The Restaurant at the End of the Universe - 2018-08-05

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1:40 AM

@Jenayah There is a site that collects various poetry translations, some from Hungarian to English. magyarulbabelben.net but also disguised under a slightly different skin as babelmatrix.org and visegradliterature.net

It seems to collect translations of varying quality, so don't trust everything you find there, but you can find masterpieces by really good famous translators there such as Makkai Ádám.

babelmatrix.org/index.php?page=translations lists all translations from Hungarian to English.

It does have prose translations too.

But it's mostly short pieces, you won't find entire children's novels like G. Szabó Judit wrote.

It does have one by Szabó Magda: babelmatrix.org/works/hu/Szab%C3%B3_Magda-1917/Az_ajt%C3%B3/en/…

And this is the list of translations from Hungarian to French, since if I understand correctly, you do read French: babelmatrix.org/index.php?page=translations

To clarify, this is a website that only publishes translations together with the original, both with full text available. It's not a catalog of translations. Though of course as it usually gives sources (as in where the translation was published), and always gives the name of the translator, it could give you hints on where to find more good translations.

@b_jonas Or, well, perhaps they're young adult novels.

8 hours later…

9:47 AM

@b_jonas alright, I'll be sure to take a look! Yeah I read French, however whole I will take a look at those translations too, I'd rather trust the English ones - English is generally better known so the translations are of a higher quality :)

But let's not all ill when I haven't read any so far ;D

10:30 AM

*talk I'll (saw that T9 error after the grace period, sorry)

10:58 AM

**talk ill (oh man, not my day ahah)

@Jenayah Wait, is that really so?

I know it's a stereotype, but I thought English just had a huge mass of mostly bad translations, because it's a big business so everyone publishes translations, whereas French has fewer translations but by those who care. But it's probably not the language that matters, but whether the translation is from before or after c. 2002, when printing new books in low volume became so easy that everyone started to publish bad books.

It might be a quantity/proportion thing. Suppose that French has lots of bad translations as a proportion of things translated into French, and suppose English has lots of bad translations because the sheer number of things translated into English will mean even 5% being bad is a lot of bad translations.

I also admit that I'm just totally biased against English, and deep down I think that English poetry isn't real poetry until it is given the proper form by a really good poetry translator, and those aren't easy to come by.

poetry itself is probably very difficult to translate

11:14 AM

@doppelgreener Yes, that's why there are so few good poetry translators, and probably only at most one before Babits's school started teaching the art of poetry translation to a circle of talented friends in the 1920, and together they figured out techniques to improve that art; the one possible exception being Arany János who was a genius, but he lived before his time and didn't have access to all those tools, so he could only do so much.

At least, that's it for translation to Hungarian.

11:32 AM

@b_jonas Hm, I was mainly talking about "indie" translations. It's my opinion, but I think English is easier to learn than French; hence, when someone translates to language X to English, I've been faced with better quality translations than from language X to French because the translator knows enough French to translate it, but not enough to convey the whole messages underneath

(credit where credit's due however, kudos to these guys for trying and making said translations available for a broader public)

The bane, of course, being someone taking a work indie-translated into English and translating it once again in French. This is like recording a voice out of a phone, with an average mike: the quality is diluted twice.

Then again, the persons doing that truly want to make content available to the public, but you know what they say, Hell's paved with good intentions.

So yeah, when there's an English translation available I'd rather go for it over a French one. However that's purely because I can speak English quite well (IMHO); most of the French audience needs the French translation, 'cause it's a reality that French people absolutely suck at English.

1 hour later…

12:47 PM

@Jenayah Oh, so your problem is that the French translation might be through the English translation, just how there are very few Latvian to Hungarian translations, so people translate it through Russian?

@Jenayah Like half of them know enough English to understand tourists now. At least the ones working in places that lots of tourists visit, like ski resort towns.

@b_jonas either that or the translator didn't know enough French to convey the message, 'cause I think English is easier to master (just my opinion mind you :) )

I'll check the French out too

@b_jonas Just because they understand (and that's a big word) tourist, doesn't mean tourists understand them ahah :D

@Jenayah But aren't most indie translators to French actually French native speakers who don't understand enough of Japanese to have a manga translation license?

@Jenayah Yes. Like, in the cheap youth hotels that we sleep in for skiing, they hand us a room equipment list we have check and confirm that nothing is missing when we arrived. It's sometimes written only in French, but more often in both French and English, and even that way it always takes us two hours to figure out most of which item each entry is supposed to refer to, by a process of elimination where we pair the more obviously named items first, then the remaining ones,

and even then there's a few we're uncertain about.

@b_jonas are you talking about those who translate scans?

@Jenayah More those who subtitle animé.

@b_jonas sounds like quite a pain :/

@b_jonas I woudln't say they don't have enough Japanese to have a translation license

Rather the broadcasting channels/DVD editors etc already have their translators

But it takes times to convert to DVD and all

12:58 PM

I hope that eventually they will start to use little black-and-white photos.

So the whole anime market takes place on streaming

(While still keeping a French and English description.)

@Jenayah Yes, the indie translators who subtitle them quickly.

@b_jonas meh. Too expensive, they'd rather want the tourist to level with them... :roll-eyes:

@Jenayah Yes, there are legends of ways they do that, such as the inspector entering the apartment with muddy shoes, then complain that we didn't clean the floor up properly.

@b_jonas well I'd also say that I'm not sure how much of a living you can actually make by being a translator, but if I had to guess, I'd say, "not much"

1:00 PM

But it's a lottery, most of the time the inspector doesn't really care about anything if there isn't something obviously very wrong (like clear signs of a wild party).

@b_jonas there's a special place in Hell for this type of persons

@Jenayah You could make some of a living back before c. 2002 when printing books in small volumes was too expensive, so publishers only ordered translations of a few books where they can publish the translation in a large number of copies, so the few best translators were paid. But it was hard to become a really good translator, and the writers who failed ended up as journalists, which is boring.

@b_jonas well, I don't know how the Hungarian books market is doing, but in France less and less people buy books

Also, the editors are jerks.

@Jenayah Sadly the punishment isn't just for them, it's for all the people who work in the ski resorts, because us Hungarian tourists are also openly disrespectful and rude with them.

@Jenayah Actually, it pays pretty well.

1:05 PM

@b_jonas in response to French behaviour or is that just a trend?

@Mithrandir oh yeah? Well that depends on countries then ^^

1:45 PM

@Jenayah It's probably a mutual response cycle. Both sides are rude becuase the other side is rude too. Everyone knows that if you go skiing to France, you pay less but you get respected less; if you go skiing to Austria, you pay more but you get respected more (and usually the ski pistes are maintained better); but the workers also know that the tourists are rude and not worth to respect for the little money they pay.

The whole ski resort complex is specialized for this mutual consent.

@b_jonas theguardian.com/world/2018/mar/26/…

A likely solution is for everyone to realize that we can just go to Slovenia, which is both closer and better, until too many people realize and it gets too crowded, like Slovakia and France.

Damn French are really rude :/

@Jenayah No, I think we are ruder.

@b_jonas Don't you dare belittling French rudeness! It's part of our patrimony and our nationoal pride! :D

1:56 PM

It's just that I retell their dirty ploys (like making the week's group pay for using up the empty fire extinguisher in the ski boot drying cabinet, because they know no-one will check that one when they arrive, even if they report all the existing small damages in the apartments as a precaution),

but omit the ploys our side makes (the wild parties and pissing off from balconies, the Trianon shirts worn since we already go on the national holiday on --03-15 every day so we have to take one less day off).

At least they did make me feel at home when there was dog shit left in the snow right at the beautiful scenery where we exit from the apartments to the ski pistes.

And we laugh at their barbarian habits, like eating snails and naming pistes instead of numbering them.

Except when those alien habits turn against us, like when they dared to install a chaired skibahn with no footrest at all, rather than the usual tiny footrest and uncomfortable seats.

@b_jonas wow that just sounds dangerous actually oO

@b_jonas yeah but that way, you know that the pist "The three little ducks" is an easy one, and on "The Dreadful Slope" you're in for a challenge :D

@Jenayah We only met that once. And that's not dangerous, it's only very tiring on your legs. The dangerous lift is the one with bad chest restraining bar, which I once met in Slovenia.

@b_jonas I mean, that kind of sounds like your skis could just slip right down on the pists below

@Jenayah That's what the colors are for. And besides, we experienced skiers are sometimes angry at those ratings because they scare the beginners from coming with us on some easy piste that is marked hard.

@Jenayah No, the footrest doesn't help much for that. Normally your skis are firmly attached to your ski boots, or else you lose them before you even have a chance to get on the skibahn. And in the rare cases when someone's skis come loose, the footrest, which is a single narrow bar, doesn't help stop the long ski from falling.

2:13 PM

@b_jonas ahah now I want to rewatch Les Bronzés font du ski because of that conversation :)

French Fried Vacation 2

French Fried Vacation 2 (Les Bronzés font du ski) is a classic 1979 French comedy directed by Patrice Leconte. It is a sequel to Les Bronzés (1978), and it was followed by Les Bronzés 3 : Amis pour la vie (2006). == Plot == The characters from the first movie get together again, this time in the ski resort of Val d'Isere where Jérôme, Gigi and Popeye work. Jérôme and Gigi are now married: Gigi owns a pancake house while Jérôme has a medical practice. Nathalie and Bernard, reconciled and fairly "nouveaux riches", are owners of a timeshare. Jean-Claude is still desperately trying to seduce any...

The footrest could perhaps conceivably stop those stupid children from falling out whose upper calf is too short to sit comfortably on the long seat and so keep wriggling and slipping forwards and not even properly sitting, just standing on the footrest and leaning their ass to the front of the seat, and their stupid parents don't restrain them with harsh words.

@b_jonas Isn't there a size limit under which you can't go on the ski lift?

But there's a good reason why the operators don't allow those children to travel alone on chair skibahns, and in the case of larger groups of children led by too few ski instructors, the instructor and operator even asks people who just happen to be there to take care of one child who gets on to their cabin.

But this generally only happens for the larger skibahns. The one with the omitted skirest is a small one on a difficult piste, you won't see those misbehaved children travel there.

@b_jonas guess so then, yeah

@Jenayah I don't think so. There's a limit under which you can't go without adult supervision, and there are recommendations for where the child should be sitting.

Losing small children would be very bad for the business. They're often the children of locals, and very often the ones who will learn to ski well and love to ski and go to ski pistes a lot.

2:18 PM

@b_jonas Ah indeed

And that limit is 1,25m. oO

Can you seriously go on those things alone when you're 1,30m tall?!

Plus, the ski resort usually runs ski schools for the little ones, so they profit from that too. (In france, it's only ski schools speaking in French that do that, for the kids of locals, mind you.)

Damn that's a 8-years-old size

@b_jonas seriously they still haven't learnt English?

@Jenayah Yeah, they're actually pretty safe equipment. Apart from many people dropping ski batons and gloves (which is totally their own stupidity) all the time, I never heard of any accident where anyone fell off a chair skibahn.

Last time I took a ski lesson was 11-12 years ago and I was the one who translated stuff to the German kid...

(my translations were kid's one mind you, but the teacher knew even less than me...)

@Jenayah Wouldn't help. The tourists' young schoolkiddoes don't speak English yet, and families with small kids will travel to Austria or Slovenia anyway.

It would only help for the much smaller market of adults who want to take ski lessons or snow boarding lessons because they start late but want to pay for a professional.

2:22 PM

@b_jonas eh, agree to disagree. from what I've seen of foreign kids, they get on with English way earlier than we do

And becoming a ski instructor is already pretty hard, you can't also expect learning ten European languages next to that.

@b_jonas Ten, no. But c'mon everybody in France is supposed to have at least seven years of English classes

@Jenayah Was the kid speaking some particularly strange dialect of German?

Agreed, they're often bad classes, but come on, you should be able to hold a conversation. Maybe not an essay, but a conversation

@Jenayah Meh, I've had eight years of French classes, and look at how little I speak now. That's not enough to actually teach skiing and understand what they say, especially if it involves kids.

@Jenayah Yes, I can ask for baguette in the shop, very useful for skiing actually.

2:24 PM

@b_jonas Dunno, but when I was telling stuff like "you stop", "you make like this", "we go points finger towards location " he seemed to understand

@Jenayah Wait, weren't you translating from the kid to the instructor?

Because that's the hard part.

Especially once the kid starts crying and the instructor tries to figure out what's wrong and calm him down and there's nine other kids around.

You may understand that he's calling for her mama, but not get the important stuff out from him.

@b_jonas mastering English is waaay more useful than speaking French. And we're supposed to encounter English on a daily basis - movies, reports, business, etc. I can understand how someone won't practice French every day, English should be a basic requirement for new generations, though.

@b_jonas nah, kid wasn't much the talking type

@Jenayah You're in IT. You encounter English every day.

@Jenayah Yes, that's the problem, that's why you can't tell what he wants.

I mean remembering that, parents pretty much dropped that poor kid off to that French-only ski class

Also, selection bias: you're in this chatroom, because you understand enough English and consider it useful to communicate with random people around the internet in English.

2:28 PM

@b_jonas True, IT people encounter it more than the rest.

Even then, when you book a holiday or something not everyone speaks French, I mean

It might change eventually, because these days much more Hungarian kids speak English good enough, especially the ones with non-poor parents who will take them to skiing.

Like when I got my room here, all conversations were held in English

So English ski instruction will perhaps have more buyers soon.

Even then, it's an overall shame we don't try more to get kids into English via school.

Everything's dubbed here because of the Vichy regime

That was 70 years ago!

Most kids these days learn English not from school, but from video games, Internet, streaming etc

And that's a good thing, mind you

@Jenayah We do. The threshold was precisely before my generation, who started school after 1985: anyone older than me is likely to have been required to learn Russian, anyone younger than me is likely to have been required to learn English in school. There's a backlash of course, and now schools teach English and German, and too few teach Russian, even as a third language.

2:34 PM

But the English teaching here is just bad.

@Jenayah Hmm.

@b_jonas Man, I'm four years into higher education, and I still have to deal with "put the S when you're using the third person" exercizes.

But that could explain why the ski instructors, who obviously can't be very young because they have to study for several years after already being a good skiers, are ones who already speak English.

@Jenayah Oh, you mean the colleges offer only beginner courses, not advanced ones? That's totally true.

@b_jonas I did the same exercizes before college...

Once you learn enough of a language, it's hard to find schools that teach you more, but that's just as well, because that part is inefficient to learn in a school.

2:36 PM

And the big diploma (baccalauréat) is a joke nowadays, but that's another debate

@b_jonas how to write a résumé? Cover letters? Hold a debate?

After some level of fluency, you have to live in an environment where you have to converse with better speakers in that language, or, failing that, at least read books and watch TV series and chat in chat rooms.

But no, we're stuck with "make a video to introduce a new student to your school"

Well actually, the English video was kind of quickly made, since there's no coordination between language teachers, everybody taking Spanish lessons recycled their scenario from the very same task we had to do in Spanish the year before

@Jenayah How to write a resumé isn't a language problem. At least not for me, because I'm bad at the social parts. The resumé is mostly about professional stuff in the profession I should already be good at, which is the easiest part of the language, plus some factual data like dates and my name. Plus it has to be short so it barely even has complete sentences.

@b_jonas well for instance it's not an established fact that you can have a 2-pages résumé

@Jenayah Wtf.

2:41 PM

Like in France, it's always one page, not a single letter more, yeah, put you 20+ years of experience in ONE SINGLE PAGE

Thank heavens for LinkedIn

@Jenayah They reformed the bac in Hungary a few years after I graduated (in two steps or so), so it's much more difficult now then it used to be.

@b_jonas oh here it's the opposite. They reform and reform but that just makes the thing easier

@Jenayah That would make it hard. I wrote my resumé as two pages, and try to keep it as that, but I don't yet have 20 years of experience.

In the meantime, they don't adjust higher education (for engineering at last), so you tend to be completely lost when you move from high school to higher

I can cheat a bit with the length since I can send a PDF with links they can click on.

As in, I say I have some number of publications in combinatorics and conference presentations, see full list at this URL.

2:43 PM

Yeah, English résumés can be two pages and that's nice

@b_jonas hehe, the little tricks

then again, no use in flooding the résumé with the complete bullet list of your papers, conferences etc

@Jenayah They can't. Figuring out how the first years of college education should work is hard, because you get young adults with very different backgrounds, and you have to get them to the same speed quickly. For solving IT education, I think it's actually impossible.

@Jenayah Certainly.

It makes sense if you're young and applying for a PhD, that resumé should contain your publication list (or at least some non-short selection of it), because they want to look at it.

@b_jonas they can't and shouldn't, but if the level bar keeps on getting lower for high school, of course the students are lost when they come to higher

But now, when I'm applying in IT and have publications in mathematics, nobody cares.

Then again, I'm not talking about universities. Universities are a whole other mess

@Jenayah The expert level version is making a thesis presentation such that you make a referee ask a question that lets you tell something that you really wanted to talk about, but doesn't fit into the time limit for your main presentation, since answering the referee questions doesn't count in the time limit.

2:48 PM

@b_jonas does bribing the referee count? :p

@Jenayah Um, I'm confused about your age now. You have 20+ years of experience, but complain about language education in universities, and now also primary education? Do you have a kid in school or what?

@b_jonas oh heavens no, I don't have 20 years of experience

The example above was a generality: people with 20+ years of experience still need to have a 1-page résumé

@Jenayah Oh, you just claim 20 years of experience on your CV because it sounds good. Yes, that's the good way to write a CV.

And I also don't have a kid, and will likely never have ahah

@Jenayah No, people with 20+ years of experience can afford to not have a good CV. They're valuable on the job market.

2:50 PM

@b_jonas Neither do I, if I had 20 years of exeprience as of now I would've started IT very soon ahah

@b_jonas Sure, because they can prove that in interviews. But you still (in France) have to give a 1-page résumé, which sucks.

I've stopped worrying about the exact ways the education system is screwed up since I got out of it. I don't have kids. It's already too tiring to try to listen to local news and politics, and if there's something I want to pay attention to, it's how fucked up the medical system is, and when it's so fucked up that I'd better flee Hungary, and when is it so fucked up that I have to try to convince even my grandparents or parents to flee Hungary.

Hey I feel like we're a bit lost in translation, so just to clarify, I'm 20ish years old, still a student, but the "school" system I'm in is a bit different from "usual" universities; French stuff, because we like it complicated :D

Aw man, at least our medical system is great - of course it has its flaws, but for most things you can expect to be cured without paying too much

My cousin is starting high school but I barely speak with her. My niece is just a baby, and she'll be affected by the education system in Sweden, which is probably fucked up in entirely different ways, and I'll be hearing stories about it when it's time, but I won't have to intervene because it's my brother's job and her wife's (and that of their older relatives who live in Sweden), and they'll handle it pretty well as far as I can predict.

@b_jonas doesn't Sweden elevate kids as high as princes or something? I've heard they almost spoil the children there.

Like a lot of people do, sure, but in Sweden it seemed to be a greater deal.

@Jenayah That's great. The problem is, you also have to care about the medical system will be in a decade or two, when you still want to be cured and will be less healthy (ok, you're 20 years old so you'll be healthier in a decade, but still, you might have elderly relatives too).

@Jenayah I don't know yet.

Do you mean just the parents, or the education system, or everyone else too?

Kids are always cute and often get their way in some things, because people just can't help loving them, it's biologically wired.

2:58 PM

@b_jonas Well sure, if we're being honest the system is kind of failing, lots and lots of debts, but at least it works now. Countries with a system that is already fucked-up aren't really likely to get it better soon

It's the way of Europe, kids are always spoiled.

The problem with the health system in Hungary is that it's fucked up enough, but is still going by innertia, because there is still a number of doctors who don't want to leave to abroad. But most of the younger doctors leave, and even some older doctors who you'd thought would never move go and migrate. They all find good comfy jobs abroad.

@b_jonas was referring to this article

(sorry for the quick-fix Google translation, I'm lazy :p )

The exception is dentists, who don't move because patients from all of western Europe come to them (and to the ones in Ukraine too) by airplane and get their asses licked for cheap. The dentists stay here in Hungary, and charge a lot, except for the worst dentists who can only get work in the state-funded system.

@b_jonas TBH we kind of have the same problem here too with people who don't want to go to the countryside

Hey, I'll have to leave to do some groceries (didn't see the time ahah), but good talk, let's pick that conversation again soon!

See you, and sorry for leaving in a rush ^^'

And that is why if you go to a pub, you don't want to get into a fistfight with a stronger guy and get your jaw broken, because all the dental surgeons are busy inserting tooth protesisis into the mouth of elderly Swedish people, and fixing your jaw won't pay well for them, so you'll get the worst dental surgeons doing the hardest operation.

And while I can blame the governments for some of it, it's not something that has some obvious solution. The trap is that as long as living here is cheaper than in west Europe, then it will always be worth for parents in west to pay the tuition of medical students to study in the east, then it's always worth for those doctors to go work in the west. Where Sweden is part of this west we're speaking.

It doesn't even matter all that much whether there are also Hungarian medical students with tuition payed by the state, who then all go abroad. That's just what politicians blame. Even if they shut all that down, there'll be western students paying for their own medical education, which is better here, and then leaving, and there'll never be doctors working here.

Even by stopping the Hungarian medical students from leaving by taxing them for it hard, they won't make Sweden suddenly make more medical universities than the Uppsala one and teach enough doctors for themselves. At worst they'll just send medical students to somewhere else in the east.

It could ruin medical education, but won't fix the medical system in Hungary.

2 hours later…

4:43 PM

10

Q: Is there an in-universe reason why pumpkin juice is so popular in the wizarding world?

Is there an in universe reason why pumpkin juice is very popular in the wizarding world but not in the Muggle world? Out of universe, I understand why JKR would pick pumpkin juice over orange juice: Pumpkins are heavily associated with magical properties; people associate them with Halloween and...

5:39 PM

@b_jonas Well, that and the obvious reason that most people don't like to get punched in the face when they just wanted to get a drink :-)

Joke aside, I guess tghe Hungarian government isn't big on "help plans" for doctors?

like "okay, we know you'd rather go to the West to have a more comfy life, but we need doctors here so here's the deal, you stay, we pay for your doctor's office/your kids' kindergarten/etc" ?

3 hours later…

8:19 PM

@Jenayah That is the tangly daily political part that politicians will loudly dispute and the government will praise whatever plan they do and the opposition will tell that it's worthless, and I'd rather not go into it. So no reply. I'm just trying to tell why it's such a difficult task.

Obviously the government claims that whatever they're doing now is the best for the doctors and the patients, and if it turns out that it isn't, then the minister of healthcare is fired and a new minister does something completely different that is now the best for the doctors and for the patients too, because that's what the ministers are for, no matter which side has formed the government.

The ministers are the hit points or shields of the minister-president: if the government screws up and they can't blame it on any minister, that is when the minister-president has to leave and a new government has to be formed, even if it's not election time.

@b_jonas reminds me of that quote

I think some other countries use such a system too. That's why the Clinton–Lewinsky scandal or the őszödi beszéd for Gyurcsány Ferenc were such big trouble: they couldn't blame any minister for those.

Ok, I'll have to Google the latter, 'cause for a French person it looks like a cat walked on your keyboard ahah

(Obviously the minister-president may also have to leave for being incapacitated for health reasons or plane crashes.)

@Jenayah Basically, Gyurcsány Ferenc did a speech on a summer vacation party where he was supposed to be surrounded by his trusted inner party members, and admitted a bit too much in such a closed circle,

@b_jonas I'm reading the speech on the English Wikipedia, and boy, the guy screwed up big time

8:31 PM

but since he isn't allowed to kill trusted inner party members after such a thing, the speech got leaked, and as Gyurcsány, the then minister-president himself said those things, he had to leave.

He recovered from it well for the 2018 election though, given how bad it was.

Did he thought he was in a Tarantino movie or what?

the guy's swearing more than some action movies I've seen ._.

I mean swearing can be alright

But swearing + saying what he says, if the translation is trustworthy...

Hi @Alex

@Jenayah Hi.

2 hours later…

10:37 PM

5

Q: Why wouldn't Harry ever have had butterbeer before?

In Goblet of Fire we find butterbeer available to students in Hogwarts several times: At the party after Harry's name is picked out of the goblet: Harry couldn’t get away; whenever he tried to sidle over to the staircase up to the dormitories, the crowd around him closed ranks, forcing...

^ This is a quite well argued question. I hope whoever casted the close vote will explain in a comment.

Ah I see. Himarm and Rand are already settling that between themselves. And Rand has the hammer.

I have to agree with Rand here. Even if it turns out that Alex is mistaken, and Fred never got Butterbeer from the kitchens, only the Hogsmeade sweets, an answer could explain why, since Alex does give reasonable arguments to the contraray.

Wow, super long Oglaf today!

@SQB Some people speculate that the Giant is in such a roll that we'll get another Order of the Stick strip a day from now.

Sadly, I don't follow that one.

10:55 PM

@b_jonas It's explicit that they can get butterbeer from the kitchens: At the party after the First Task Ron states that Fred and George are getting stuff from the kitchens. Harry comes into the party and there is butterbeer. Hermione asks Fred and George if they got everything from the kitchens. Fred and George say yes.

@Alex Yes, that's what your question explains.

Wasn't there a question about why Apparition is not used in the first three books? scifi.stackexchange.com/q/111814/4918 "When is Apparating first mentioned in the Harry Potter books?" is similar

11:15 PM

As we know now (scifi.stackexchange.com/questions/106986/…), the relevant quote from The Chamber of Secrets doesn't actually appear in the Bloomsbury version but was added in to Scholastic's editions. Worth knowing :) (Arguably :P) — Au101 Nov 6 '15 at 2:30

I wonder if this comment should be edited into the question, and how much exaclty. Should I just change the attribution of the first quote from "Chamber of Secrets" to "Chamber of Secrets, Scholastic edition only, chapter 5"? Or should I add a note after the quote that "Alas, this decisive evidence only appears in the Scholastic edition." or before the quote?

Could some experienced harry-potter editor give me a help there please?

@SQB @Mithrandir ^

First leave a comment asking the OP to incorporate the comment. If they don't, then I'd add it as its own little blurb after the quote.

@Mithrandir Ok, but I'll probably forget that I left that comment immediately and will never edit it. As a workaround, I touched the question so it's on the active list and other people may find it.

11:47 PM

Hmm. scifi.stackexchange.com/a/51782/4918 gives a very good point. What exactly happened at the escape from Malfoy Manor?

@b_jonas you mean with Bellatrix's knife?

@Jenayah No. With Harry disapparating to Shell Cottage, which may be an example of Side-Along Apparition that might invalidate my answer, though of course it too was an emergency so it's not very strong evidence. I have to at least incorporate it into scifi.stackexchange.com/a/192365/4918

The quote that answer gives is in chapter 23 near the end.

@b_jonas By the way, you have a typo in that answer. Referring to Hermione, you wrote he only used it as an emergency measure when it shoud be "she". It's too small of an edit for me to suggest, so you might want to just fix it yurself.

I could also imagined that Dobby actually helped him with that Apparition or something.

@b_jonas Dobby's OP anyway.

11:59 PM

@Alex Thanks.

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