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3:25 AM
@Shokhet @IsaacMoses @MonicaCellio (Just catching up here in chat.) I didn't close it because it's about a Tanach personality. If it cited B'reshis as not indicating where Adam's buried, or some such, that'd bring it squarely on-topic IMO. As it is -- eh.
... I'd probably vote to close were my vote not binding.
...which is basically what was said above:
10 hours ago, by Isaac Moses
@MonicaCellio I think close voters get to assess the reasoning for persuasiveness. Iff it seems persuasive enough to make it seem like the question's worth asking, then leave open.
10 hours ago, by Monica Cellio
@Shokhet yeah, I was asking if such "reasoning" is enough or if we need an actual claim. I think @IsaacMoses is probably right -- individual close voters will evaluate on a case-by-case basis.
... as opposed to e.g. closure by moderator's fiat.
@MonicaCellio @YeZ @IsaacMoses "Why are eggs like this?" can be on-topic. "general knowledge (science, etc.) as it relates directly to Judaism"
@MonicaCellio You mean, add ornaments to it?
 
@msh210 well, if there were any reason to think that Judaism had something to say on the subject. We don't want to do "boat programming" ("boat halacha"?); there needs to be something to tie it to Judaism.
 
@MonicaCellio Of course. Hence "can be" and the quote.
 
@msh210 that's not a use of the word "trim" I would have anticipated on this site. :-)
@msh210 ok. Good; for a moment I wondered if we were on the same page, and I'd've thought we were.
 
@YeZ 280?
@MonicaCellio :-) 'Tis the season.
 
@msh210 and many of us are adding ornaments to our gravatars, I guess. :-)
 
YeZ
4:01 AM
@msh210 some say there are 70 פנים for each level of פרדס
 
4:19 AM
@YeZ it's a pity you weren't here for last year's hats; one of them was called (something like) "Johnny Three Hats" and looked like just what you'd expect. Given your hat-on-hat approach here, it'd've been perfect for you. :-)
 
YeZ
@MonicaCellio NOW I'm wearing a hat
wait what happened
give me my hats!
hmph.
 
@YeZ huh, I see two different versions of your adornments in here! I would have thought that the gravatar+decorations would update everywhere, or not.
 
YeZ
@MonicaCellio I certainly wouldn't have thought it would take my old gravatar and put my current hat on it.
 
The one you were wearing immediately prior also looks like a hat to me, and you wore it well. But I agree that the current one is more clearly a HAT, DARN IT.
 
YeZ
well in my user profile I'm quite decked out.
 
4:24 AM
@YeZ well no, neither would I. And that's not what I'm seeing. I see one version of you (on your message to msh a few up) with the green/white/black hat, and then newer ones have your werewolf-hunter getup.
 
YeZ
@MonicaCellio seems chat just can't handle that much bling.
 
@YeZ oh! Ok, I hadn't yet seen that. And if you're not seeing it in chat, refreshing the page should do the trick.
 
YeZ
It just showed up.
 
@YeZ caching. Refresh or wait.
@YeZ there you go. I see it now too.
That's quite a stack.
 
YeZ
well, actually, this is funny. In my image of myself next to my chatbox I've got my whole wardrobe on, but next to my posted messages, a mere two hats.
 
4:27 AM
I'm surprised you haven't worked the solstice one in there yet, maybe as a small bit in the middle of the black hat.
 
YeZ
it was in there at one point. Perhaps it should make a comeback.
 
I see spock, the helmet, the joga one, and the black one with crossbow.
If the others are in there I don't see them.
 
YeZ
@MonicaCellio that's all of them, but I only see the helmet and black/crossbow.
 
@YeZ in the small version in chat I basically just see the black hat and the green/white/black one, and I only know that those bits of light blue are from the Spock hat 'cause I've seen it larger but I wouldn't have parsed it out otherwise. In chat I've lost sight of the helmet entirely. But the larger image in your profile is much clearer on all this. Some things just weren't meant to boil down to whatever that small size in here is. :-)
 
YeZ
@MonicaCellio took your advice.
oy now chat replaced my black hat with the solstice
 
4:41 AM
@YeZ hmm. This is what I see on your profile now:
 
YeZ
0
Q: My wardrobe isn't showing up in chat!

YeZMy hats aren't showing up in chat! My self-image next to my chatbox has my full regalia, but the gravatar next to my posted messages has a measly two hats! It's not a cache delay because it already put on my current hat. It is using an outdated version of my gravatar and adding my current ...

 
Maybe not what you intended?
Everybody, it might be time for us to have a little intervention with @YeZ about hoarding... :-)
4
 
YeZ
@MonicaCellio oysh. That's not what I see in my own.
 
@YeZ and not what I see in the room, where I see your solstice but not your black hat. Hmm.
 
YeZ
@MonicaCellio Although I do look pretty spiffy with 2 crossbows.
 
4:44 AM
@YeZ that's what you see on your profile? Maybe it's caching here, then.
Ah, there we go -- I see your black hat with solstice on your profile now.
 
YeZ
well, here, next to posted messages I see my egghead and solstice. Next to chatbox, egghead, solstice, soccer, and spock.
 
I think the smaller version next to posted messages may be degrading gracefully in the absence of sufficient pixelage. Or something; I don't know much about SVGs and rendering and stuff.
 
YeZ
I can't look at my user profile without cracking up
 
Anyway, it's time for me to drop off for now. Have fun continuing to bling yourself out. TZT.
 
YeZ
@MonicaCellio Gnite. I think I'm done for now.
 
 
10 hours later…
2:45 PM
Or maybe "bountician"? "bountist"? "bountifier"?
 
3:18 PM
Some folks here might have opinions on this:
0
Q: How do hats modify users' behavior?

Monica CellioHow are users modifying their behavior because of Winterbash 2014? What have you seen, positive and negative? I've seen some comments on various Winterbash posts about the behaviors the hats encourage, and I thought it would be useful to collect those observations in one place.

I've left @YeZ 's hat-fest for someone else to comment on, should anyone feel inclined. :-)
 
@MonicaCellio I'm am curious about whether you've seen any behavior that you think could have been motivated by a desire for "Business in the front; party in the back." That one, in particular, I could imagine spurring undesirable behavior.
 
@IsaacMoses I can imagine that too. I've seen one meta post on another site asking if it's kosher to ask for DVs; that got a lukewarm-negative reaction. I haven't yet seen people being blatant, or established users deliberately posting junk.
 
@MonicaCellio Good
 
I haven't been monitoring self-deleted posts; that's another avenue of possible abuse. I'm interesting in hearing what's happening on other sites (hence asking on MSE not our meta) on all this.
 
@MonicaCellio Our questions-per-day, as reported on stackexchange.com/sites , usually hovers around 11-14, IIRC. It recently spiked to 18. Not sure how much this is attributable to hats, C-MY, Chanuka, or other factors
 
3:42 PM
@IsaacMoses oh, I'd forgotten that that was tracked there for all sites. I wonder if anybody cached it before the start of Winterbash.
 
@MonicaCellio Someone did :)
On Dec 10, Academia was showing 12K VpD and 16 QpD, and MY was showing 2.8K/13
Today, Academia has 14K/15, and MY has 3K/17
That's just one example. But, oh, academics may have other seasonal effects, e.g. finals and vacation, messing with their activity
DIY: 59K/17 -> 55K/15
Islam: 6.6K/3.3 -> 6.7K / 3.5
Christianity: 18K/8.4 -> 19K/8.2
Academia: 12K/16 -> 14K/15
** MY: 2.8K/13 -> 3K/17
So far, it looks like we're seeing a site-specific jump in QpD.
My first guess would be that the main cause is Chanuka itself. Lots of thinking about the holiday. No extra issur melacha to keep people from posting questions as they think of them
 
4:00 PM
@IsaacMoses that seems likely. A little SEDEing might be able to tell us the tag distribution of newly-asked questions.
 
@MonicaCellio It would also be interesting to see what archive.org tells us about past Chanukas here. My hypothesis would be that there would be similar jumps.
If that hypothesis is rejected, then I'd give extra credit to C-MY
Another possible non-linear effect: Jews are just weird about hats.
 
@IsaacMoses :-)
@IsaacMoses I definitely give credit for views to C-MY. I don't have a good sense of what our "conversion rate" is from our publications.
 
@MonicaCellio We don't have a huge views jump. Views of the C-MY landing page since we published is about 600 now, but some of those didn't download or print, while some multi-printed, do we don't know how many were printed and distributed. Also, the landing page itself (and publicity directing people to it) may have generated some traffic on MY independent of C-MY getting printed and read. So, it's really confounded
 
@IsaacMoses yes, I'm also assuming that the promotion might have led people to check out the site without actually passing through the book. But it's all guess-work.
 
 
2 hours later…
6:31 PM
Also turned up in casual browsing of imgur:
 
6:57 PM
@IsaacMoses Because it takes a lot of work to try to get a downvote while also only posting Q&A that you consider appropriate.
 
@IsaacMoses I got that hat on MSE, where you don't need to try to get downvotes because people are random sometimes. It's not a hat I would seek, and certainly not here. (I have gotten DVs here of course, but I try not to deserve them. :-) )
 
@MonicaCellio One could try to be simultaneously correct and controversial
 
@IsaacMoses hi
@IsaacMoses check the quote which i posted!
 
@havarka I saw. I added another supporting quote to my answer
 
@TRiG are you saying the that propaganda continues?
@IsaacMoses Just is so simple for me, why anyone shouldn't support Israel, now when Jews are living within it?!
 
7:08 PM
Wow. This question was posted 20 hours ago and has amassed 2.7K views and counting. HNQ plus feminist interest, I guess.
 
YeZ
@IsaacMoses looks like sam was the primary beneficiary of that interest.
 
@YeZ I'd say the 2.7K people who learned a little Torah are!
:)
 
YeZ
@IsaacMoses I was 75% expecting you to say that.
 
@YeZ What was the next-less-probable alternative?
 
YeZ
@IsaacMoses Mi Yodeya as a site - 24%. Agreement with my statement - 1%
 
7:14 PM
@YeZ :) reliably contrarian me
 
YeZ
Where was that Q about the brothers telling Yaakov that Yosef was alive despite the cherem?
 
@IsaacMoses just saying no need for a such question.
 
YeZ
found it.
 
@havarka I pretty much agree
 
good :)
 
7:19 PM
@havarka It's somewhat different propaganda, you must agree.
 
@TRiG what do you mean?!
 
@havarka @TRiG before anyone gets too excited, I recommend that you both resolve to continue the conversation in as clear language as possible, without allusions or sarcasm. You are in danger of talking past each other
 
YeZ
@IsaacMoses @havarka @TRiG and please consider any possible language barriers, as you are not from the same country
 
? don't we speak english here?
 
@YeZ USA USA USA
 
YeZ
7:22 PM
@IsaacMoses WOOOH!
 
omfg
 
YeZ
@havarka lighten up, we're just joking
 
just didn't get you. i don't have a problems with languages I'am not from USA :D
 
@YeZ It's cool to consider that you addressed three people in three different countries in one realtime message
 
Jesus, aren't we jews on internet, and english should be a problem?!
shouldn't
 
YeZ
7:28 PM
@havarka case in point, I have no idea what you mean by that.
 
whatever
 
YeZ
7:43 PM
how long does it take a question nominated for closing into the review queue?
 
@YeZ If you were the first close vote, it doesn't show for you in the queue.
 
YeZ
@Shokhet I know. What about when I'm sitting there looking at a close-voted question and waiting for it to go to the queue so I can get review badges?
(I didn't do that - I voted on it completely altruistically.)
 
@YeZ :)
......if three people reviewed it "Leave Open," then it's out of the queue....was it close-voted long enough for that to happen?
 
YeZ
@Shokhet No, and I'm sure it will not be voted to leave open.
 
@YeZ Aha. I don't know.
@IsaacMoses Thanks! ....I think I definitely want a copy of that one :)
 
7:56 PM
@Shokhet I am not surprised :)
 
.....and I know that that one can be trusted, because it was written by my rebbi in הלכות שחיטה :) ....he has told my father to put certain other kosher bird books in shemos because of the proliferation of mistakes in them :P
@IsaacMoses :)
 
8:09 PM
@Shokhet Could you get him to answer this?
 
@IsaacMoses That's actually not a bad idea. I'll ask him.
I can't believe that didn't occur to me.
 
@ShmuelBrin Nice!
 
YeZ
8:27 PM
@IsaacMoses I was in the middle of writing that!
 
@YeZ baruch shekivanti
@ShmuelBrin Wow! Nice!
I didn't know adults did the ChH"T
 
YeZ
@IsaacMoses we're on the same wavelength today.
 
8:40 PM
as for sod.....
see the Maharatz Chayes' Mavo Hatalmmud, where he mentions a few of the rules for drash in stories (beginning with chapter 15 or so). As for pshat, whatever fits the words, as for remez, see R. Yaakov Emden in his comments to Avos end of ch. 3, and as for sod: it's a secret and I can't tell you :-) — Matt 29 secs ago
 
@Shokhet cute
 
8:59 PM
@ShmuelBrin There's a Tanakh competition. I suppose I shouldn't be surprised.
 
9:10 PM
@TRiG I find it remarkable that it was founded by secularist David Ben-Gurion and has been administered all these years by the (varyingly secular-dominated) State of Israel. It's wonderful to see Jerusalem exercising due leadership in helping keep Tanach in the popular Jewish consciousness and honoring those from around the world who excel in knowing it. </soapbox>
3
Nope, Oholei Torah (in Brooklyn). There were boys there who knew their way around Tanach pretty well. — Alex Apr 22 '10 at 17:52
 
9:44 PM
18
A: May my wife wear my jacket to keep warm?

samFrom Rav Aviner's tshuvot (text) Wearing Wife's Jacket in the Cold Q: Is it permissible for a husband to wear his wife's jacket if he is cold, or is it forbidden on account of "Lo Yilbash" (the prohibition of cross-dressing)? And what about visa-versa? A: It is permissible, sin...

+18!?!?
 
@DoubleAA And accepted, apparently.
 
@DoubleAA 3.2K views and counting ...
 
@Shokhet That's not a proof of anything. There's no telling why people accept things.
The answer doesn't even cite the Shakh or Taz, or the Gemara about Amoraim sharing coats with their spouses.
 
@DoubleAA I wasn't trying to prove anything. Were you?
@DoubleAA I don't know the sugya that well, or really at all.
Sounds like you might be able to post a better answer yourself, though.....
2
@all, is this question too broad? .....I could certainly imagine a whole book on the subject.
 
 
2 hours later…
11:34 PM
2
Q: Kabbalah is covered on Mi Yodeya

warrenProposal: Kabbalah is clearly already covered on Judaism.SE:

 

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