 AM

㍼

I have a unicode character for km²: ㎢

∎

↗

Sonic The Hedgehog

@David come on! Mah made me change it! I need a star! Please?

Mahnax

@SonicTheHedgehog I never made you do anything.

Sonic The Hedgehog

@Mah well you suggested to me.

Mahnax

@SonicTheHedgehog I rest my case.

David Wallace

Then say something that inspires me to star you.

Sonic The Hedgehog

5:27 AM

Agh...

finished my homework.

finally.

I'm gonna call it a night.

David Wallace

On the bright side, Jacques Kallis is out for 4. Maybe New Zealand have a chance after all.

Mahnax

@DavidWallace A nod's as good as a wink to a blind bat.

speedyGonzales

7:58 AM

is there someone here, i am daring you

speedyGonzales

8:13 AM

hi david

RegDwight Ѭſ道

11:18 AM

0

A: Is "actioned" a valid word?

Your mum actioned a suck on my dick

Cerberus

11:50 AM

Hi.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Wo?

Cerberus

Do.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Wow you speak Moselfränkisch?

Cerberus

Too bad you don't speak Dutch, or I would have spammed you with funny videos right now.

If I could find the right ones.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

I don't think you understand what spam means.

Cerberus

11:52 AM

I don't think you do!

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Spamming is all about not asking for permission or caring about people speaking Dutch.

Cerberus

Muwahaha.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Besides, I speak just enough Dutch to find any video in Dutch funny.

Cerberus

Somehow I don't think you would need to speak any Dutch for that.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Which is what I'm saying.

You are extra fast today, aren't you.

Cerberus

11:56 AM

0

Q: Relevant to vs. relevant for

Is there a rule to decide which is the better preposition? One is accusative and one dative but that doesn't really help me

prepositions

> One is accusative and one dative but that doesn't really help me

How come people like him even know these words?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Home assignment: which one is which?

Cerberus

The things people call "passive" also amaze me.

@RegDwightѬſ道 Haha, yes.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

12:35 PM

@Cerberus Pro tip: Just about anyone who refers to the "passive voice" is using that phrase wrong.

Cerberus

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Yeah, the probability will be near 99 % because people are stupid...or is there something about those exact words?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

If you want to be on the safe side, refer to the "active voice" instead.

Cerberus

@RegDwightѬſ道 ?

I think I'm missing something.

By the way, the latest threat to internet freedom is being negotiated around the Pacific:

Trans-Pacific Strategic Economic Partnership

The Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP), also known as the Trans-Pacific Strategic Economic Partnership Agreement, is a multilateral free trade agreement that aims to further liberalise the economies of the Asia-Pacific region; specifically, Article 1.1.3 notes: “The Parties seek to support the wider liberalisation process in APEC consistent with its goals of free and open trade and investment.” The proposals have been accused of being excessively restrictive, providing intellectual property restraints beyond those in the Korea-U.S. Free Trade Agreement and Anti-Counterfeiting Trade Agreeme...

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Aug 23 '11 at 22:38, by RegDwight Ѭſ道

@JasperLoy I am not saying that I am not linking to the Wikipedia article on joke again again.

Jul 29 '11 at 13:29, by RegDwight

@JSBangs I am not quoting myself about not linking to that Wikipedia article on joke again again.

Drift, catch, you, yada.

Cerberus

I could tell it was some kind of joke; I just don't get it.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

12:40 PM

You could see an ophtalmologist about it.

Cerberus

Probably because there is something about "voice"?

@RegDwightѬſ道 Hah. Hah.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Cerberus It's because people were taught passive voice in school, probably in the context of a science class where they were encouraged to use it for lab reports. And then later on, they forgot what little they learned about it and remembered only the label "passive" which they no longer understand.

Even Strunk and White's book on avoiding the use of the passive doesn't accurately provide examples of the passive voice in action.

Cerberus

Yeah I know.

Very strange.

But how is the word "voice" significant?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Well, it's not the word voice that's the problem. They just think "there are different 'voices', one passive, one active" and the "passive" one must be the opposite of aggressive. or something.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

1:02 PM

I am about to cut the Gordian Knot and migrate the absorbtion question to Linguistics. Any objections?

KitFox

The passive voice in action. That's funny.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@RegDwightѬſ道 Personally, I don't think the question is inappropriate for this site.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

The answers are.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

I think John's answer is somewhat lacking because it jumps to the part about latin

Cerberus

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Well, both voice exist; but you mean they interpret "voice" as a semantic concept instead of a syntactic one?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

1:05 PM

My problem with the question is of a different kind. Once more, I would like to point out that I closed it as gen-ref, not off-topic.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

What it needs is the true answer which you posted as a comment instead of as an answer, which is what led to the whole brouhaha

Cerberus

@RegDwightѬſ道 You have my shrugging.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@MrShinyandNew安宇 yeah, but I didn't post it as an answer precisely because it's gen-ref.

Off-topicness only comes in once you have looked it up. Chicken-and-egg.

KitFox

Oh, are you guys talking about Yoichi's question?

Because someone needs to give that a proper answer.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Nah, the other one.

11

Q: Why does the 'b' in absorb change to a 'p' in absorption?

The question pretty much says it all. Why is "absorbtion" an incorrect spelling?

spelling rules

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

1:07 PM

@RegDwightѬſ道 perhaps. But it bugs me that etymology questions are gen-ref.

KitFox

@RegDwightѬſ道 I meant about the Passive voice thing.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@MrShinyandNew安宇 it bugs me, too. But such is the status quo.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

so if someone looks up the etymology of absorb then they will find nothing that answers their question

Only if they think to look up the etymology of absorption

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Back in the day I used to post quotes from Etymonline as answers, too.

KitFox

@RegDwightѬſ道 Any questions that starts with "The question pretty much says it all." bugs me.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

1:08 PM

It's not always clear that all the different word formations have notable etymologies that differ from the root word's etymology

RegDwight Ѭſ道

But back in the day there was no such thing as gen-ref, either.

@KitFox Exactly! Thank you.

KitFox

I think you should migrate it to Latin.SE.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

It just cries "this question shows zero research effort".

@KitFox nah, that would be mean. And John's answer doesn't deserve that.

It does deserve to be on Linguistics, though.

KitFox

> That is a distinctly unhelpful answer. The real reason has to do with pronunciation, not etymology. Where did the /p/ come from?

That's annoying.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Well, this question is clearly from someone who doesn't understand how spelling changes over time, etc.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

1:10 PM

It's okay. We are here to teach just that. But saying that it's not really about English is part of the teaching.

Migration is part of our service here.

Cerberus

If an answers explains the etymology a bit more elaborately, I'd say it adds information.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@KitFox yeah, see? This is the part that makes me wish Reg had posted an answer. The answer is: "It was imported to English that way, see the etymology. In latin it had already changed to a p because of [john's answer], a process that also happens to other words in English." That, I think, makes for a useful answer that is relevant to modern english.

Cerberus

Etymonline is often barely intelligible for the inexperienced.

@MrShinyandNew安宇 I agree.

KitFox

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Agreed.

Cerberus

Message to room: hoi polloi means "the many".

RegDwight Ѭſ道

1:12 PM

@MrShinyandNew安宇 well knock yourself out. You have my vote.

KitFox

Or send it to Linguistics and stop worrying about it.

Cerberus

So no article please, and no singular.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

I'm not really in the business of posting answers anymore.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

Instead, John gets snarky, then posts an essay that explains part of the problem but glosses over an important detail, which is that nobody used the word in English until long after it was already changed.

@RegDwightѬſ道 Why not? I liked your answers.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Feb 22 '11 at 11:34, by FX_

Hoi is the Greek word for the, and the phrase hoi polloi means ‘the many’

KitFox

1:13 PM

3

Q: Why is "head for" in the passive voice in "Mitt Romney was headed for a decisive victory in Arizona”?

Today’s Washington Post article titled, “Romney wins big in Arizona, AP says” begins with the following sentence: Former Massachusetts governor Mitt Romney was headed for a decisive victory in Arizona Tuesday night, where he had the support of the state’s governor, Jan Brewer, and a sizable c...

phrases

Can someone give this a good answer?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@MrShinyandNew安宇 hey most of my answers are now gen-ref as well. In fact, right when the gen-ref close reason got introduced I closed a bunch of questions on which my answer was the accepted one.

And then the whole Jeff-explodes-in-our-faces thing happened, and nobody would post anything anyway.

Cerberus

> gods forbid we might stray from The Topic here. whatever it is. – John Lawler ↵ 15 hours ago

RegDwight Ѭſ道

And right now I just have work to do.

@Cerberus Haha yes. Well that is somewhat annoying.

Cerberus

@RegDwightѬſ道 But is this desirable? Why close such questions at all? What is the underlying reason behind the rule?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@Cerberus I never quite understood it either.

Cerberus

1:17 PM

@RegDwightѬſ道 I posted a comment supporting him. The Topic has annoyed me ever since I joined and continued to do so.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

I used to argue against it. Time and again.

It's on record. On Meta.

Cerberus

Then why execute it?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Because that's what I do.

Cerberus

I appreciate your sense of duty.

But...

I know I am too lazy to have a right to speak.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Jan 11 at 10:51, by RegDwight Ѭſ道

Dear everyone, if you don't like the rules, we can work on changing them. But simply breaking them at will won't cut it. As long as a rule is in place it has to be followed. Otherwise there's no point in having rules at all.

This is my stance.

Cerberus

1:20 PM

In Holland, we know better.

We just don't execute rules that nobody likes.

Oh, the Germans and their Rules!

And the Americans! And the French!

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@Cerberus why not dump them? Why have them in the first place?

So that some attorneys can get money by insisting on them?

Cerberus

@RegDwightѬſ道 Because dumping them is too hard to pull off.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

So what does it take to improve the criteria for gen-ref?

Cerberus

@RegDwightѬſ道 They don't. Not executing certain rules is official policy.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@Cerberus Smoke less, work more.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

1:21 PM

because it really bugs me that explaining an etymology is off-topic

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Hold on a sec, I'll look for a couple quotes on meta.

KitFox

Well.

Cerberus

@RegDwightѬſ道 See, that would defeat the purpose, since officially allowing the sale of drugs even though it is against the law is what this is about.

KitFox

I don't want us to explain the etymology of every word ever.

Cerberus

@RegDwightѬſ道 No need, we believe you.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

1:23 PM

13

A: Pointless questions and answers

The idea behind any StackExchange site is to build the ultimate resource on a given topic. Just like StackOverflow, with which it all began, we eventually want to cover all questions that are on-topic, even those already answered elsewhere. Just because an answer to a question is right there shou...

This was the original thinking. Not mine, mind you. This is what we started off with.

Cerberus

@KitFox It is very easy to give an etymological answer that goes well beyond what Etymonline has to offer, if only because often a bit more explanation helps a great deal.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Then one fine day it just changed. Just like that. It just did.

Let me see if I can find something...

KitFox

Why am I talking? I don't actually care. I think a bunch of things get closed as gen ref in an abrupt and snarky fashion when they aren't really gen ref if you don't know where to look, and I don't like that.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

8

A: Should we require some reasonable research being done? (aka Questions that can be answered by opening an online dictionary)

see http://meta.scifi.stackexchange.com/questions/197/should-trivially-easy-to-find-be-a-benchmark-for-moderating-the-site specifically some new close reason proposals: not sufficiently interesting: this question is too basic; it can be definitively and permanently answered by a single link...

See my comment on that answer.

KitFox

I also don't like it when I feel like our site is being handled by children.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

1:25 PM

Basically I called Jeff out on it, but never really got a satisfying reply.

Cerberus

Very typical.

So why bother carrying out the spirit of his policies?

He's a goner anyway.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

I resisted the gen-ref close reason after it got introduced. Sometimes by not closing at all, sometimes by picking a different (but still valid) reason.

But then it started getting traction in the community.

Cerberus

OK.

Robusto

@RegDwightѬſ道 What, you said prayers to JA and received nothing in reply? You must be a sinner.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

And then one fine day I just went through the list of my answers and closed a bunch of them as gen-ref.

Cerberus

1:28 PM

Personally I don't see the apparently widespread interest in closing questions at all. Why isn't down-voting enough?

KitFox

And the world got a little darker.

...I am about to do something very dangerous.

BRB

Cerberus

You're going to vote for S. in your state's primary?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Oh and when Jeff assploded and Rchern and Dori were here, I tried to stand up for our supposedly too basic questions, but they completely missed my point (and in fact so did Rob, though for a different reason).

Cerberus

I know you did.

KitFox

@Cerberus I'm disarming a bomb. I requires my full concentration.

Cerberus

1:31 PM

We wouldn't know what to do without you: nobody else invests nearly as much time in cleaning things up.

@KitFox Oh, are we distracting you?

KitFox

What do you boom

Robusto

@RegDwightѬſ道 How did I miss your point?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

I don't even remember the question now, but it was something along the lines of grey vs gray, to which I tried to provide an answer that went beyond being gen-ref. The point I was trying to make was that sometimes it really depends on the answers whether or not a question can be considered gen-ref.

@Robusto You thought it was just blatant rep-whoring.)))

Cerberus

@KitFox Maybe you should shake the bomb to test it. I mean, what if you were needlessly worrying over an innocent device?

@RegDwightѬſ道 Exactly. *

RegDwight Ѭſ道

And in fact it ended up not far away from just that. Because Dori and Rchern just went there and upvoted my answer and I got a pat on the back, but they missed my point.

Robusto

1:33 PM

@RegDwightѬſ道 You ceased being a rep whore in my eyes the moment my own rep-whorishness exceeded even your own.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@Robusto Haha. But that was like months before the incident in question.

Cerberus

That was a long time ago!

Jinx!

RegDwight Ѭſ道

KitFox

@Cerberus But actually it is "This password would not work."

Robusto

@RegDwightѬſ道 I don't recall the debate. Was it in meta?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

1:34 PM

My problem with all of this is that while I don't like how that 'absorb' question was written, and I'm annoyed at the snark in the comments, I like the "question" and I learned something from it. I think that is a good kind of question to have because it teaches about how words get borrowed and how pronunciation changes.

KitFox

@RegDwightѬſ道 How pineapply.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@Robusto Nah, here in chat.

I'm trying to think of a good key word to search for.

Robusto

@RegDwightѬſ道 And you don't have it open in one of your tabs? For shame.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@Robusto I have, but I lost the number.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

And if this question is not a good fit for this site, why do we even bother? We should just write a grammar textbook or style guide, post it on the blog, then shut down.

Cerberus

1:36 PM

@RegDwightѬſ道 Oh no, choices! mind shuts down

Robusto

@RegDwightѬſ道 You don't have the tab numbers in a database? For shame.

Cerberus

@KitFox That is your bomb? rolls eyes

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@Robusto I do. But that database is in a different tab still. Of which the number escapes me as well.

Cerberus

1 min ago, by Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

My problem with all of this is that while I don't like how that 'absorb' question was written, and I'm annoyed at the snark in the comments, I like the "question" and I learned something from it. I think that is a good kind of question to have because it teaches about how words get borrowed and how pronunciation changes.

This.

Except that I didn't learn anything.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Haha.

Cerberus

1:37 PM

But you know what I mean.

Robusto

@RegDwightѬſ道 Feet of clay, my friend. Feet of cuh-lay ...

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Well, that is kind of what the Reversal badge is for.

Cerberus

@MrShinyandNew安宇 Stop it! I can't keep on starring your every message.

KitFox

@Cerberus I have to do it manually. It is time consuming and requires doing updates on the production database, which is incredibly dangerous.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Downvote a crappy question into oblivion, provide an awesome answer that gets upvoted like hell, get a gold badge.

Except that on our site, such questions get 11 upvotes and zero downvotes.

And this is not an isolated incident.

Nobody has the Reversal badge.

KitFox

1:38 PM

140 Kweschun: Y u no suk my dik?

-10 Answer: [discussion of lolcat as linguistic phenomenon]

Cerberus

@KitFox Ohh that kind of bomb. Perhaps get get good food and baby pictures?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

2 hours ago, by RegDwight Ѭſ道

0

A: Is "actioned" a valid word?

Your mum actioned a suck on my dick

@Kit.

KitFox

@RegDwightѬſ道 Precisely.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

I wasn't sure.

You enter the room at the weirdestest time's.

Cerberus

@KitFox You mean "Actually, the etymology of "dick" is quite interesting in light of its meaning in the 18th century, and blah blah..."

KitFox

1:40 PM

@RegDwightѬſ道 I love, support, and affirm you as our leader.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Put me on the Ritz.

Cerberus

It is good to see you united on such a subject.

I.e. the "action" described.

KitFox

►

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Why English misspell Putin always?

KitFox

@Cerberus R u impling i suk dik?

Robusto

1:42 PM

I'm more curious why someone would take the name "Adolf Garlic" ...

Cerberus

@KitFox If you like.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@Robusto You mean you wanted to take it?

Cerberus

@Robusto Yeah Adolf was hardly a garlic eater...

Is that even an expression in English?

KitFox

I took it, but I put it back when I was done with it.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Aug 15 '11 at 19:22, by RegDwight Ѭſ道

Etymonline sez: O.E. garleac (Mercian), garlec (W. Saxon) "garlic," from gar "spear" (in reference to the clove), see gar + leac "leek" (see leek).

Gen-ref.

Robusto

1:43 PM

@RegDwightѬſ道 Well, you have to admit it strikes one dumb with awe.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Obviously "spear" is a reference to "fasci", whence fascist, which Adolf kind of was.

Robusto

@RegDwightѬſ道 Thank you, but I studied Old English and know the derivation of the term. It is the combination that is of interest.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@Robusto to you, my friend. To you.

Nöone älse cares.

Robusto

@RegDwightѬſ道 To me and all right-thinking people. YMMV.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

You have way too many right-thinking people in your country.

Not that we want to have them over here.

Robusto

1:45 PM

@RegDwightѬſ道 Curiously, the right-thinking people are also the wrong-thinking people. So how do you like them apples?

2

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Pine. I like my apples pine.

Robusto

[Waits for Reg to make a remark about apples.]

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Also, seven.

Robusto

Haha, see? I knew you were going to say that.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@Robusto My remarks are faster than your waiting.

Robusto

1:45 PM

I had it ready to fire right after I saw yours.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

I am the speed of light, baby.

Robusto

@RegDwightѬſ道 You're just a tweaker. It's an illusion brought on by too much reliance on amphetamines.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

There can be too much reliance on amphetamines?

How about you start making sense for a change.

Robusto

@RegDwightѬſ道 Watch all four seasons of Breaking Bad and then we'll talk.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Wow, another achievement in the field of excellence: Watching TV all day!

Robusto

1:48 PM

@RegDwightѬſ道 You don't have to watch it all day. You can spread it out over, like, a week if you want.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Sorry, Watching TV all week.

Robusto

@RegDwightѬſ道 Also, this from a man who regularly leaves chat to watch American Dad.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

I never left chat for that.

I used that as an alibi.

Robusto

@RegDwightѬſ道 Lies!

You say that now.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Sometimes I just read stuff here without posting. That's called listening to others, you know.

Robusto

1:49 PM

What were you doing with the goat? Was that an alibi too?

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Well, did it work?

Robusto

The jury is still out. And I mean "the jury" literally.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

@Robusto no it was an albino

RegDwight Ѭſ道

An alibi that doesn't work isn't.

Robusto

Stop trying to wear me out.

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

1:50 PM

alibino: An alibi that involves an albino

RegDwight Ѭſ道

@Robusto You misspelled "succeeding in".

Robusto

The "you misspelled" meme is played out. Let's go back to LOLCATZ or something.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

Robusto

You misspelled "misspellz" ...

KitFox

You misspell everyting.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

1:56 PM

TIL that Fred Astaire was a Jedi.

Source: YouTube.

►

KitFox

Man, how much do I love Fred Astaire.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

OVER 9000.

But seriously, how he dunnit?

Mr. Shiny and New 安宇

A friend of mine is composing a percussion concerto. I think he needs to include a tap-dancing cane-waving soloist.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

This Hollywood trickery is playing tricks on my mind.

Robusto

Baryshnikov described Fred Astaire as "absolute elegance" and the best dancer he had ever seen.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

1:59 PM

And then he went on to make out with Sarah Jessica Parker.

Robusto

Nobody's perfect.

RegDwight Ѭſ道

That's what she said.

Transcript for

English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…