English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

Matt Ellen

9:00 PM

:)

Cerberus

@MattEllen Oh! Well, not on this side of the Channel!

Matt Ellen

But this room can get a bit hot and humid!

Cerberus

Yes it can!

user19161

@MattEllen Wait till you come here. It's humid 24 7 52.

Matt Ellen

@JasperLoy I like it all apart from how difficult I find it to breathe in

Cerberus

9:01 PM

@JasperLoy Really? Oh, dear. How many degrees Celsius is it there in winter?

user19161

@Cerberus Well, we don't call it winter though, but day temperatures almost always 32. But we're talking about humidity here.

user19161

Actually, it's the humidity that makes you feel hot, not the temp. Body temp is 37.

aedia

@JSBangs pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anan%C3%A1s

Oh, that's mean! It doesn't make the pretty box for Portuguese Wikipedia!

user19161

@aedia Maybe you can't type anything on the same line?

Matt Ellen

Língua guarani

O guarani é uma língua indígena do sul da América do Sul, falada pelos povos da etnia guarani, estes pertencentes ao grupo maior dos tupis-guaranis. Uma variante, popularmente conhecida como língua tupi ou nheengatu, foi usada pelos colonizadores portugueses e missionários jesuítas desde o descobrimento até fins do século XVIII. Desse modo acabou influenciando fortemente o idioma falado no Brasil legando várias expressões e vocábulos ao português brasileiro, preponderantemente na toponímia (designação de lugares v.g. Paraná, Ivaí, Paraguai, Piraí, Guamirim, etc). A língua viva A varia...

@JasperLoy score 1 for you!

user19161

9:08 PM

You guys are still talking about pineapples from before I took my shower till now.

Matt Ellen

we like our conversations fruity

aedia

The Google Translate version of the Ananas article is great. It's like, "the word pineapple is used to mean the crappy fruit; on the other hand, pineapple is used to indicate the awesome fruit." Abacaxi is the latter (I discovered after much mousing over and comparing)...

user19161

The only fruit I eat is the banana. They are always sweet.

user19161

Apples, pears and oranges can be sour, but not bananas.

Matt Ellen

@aedia lol

aedia

9:10 PM

@JasperLoy I totally swore you could have the lil reply arrow on there but I must be mixing it up with pictures.

user19161

@aedia Maybe there's a diff between clicking reply and typing?

aedia

@MattEllen And that was just an example of that use of "like" where it's not quiet quotative, but close. If only I could remember what it was called, I would look it up. Arrgh. I'm getting as bad as @Cerberus.

@JasperLoy Oh. Right. Probably.

user19161

Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.

Matt Ellen

@aedia simile?

?

user19161

@aedia I'm always right. Well, most of the time.

simchona

9:13 PM

My brain hurts:

0

Q: Does "'tis" means "this is" or "it is"?

I have found much trouble identifying the old word 'tis. Does it mean "this is" or "it is?" I have done some research and found that the dictionaries conflict. One said 'tis :An old English word used in the place of this is ; a contraction of this is. I showed this to my brother and he showed...

old-english

aedia

Hmm, well, I guess, but it's more a spoken phenomenon. Maybe it is "quotative like," when speakers insert "like" to say what someone said. runs off to see if quotative like can include paraphrase

user19161

@simchona I just realised that Thursagan not = Thursagen. Oh man!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

simchona

@Jasper That's just what they WANT us to think

Matt Ellen

Right you pineapples, I am off to bed.

user19161

@simchona I think Thursagan is an account of the same person, but he won't use it to upvote himself anymore.

Jez

9:17 PM

could be a pineapple in the UK right now

it's so hot

feels like the Caribbean

simchona

@Jasper Did he upvote himself before?

user19161

@Jez Maybe seeing red all the time makes you hotter?

user19161

@simchona Wasn't that supposedly why Thursagen got suspended?

simchona

@Jasper I'm not sure. I wasn't privy to the reasons

user19161

@simchona Reason given was 'voting irregularities'.

simchona

9:19 PM

@Jasper Hmmmmm... Maybe, then. But the new dummy account is new. Who's to say he won't do it again?

user19161

@simchona Because once bitten twice shy?

aedia

@MattEllen G'night MattE!

simchona

@Jasper That assumes learning

user19161

@MattEllen guten nacht. buona sera.

user19161

@aedia That doesn't sound right in real life!

Cerberus

9:22 PM

@aedia As bad as who? What?

@simchona Wow. 32 is hot.

simchona

32 is hot?

user19161

@simchona He clicked wrongly again!

Cerberus

@simchona Isn't it?

simchona

I don't do Celsius...

Cerberus

Ah.

It should be about 90 F.

simchona

9:24 PM

Ohhh. With or without humidity?

aedia

@Cerberus Bad doggies! Um. I mean... I think I am getting as forgetful as you.

Cerberus

@aedia I know. I was just pretending.

@simchona Jasper said it was 32 even in winter, when it is probably not humid.

aedia

@JasperLoy What real life?

user19161

@Cerberus She didn't understand because you clicked on the wrong message!

aedia

@Cerberus mock scowls

Cerberus

9:26 PM

@JasperLoy Oh! My bad.

user19161

@aedia You would not say goodnight Matt E to Matt in real life. You would say Matt without the E.

Alain Pannetier

@all. Just a thought: Are there nice exhibitions where you guys live?

user19161

@AlainPannetier What kind?

Cerberus

Yeah there are always exhibitions...

aedia

@JasperLoy But (disregarding how I clicked the lil arrow and thus made it say his name twice) the E makes it a diminutive as well as distinguishing him from any other Matts. And I know a lot of them.

Alain Pannetier

9:28 PM

Like interesting (art, archeology, science, creepy crawlies etc)

simchona

We don't get too many. Too expensive to ship over.

user19161

@aedia I see. But even if I knew lots of Matts in real life, I wouldn't say that to him in real life. But that's just me!

aedia

@AlainPannetier I went to some of the museums in DC just last weekend! There are always nice things. I should go more often.

Alain Pannetier

@simchona you're more into trade shows i guess?

simchona

@Alain It's not what I'm into; it's what they can afford to bring. In that sense, we don't get much.

Kind of thousands of miles away from other land masses

Cerberus

9:31 PM

@AlainPannetier Why do you ask? I haven't checked, but I'm sure there is plenty to see here.

aedia

@JasperLoy Some people with common names like Nick or Matt we call even just by their last names (to the point where it surprises or confuses me to hear them called by first name alone).

Cerberus

@simchona Wait, you're not in America?

simchona

@Cerb I am.

aedia

He'll figure it out in a second.

Alain Pannetier

DC usually has nice ones (Smithsonian, National gallery of Art...)

Cerberus

9:32 PM

But there is plenty of art there, I should think? Why not?

simchona

@aedia I assume you got it?

aedia

I cheated. I think you mentioned it before.

I guess remembering isn't exactly cheating.

Cerberus

It is!

user19161

@Cerberus Are there many pineapples there, the fruit I mean?

simchona

@Jasper Did you misclick?

Alain Pannetier

9:34 PM

@Cerberus because I'm watching a program about an exhibition in London about maps and I feel like browsing the Internet for more.

user19161

@simchona Yes!

Cerberus

@JasperLoy Where? They don't grow here, I presume.

simchona

@Jasper Yes, there are lots of pineapple fields here. This is not, however, to say that we are entirely rural. We're really not.

user19161

@Cerberus I misclicked like you!

Cerberus

@AlainPannetier Old maps?

@JasperLoy It is contagious.

user19161

9:38 PM

@Cerberus In this case it happened because while I was trying to click, more messages got posted and the posts moved upwards you see!

simchona

Beaucoup d'ananas

user19161

Do you guys like durian?

Alain Pannetier

Yes that was nearly one year ago.
I recorded all the documentaries and they are broadcasting them again on BBC-HD tonight. Gorgeous!
http://www.bl.uk/magnificentmaps/

simchona

@Jasper My roommate does. She's from Malaysia.

user19161

Durian

The durian () is the fruit of several tree species belonging to the genus Durio and the Malvaceae family (although some taxonomists place Durio in a distinct family, Durionaceae). Widely known and revered in southeast Asia as the "king of fruits", the durian is distinctive for its large size, unique odour, and formidable thorn-covered husk. The fruit can grow as large as long and in diameter, and it typically weighs one to three kilograms (2 to 7 lb). Its shape ranges from oblong to round, the colour of its husk green to brown, and its flesh pale yellow to red, depending on t...

user19161

9:40 PM

It seems that most non-Asians hate durians, dunno why.

aedia

@JasperLoy This is a food?

user19161

@aedia It is a fruit as well.

Cerberus

@AlainPannetier Maps are my best friends too! (@Aed after Dishwasher)

They sell Durians not twenty meters from where I am sitting now.

Except that the shop is closed.

That's why all the Chinese shops here stink pretty bad (no offence).

I am looking through the window of the shop now, but I can't make out any durians.

user19161

Agreed, they do leave a strong smell.

user19161

I think the smell scares foreigners away, but they should really taste it. It's nothing but sweet.

Cerberus

9:43 PM

You actually like it?

user19161

Like yes, but don't usually eat it. Always sweet just like the banana.

Alain Pannetier

@Cerberus, I actually collect old atlases. I've got two of 1909 and one of 1913.

Cerberus

My friend has tasted one, and she is very open minded, loves gross things more than anything. But she was disgusted.

Alain Pannetier

Plus various newer ones.

user19161

@AlainPannetier Very interesting.

Cerberus

9:44 PM

@AlainPannetier Oh, cool! I have some 18th-century maps.

They can be had quite cheap on Ebay.

Alain Pannetier

I do have 18th century books but no maps.

user19161

@Cerberus Maybe because the flesh looks like poop.

user19161

Yellowish baby poop.

Cerberus

@AlainPannetier I also have 17th-century books, and 16th-century etchings. Muwaha!

Alain Pannetier

wow; that starts to be a museum.

Cerberus

9:47 PM

@JasperLoy She said it tastes like rotten meat, just like the smell.

I also have a silver Roman coin and a few Greek coins (really not that expensive off Ebay).

user19161

I have no ancient items, and I have not gone to any real exhibition for the past decade!

aedia

@Cerberus I love maps too :) My family had a lot of these National Geographic maps all over the house when I was a kid...

Alain Pannetier

I don't spend too much money on coins "Samlung" now . If find it hard enough to have a house large enough in the suburbs of Paris to house all these books.

What are your coins?

Empire? sesterces? staters?

Cerberus

@aedia Pretty!

aedia

I am envious of your collecting though @Alain and @Cerberus! I have made myself vow not to buy anything like that until I have settled on a more permanent residence to put it in. It is difficult to restrain myself.

Alain Pannetier

9:52 PM

@aedia. You're right. I've stopped purchasing etchings as well. I'm out of walls to hang them...

simchona

What do you all think about the various e-readers?

Alain Pannetier

@simchona, do you have a special one in sight. As an android/ios developer, I prefer a full fledged tablet.

simchona

@Alain I was looking at the Nooks (Color and BW)

Alain Pannetier

I'd go for colour if I were you. B&W seems to be something to regret in hindsight.

aedia

@simchona Hmm. I have an older Kindle and I don't know much about the others. I like it well enough for novels to read once through. I like my textbooks in dead tree form still.

simchona

9:55 PM

@Aedia I definitely like holding a textbook. But I do buy mags and books.

Alain Pannetier

What I don't like is all the formats the vendors lock you in.

simchona

I was attracted to the color because of how many magazines I read, but the battery life is less than 8 hours

Alain Pannetier

I want to be able to move my PDFs around.

May be even dust them off at times.

Cerberus

@aedia As long as you buy very small objects, you can't go wrong...

aedia

@Cerberus Oh, no! Don't tempt me. You're terrible.

That's how it starts. Just one book, you say, and soon you've got whole encyclopaedias.

Cerberus

9:59 PM

Hehe...

A coin is really small.

I don't know much about coins, but I like having a Greek coin, because it is by far the oldest object in my house.

Spare Oom

@aedia My Kindle is B&W, and is good enough for most books, but it would have been nice to see images from magazines in color. Brain scan images in color are so much more fun! But I can see the color images on my laptop if necessary. Kindle is free for Macbooks and PCs too, I think.

@aedia But they take up no room. :)

simchona

@SpareOom Can you read magazines on the Kindle itself? Or just on an external app?

Jez

@AlainPannetier How come you're not committed to A51 french language and usage?

Cerberus

I have a question about electronic books readers: when do you take them with you? Isn't it a burned to have to carry them around and not scratch/break/lose them?

aedia

@SpareOom Oh, I didn't know there was a version for desktop computers! I do have the Android app.

Spare Oom

10:06 PM

I don't know what I do. They're as a pdf, but you can also get a subscription to them to read.

I have one for Macbook at least. I think I heard about desktop. You should double check me on that.

@Cerberus The carrier I have has a hook on it. Also, some people's purses are big enough to carry them.

Cerberus

@SpareOom I suppose so... but real books are so much easier to handle!

Alain Pannetier

@Jez the previous reason is that I was committed to linguistics, history and japanese. The new reason, now that I've uncommitted all my previous commitments following the TPTB vs the rest of EL&U episode is that I don't feel I can sincerely commit any more.

Cerberus

@AlainPannetier I feel the same.

Spare Oom

@Cerberus Until you want to travel and read a book on a plane.

aedia

@Cerberus I carry mine when I travel, to avoid carrying lots of physical books, but if I am not in the middle of a really good book I don't always take it on my daily commute.

Cerberus

10:10 PM

@SpareOom Why can't I read a real book on a plane? I do?

bracho monacho

Hello! Long time no see... Did I miss much?

Spare Oom

Sorry, you have a choice of what to read.

Cerberus

@aedia It'd just be another thing to worry about for me, though I suppose it's different if you're a woman and you can't put your phone/wallet in your pants/pockets anyway.

@brachomonacho Hi!

Spare Oom

@Cerberus Of course I read books on planes too.

Cerberus

@SpareOom Right, you can decide at the last moment. But then you'd have had to pick a lot of books beforehand.

aedia

10:12 PM

@Cerberus Whoever designed women's dress pants without useful pockets should... should... have to wear them forever. Blasted things.

4

Spare Oom

@Cerberus I understand Ipod touches are small enough to fit in your pocket and also have e-reader applications, don't they?

Cerberus

@aedia Yes! Haha, an excellent punishment.

Alain Pannetier

Possibly in linguistics, the entry ticket would be more expensive and the audience more elitist. Also possibly prudishness-driven people could not keep an eye on languages they're not familiar with and there would be less tridents in other non English forums... In the meantime wait and see...

Spare Oom

@aedia Exactly what my dad would say. <3

Cerberus

@SpareOom I can read PDF and Word on my 4-y-o phone, so that isn't a problem. But you either have a small screen, or you need to carry it around.

Spare Oom

10:14 PM

Or you can carry a man-purse.

bracho monacho

@aedia Maybe it's a sign that sporrans should come back into fashion. Heehee

Cerberus

@AlainPannetier Tridents?

@brachomonacho Hi! Not much.

Spare Oom

@Cerberus Is a backpack convenient?

Cerberus

@AlainPannetier I think Linguistics will not be viable in any case. Who would be asking the questions? SE wants many questions a day.

aedia

@Cerberus I usually carry a small backpack on my commute, anyway, for paperwork/notebook from w-o-r-k and umbrella and water bottle and such to survive the bus or metro. So a Kindle or laptop fits in there when I need them.

Alain Pannetier

10:15 PM

@Cerberus Like the greek letter after Phi.

Cerberus

@SpareOom I never takes bags with me when I can avoid it, but I suppose a backpack is acceptable. But it isn't so much the bag as the fact that you have a vulnerable, expensive instrument in it.

Alain Pannetier

@Cerberus I would ask a lot of (dummy) questions. At the moment I understand only half of what I read about linguistics.

Cerberus

@AlainPannetier Ahh those. I had forgotten all about them. And it comes after chi.

Alain Pannetier

right.

bracho monacho

@Cerberus What's the greek letter after chi?

(I only know greek letters that are used in equations).

Cerberus

10:17 PM

@AlainPannetier I don't know... even Philosophy gets too few questions.

Alain Pannetier

Got my new name wrong then. I thought it was trendy anyway.

Cerberus

@brachomonacho Psi!

@AlainPannetier I suppose it was! I just never remember things.

Spare Oom

@Cerberus Kindle: $139 Not too bad, really.

An added benefit is that you can take notes in the e-reader.

Cerberus

@SpareOom It's still not funny if you lose that at the rate I lose umbrellas.

bracho monacho

@Cerberus Oh, I know that one... it's cool! (I think I had to use it once in a physics course that I failed.)

aedia

10:18 PM

@brachomonacho I didn't know what those were called! Tee hee.

Cerberus

I can take notes on a piece of paper folded in my pocket.

Spare Oom

@Cerberus Then you need something that has a cable attached to it.

Cerberus

@brachomonacho Hmm I don't remember whether it was used in physics... probably so, since they use a great many Greek letters.

Alain Pannetier

@SpareOom, that's a plus. I don't have a good solution for this today.

Cerberus

@SpareOom A cable? Oh, my, I hadn't even considered cables... what are those for?

aedia

10:20 PM

Spare Oom

@Cerberus Idk. They make cables to lock down computers to desktops, I was just extrapolating.

Someone should invent their use for people who can't hold on to their belongings.

@aedia haha

Cerberus

Hehe.

Your theory has merit.

@aedia It should probably be I who was wearing the thingy, or whatever that is called.

Spare Oom

@aedia Those don't work with smart children.

Cerberus

No?

aedia

Spare Oom

10:23 PM

or maybe I just know a Houdini.

bracho monacho

Most people don't... (I didn't know what it was called until I joined my local pipe band.)
It's funny, a lot of people I've met who don't know what they're called end up picking the term "man bag".

aedia

See, teh cables exists for people who can't remember what pocket they putted the wallet in.

Spare Oom

I heard the term man bag on a commercial.

Cerberus

@aedia Oh, God, those...

Man bag is a well known term here.

Though they are not often spotted in the wild.

aedia

@Cerberus I must have safesearch on... I did not see any photos of underwear sticking out, in my search, but the two are inevitably linked, in my experience.

Spare Oom

10:26 PM

They also call them "Men's European shoulder bags"

Cerberus

@aedia Yes, very much so! Pants often hang down attached to the underwear, even. I have seen it.

@SpareOom Shoulder bags?

Grace Note

@Cerberus Better than the "Men's European One-Legged Pant"

Cerberus

With a long strap, or a short one? The former would seem pretty normal...

Grace Note

(AKA a long denim skirt)

Spare Oom

I just googled man bag and got that result.

Cerberus

10:27 PM

@GraceNote What the... aha!

Hehe.

Mana

OMG FASHIOOOOON

waves arms

Cerberus

This is what I was thinking of.

Spare Oom

Those are popular?

Cerberus

Or this:

aedia

That (the former) kinda looks like a fanny pack.

Cerberus

10:30 PM

No, they are rather uncommon here.

Spare Oom

google.com/products/…

Cerberus

But this is quite common:

Spare Oom

That's as expensive as the Kindle, so someone is sure to know that something expensive is inside.

Cerberus

Hehe.

Yeah.

aedia

Ew (middle one) nobody looks good carrying those lumpy hobo bag things. Like a tote bag and a quilt snuggled together.

Spare Oom

10:31 PM

If you buy a cheap one, it probably just contains regular books.

Cerberus

@aedia Yeah not my taste.

Spare Oom

@Cerberus That one looks fine to me.

And the bag too.

aedia

@Cerberus Plain bags like this one are totes normal here for people of all kinds.

Spare Oom

That might even fit a collapsable umbrella in it.

bracho monacho

@Cerberus Actually, I can't remember when I've used psi in physics either... So I've probably just seen an astrophysicist writing it in an ugly quantum mechanics problem.

Grace Note

10:33 PM

Cerberus

@SpareOom Hehe. I agree.

@aedia Yeah they are common here as well.

Spare Oom

@GraceNote What ... is... that?

bracho monacho

@aedia lol at fanny pack... In Australia, fanny refers to the front bum.

Grace Note

@SpareOom A men's one-legged pant.

Spare Oom

lol

Cerberus

10:34 PM

@brachomonacho Could be... or it could be the letter phi you saw, with stands for rotational velocity, if I remember correctly.

Spare Oom

a skirt?

bracho monacho

@Cerberus o.O That's the craziest man bag I've ever seen.

Grace Note

@SpareOom I'd call it that

Cerberus

@brachomonacho Front bum! That is a fun expression. We have that too in Dutch (voorbips), but I had no idea it existed in English.

@GraceNote That is... astonishing.

@brachomonacho We see them here in Amsterdam.

Spare Oom

Did fanny packs used to be worn on the back fanny?

aedia

10:36 PM

@brachomonacho I forgot! I don't even know another name for fanny pack. We do make fun of tourists carrying them...

bracho monacho

@Cerberus Na... Definitely a psi. www4.ncsu.edu/unity/lockers/users/f/felder/public/kenny/papers/…

user19161

@brachomonacho They all can be. :)

bracho monacho

@GraceNote Is that some sort of FF attire?

Grace Note

@brachomonacho FF?

bracho monacho

Final Fantasy

Grace Note

10:37 PM

(For the record, that particular one-legged pant used to be sold at Hot Topic)

@brachomonacho Oh, no, that's just plain old real-world fashion

user19161

@brachomonacho I thought you meant funfair.

bracho monacho

@SpareOom That's what I always wondered, too... Noone calls them fanny packs in Australia; they're always called bumbags.

Cerberus

@brachomonacho What the... that is no psi! Y is upsilon/ypsilon.

Those people are insane.

aedia

@SpareOom Hmm, I've seen them on both. I even had one when I was a kid. At least one. And then later one of those miniature backpacks. Ugh. Also a lot of neon.

Spare Oom

Here, as far as I know, fanny is the back bum, and they seem to fit there better than in front, where they're in the way

@aedia They used to call them book bags, I think, but that could have been used for the kind you carry too.

Grace Note

10:40 PM

@Cerberus I see a PSI in there, specifically a capital one

bracho monacho

@JasperLoy No, I'm not good at making up acronyms.

Grace Note

Cerberus

@GraceNote This is a psi:

Yes.

bracho monacho

@Cerberus I see a capital psi too.

Grace Note

@Cerberus I learned the Greek Alphabet long before I even learned Greek Mythology

Cerberus

10:41 PM

Is it my browser then!?

bracho monacho

@JasperLoy P.S.: lol at the new avatar. (That is all.)

Grace Note

(Which is why I'd call a reverse alphabetical process "Omegapsical" rather than "Zetabetical")

user19161

@GraceNote I learnt the Greek alphabet last year but forgot it this year.

Grace Note

@Cerberus I think that fellow cannot type an actual Psi

So is using Y as a substitute by graphical resemblance rather than linguistic translation

Cerberus

Then he shouldn't type an Y!

bracho monacho

10:42 PM

@GraceNote Wow that's the first time I've ever seen the word zetabetical.

aedia

@SpareOom Bookbag = backpack in my dialect; mini backpack = something else horrendous...

Cerberus

That is just bad.

Grace Note

@Cerberus Ooh, I don't deny that

Michael Myers

Is it true that "psi" is derived from "Poseidon"?

Spare Oom

Those actually would bother my back.

Cerberus

10:43 PM

He should just have Google the letter and copied it off Wikipedia.

Grace Note

@brachomonacho We had a short story we read in grade school about the "Zetabet", which was about people who fancied the reverse alphabet, ate Zucchinis all day, and lived in ziggurats.

Spare Oom

Well, folks, I need to go for now. Bye.

Grace Note

From a literary perspective, "Zetabet" works better because of the Z matching to our last letter. But from linguistic perspective, it drove me nuts. And I was too young to even know linguistics back then, yet it drove me nuts.

bracho monacho

haha

user19161

@GraceNote Where are the nuts? Share some with us.

bracho monacho

10:45 PM

Ziggurat is an awesome word.

Cerberus

@MichaelMyers I think not, but I am not sure. There are many other letters that end in -i.

Grace Note

@brachomonacho It is, and so I endeavour to use it in a lot of my projects.

Cerberus

@SpareOom Adios!

aedia

@SpareOom Safe passage to the wardrobe!

Michael Myers

@Cerberus But it's a tiny little trident even!

Cerberus

10:46 PM

Pi, xi, chi, phi, psi.

@MichaelMyers Ah! Haha.

bracho monacho

It's your browser.
https://skydrive.live.com/#!/?cid=2b8cae2bf5ef82f8&sc=documents&uc=1&id=2B8CAE2BF5EF82F8%21104!cid=2B8CAE2BF5EF82F8&id=2B8CAE2BF5EF82F8%21123&sc=documents

user19161

And I realised that the greek way of pronouncing the greek letters is diff from the Eng way.

bracho monacho

@GraceNote Ooh, what kind of project has ziggurats in it?

Grace Note

@Cerberus Aren't Xi and Chi the same or am I being really stupid right now?

Michael Myers

Hmm. Wikipedia says the origin of Φ, Χ, and Ψ is disputed.

Cerberus

10:48 PM

@brachomonacho Is it? That is good/bad to hear. I don't get anything when I click your link except my own Skydrive.

Grace Note

@brachomonacho One of my game world settings includes a religious leader called the High Patriarch, whose main religious office eventually is a Ziggurat. That's the main one.

user19161

@GraceNote xi=ksi

bracho monacho

@Cerberus Hmm.... I'll try again..

Grace Note

@JasperLoy Could you put out the actual Greek letters?

Cerberus

@GraceNote The letter that looks like X is pronounced chi; the letter that looks like three horizontal bars is pronounced xi.

@MichaelMyers Which article? The one psi said nothing to me.

user19161

10:50 PM

Greek alphabet

The Greek alphabet is a set of twenty-four letters that has been used to write the Greek language since the 8th century BC. It is still in use today. It is the first and oldest alphabet in the narrow sense that it notes each vowel and consonant with a separate symbol. The letters were also used to represent Greek numerals, beginning in the 2nd century BC. The Greek alphabet is descended from the Phoenician alphabet, and is not related to Linear B or the Cypriot syllabary, earlier writing systems for Greek. It has given rise to many other alphabets used in Europe and the Middle East...

Grace Note

@Cerberus Right.

Like Arda Xi

Michael Myers

@Cerberus What Jasper Loy said.

Grace Note

Which I've been mispronouncing for a year, because I confuse the letter Xi with the letter X (in part because I confused the capital Xi having a different lower case than it does)

Michael Myers

@GraceNote I assumed it was Chinese and pronounced it "She". Is that wrong?

Kit

@MichaelMyers Tsi, not she.

Grace Note

10:52 PM

@MichaelMyers It's based on the letter Xi. He even used the capital to combat my music note a few times.

@Kit Actually, at least the way I've known it, "She" is closer. But that really depends on what dialect and which romanization method you're going for.

(I loathe Chinese transliteration)

Michael Myers

@Kit Close enough. It sounded like "she" when my teacher said it.

bracho monacho

@GraceNote Xi is the squiggly one that looks vaguely like a zeta (comparing lowercase letters). en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xi_(letter)

Kit

"She" would be retroflected, which "xi" is not. At least not in standard Chinese.

Grace Note

@Kit "Standard"?

Kit

@GraceNote Textbook, "mandarin", putonghua, usually Beijing dialect.

Grace Note

10:54 PM

You might be more right on a linguistic level, I wouldn't know. I only know what it sounds like in the way I've been taught it all my life, is that it's basically an SH sound. TS would be for summat else.

bracho monacho

@Cerberus I can't find the image link for my upload... It's just got an embed thing. (Hopefully this works...)