English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

Mitch

1:54 AM

@MετάEd Immortality is underrated

Cerberus

Hmm the bike police have just arrested someone opposite my house.

I wonder what he has done.

ktm5124

3:30 AM

@Cerberus It was probably Hercules, who was trying to steal you all over again.

3

ᴡᴏʀᴅs

4:00 AM

[ SmokeDetector ] Few unique characters in answer: Opposite of "arrogant"/"having attitude" by QWDERFG on english.stackexchange.com

Færd

@ktm5124 That is cool; thanks.

Yes, I've heard/read that too, but I know little about language history, so..

Mazura

5:36 AM

What's with the hyphen in this question?

8

Q: I am [who/whom] G-d made me

Please fill in the blank with the correct word and explain your choice. I am __ G-d made me. A. who B. whom Some people have suggested I elaborate on this question so here goes. The above was not copied from any test. It is a question about basically two things: (1) whether an objective co...

Mazura

5:53 AM

@RejlanGivens Gas, Oxygen and Explosibility (Combustible Gas) Monitors. –OSHA combustible gas testing / testing for combustible gases

sumelic

7:41 AM

5

Q: Why are Jews so meticulous about not saying/writing "god"?

Why are Jews so meticulous about not saying/writing "god"? I see all sorts of words around, like "G-d", "lord", etc., but they all mean exactly the same thing. It's not like the halacha has a list of words meaning "god" in all foreign languages, which are to be avoided. "God" is an English word, ...

halacha shemos-sacred-names

Shafizadeh

7:54 AM

Is this correct? "don't wait until people are dead to give them flower"

Anonymous

8:16 AM

@Shafizadeh You probably want to say flowers.

Shafizadeh

ah thx

just can I say "a flower" instead ?

Anonymous

Well, it would be grammatical. Somehow I feel like flowers is better.

Shafizadeh

ah ok :-)

Tonepoet

8:42 AM

The greatest improvement to the English Language was making s discernable from f. I can't even suppose how anybody could tolerate reading before. XP

Anonymous

8:57 AM

The greateſt !

Anonymous

We should start a movement to bring back þorn.

Mazura

SPACEMAKESWASTE

caub

10:08 AM

@tchrist as you know well unicode, is there something close to images.clipartpanda.com/…, ? 📍 is a bit too sharp

it's for representing an address

Anonymous

10:36 AM

1

Q: What is unicode character of location?

I want use character for the location (like in Google Maps) – location symbol. I want to ask if there is such a unicode character?

unicode location character

terdon

I think either of these looks better:

graphemica.com/characters/tags/pin

Sᴋᴜʟʟ ᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ

10:50 AM

I would vote for the push pin.

📌

caub

1:30 PM

thanks, yes (my favorite one: 🚭)

terdon

1:53 PM

And mine: 🚬

Rejlan Givens

@Mazura Thank you Mazura, right place to look up for the language I need right now, thank you.

Cerberus

2:15 PM

@ktm5124 Grr at least I escaped.

Færd

2:45 PM

> Sending your cargoes from all over the world to Iran and vice versa via air

Doesn't vice versa sound clunky there?

And in this one:

> Presenting of regular container services, for export to Middle East countries area, Eastern South Asia, Far East and vice versa.

Maybe it's not just the vice versa that clunks.

tchrist

@Færd Kinda.

@Færd That one's more ok but still far away.

Færd

How would you edit the first one?

I can't pin it down what it is about that use of vice versa that makes me uneasy. Maybe it's just a delusion on my part.

tchrist

3:02 PM

Sorry back.

Maybe the reason is that it's too far from the thing it's vice versing?

terdon

3:37 PM

> Sending your cargo to or from Iran.

Sᴋᴜʟʟ ᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ

3:48 PM

I think "transporting" works too :-)

Cerberus

@Færd One thing is that from all over the world is rather general.

I think usually vice versa is more used between specific things?

And I agree with Terdy in that I wouldn't pluralise cargo.

caub

@terdon 🚒

I'm gonna extinguish that immediately

Færd

4:40 PM

@tchrist @terdon @Sᴋᴜʟʟᴘᴇᴛʀᴏʟ @Cerberus Good ideas. Thank you.

Yes, maybe vice versa is better suited for more specific/immediate/etc double-sided transactions or activities. But I have to research that.

Cerberus

@Færd It means "with roles switched".

But "all over the world" and "Iran" seem like two things that are too different qua category to switch.

Or I don't know.

ktm5124

4:54 PM

Nice use of "qua". I've been meaning to learn about that word.

Cerberus

5:13 PM

It's a lazy word in English.

Which is why I used it...

MετάEd

5:30 PM

Porquoi?

Mitch

5:54 PM

@Cerberus Qua?

Cerberus

Qua.

Mitch

@Færd drop the vice versa and say import/export

Next!

MετάEd

Quahog?

Mitch

no no not a weird clam from New England. You're thinking of a low sandy island in the Caribbean.

MετάEd

@Mitch Stumped.

Mitch

6:09 PM

@MετάEd no no not quay, you're thinking of a method of drilling and connecting wells in dry regions.

MετάEd

@Mitch No, no, not stumped. Completely balls-up stupefied.

Must need coffee.

ktm5124

7:03 PM

Has anyone read All the King's Men? If so, is it a page-turner?

MετάEd

Now that's a page-turner.

Mitch

7:23 PM

@ktm5124 I've only read one of them

caub

I didn't know this song/anime youtube.com/watch?v=eh7lp9umG2I, it's fantastic

@MετάEd reminds me of youtube.com/watch?v=nOSnW3HdOao

oerkelens

@caub try the original youtube.com/watch?v=6NXnxTNIWkc

caub

oh, TIL

@MετάEd nice French/Spanish mix

oerkelens

a new acronym for me! TIL :)

And yes, those occurrences make me feel old :P

caub

don't worry I'm old too, remember youtube.com/watch?v=ymNFyxvIdaM?

Mitch

7:37 PM

TIL TIL. rather, TIL 'TIL'

oerkelens

Yup, that was the new kids' stuff for me :X (well, so was Four Non Blondes)

I discovered recently I knew way too many lyrics of Wet Wet Wet songs. Turns out maybe I was a fan of theirs for decennia :X

MετάEd

:31225641

Mitch

@caub I'm so old I didn't hear those in the first place in order to forget them

because old people don't listen to music, get it?

also, they feel the need to explain their jokes

if you know what I mean

and use out of date lingo that was out of date in the old TV show it showed up in.

oerkelens

right on, bro!

or should it be peace, man!

ditto

Mitch

word

oerkelens

7:44 PM

up

Mitch

that was dope

oerkelens

so cool

Mitch

wait.. that's out of date?

sigh

oerkelens

Life's what happens when you're making plans

Then, one day, you wake up and the girl at McD's calls you sir, and you realise you're old

ktm5124

I like to think we gain knowledge from end to end.

oerkelens

7:49 PM

And then we die

mmm... that came out more gloomy than I actually feel :P

ktm5124

I think the best meditation on this comes from Waiting for Godot.

"Well that helped to pass the time" (Vladimir)

"It would have passed anyway." (Estragon)

Færd

Oh I'm in the middle of that play right now!

Mitch

LIterally? Or are you just reading it?

Færd

No, I'm reading it.

ktm5124

It's one of my favorites.

Cerberus

7:56 PM

@oerkelens You shouldn't sleep at McDonald's, and certainly not with the girls working there.

Færd

Did people stop swearing from 1820 to 1950?! books.google.com/ngrams/…

ktm5124

@Faerd I really like this quote from the beginning.

Cerberus

Unless her calling you Sir is part of some fancy sex game.

ktm5124

@Faerd "There's man all over for you, blaming on his boots the faults of his feet."

oerkelens

@Cerberus Now you sound like my wife :(

Mitch

7:57 PM

I couldn't get past the first few pages. So I went to see 'The Bourne Antepenultimatum'

@Cerberus Never having the special sauce from there again

@Færd Yes.

Færd

Actually I'm listening to the audiobook on Youtube.

Cerberus

@oerkelens Thank you.

Mitch

@Cerberus The uniform is the key

Cerberus

@Mitch Hah!

@Mitch But...they're ugly.

ktm5124

@Mitch You should give it another chance.

Mitch

7:59 PM

@ktm5124 They're too tight around the seat

Færd

@ktm5124 I have to listen through before giving any opinions, and maybe listen again to catch the subtle messages.

@Mitch How come?

Mitch

@Færd It's like Seinfeld but really nothing happens.

Færd

I haven't seen Seinfeld.

Mitch

@Færd You know that disease that snails get, the virus or bacterium, that causes slight nervous problems, that encourages the snails to climb high on grass to what would normally be considered dangerous (and is) because birds then eat them, and then poop them somewhere for other snails to eat and continue the process, but is evolutionarily adaptive?

It's like that.

@Færd Oh. Then Seinfeld is a lot like Waiting for Godot but even less happens.

Full disclosure: I haven't even read the first page of Waiting for Godot.

Færd

@Mitch Nice tip. Not a very absorbing sitcom (for me) then.

Mitch

8:04 PM

@Cerberus I normally don't associate McD's and 'fancy'. So I think you're suggesting that makes it even wilder.

Cerberus

@Mitch Snob.

Mitch

@Cerberus If saying that makes me a snob then, very well, add some fries and supersize me!

Cerberus

Yay!

I'm sure that fat would look lovely on you, under your McDo outfit.

Mitch

Fills it out quite nicely.

Really makes the red and yellow really pop!

ktm5124

@Mitch A lot can happen in these minimalist plays.

Mitch

8:06 PM

Literally.

Yellow and red buttons popping out everywhere.

ktm5124

@Mitch A good contemporary example is the Pulitzer Prize winning play, 'The Flick'

oerkelens

Any has a bottle of eye-bleach I could borrow?

Mitch

visine will work.

oerkelens

:)

Mitch

or these handy knitting needles

ktm5124

8:07 PM

@Mitch The dialogue of 'Godot' stands out precisely because nothing happens.

oerkelens

Anyways, I'm going to abuse a piano for a while :)

Mitch

@oerkelens Give your apologies to the piano for me!

If you make any mistakes, mean them!

Or pretend it's jazz

oerkelens

I mean to make mistakes :P

Mitch

Oh, so you're playing jazz?

ktm5124

@Faerd After you finish Waiting for Godot, you should ask yourself: Are the things you do just ways to pass the time, or are they meaningful?

Mitch

8:10 PM

Then by all means avoid any tonality at all. like going to get tapas, and then just having a small bowl of vanilla ice cream

ktm5124

@Faerd Is chatting on this ELU chatroom just a way to pass the time?

Cerberus

Of course.

What else could it be?

Mitch

It's my way of practicing English

Færd

It's rather a superficial way to criticize literature to say nothing happens. It's not supposed to be a fun movie.

Mitch

in order to waste time later.

ktm5124

8:10 PM

Are we satisfied by the ways we pass the time? (When time is all we have.)

Cerberus

@Mitch Bang!

Mitch

@ktm5124 We'd be lucky to have time to waste.

ktm5124

Some would argue the opposite. They are lucky who have no time to waste.

Færd

@Mitch Hey don't steal my reason!

Mitch

There's cooking to be done, nappies to be washed, people to be picked up from school.

@Færd hahaha! see there are reasons

ktm5124

8:13 PM

I feel trapped in a boring job where there is no way to spend the time well.

Mitch

You'd think I no need it.

Færd

@ktm5124 So it's not that important who Godot is, right? (Why am I asking before reading it?)

Mitch

@ktm5124 Like sitting on an open bear trap, eating saltines one by one, waiting for the inevitable.

@Færd YOu'lll get the answer by the end.

no spoilers

other than everyone dies.

maybe not in the play itself

ktm5124

@Faerd Well, should I answer that?

Færd

I'm already dead; don't you remember?

@ktm5124 No please!

ktm5124

8:15 PM

@Faerd Oh ok, I won't answer it then.

Mitch

@Færd ?? That's upsetting.

You look pretty good for being dead

Færd

yesterday, by Færd

@Mitch Too late. I'm dead now.

Mitch

@ktm5124 Do you think it would give away too much if we told him about the sequel?

Færd

There's a sequel?

ktm5124

@Mitch He may have already read the Bible.

Færd

8:17 PM

Not all of it.

Mitch

@ktm5124 flips furiously through revelation looking for clues

@Færd hahahah.

No

@Færd Oh. There's something about that that I just don't quite believe

Færd

You will believe when I haunt you tonight.

HAHAHAHA

@Mitch Okay, what is that something?

Mitch

That it's too late. It's still pretty early here

Also, this McD's uniform fits a lot better than I expected.

ktm5124

8:33 PM

Curious. What attracted you guys to ELU?

Færd

Me, learning English.

ktm5124

@Faerd Where are you from?

Færd

Iran.

Mitch

@ktm5124 The time wasting

Færd

I'm guessing that at the end you should be thinking how Godot worked out in giving meaning to their wait.

Mitch

8:35 PM

Also people being totally wrong

ktm5124

@Mitch Hehe

@Faerd Cool!

@Faerd Well, we are all waiting for something, right? (death, salvation, reincarnation)

Færd

Kind of.

ktm5124

People have a different idea of what they're waiting for.

You get different answers if you ask a Christian and a Buddhist.

Mitch

@ktm5124 I wasn't thinking about any of those before you mentioned them.

Færd

The answers lie in their futures, not in their responses.

Mitch

8:41 PM

Thanks.

I was pretty happy not thinking of them

ktm5124

The playwright grew up in Ireland, which was predominantly Catholic, so there might be some Christian overtones.

I find it funny how Godot resembles God, but that's by no means the playwright's intention.

My point is, I think we can only guess

Færd

It doesn't bang you on the head with a religious theme though. You're free to interpret. At least so far for me, since I'm not through yet.

ktm5124

@Faerd Yeah, exactly! Free to interpret.

Mitch

Somehow, esthetically, that would be really poor taste of Beckett. Almost too obvious. He could try to hide it a little bit more.

ktm5124

@Mitch I agree

@Mitch I think part of it is the absurdity of not knowing what we're waiting for.

Mitch

8:45 PM

@ktm5124 It took me years, and people emphasizing it to me, to realize that maybe, just maybe, that the Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe was just a Jesus allegory. Years. I kid you not. So obvious now.

oerkelens

@ktm5124 masochism, I guess :)

ktm5124

@Mitch I haven't read CS Lewis! I should...

Mitch

@ktm5124 You know you can click on the arrow to the left of a message to respond to it directly. That way we know what you're referring to in our multiple conversations.

@ktm5124 I remember reading it as a kid so I don't know how it would work for an adult.

ktm5124

@Mitch I was reading his Wikipedia page yesterday. He was a staunch Christian apologist

Mitch

which I never understood. does that mean he was a non-believer but really liked the idea of it all?

and away!!

ktm5124

8:49 PM

@Mitch No I think he was a believer. I think Christianity was central to his life.

"What are we doing here, that is the question. And we are blessed in this, that we happen to know the answer. Yes, in this immense confusion one thing alone is clear. We are waiting for Godot to come—"

Færd

To me, that's mixing up waiting with hoping.

ktm5124

The first sentence is a Hamlet reference. But the emphasis is shifted to, "Why are we here?"

The absurd thing is that he claims to know exactly what he is doing there. Waiting for Godot...

Færd

Which is in fact thinking of a goal and hoping to achieve it. I wouldn't call that waiting.

ktm5124

Maybe he's so uncomfortable with not knowing that he invents an answer instead. That invention never shows and always lets him down. But he's fine with that. He prefers it to not knowing.

Færd

Yeah. And in that sense, almost all of us are waiting for something.

sighs

ktm5124

8:56 PM

@Faerd In his case, it's something so unattainable that it gives him an excuse to just wait by a tree all day.

Færd

Mhm. Good point.

Nice talking to you all. I better go hit the hay.

ktm5124

@Færd Nice talking to you too.

@Færd Sleep well!