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12:39 AM
@Færd Just like influenza.
 
12:58 AM
I want a T-shirt like this one. @tchrist will get why.
 
1:30 AM
@Robusto Don Oso is named Javier?
 
1:51 AM
@tchrist Exactamente.
Porque haber suena como "a bear" ... but I know you know that, and are merely avoiding an easy resolution.
 
A ver, ¿qué tenemos?
Ya me enteré de todo.
@Cerberus Unless you're a Chinese doctor or nurse.
 
2:25 AM
@RegDwigнt: BTW, if you like "Rhapsody in Blue" you ought to give Porgy and Bess a listen sometime. It is the quintessentially American opera. It's gone through phases, and currently seems out of favor for reasons of political correctness, but it's a stupendous work.
Here's a taste. Serena's song, after her husband is killed in a fight:
 
2:41 AM
@tchrist Mostly.
 
@Cerberus Most inimical things kill mostly old people.
Well, except bullets and bombs. They seem to fall disproportionately on those of combat age. And those who obstinately put themselves in the path of this or that army's plans.
 
 
7 hours later…
9:56 AM
@Robusto we listened to Porgy and Bess in school. Soviet school, mind you.
Gershwin always had a strong focus on gorgeous yet simple melodies, and so did Russian music at the time (or maybe always). So he fit right in.
There was an aria or two in one of my piano books as a kid. And I don't even think it was the Lullaby.
 
 
4 hours later…
2:19 PM
What would the typical sentence be if a doctor is peeking into the corridor and sees a person waiting there. "Are you to see me?" or "Are you waiting for me?" or something else?
 
@CowperKettle The latter more so than the former.
"I'm to see the doctor at 11" sounds fine, but for some reason it sounds funny the way you've used it for asking a question of someone in the hallway. A little formal or something.
 
2:35 PM
@tchrist "I'm to see the doctor" or "Are you to see me?" don't sound natural. Maybe bookish as oyou said. The idiomatic way to say them would be?
> I'm here to see the doctor
> Are you here to see me?
It seems weird to say that grammar -requires- the here, but I can't imagine saying it without it.
 
2:57 PM
Thank you!
 
3:24 PM
@Mitch Are you here to see the me?
 
@RegDwigнt Yes. The melodies are so very expressive, but I wouldn't always call them simple. Look at "My Man's Gone Now" for example, and you'll see every line attempting to rise in the beginning, fighting to stay up, yet pulled down and down by grief, with the final note being its lowest point. Brilliant.
 
 
1 hour later…
4:32 PM
@M.A.R. The me that is you or the me that is me?
 
4:47 PM
So there's a certain rhetorical device I've noticed. I'll describe it by giving a couple of examples.
One is the saying, "You only have to floss the teeth you want to keep."
Presumably, the listener wants to keep all of their teeth, so the implication is that they should floss all of their teeth.
Another example is a directive in a piece of RPG literature: "Offer no surrender that you would not accept."
In context, the reader is expected to understand that they are never supposed to surrender, and so the directive is telling them never to offer surrender, either.
Another example might be, "Don't touch this machine while it's operating if you like having hands."
Or, "I'll only work for your company if I don't have to go anywhere or perform any duties."
 
5:16 PM
@TerranSwett I sense irony, and tautology.
 
@TerranSwett I would simply call that verbal irony.
Jinx!
 
Ding!
I think we may have posted that at the exact same second.
 
> Verbal irony is very common in everyday speech, plays, novels, and poetry, and usually occurs in the form of sarcasm. It depends upon timing and suitable circumstances to achieve its effect. Verbal irony develops funny and dramatic situations.
> Through verbal irony, writers and poets can convey their bitter messages indirectly, in a less bitter and more effective way. It makes a literary piece more effective by provoking readers into analyzing and thinking harder about a situation. By contrasting and comparing suppositions with reality, the readers can better understand the writer’s intent.
@Cerberus Seems that way. But you still owe me a coke, since I cried jinx first.
 
I'm not sure you can have irony without words, though.
@Robusto I don't play that game!
 
@Cerberus Way too late for excuses. Pay up!
 
5:18 PM
folds paws
 
@Cerberus I think actions could be ironic, even if unstated. For example, in a play, if a person the main character thinks is in Timbuktu appears in an English drawing room behind him without his apparent knowledge, that would be a sort of irony.
That would be a kind of dramatic irony.
 
@Robusto Yes, OK, dramatic irony it can be.
But I would say it would still only apply to something he was saying.
Like, "since x is in Timbuktu, we can loot his safe now".
That that utterance has dramatic irony.
 
@Cerberus That scene, and its irony, could play out without words.
 
I'm not sure I would qualify anything other than those words as such.
 
As long as the Timbuktu thing had been established earlier.
 
5:25 PM
I would just call it is a surprising situation, or whatever.
Or a funny situation if applicable.
 
No, there's a term for that, and the term is irony.
 
I believe it is called dramatic irony because it is the playwright's words that are the opposite of the truth and the audience knows it (definition of irony).
 
dramatic irony irony that is inherent in speeches or a situation of a drama and is understood by the audience but not grasped by the characters in the play.
 
I'm not entirely sure that would be my preferred definition.
 
The whole thing with Oedipus killing his father and marrying his mother is supremely ironic.
 
5:30 PM
@Robusto well, "simple" by Russian standards anyway. Rising and fighting and falling are just the tools of the trade.
 
@Cerberus Well, you're just indulging your willfulness now.
 
I know we've long lost them tools. Every melody these days is just the same note repeated ad infinitum.
Nobody could write Somewhere Over the Rainbow anymore.
 
@RegDwigнt But it's the way it falls, lilting through the blue notes as the notes lengthen, downard to darkness.
 
Yes, yes. We called it "skill". We tried to learn it.
 
@RegDwigнt Well, somebody could, just not the ones who are prominent today.
 
5:32 PM
Well, I could but I don't give two shits about prominence.
 
And you are somebody. QED
 
Glad we do go over these things.
 
@Robusto I would only call any obviously (but unwittingly) untrue statements dramatically ironic.
 
I would call your gravatar dramatically ironic.
You're not even a dog. And you have no idea.
 
He does have a dog's understanding of irony, though. ^_^
 
5:42 PM
Anyway, I must be off to have a shave and pack for the choir rehearsal. And to download Clara's Lullaby.
That one we actually analyzed in the German school, by the way.
 
In any case, @Cerb, even if situations are set up verbally the irony does not have to be verbal, at least not in the same way that a statement like "You only have to floss the teeth you want to keep" is. There the entire irony is predicated on a turn of phrase.
 
But yeah, more Ella can never hurt.
 
Well, good on you, mate. Have fun!
1
Q: Is there a word to encompass the concept of daylight savings time and standard time?

Chad MIf I need to talk about the concept of the switching between daylight savings time vs non-daylight savings time, is there a term specific to that? I can say something like "Tomorrow, we'll change timezones." or "The misunderstanding on delivery time was a timezone issue." because things like EST...

zomg
Why do we get this kind of crap in here?
"Is there a word to encompass bikeshedding and boatshedding?"
 
@Robusto Because they're setting up a table in a database or designing a UI where they have to label a field whose possible values are daylight and standard time
 
@Robusto yes. Thank you. See you on the other side.
@Robusto well we do have such a word. It's stuff.
Encompasses boatshedding, too.
Really quite versatile.
 
 
1 hour later…
7:20 PM
[ SmokeDetector | MS ] Mostly punctuation marks in title (25): Mentor .........? by Sudheera Y S on english.SE
 
 
2 hours later…
9:20 PM
@Mitch Yeah, they admit that in the comments. Voting to close on that basis.
 
 
1 hour later…
10:47 PM
@Cerberus That's also another sign of pessimism.
 

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