English Language & Usage: Multi-Layered Discourse Room

"Song for Guy" is a mainly instrumental piece of music by Elton John. It is the closing track of his 1978 album, A Single Man. Musical structure Elton said this in the sleeve notes of the 7" single: "...As I was writing this song one Sunday, I imagined myself floating into space and looking down at my own body. I was imagining myself dying. Morbidly obsessed with these thoughts, I wrote this song about death. The next day I was told that Guy (Burchett), our 17 year-old messenger boy, had been tragically killed on his motorcycle the day before. Guy died on the day I wrote this song." The...

Cerberus

@Rob: Ah, I was thinking of Sadism.

RegDwight

@Cerberus That regime is gone. Them has democracy now.

Robusto

Yeah. Named after one guy.

Cerberus

@Reg: A pity they should have lost that bit of folklore.

RegDwight

4:15 PM

@Robusto Family guy?

@Cerberus What's with your grammer, buddy?

Robusto

Actually, the French do have a word for "pleasure at the pain of others" — it's called Francais.

RegDwight

Cedille!!!!

Robusto

Not on this keyboard.

Cerberus

@Reg: Meh, fortunately I can blame most of my grammar mistakes on typos... I forgot "have" in that sentence.

ç

Ç

RegDwight

@Robusto You probably won't believe me, but I figured as much.

Robusto

4:16 PM

Français

There, satisfied?

RegDwight

@Cerberus Yeah, it's just that you forgot the "have" shortly after forgetting an "a".

@Robusto Very much so.

Cerberus

@Reg: Huh? Where?

RegDwight

You have fixed it since.

I'm just worried.

Cerberus

@Reg: I forget all kinds of stuff, all the time... but now I am curious: where did I forget an a?

I even forget fixing things.

RegDwight

"I know guy who was Austrian".

Cerberus

4:19 PM

Oh!

I don't remember that, but you are no doubt right.

RegDwight

I'm so worried about what's hapenin' today in the Middle East, you know.
And I'm worried about the baggage retrieval system they've got at Heathrow.

Cerberus

It doesn't feel like a grammar mistake though... not the kind I'd make.

You should quit reading newspapers then!

RegDwight

That's why I'm worried!

Robusto

I just experimented and discovered Alt-0231 is a cedilla.

ç

RegDwight

Mind = blown!

Cerberus

4:21 PM

I only have to type a c and two commas, lalala....

Robusto

c,,

RegDwight

I only have to type one apostrophe and a c.

Robusto

doesn't work for me.

'c

nope

Cerberus

You'd need the special program I wrote for that in Autohotkey, muwaha.

RegDwight

You have to mess with nodeadkeys.

Robusto

4:22 PM

On my Mac at home I just type Option-c to get the cedilla.

Cerberus

I personally can't stand the 'c cedille, because I type quotation marks all the time and can't be bothered considered whether I need to type a space afterwards or not.

I also hate holding down keys for accents: I just want to type keys in succession, yes, dead keys in a way.

But my c and my , aren't dead: only when I type c,, does the magic happen.

/promo talk

RegDwight

Oh, and ö, ä, ü, ß, ŧ, ø, đ, ð, ſ, æ, ¢, ŋ, ħ, ĸ, þ, µ, and a few others are right here on my keyboard.

Cerberus

Just as 5:23 PM 3/24/2011 appears when I type dateqq.

ß

just ss,,

RegDwight

ß. Just ß.

Cerberus

No fair. You need extra keys.

RegDwight

4:24 PM

No.

Robusto

@RegDwight — It's so unlike you to show off. Or try to one-up anybody.

RegDwight

It's right to the left of 0.

@Robusto Yeah, I know, right?

Cerberus

Yes you do! Either modifier keys or physical keys?

RegDwight

@Cerberus No modifier keys for öäüß.

Robusto

Can we have a meta discussion about this meta discussion?

Cerberus

4:25 PM

Then you need dedicated physical keys! It's one or the other!

RegDwight

In fact, no modifier keys for йцукенг, either.

Cerberus

One more thing: how do you type macrons?

RegDwight

@Cerberus First, an M.

Then, an A.

Then,..

Robusto

@Cerberus — Macaroons are baked, not typed.

@RegDwight — Wow, this is taking geekiness to a whole new level. I'm impressed.

Cerberus

@Reg: Wow, a clever solution.

RegDwight

4:27 PM

@Cerberus Yeah, I will be giving away the rest of it tomorrow.

Cerberus

Exciting!

RegDwight

I know, I can barely wait myself!

Cerberus

I type o-=- normally, but I can't find the program on this pc.

Robusto

I didn't think geekiness could get geekier than SO main site or SuperUser.SE ... but I stand corrected.

Cerberus

I'll presume you wouldn't want me to go on, muwaha.

Robusto

4:28 PM

Thank you for showing me the light.

Cerberus

Your precious soul deserved it.

RegDwight

Oh, and @Robusto, I don't think I could one-up Kosmonaut.

Feb 7 at 16:13, by Kosmonaut

ʕʔ

Cerberus

What the...

The lower part seems missing. There is your chance!

Robusto

I'm not going to go messing around with your lower parts.

RegDwight

Feb 7 at 16:19, by Kosmonaut

Haha, I guess we are back in a psychiatry session then!

Cerberus

4:30 PM

They are Kosmonaut's, not mine.

(Off for a run.)

RegDwight

Run, Lola, run!

Cerberus

Hey I am embarrassed enough running around town in white shorts...

RegDwight

Run Lola Run

Run Lola Run (, literally Lola Runs) is a 1998 German crime thriller film written and directed by Tom Tykwer and starring Franka Potente as Lola and Moritz Bleibtreu as Manni. The story follows a woman who needs to obtain 100,000 German marks in 20 minutes to save her boyfriend's life. The film's three scenarios are reminiscent of the 1981 Krzysztof Kieślowski film Blind Chance; following Kieślowski's death, Tykwer directed his planned film Heaven. Plot The film begins with Lola (Franka Potente) receiving a phone call from her distraught boyfriend, Manni (Moritz Bleibtreu). He is a small...

Cerberus

Yeah I've heard of it, supposed to be good. Will see it some day.

poof

Cerberus

5:31 PM

I see dead people!

Or rather people in a dead room.

Robusto

5:42 PM

Dinosaur alert! Someone is trolling for @Kosmonaut:

0

Q: Does sign language (ASL) have the same grammatical rules in place as spoken language?

Does the ASL version of sign language have grammar? Is it possible to quote a Mime?

grammar language-formation

Cerberus

Hah I just saw it.

I believe this was either dupe or off topic?

Robusto

I voted to close as off-topic.

Cerberus

Same.

Testing macrons: ā ē ī ō ū

Testing short vowels: ă ĕ ĭ ŏ ŭ

Yay.

kiamlaluno

@Cerberus: Are you getting ready to write in Esperanto?

Cerberus

@Kiam: Oh, would I need macrons in Esperanto?

kiamlaluno

5:49 PM

I could get an use for the short e.

Sure thing.

Cerberus

I type e\/ for ĕ

Huh I'd have expected Esperanto to be free of weird accents!

kiamlaluno

Do you have a program that replaces the text you write?

Cerberus

Yes, Autohotkey.

e// is é

e-=- is ē

Robusto

0

Q: shoudl i write repartee with an accent

what's in the title. does repartee need an accent with it in writing. also what does it mean?

words

Dupe

RegDwight

Of?

Cerberus

5:52 PM

@Rob: Hmm I'm not sure it is a real dupe: the general process of foreign words' dropping accents doesn't say anything about what phase repartee is in now, does it? And The OP also wants to know what it means.

Robusto

Posted

Cerberus

Sounds rather like a low-quality dictionary question.

Hey is anyone using FF4? Does he like it?

RegDwight

Arg. How I like them MIME-Type:multipart/mixed questions.

Cerberus

I know.

Sort of.

Robusto

@Cerberus — Using it. FF4 is very fast, both on Mac and PC.

They've solved their HTML5 problems.

kiamlaluno

5:56 PM

As I was saying, the Esperanto alphabet is: a b c ĉ d e f g ĝ h ĥ i j ĵ k l m n o p r s ŝ t u ŭ v z.

RegDwight

Except it's still slower than Firebird 0.4.

Robusto

@RegDwight — The suite or the entire ballet?

RegDwight

Seriously, Firefox is one of the most bloated OSes out there.

Cerberus

@Rob: Okay, good to hear. And how about your extensions? Do they work?

RegDwight

I want a browser, dammit. Not an egg-laying wool-milk-sow.

Cerberus

5:57 PM

Well FF can do some stuff that your OS probably can't...

Robusto

@Cerberus — Yep, with updates to Firebug and Colorzilla.

kiamlaluno

It's usual to write "ux" instead of "ŭ", if you cannot use strange characters.

Robusto

@RegDwight — You can't even get sound in your country. What do you need an advanced browser for?

Cerberus

@Rob: Okay, good. I will try it on my parents' PC. I couldn't live without most of my extensions, so we'll see.

RegDwight

@Robusto I have sound right now. And I am using an advanced browser right now. Two of them, actually. And none of them is FF.

Cerberus

5:58 PM

@Kiam: Hmm I still think it's a strange decision to use letters with accents.

Robusto

@Cerberus — You misunderstand. ALL my extensions work, those two were the only ones that needed updates. I'm talking Adblock, FasterFox, WebDeveloper, etc.

Cerberus

My ideal language wouldn't have accents for shoa.

Robusto

@RegDwight — How very special you must feel.

kiamlaluno

@Cerberus: It is to distinguish the sound of the letters. In Esperanto, every letter has just a pronunciation.

Cerberus

@Rob: Oh! Excellent! Do you use some uncommon ones?

RegDwight

5:59 PM

@Robusto It's spatial, you NNS.

kiamlaluno

When you find a ĉ, you already know how to pronunciate it.

Cerberus

@Kiam: Then why not either decrease the number of pronounced vowels, or use diphthongs instead?

What was NNS again?

kiamlaluno

@Cerberus: Because the sound of a a is different from the sound of a e.

Esperanto has diphthongs.

Cerberus

@Kiam: ? Just have one a-like sounds, written a? Or use diphthongs like ei if you need any?

Oh...

Then just write ee for a long e?

Anything better than accents imo.

Robusto

Cerberus ^^

Cerberus

6:02 PM

@Rob: Okay that is a modest list.

Robusto

There are more but I have some disabled because I don't use them much.

kiamlaluno

@Cerberus: Each letter has only a sound; there is a perfect match between sounds and letters.

Robusto

There are also a number of plugins.

kiamlaluno

The only diphthongs are aŭ and eŭ.

RegDwight

The repartee question has been greatly improved! It now also says "hi thanks for answer can u use it in a sentence for me i'd really appreciate it!"

Cerberus

6:04 PM

Robusto

@kiamlaluno — Which works until the language starts acquiring variants of phoneme pronunciation. Which it inevitably will.

RegDwight

@Cerberus God, why do you even need any of that stuff?

Cerberus

This is only a–i, and on a profile whose list of extensions I have recently trimmed to bare necessities.

Robusto

@Cerberus: I don't need no cute buttons.

Cerberus

I used to have 200 or so.

kiamlaluno

6:06 PM

@Robusto Well, Esperanto has the same pronunciation since it was born. :-)

RegDwight

I just use a browser that has everything I need right from the start.

Cerberus

@Rob: Yeah the cute buttons are a bit embarrassing. I basically want them because I want every entry in my context menus to have an icon, which makes them easier to recognize. This is the best extension that does that.

@Reg: Then you must be needing very little!

RegDwight

@Cerberus Well, certainly no "cute buttons". I'm not a five-year old girl.

Cerberus

@Reg: I know, I know...

I will show you the cute buttons.

RegDwight

O God, everybody HIDE!

Robusto

6:08 PM

@RegDwight Jinx!

RegDwight

yesterday, by Robusto

No. Mine was better.

Cerberus

Robusto

Also ... IE Tab? Really?

RegDwight

It's not a jinx if I read your comment, and Cerberus comments on your comment, and then I comment on Cerberus' comment on your comment.

Robusto

@RegDwight — Rationalize all you want.

RegDwight

6:10 PM

@Cerberus If this is your cute then I don't want to see your ugly.

Cerberus

Yeah, IE Tab is the quickest way to test whether a page doesn't load owing to something browser specific, such as interface, extensions, cookies, etc.

RegDwight

@Robusto Not rationalizing, explaining to NNS.

Cerberus

@Reg: Hey don't push my button! They are cute already!

Robusto

@RegDwight — Spoken like propagandist.

Cerberus

Seriously: if each option has an icon, doesn't matter what, I can press it faster. Productivity trumps looks, by far, as far as I am concerned.

Robusto

6:12 PM

@Cerb: glow.mozilla.org/?WT.mc_id=s3&WT.mc_ev=click

RegDwight

@Robusto Worst retort ever.

Cerberus

@Rob: Cute!

RegDwight

@Robusto Cool, I am none of those flashes.

Cerberus

I saw no sparks over northern Japan somehow.

Robusto

Cerberus

6:13 PM

Cuter!

Robusto

For Reg ^^

Cerberus

Is that an impression of you?

RegDwight

Is that you?

Jinx!

Robusto

Now we know what @RegDwight looks like.

Cerberus

@Reg: Hehehe, we're good ain't we.

Robusto

6:14 PM

We all know who said "Worst retort ever."

1 min ago, by RegDwight

@Robusto Worst retort ever.

Cerberus

Rob is pretty fun to gang up on.

Robusto

Q.E.D.

RegDwight

@Robusto Retort != episode. Look it up in a dictionary of your choice. I'll wait.

Besides, I have posted actual pictures of myself already. You fail.

Cerberus

Downloading Cute Dictionary™.... Hey, it says: unicorns?

@Reg: Have you?? Feel free to quote yourself!

RegDwight

Sigh And you, you feel free to pay attention, you.

kiamlaluno

6:17 PM

(I have to remember that the nice red circular button is the one to close a window.)

Cerberus

Meh how am I supposed to remember things, with my memory...

Robusto

@RegDwight — My unicorn dictionary doesn't have an entry for either of those words.

RegDwight

Feb 8 at 14:03, by RegDwight

http://www.silverwolf.ru/events/gallery/?id=133

Feb 11 at 15:06, by RegDwight

http://pics.livejournal.com/nizami/pic/000197p6/

Robusto

But it has shiny, cute buttons.

Cerberus

@Kiam: Watch out, or I'll be forced to evangelize mouse gestures upon you...

RegDwight

6:18 PM

@Robusto Okay, then alles vergessen und vergeben.

Robusto

@RegDwight — Wow, you're taking this very personally.

RegDwight

@Robusto No, I'm doing my job. When people say, quote that link, I will.

kiamlaluno

Gestures? My little mighty does that alone.

Cerberus

The one with the helmet is cute!

Robusto

@RegDwight — What other orders are you bound to obey? Just curious ...

Cerberus

6:19 PM

Are you also the guy with the mink?

kiamlaluno

(Well, it is really a magic mouse.)

Cerberus

Ah...

RegDwight

@Robusto It depends on whether you are still wearing that nurse drag.

Cerberus

Well then I shan't bother you by explaining how I draw a C to close a window...

Kosmonaut

@Robusto I wonder what is wrong with this guy?

kiamlaluno

6:20 PM

There is an utility for that, but I didn't install it.

RegDwight

@Robusto Seriously though, why don't you just give it a try?

bk.com/en/us/campaigns/subservient-chicken.html

Cerberus

@Kos: Hey I just forgot to take my pills for a few days...

kiamlaluno

It's cute.

Cerberus

Quite.

Oh, that guy.

Yeah he has me wondering too.

Kosmonaut

What does he want from this site?

Is he simply doing performance art?

RegDwight

6:23 PM

Apropos performance art, I gotta go.

Pina (film)

Pina is a 2011 German 3D dance film directed by Wim Wenders. The film premiered Out of Competition at the 61st Berlin International Film Festival. Cast * Pina Bausch References External links *

See you later.

Rhodri

3D dance film. Does that mean they dance up the walls as well as on the floor?

MrHen

So... how long should I wait before I ask another question about anonymity? ;)

Rhodri

@MrHen Depends on whether you use a sockpuppet or not :-)

MrHen

@Rhodri Haha, nice. :)

Martha

@RegDwight I hope the lead actress of that film never moves to Hungary. Or if she does, I hope someone pulls her aside and tells her why she has to change her name ASAP.

kiamlaluno

6:29 PM

(ASAP is never ASAP enough.)

Martha

(Oh, and if the distributor has had trouble selling the film in Hungary, I can tell him why.)

MrHen

@Martha So vague and tantalizing you have become...

Martha

'Pina' is a very rude word for female genitals.

(And now quickly somebody find a different subject, because we can't leave that message there with a "The last message was posted X hours ago" below it.)

JPmiaou

Regarding the dumb blond on the "quiz" show: I'm fairly certain the whole thing is a fake. Notice how the host consistently mispronounces Hungary with two syllables?

Martha

Well, "Are You Smarter Than a Fifth-Grader" is a real TV show.

Whether the dumb blond was pretending... I kinda doubt it, nobody would volunteer to be humiliated that way under their real name, would they?

Cerberus

6:41 PM

Unless they were offered big monies.

The first season of Big Brother was fake already.

Participants were paid 500 guilders a day regardless, while we were led to believe they got nothing if they didn't win.

(BB was alas invented in Holland.)

JPmiaou

I know it's a real TV show; I'm saying it's not a real game show.

Cerberus

Hmm I should go... bye!

@JPM: Agreed. There is no telling what's real and what's fake about such a show. I think many, many more shows are fake in various respects than we know.

That is only to be expected: fake = cheaper, and more bizarre = more attention = more viewers = more money.

Martha

It was supposedly a for-charity episode, i.e. the dumb blond was a beauty queen of some sort.

Cerberus

"Queen" hah.

Well I'm off. poof

Rhodri

Another statement that could be misinterpreted, darling.

:-)

Cerberus

6:46 PM

Meh! I suck.

Ah, balls.

Noo...

JPmiaou

I think some people may be willing to be humiliated like that for charity, as long as it was well-publicized as being for charity.

Cerberus

*money

JPmiaou

I believe the woman is a country singer or some such, by the way. Definitely famous, anyway.

Ugh, who starred Martha's post? Now I have to look at that word front and center any time I'm in chat!

Rhodri

::stares at gift horse::

Robusto

0

Q: Why is "sautee" spelled with an accent and "repartee" not?

They have the same sound at the end, right? Argh, it is so frustrating! Why isn't English more logical?

words spelling

WTF???

Voting to close.

Martha

6:53 PM

@Robusto Wouldn't it be enough to edit to remove the rant (and correct the spelling of sauté)?

Rhodri

It's a rant following up on this one:

0

Q: Should I write "repartee" with an accent?

Does repartee need an accent with it in writing? Also, what does it mean? Edit: Can you please provide an example sentence or two? I'd really appreciate it!

meaning nouns spelling

Robusto

@Martha — I don't know. I don't feel comfortable editing someone's communication to that extent.

Martha

I figure if the choice is between "get your post closed" and "get your post edited", most people will choose the latter.

MrHen

@Martha You'd be surprised... as it turns out, some people do not think rationally.

Rhodri

@MrHen Shocking. They must be artists.

Martha

6:59 PM

@MrHen I think you misspelled "most" as "some".

But anyway, I added comments on both the edit and on the question, so hopefully she'll get the point.

Oops, gotta go. TTYL.

Rhodri

7:31 PM

...and when Martha goes to sleep, all her friends go to sleep too.

In other words, I'm off.

F'x

I need help for an answer

does English have any common word with the sound "te" (IPA)

or actually, just that contains it

like the French 'é', or the sound of e in the Italian "va bene"

the answer is here, if you want to help:

0

Q: Why is "sauté" spelled with an accent and "repartee" not?

Why are these words spelled differently? They have the same sound at the end, right?

pronunciation spelling

MrHen

taint?

I am a little rusty on IPA

F'x

7:46 PM

@MrHen yes, like taint, but without the "i" after the "e"

I can think of plenty of "ei" examples, but no single "e"

I was told by an old English teacher that it's not used in English, but every rule has exceptions :)

Robusto

0

Q: What is the difference between 'roof' and 'canopy' ?

What is the difference between 'roof' and 'canopy' ? And would you describe the sky as the roof of the earth or the canopy of the earth. (Sky meaining everything up to the ozone layer).

usage

This guy is determined to be the new vgv8 or T-Rex.

MrHen

@Robusto Arg, yes.

@Fx I guess I don't understand. You want the "ay" sound with a "t" in front and no "i" involved? Or is there a subtly I am not seeing/hearing here?

F'x

so, Wikipedia's IPA Chart for English tells me that the only use of "e" as a vowel in English is: "bed" in Australian English

I want the IPA "e" sound: like "va bene" in Italian

actually, even without the "t" works for me

a single vowel, not a diphthong

MrHen

Ah

Hm.

F'x

simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPA_chart_for_English

Robusto

7:50 PM

What about beta and theta? Both English derived from Greek.

F'x

except the standard US pronunciation of beta starts like beetle

Robusto

Both rhyme with data. (dayta)

Kosmonaut

Beta and theta have diphthongs

@Fx No, it doesn't.

F'x

@Kosmonaut you're right, it's British English, not US English

Robusto

If beta has a diphthong then so does date.

Kosmonaut

7:52 PM

We say /beɪtə/ and /θeɪtə/. Yes, "date" also.

F'x

@Robusto yes, date also does

Kosmonaut

/deɪt/

Robusto

All right, if that's the distinction you're making.

F'x

so, I'm looking for a "Close-mid front unrounded vowel" in English

anyone selling?

Robusto

How much you wanna pay?

MrHen

7:53 PM

"cake" is pretty close

F'x

50 rep :)

@MrHen diphthong too

Robusto

Hmmm ... make it 100 and I'm in.

I don't roll out of bed for 50 rep.

MrHen

@Fx Not where I am from. The double 'k' totally kills the diphthong

F'x

trouble is, I'm always going to find some regional variation where people use this or that

MrHen

@Fx Very true.

@Fx Btw, if you ever want to hear some awesome diphthongs, move to Texas

JPmiaou

7:56 PM

@Fx Sorry, doesn't exist. English only uses [e] as part of the diphthong [eɪ].

F'x

@MrHen I'm sure even if I wanted to hear amazing diphthongs, I'd still find a good reason not to move to Texas

Robusto

@MrHen — If by awesome you mean gratuitous, I agree.

F'x

@JPmiaou so I gathered, thanks for the confirmation

Robusto

The situation is general all through the south.

JPmiaou

Even "sauté" and such borrowings get the pesky [ɪ] added.

F'x

7:57 PM

Close-mid front unrounded vowel

The close-mid front unrounded vowel is a type of vowel sound, used in some spoken languages. The symbol in the International Phonetic Alphabet that represents this sound is . Features * Its vowel height is close-mid, which means the tongue is positioned halfway between a close vowel and a mid vowel. * Its vowel backness is front, which means the tongue is positioned as far forward as possible in the mouth without creating a constriction that would be classified as a consonant. * Its vowel roundedness is unrounded, which means that the lips are not rounded. Occurrence {| class="wikitable...

Robusto

If you go to Disney World, for example, you'll be invited to visit "Fahantasy Layund" ...

F'x

well, many borrowed French words have been changed that way, because French uses it a lot (as does Italian)

Transcript for

English Language & Usage: Multi-Layer…