V'dibarta Bam

Double AA

12:46 AM

@SethJ There's a midrash that אמתה here means her arm got very long not her maidservant went and fetched it.

HodofHod

1:18 AM

@SethJ Well clearly they're all wrong.

Seth J

1:33 AM

@double aa sorry, I'm clear on the Midrash. What's a TL,, and what's with the drawing?

Double AA

@SethJ TL is the general mod chat room.

Seth J

Ohh. And casper?

Double AA

casperOne ♦, Brooklyn, NY

44.5k 8 72 131

c# .net linq wcf asp.net sql sql-server

mod on Stack Overflow

@SethJ The photograph is of Hod and casper ~~at lunch with Aarthi~~ after Hod was invaded by SE's katana-wielding minyans.

Seth J

Ok. And I just now got @Isaac's pun.

@hodofhod you aren't the slowest one in the room, apparently.

(Ftr, I got the pun before @double aa edited his last comment.)

Double AA

@SethJ casperOne has a dedicated fan chatroom chat.meta.stackoverflow.com/rooms/551/in-praise-of-moderators

Seth J

1:41 AM

How...friendly.

HodofHod

2:35 AM

@SethJ New Achievement Unlocked! "Not the slowest one in the room"

Seth J

@hodofhod Mazal Tov!

HodofHod

@SethJ badge-suggestion ?

:D

Shmuel Brin

4:09 AM

@DoubleAA Is this picture from a website (which converts photos to sketches)?

Double AA

4:47 AM

@ShmuelBrin That's the original ~~MS paint sketch by Aarthi~~ photograph!

@DoubleAA I didn't know Ketanos counted for a minyan!

msh210

6:15 AM

@DoubleAA en isur chal al isur

Seth J

12:59 PM

I've been wondering about this for quite some time, and I think I'd figured out most of the (relevant to me) details before reading it, so it was good to get confirmation (unless I've misunderstood the post).

200

A: How do comment @replies work?

You can use @name syntax anywhere in your comment to reply to a specific user. This will notify that user in their global inbox. There can also be notification through email if you click the "email settings" link at the lower left of your global inbox. In short: See comment replies in the M...

This seems to mean that I can ping @ms @do @hod and @mon and msh210, Double AA, HodofHod and Monica Cellio will all get pinged. Is that correct? If so, this makes commenting and chatting on mobile a lot easier.

Double AA

1:17 PM

@SethJ You need to use at least 3 characters.

@set I was not pung.

Seth J

@double roger.

"@Jo will notify Jo Miller but not John"

Monica Cellio

2:02 PM

@SethJ I got the ping.

Seth J

2:44 PM

@MonicaCellio Sweet. So it's 3 characters unless the full (first) name is two characters long. And in case of a shared name, the most recent commenter/chatter with that name is pinged.

So @hod works, @isaac works (sorry to annoy everyone, I'll stop after the next one)...

and so should @isa

(done being a nuisance)

Monica Cellio

3:11 PM

@double, is there a way to get the "show rashi" links from the Chabad site, or do you have to manually modify them? (Thanks for the edit showing me how to do the latter.)

Isaac Moses

3:34 PM

@SethJ You rang twice.

@MonicaCellio There used to be a simple checkbox that, when changed, caused the page to reload and give you a new link. Now, they've got a Web 2.0 show/hide control that updates your view of the page without reloading. Unfortunately, I don't see a way to get the site to generate a showrashi URL now. I even just tried the "share" link while showing Rashi, and it got me ready to share a plain URL.

HodofHod

3:49 PM

Now that I my comment about being descended from Basya has 3 stars, and looks like it may reside upon the sideboard for a bit, I feel I need to point out that we have no such tradition, the statement was made facetiously, i.e., for the purpose of the joke.

Context is a wonderful thing.

- Abraham Lincoln

Isaac Moses

@HodofHod Abraham Lincoln wasn't descended from Basya? That's a shame. It would have worked well with his reputation as the spiritual heir of Moses the Freer of Slaves.

Monica Cellio

@IsaacMoses yeah, that's been my experience too -- I'll be there looking at the Rashi, get the URL for the verse -- and there's no Rashi when somebody goes to that URL.

Double AA

@MonicaCellio I only know how to do it manually. There might be another way. This manual way might be deprecated at some point. Don't know.

Isaac Moses

@MonicaCellio The good news is that deep-linking to show Rashi is at least still possible, if you know to add /showrashi/true to the end of the URL. They must have made a special provision for that.

Monica Cellio

@HodofHod it's ok, we understand. As Abrham Lincoln said, the trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine.

@DoubleAA thanks. Now that I've got the clue about how to do it I'll just do it manually as long as that works.

@IsaacMoses &showrashi=true is what I've seen. And it has to go before the #verse part.

Isaac Moses

4:03 PM

@MonicaCellio Huh! Both syntaxes work in that location.

Monica Cellio

@IsaacMoses good to know.

Isaac Moses

@MonicaCellio Put it on the job application quiz for MY mod.

HodofHod

@MonicaCellio (That's actually exactly what I had in mind when I attributed it to him :D

@IsaacMoses "I think the more troubling fact here is that you seem to think I'm Abraham Lincoln"

-Abraham Lincoln

Double AA

None of y'all better call me Abram Lincoln.
--Abraham Lincoln

HodofHod

@IsaacMoses I spoke to one of the guys about it. I mentioned that I missed that feature, he mentioned that it was still possible.

Isaac Moses

4:14 PM

@HodofHod Where are you getting these quotations from? They are eerily on-point for this conversation.

@HodofHod Nice!

HodofHod

@IsaacMoses "If you shoot the arrow and then paint the target, your guaranteed a bullseye every time" -Maggid of Dubno

Who knew the Maggid of Dubno made such classic mistakes like your/you're?

2

Isaac Moses

@HodofHod Are they interested in making an API a la this comment?

@HodofHod The Maggid did not speak English. And please do not insist that this mistake works the same way in Polish, Russian, Yiddish, and Chinese.

HodofHod

@IsaacMoses The Maggid spoke Chinese? I'm sorry, I'm going to need a source for that.

@IsaacMoses I suspect they might have licensing restrictions that would prevent them from doing that.

Though if they ever finish this project who knows what might happen?

That article is 2.5 years old. I know they're still working on it, but apparently they're undermanned.

Isaac Moses

@HodofHod Wow. Pretty. I can see how that'd be a big job.

HodofHod

@IsaacMoses Yeah. According to my sources, one of the main focuses is supposed to be its online formatting and accessibility.

heh. "my sources"

> with commentary & insights from 400 sages & mystics

Whoa.

Menachem

4:38 PM

@IsaacMoses @MonicaCellio This still works, although I don't know if they plan on keeping it forever: old.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/aid/15957

changing "old" to "www" brings up the new version of the website

Seth J

4:59 PM

@MonicaCellio Amazing, actually.

@IsaacMoses I can only think of one MY user who might make that claim, and it's not @hod.

Daniel

@SethJ former user

Seth J

@Daniel The link still works, so whatever.

Seth J

5:19 PM

You are all being so careful with attributing quotes correctly. I'm impressed, but I think you're overdoing it. Bill Cosby says it's unnecessary:

reddit.com/tb/14cc7q

For those who can't open it:

Seth J

5:34 PM

Thoughts? dnainfo.com/new-york/20130606/gowanus/…

Isaac Moses

@SethJ Good. Ideally, the correct address for such advocacy is the school administrations, then the rabbis they listen to and/or the DoE. Assuming that those avenues have been pursued unsuccessfully, public tochacha sounds like a good idea.

HodofHod

@SethJ Good.

...everything in moderation

msh210

@HodofHod Yes, but are you referring specifically to the reprimand or the secular education?

HodofHod

@msh210 To my comment, which used to say "very good"

msh210

@HodofHod Ah. :-)

HodofHod

5:49 PM

@msh210 Truly, I'm not sure though. My gut reaction is "good", but then again, I know a lot of Oholei Torah'niks, who seem to be doing fine without any secular education. @Alex is one, although I don't know if all of his childhood education was in OT.

It's my understanding that the Rebbe preferred students not to learn secular studies, at least until the age of 9.

Isaac Moses

@HodofHod He's got a college degree. If he was able to achieve that without secular high-school education, then he's exceptional.

It's interesting that YAFFED (the organization that put up the billboard) not only has no haskamot on their website (a handicap but probably beyond their control at this point), but also seems to have geared the tone of the website toward people outside the UO community.

For example, see the quotations that their front-page banner scrolls through. None of them are from core Jewish sources.

HodofHod

@IsaacMoses He got a college degree when he was married. I'm unaware of when the Rebbe received his elementary education.

"then he's exceptional" . Well, yes.

Isaac Moses

@HodofHod I meant Alex.

HodofHod

@IsaacMoses Oh..... /facepalm.

Daniel

@IsaacMoses Alex is also exceptional :)

HodofHod

6:00 PM

@IsaacMoses I think my "Not the slowest one in the room" achievement just got revoked

2

Isaac Moses

@HodofHod Heh. I don't think I'd've needed a conditional clause to establish that the Rebbe was exceptional. :)

HodofHod

So, back to Oholei Torah. I don't know about Alex, but I do know people who went through their whole system, then chose to go to college (after studying on their own for a GED). I know some who are successful businessmen, one DA, a bunch of shluchim, etc...

@IsaacMoses Yeah, I wondered about that. Even his biggest detractors probably wouldn't claim that, just based on his successes. Should've tipped me off that I was misinterpreting.

another /facepalm, just for good measure.

Isaac Moses

@HodofHod Is there selection bias at work? That is, do you tend to hang out with people who are more oriented toward success in the secular world?

@HodofHod "Studying on their own for a GED" does not sound like the result of a parental fulfillment of "Chayav adam ..." And not just formally. It takes extra, perhaps exceptional, drive to bootstrap oneself like that.

HodofHod

@IsaacMoses Not necessarily. I also know many who stuck around in Kolel and then went into Chinuch, askanus, or shlichus. I also know people who are struggling to find their niche, though the community tends to find a place to fit them in.

Then again, I also know strugglers who had secular education in cheder.

What I'm saying is that there's always going to be a spread.

Seth J

6:17 PM

@msh210 I assumed "everything" meant "everything".

msh210

@SethJ Pardon?

HodofHod

@IsaacMoses This is true. I'm not sure how literally that dictum must be fulfiled, though. (I.e., I assume that hiring a teacher counts, but does paying for ones GED curriculum and testing, etc, count? Does GED count as אומנות ?

Isaac Moses

@HodofHod True. I guess it'd take a socioeconomic study to determine what the distribution really looks like, which probably varies significantly by community.

@HodofHod [ask-a-question]. No, seriously, I might later.

Seth J

@HodofHod askanus is a profession?

HodofHod

@SethJ Well yes, (except for humility).

@SethJ Sure,'

@IsaacMoses Answer: It's a machlokes.

msh210

6:20 PM

@SethJ Oh, sorry, didn't see your arrow back.

Seth J

@HodofHod "though the community tends to find a place to fit them in" also doesn't sound like the father is preparing them; it sounds like there is an assumption that the child will be taken care of and/or never leave the community.

Isaac Moses

@SethJ indeed.com/…

HodofHod

@SethJ Agreed. I don't disagree that that particular dictum needs to be put into practice more. I wonder, is a poor person who sends their child to public school, and the child works his own way through college, fulfilling that dictum? If not, how should he?

Seth J

@IsaacMoses @HodofHod I also note that there is nothing wrong with a community "taking care of its own". To a point. The problem is when the community reaches critical mass. And of course there are other problems that tend to arise.

@HodofHod I think the objection is, first and foremost, to the practice of refusing to teach children basic skills like math and [local-vernacular]. Even if a child dreams of growing up to become a Shoel UMeishiv in Kollel, he still has to be able to buy groceries, clothing, and housing, etc. That's not to say they couldn't pick it up "on the street", but that doesn't seem to fulfill the ~~ideal~~ obligation.

Of course the organization may have a "bring down the ultra-orthodox" mindset, I don't know. But even a broken clock, as they say...

msh210

7:03 PM

Hm. judaism.stackexchange.com/posts/3317/revisions

Charles Koppelman

7:46 PM

@msh210 judaism.stackexchange.com/questions/8350/… inclarity?

isn't that a bit more... inclear (not for lack of a better word)?

Daniel

Question for everybody... how long do you all generally have to wait for shatnez testing in your various locations?

MoriDoweedhYaAgob

8:12 PM

I usually give it in 5 and get it back at 8 when the guy closes. I usually pressure him to do it fast because I need to go to a simcha and this is the new suit I bought

Daniel

@MoriDoweedhYaAgob So a couple of hours?

The guy in Chicago says he'll need a week

that seems ridiculous to me

MoriDoweedhYaAgob

Basically

Daniel

It should just take a couple of minutes

Isaac Moses

@Daniel In Baltimore, the guy would do it while I watched.

@Daniel Maybe he's mailing a sample to a lab somewhere else?

MoriDoweedhYaAgob

If it has shatnez and the guy removes it he gives you new material to go to a tailor and repair the collar if he doesn't have a stitcher on spot

Daniel

8:14 PM

@IsaacMoses I guess

MoriDoweedhYaAgob

that can take max a day if you come late to a tailer

If its a suit jacket, the guy knows which companies usually have shatnez n which don't. European companies do like from Italy n Bulgaria American companies like Kevin Klein n Ralph Lauren(both yidden) don't usually have it

My suit is Hugo boss from Italy so it had to be restiched when he took out the shatnez

Seth J

8:58 PM

@Daniel There is no way to gauge this at all. Varies by location/checker.

@Daniel There's only one guy in Chicago?

@MoriDoweedhYaAgob Interesting. I see a question here.

MoriDoweedhYaAgob

@SethJ im not seeing it :(

Daniel

@SethJ As far as I know, there are 2, but one of them only comes in once a week

Seth J

@Daniel In all of Chicago?!

@MoriDoweedhYaAgob No, I meant potential for a question. It's been asked, btw. By me. Just now.

judaism.stackexchange.com/review/suggested-edits/5699

Anyone want to discuss the accuracy of this edit? I'm inclined to vote to reject it.

MoriDoweedhYaAgob

@SethJ you taking my MY karma?

:OOO

Seth J

9:16 PM

@MoriDoweedhYaAgob Are you unforgettable?

MoriDoweedhYaAgob

unforgiveable

Daniel

@SethJ Well I don't really know. I haven't researched it that thoroughly.

Seth J

@MonicaCellio, did you really like that tag wiki edit that much? I don't think that's what that term means or what that tag is for. Am I missing something?

Daniel

@SethJ I'm not sure it even really makes sense to have that tag

But if we do, I agree that that description doesn't seem quite right

@SethJ After further research, there are 5 locations in chicago: youngisraelwrp.com/ShatnezPoster7-11.pdf

Seth J

@Daniel That's useful information. I wish there were a pinboard here in chat for stuff like that.

Daniel

9:21 PM

@SethJ That link is also a useful answer for the question you posted :)

I'll answer now

Actually it doesn't really answer your question

since you ask for lists of companies that don't use shatnez, and this is a list of companies that do use

Seth J

@Daniel I also asked if it was possible to rely on Rov, etc., for any known-ish companies.

The information in the poster implies that you cannot.

(I'm going to email myself that poster; going to Chicago for a wedding soon, and I'd like to get a jacket checked.)

Monica Cellio

@SethJ it looked consistent with the questions it was used on. Perhaps I needed a broader context?

@Daniel ok, with two regulars saying "no", I'm fine with rolling that back. (Goes off to look for revisions link for tag wikis.)

Seth J

@MonicaCellio Yeah, I thought that was the inspiration for the edit, but I think the question is a specific application of the rule, not a good example of the definition of the rule.

Monica Cellio

@SethJ rolled back. Can someone raise on meta whether the tag should exist?

Seth J

@MonicaCellio Here's the definition of the word: thefreedictionary.com/alacrity

@MonicaCellio And in fact I'm not sure that alacrity is the definition of Zerizuth, either.

Monica Cellio

9:29 PM

@SethJ that's consistent with the understanding I had before reading that, which was basically "haste".

Seth J

@MonicaCellio Sort of (that's how I understood it, too). But the dictionary definition seems to imply joyful haste, and I tend to think of Zerizuth as more obsessive haste.

Still, it's a much better one-word definition than I could have come up with for Zerizuth.

@Daniel Upvoted. Good answer. I'll wait a while before accepting, though. I want to see if someone tries to say yes.

Monica Cellio

@SethJ ah. I missed that nuance. I've rolled back the tag wiki and excerpt to their previous (null) states, so if the tag sticks around I invite others to take another crack at it. But first let's figure out if we even need the tag. (I think I'd be happy to see both this and priorities go away.)

Daniel

@SethJ A list of companies that generally don't use shatnez doesn't really contradict my answer. I haven't really answered that question at all

This source just says that you always have to check

but there could be a list of companies that don't use it, and people would buy from them because they know that it will be very unlikely that they will have to be inconvenienced with restitching the suit or buying a new one

I really only addressed point c

msh210

@CharlesKoppelman I guess I'm just used to nouns' having in-. This one takes un- though: you're right. See also

4

Q: Un-(adjective) but In-(noun) -- does it ever go the other way?

Many pairs of words use un- as a prefix for the preferred adjective but in- as a prefix for the preferred noun (e.g. unstable/instability, unequal/inequality, unable/inability, unjust/injustice, ungrateful/ingratitude). I was wondering if anyone has encountered the reverse phenomenon? Where the...

etymology negation

@SethJ Me,too.

@MonicaCellio I think z'rizin makdimin l'mitzvos is a concept people will want to see a collection fo questions on and makes for a useful tag.

Daniel

9:56 PM

I don't think priorities should be on that question about bris milah

I thought that tag was about stuff like one thing taking priority over another thing

Meta-Man

11:58 PM

0

Q: Dear @MonicaCellio, did you roll back my proposed tag wiki on purpose?

Dear @MonicaCellio, First of all, I commend you for all the questions you ask, the answers you provide, and administration work you do around here. Thank you! Much appreciated. I wonder: Did you roll back my proposed "alacrity-for-mitzvot" tag wiki on purpose? Also, did Stack Exchange offer yo...

discussion tag-wiki rollbacks

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