@Shmuel a reference to jokes like youtu.be/MwbWv2oiuAs and torchweb.org/torah_detail.php?id=235

@DoubleAA what's the problem now? Thought I made my intentions clear...

Like I said, it's a genuine question and I thought it was clear...it had five reopen votes even against your decision.

@chach you returned the post to its original state, so the problems are obviously the same as when it was in its original state

But now my intentions are clear and it's obvious it is about Judaism because I want a Jewish answer.

@chachamNisan Wanting a Jewish answer doesn't necessarily make a question about Judaism.

But it is about Judaism...

You've got nonJews asking questions about their religion from a Jewish perspective. Well, I'm a Jew asking a question about Judaism from a Jewish perspective.

@chachamNisan But you're not asking about Judaism. You're asking whether knowledge is possible without proof.

@chacha anything in comments or edit history doesn't matter. All that matters is what's in the question post. You may have added Judaism to the post, but then you removed it. So we're back to where we started

What was wrong with the final version that you edited it back to the original?

I'm asking how we can claim we know God if we can't prove He exists? Disclaimer: I'm a believer.

The problem was that it just complicated the question.

The question is clear and understandable as it is now...no need to be fancy.

I believe it clarified it significantly.

Prove it...just kidding.

Right now it says: I know God exists but I can't prove it; do I know it? You literally ask if your own assumption is true.

I can't make this stuff up.

It confused me...and it's supposed to be a question I posted. How can I approve it.

I meant I can't scientifically prove, but logically I can.

You can edit to clarify it to your liking, but if you return it to how it was originally then don't be surprised if you get the same response from the same people.

Stare decisis, as they say

I think it's personal.

I don't know what your problem is with me.

Because you learned that the question is about Judaism but you still put it on hold...or am I missing something?

I don't see how the current question is about Judaism. It appears to be the same exact question as if you replace "God" with "George Bush"

You get the point...

Nobody else saw it that way.

So you see why I think it's personal?

If others see it that way and vote to delete it, then there's a problem with it.

And I would edit it. My point with the question was to clear something up that even if we can't scientifically prove God's existence, that we can still know Him and it doesn't make us stupid or wrong...or at least that is the answer I'm looking for but in a more structured and penned out manner.

I can't stop you from believing what you want, but let me assure you I don't care enough about you to attack your questions just because you wrote them.

If you know the answer to a question already

the be extra careful to write it well from the perspective of someone who doesn't know the answer already

How respectful...you confirmed my suspicion.

I wanted answers from others...is that Assur?

And maybe I don't know the answer myself.

@chachamNisan In my opinion, the question is unclear but presumably on-topic. If it were open, I'd close it as Unclear. Explaining what you meant by "know" made the question sufficiently clear.

It's difficult but not impossible to frame a question well when the goal is to expose a certain answer. It's also difficult but not impossible to frame theology questions well, in general.

It's valuable that here on Mi Yodeya, people will step up instantaneously to help authors improve their questions. That process makes it a great deal more likely we end up with high-quality, to-the-point answers.

In case anyone wants to know the context of this conversation: judaism.stackexchange.com/questions/96007/…

Anyone want to help me with this? That understands the premise. I'm having a hard time putting my thoughts to words after this fascinating ordeal. @MonicaCellio @IsaacMoses @Alex

@chachamNisan What was wrong with this version of the question?

@IsaacMoses how's the current version? If doubleaas version is better than I guess I could go with it.

@chachamNisan When you changed your version to asking about fulfilling a mitzvah, you probably got your last vote needed to reopen. If I knew you yourself reverted the Q back to its original text, I would have withdrawn my reopen vote.

@chachamNisan It looks to me like this one, tightened. I'll re-open.

@chachamNisan In general, its better to bend our wishes to make as many members of the community (and definitely mods) comfortable with our posts.

@DavidKenner FTR If five community members vote to close or re-open a post, we moderators will generally respect that decision and leave it alone even if we personally disagree.

(Assuming the post hasn't changed in the interim.)

ty, I thought so.

@chachamNisan It seems like the question you want to ask is "To what extent does the Torah obligate you to know Hashem?"