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12:01 AM
@MattE.Эллен I haven't seen -any- of the neo-pronouns in anybody's list. They're like a theoretical solution that just ignores how people work.
like, as @tchrist has hinted, I find it unlikely that Spanish speakers will adopt 'latinx' ever. only anglos do it because they don't care how it sounds because it doesn't apply to them.
 
@Mitch The majority of them actually find that term offensive.
Just read that today.
The English word lynx would be unpronounceable in Spanish because their phonotactic constraints forbid it.
But it just isn't a word you can even SAY in Spanish. It's not possible.
 
@tchrist so Chinese (entirely caseless. yay Chinese!) has a non-gendered pronoun tā which presumably should make every gender happy. But supposedly even with the ungendered word, there's still default gendered presumption to think the referent is predominantly male (depending on context). Reference for this? Some comment I half remember on Language Log for which I have no keywords to find again.
 
"Rhymes with pharynx"
Your what hurts?
 
@tchrist Oh... I thought it was pronounced 'latin eks' in English. The latinxos/as should just give in to anglocentrism and pronounce it that way.
 
¡Pero el inglés no lo hablamos aquí, no lo sabías?
 
12:11 AM
por supuesto
or I should say 'exactamundo'
haha
that doesn't even exist
 
De boca española esa palabra no sale ni nunca ni jamás.
 
like 'no problemo'
 
Fonzorelli.
 
Genau
I -am- surprised that people try to use naturally 'themself'. That just sounds like an engine having trouble starting. But people are saying it so good for them.
but them also
ok I'm starting on a pet peeve rant
 
This is a non-issue. Let's forget about it.
 
12:17 AM
but then also it really bothers me when people say 'paths' without voicing the '-ths'.
It's like they haven't heard them before and they try and pronounce out the spelling in their head and that's the way it comes out
bath -> baths (/bæðz)
path -> paths (/pæðz)
wreath -> wreaths (/rI:ðz)
I'm sure there's more.
ok, rant over, got that out of my system
if that's all I have to complain about today, things are going pretty good then.
I mean it could be r
looks out window
whew
I mean it could be raining
Which issue is not an issue?
1) there were a bunch just mentioned
2) I've moved on
3) if you call it an issue it's an issue and can't be a non-issue, that is literally the most contradictioningness-in-terms possible.
and some other fourth thing
well
@Cerberus I see I -have- forgotten what we were talking about.
So
I guess
well done on my part?
What's up next?
The Webb telescope is supposed to be launched... is it Dec 22nd?
That's something to look forward to
 
@Mitch Excellent!
 
@Cerberus all you have to do is wait for me to distract myself and
BAM
Where was I?
something about rain?
webs?
spider webs?
no, that doesn't seem right
OK how about this...is there a reliable news source?
 
You were talking about parasite waps?
 
I don't see a parasite wasp.
 
12:30 AM
You mentioned something else though
 
I don't remember mentioning women in a pool, but OK, sure.
 
poetic license?
I think it's a metaphor
 
They don't look Protestant, though.
 
I don't know why Rosalia is in that video though for a 1/2 second
@Cerberus No, I don't think so either.
 
So no wasps.
 
12:40 AM
@Mitch breathes, moths, houses, calves, wives
 
@tchrist yeah 'moths' is what I was thinking of. or rather unable to think of.
'houses'... I don't hear it... or rather I think nothing of the difference
 
houses is voiced; house’s is unvoiced.
 
and I guess I've never heard anyone say calfs?
 
Really? I hear woofs all the time.
 
@tchrist well I'm sure there's a rule but it doesn't bother me if peope say it voiced or unvoiced.
 
12:44 AM
Drives me bunkers.
 
@tchrist wife's?
hoofs/hooves sounds fine to me.
I still think it's supposed to be dwarves and rooves
 
Well, everybody SAYS it with a V, they just might lack the force of conviction to write it with one.
 
that's what we need more people with the force of conviction
half the people you wish would have more confidence, the other half should just back off man
hm... my dog brain is telling me that someone would be very happy if I ate some food. And I totally want to make them happy...
BBL
 
 
1 hour later…
2:17 AM
 
Yeah, we don't have that here!
 
> I was in Russia listening to a stand-up comedian making fun of Putin.
The jokes weren't that good, but I liked the execution.
@tchrist Nice, totally comprehensible. Thank you, invaders of 1066, for making French more comprehensible to English learners worldwide.
 
Indeed.
 
Invasions. Connecting people.
 
2:31 AM
So much for keeping their distances.
Sorry about Ukraine.
 
For coronavirus tracking purposes only.
 
@tchrist Looks like there will be no war. Biden agreed to Nord Stream 2, and Putin will pull back troops until spring.
Putin uses 10 divisions of troops as a phonecall ringer.
Very quaint.
 
Does he ever fail to achieve his goals?
 
Yes. He planned to make ordinary Russians as rich as ordinary citizens of Portugal by 2020.
Now the official minimal salary in Ukraine is a bit higher than in Russia, and Russian teachers from the Far East migrate to China, because in Chinese schools they get several times more money per month.
Putin has lanuched an huge development program this year, with trillions to be spent to speed up the economy.
We shall see.
 
2:37 AM
@CowperKettle That's not an especially high mark, you realize. He still missed it substantially; he'd need to raise it by 25% just to match.
 
2:49 AM
@CowperKettle Hmm he thinks he'll have trillions because of high gas and oil prices?
Who knows how long those will last?
@CowperKettle Oh, that's good to hear, in a way.
Although it is quite uncertain whether Europe will allow Nordstream 2.
In its current form.
 
3:07 AM
@CowperKettle Until spring? I thought the logical invasion timetable was to start in March anyway.
 
3:59 AM
I don't know.
Are offensives in winter still impracticable?
 
 
2 hours later…
6:07 AM
The ground needs to be frozen to support the tanks. Forthcoming article “Consequences of Global Warming for Tank Invasions,” not yet peer-reviewed.
 
6:33 AM
If alcohol can damage your short term memory…
…Imagine the damage alcohol can do
 
 
1 hour later…
7:52 AM
Languages of India
That time is nearing.. the song Novy God by Steklovata ("Fiberglass" in Russian). I hope this year somebody makes more spoofs.
Novy God means "New Year"
Oh, this cover I did not notice.
LOL
 
 
2 hours later…
10:37 AM
I walked my mom to the revaccination station and back. Helped a Chinese man to fill out the form. He poorly knew Russian, and had zero knowledge of English.
There was even a black guy filling out a form.
The Chinese guy's name was Li Sinlu. Or "Shunlu"? Li is a surname, and Sinlu is a first name.
He was smiling constantly and saying spasibo (thank you)
I could recall only the Chinese word nihao but I did not use it.
你好
I don't know how "thank-you" sounds in Chinese.
Ah. It's syeah-syeah nee
Xièxiè nǐ
 
11:07 AM
Word of the day: bindi (red dot in the forehead of Indian women)
> Never lie to Indian girls. That red dot means they are recording everything.
 
 
1 hour later…
12:10 PM
@Mitch I went looking (on twitter) and I found a few instances of neo-pronouns (e.g.). Having a second think, I guess "he/him" makes it clear I'm talking about my pronouns rather than having to write more (e.g. "I go by masculine pronouns" or whatever). Just putting "he" in a profile could more easily be missed. I also saw quite a few "she/they" or "he/they" (and some other varieties), which makes more sense.
I agree that neo-pronouns won't take off. feels like the pronoun bag is full, and the neo-pronouns just won't fit
 
1:04 PM
What if some famous rap musician starts using noun cases in English? Not a whole set of cases, just one or two for starts.
I wonder if that will result in an adoption of cases.
 
1:17 PM
@MattE.Эллен Yes, I bet, for the reasons you say, that it was a slightly conscious design decision to make it clear what was going on, not an attempt to make many permutations possible.
@MattE.Эллен To me they sound like 1950's geewhiz sci-fi, or like a costume party with wild costumes that would just feel weird to wear everyday.
 
@CowperKettle AAE seems to be a constant source of new vocabulary in standard English, which then gets adopted in GenAmE and BrE and pretty quickly into World English.
 
I picture-googled for "1950's geewhiz sci-fi", and fell through into a picture hole.
 
@CowperKettle I feel like if you have more than one case, it is easy enough to add others. But English (despite the grammatical terminology) really has no cases, at least not like Russian/German/Latin. So it would be like the pronouns... no concept of other cases, so no realization that a new case could be a thing.
But!
You surely know of how AAE has a much more complex verb sense than GenAmE.
 
For instance, instead of "He was hit by a car" you could add -im to the noun: "He was hit carim".
 
1:28 PM
And that is something that could show up in lyrics and then eventually in the standard
 
"The bill was passed Senatim".
(by the Senate)
And gradually build up from there.
 
@CowperKettle Yes, that is a great example of a new case, but also would show that it is not likely to be adopted (I say that as a native speaker hearing it)
 
A Yekaterinburg woman broke her arm at the trauma station where she came because she had broken her leg.
The station's guard did not let her friend accompany her into the station, and she was jumping on one leg there, and fell.
Covid measures are tough.
This is a real story ))) Happened on 5 December - e1.ru/text/incidents/2021/12/05/70296209
 
1:54 PM
Guess what this is. A covid vaccine factory.
> Medicago uses plants as living factories to grow virus-like particles, which mimic the spike protein that coats the coronavirus.
Efficacy 71%.
 
2:25 PM
@CowperKettle Hurray now we can vaccinate vegetarians!
 
Yeah, I had read that.
 
Honestly.
 
Just another death cult.
 
Everyone should have a gun and carry it everywhere. But nobody should get vaccinated.
 
everyone should know how to use a gun
but you don't need to own one
and everyone should get vaccinated
but you shouldn't be forced to
that's my thought on what a "reasonable" person from that group would think
but we all know that not everyone is reasonable
 
3:01 PM
@CowperKettle things can change but usually not deliberately. for things to catch on it usually needs to be organic, people do it naturally, as a matter of course.
 
@Flats Doesn't everybody already know how? After all, they don't call it a point-and-shoot user interface for nothing, now do they now? :)
 
@tchrist But not everyone can use one safely, and that leads to unnecessary incidents
 
@tchrist wait... you have to -pay- in order to call it that kind of interface?
LIke 'Windows' is a trademark you have to pay for?
So for every time you pull the trigger, there's a fee?
 
@tchrist I thought it was point-and-click. No shooting involved.
 
@Robusto Shoot, that's a good point
 
3:07 PM
@Flats Which is why the most important post-primary classes in school remain Hunting Education, Driving Education, Drinking Education, and Sexing Education.
Any two of those can run concurrently, and often do so.
 
I feel like it was only yesterday that I saw an article on the experiment some guy did comparing habitual 'be' and present null-copula in AAE speakers and standard English speakers in like 5 year olds.
 
@tchrist to be fair, those are all taught in a sense. firearms safety is required to hunt, drivers education is mandatory to drive a car, and every school that I have ever attended has brought in education about alcohol, drugs and sex so I mean
 
@tchrist The Bureau of ATFS
 
@Mitch Your pinned canisurvey is no longer accepting entrants.
 
I remember drivers ed and sex ed (taught by the soccer coach) but no drugs/alcohol ed. I must be old.
@tchrist unpinned. I thought that would get rid of all the stars but I guess not.
clicked on the right one this time
 
3:13 PM
@Mitch lol we had a required course on it in college, and I know for sure it was discussed in out health classes along with sex ed and other topics
 
I went to Catholic school. We weren't taught about sex, except that it was something you should never, ever even think about.
 
in college? I think the only required thing I had in college was swimming and I luckily tested out of that
@Robusto half the old testament is about it
 
@Robusto sounds like your parents screwed you over
 
the other half about wars and stuff
 
@Mitch Swimming? interesting
 
3:15 PM
@Flats They didn't even go to church. Which did teach me important lessons about hypocrisy.
 
@Flats I mean they want you to be prepared in case your ship gets torpedoed
 
@Mitch ah, military. Gotcha
 
@Flats Swimming was required in high school.
 
@Robusto maybe the catholic school had other things going for it that wasn't religion
 
@Robusto the best way to turn someone from religion is to force it upon them
 
3:16 PM
like the local public schools aren't as good educationally?
 
@Mitch To be fair, though, the Catholic prep school I went to did have high standards on education. When I got into college I tested out of all the "required" intro courses.
 
jinks
 
But you never had boys swimming class and girls swimming class at the same time.
 
that's not how you spell it, is it.
 
nifty, Although I think it really just depends on the student more than the standards. A smart kid will find a way to be smart even if everyone around them is stupid
 
3:17 PM
@Mitch Not in the town I grew up in.
 
I bet the Spanish can't pronounce it -or- spell it.
 
@tchrist why not?
 
@Flats Seriously?
 
@Flats It'd be nice if that were true, but I fear that it just means that the one with potential will be encumbered
 
Too many nekkids at once.
 
3:18 PM
@Flats because the water... you know
 
@tchrist I think the only thing that was ever split by gender in my schooling was changing in the locker rooms lol
and sports
*competitive sports
 
In the generation before me, swim suits weren't even allowed in swimming classes.
 
@tchrist wha?
 
@tchrist: Does this sound idiomatic to you? No sé cuándo volveré a verte. It literally means what I was trying to write, but I'm wondering if it's what people would actually say.
 
did every one just stand at the edge of the pool not wanting to get their school clothes wet?
 
3:20 PM
@Robusto Seems a little formal.
 
What would you say instead?
 
No sé cuándo nos veremos.
 
So using first-person plural makes it less formal?
 
@Mitch Yes, look it up. Happened at least into the late 50s and probably beyond.
No sé cuándo voy a verte.
 
I was thinking about imperfect future, if that's what it's called.
 
3:24 PM
The inflectional future is always a bit more formal than the to be going to future.
 
OK, thanks.
 
You can add "otra vez" or "de nuevo" or "la próxima vez" or some such.
 
Of course.
 
No sé si nos veamos jamás.
 
THERE IS NO PRESENT TENSE IN ENGLISH
 
3:27 PM
I don't know whether we may ever see each other (again).
@Mitch Un idioma que no lo hablábamos en este momentico.
@Mitch This is present tense, am I right?
 
The form of the present tense in most languages is unmarked. The corresponding unmarked thin in English is called 'the present' but does not code for the present. "He sits" ... it's more like some weird habitual thing. The present progressive "He is sitting" is what people use for the present.
 
@Mitch Why are you always shooting for the starboard?
 
@Mitch Not true.
ama, come, y vive.
Those are marked in the present tense. I can give you half a dozen other Romance versions as well if you wish.
You're being too Teutonic again.
Or are you getting all aorist on me here?
English marks the present tense only in the 3rd person singular unless it's be.
@Mitch Gnomic pronouncements are so tensing they might as well be Delphic. It's coronavirus bad enough?
 
4:16 PM
World War I was fought on many fronts around the world from the battlefields of Europe to the far-flung colonies in the Pacific and Africa. While it is most famous for the trench warfare stalemate that existed on Europe's Western Front, in other theatres of combat the fighting was mobile and often involved set-piece battles and cavalry charges. The Eastern Front often took thousands of casualties a day during the major offensive pushes, but it was the West that saw the most concentrated slaughter. It was in the west that the newly industrialized world powers could focus their end products on the...
> Based comes from the slang basehead, a term from the 1980s to describe people addicted to freebasing cocaine, a method which makes the drug smokable.
> The term basehead became synonymous with the crack epidemic that swept the United States at the time. Over time, calling someone based was a way of saying that they were a crack addict, or acting like one, especially in West Coast street slang.
I learned this only today.
> In reaction to people calling him based, Lil B decided to redefine the term. In 2007, his group, The Pack, released their debut album, Based Boys. In a 2010 interview in Complex magazine, Lil B described his new definition of based: “Based means being yourself.
 
pretty based to be honest
 
> The re-invented based, as a signal of power and swagger, was picked up by the alt-right/white nationalist community online in the 2010s. In 2014, during a controversy over female video-game reviewers known as Gamergate, conservative commentator Christina Hoff Sommers was referred to as Based Mom for pushing back against criticisms that video games and their culture are sexist.
 
I don't think that it's fair to call her conservative
she's a libertarian leaning liberal at most
 
I was coming across "based" the last year, but was too lazy to read up.
Today I came across "based" in Russian, as базовый. Then I knew I would have to actually read up to understand the meaning.
 
that's interesting, I'm surprised that it has spread outside of the US
 
4:30 PM
Me too. I caught this specimen 5 minutes ago on Twitter.
 
oh if only I knew any Russian
 
Never too late to learn Russian
Because Russia is beautiful
😍😍😍
 
I'm still committed to Italy, sorry to say
not that I know Italian
 
One day after the Biden-Putin talk, we are shelling New York.
New York or Niu-York (Ukrainian: Нью-Йорк, romanized: Nʹiu-York, Ukrainian pronunciation: [ˈnʲʊ jɔ̈rk]) is an urban settlement in Toretsk urban hromada of Bakhmut Raion of Donetsk Oblast, at 37.9 km NNE from the centre of Donetsk city. The settlement was from 1951 until 2021 named Novhorodske (Ukrainian: Но́вгородське, romanized: Novhorodsʹke).New York is administratively subordinated to Toretsk city, that is located about 10 km north of New York. Population: 9,917 (2021 est.) == History == The settlement first appeared on maps in 1846 under its original name New York and was then situated in the...
 
4:46 PM
Right now?
 
Today, based on the Press-Service of the Ukrainian Army glavnoe.ua/news/…
There was recently a New York Marathon held there. My Ukrainian friend on Strava sent me a weblink.
 
wild
 
I don't run haha. I'd bike it though
 
I've run 1805 km this year )))
I used to bike, a couple of thousand km per year, but for some reason got tired of it.
 
4:55 PM
interesting. perhaps you just needed a little break and it'll come back for you in the future ;)
 
 
2 hours later…
7:13 PM
I was born a month early.
Probably due to all the over-policing in Moscow in 1978.
 
7:41 PM
Word of the midnight: to spend a penny
> If you'll excuse me, I need to spend a penny.
 
8:25 PM
> Congenital disorders of glycosylation are a group of over 130 disorders.
The first two patients were described in 1980.
41 years have passed, and there are 130 disorders. I wonder how many disorders are still undiscovered.
 
probably like 4
get back to me at the end of time as we know it to let me know if I was right or not
 
9:12 PM
@tchrist this doesn't apply here but F*** Nuance is a fun read.
@Robusto Why would I capitalize it if I wanted it starred? It's annoyingly loud enough as it is.
Cripes, now I have to capitalize everything to avoid your second-guessing everything.
@tchrist hm... maybe I'm being ambiguous in my use of 'marked' and 'unmarked'. what I mean was the elementary forms 'il s'asseoit' and 'er sitzt' are present tense, but the corresponding form in English 'he sits' is not some simple present but this weird mix of habitual and god knows what else semantics, and no one actually uses it as the present. The appropriate translation of 'er sitzt' is 'he is sitting'. No one ever says he sits, to mean that guy is sitting right now.
@tchrist That doesn't augur well for my colonoscopy.
haha get it? reading my entrails... ha ha ha
But anyway, if you're going to say there is no future tense in English you might as well say there's no present tense either.
This all came about when trying to find good examples of habitual be in AAE for @CowperKettle.
> In that 2005 University of Massachusetts study, groups of black and white children were shown images from Sesame Street. In the crucial picture, a sick Cookie Monster languished in bed without any cookies, while Elmo stood nearby eating a cookie. “Who is eating cookies?” Jackson asked her test subjects, and all of them indicated Elmo. “Who be eating cookies?” Jackson then asked. The white kids replied that it was Elmo, while the black kids pointed to Cookie Monster.
> After all, it is the existential state of Cookie Monster to be eating cookies, while Elmo just happened to be eating a cookie at that moment. Cookie Monster, to those conversant in AAE, be eating cookies, whether he is eating cookies or not. The kids in Jackson’s experiment picked up on the subtle difference when they were as young as 5 or 6.
2
many links out there to similar but this was from Slate
 
9:52 PM
@Mitch That is extremely interesting
 
 
2 hours later…
11:40 PM
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Few unique characters in answer, no whitespace in answer (184): A word to describe responses such as "I see" and "Okay"‭ by Radwa Magdy‭ on english.SE
 

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