Pokes his head back in

Sorry for vanishing. I was on the phone with a prof, just got offered a graduate postition

:6323040

@DavidCarlisle glares

@DavidCarlisle alias emacs=vim

@Canageek Congratulations!!

Wait, is that as a graduate student? That changes things if it is. :-)

@PeterGrill: Congratulations yourself... 50k!

You've been gravatar-ing lately...

@Werner Thanks. Actually no I have not Gravatared. I don't know what caused today's change -- seemed to coincide with the 50K rep. The other day I made a minor change to my profile and it got changed then. But I did not make any changes today.

@PeterGrill The gravatar should be based on your email address... Mods would be able to clarify.

@Werner Haven't changed the email address.

@PeterGrill The boo... I don't know. :)

@JosephWright: A minimal example with 5 lines and so much errors ;-)

@MarcoDaniel Indeed

@MarcoDaniel \protected@edef would also work, but not in 'the general case'

@JosephWright Indeed. I am thinking about something like expandonce

@JosephWright I've supplied an example with \edef that shows how that approach is wrong in general.

@egreg Great

@MarcoDaniel And upvoted your answer, of course.

@egreg I upvoted yours ;-)

@egreg It's a special, simplified skin for emacs ;?)

@PauloCereda emailz 'n trelloze 4 u!

@Brent.Longborough Answering it right now. :)

@Brent.Longborough No, see David's commercial

@egreg Oh, yes, but it scratches your pots and pans!

@egreg As I think I may have said before: sed -- now there's a real editor

Good morning, @DavidCarlisle -- talk of the devil, and he appears with a flash, a bang, and a slight whiff of sulphur ... :)

@Brent.Longborough Sorry been busy with a real typesetting system none of this tex nonsense. (libre office) I don't think I understand wysiwyg editors.

@DavidCarlisle : Just out of curiosity, what do you use for editing XML?

@Brent.Longborough well that's a silly question

@DavidCarlisle LOL, how about waterloo script?

@DavidCarlisle Vim, then? (I could understand if you said XMLMind or summat else)

@DavidCarlisle In my last experience with LibreOffice (a friend was typing, of course) the enumerated lists had the peculiar habit of popping out showing dingbats instead of the numbers each time the file was reopened.

@egreg bingo (actually it was the bullet lists that went wrong) and they were only there in my (2007) test document to show I didn't mess up the normal text while getting the math to work

@Brent.Longborough waterloo?

@egreg I've always had the impression that the whole style thing in star/open/libre office wasn't quite mature yet

@egreg I just downloaded it last night as it was mentioned here the other day that its mathml export was OK

@DavidCarlisle From the days when computers were run on kerosene...

Similar to troff/nroff, I believe, though it may have predated them

@Brent: you got mailzzz. :)

@Brent.Longborough ah same waterloo as maple etc wikipedia says Waterloo Script was created at the University of Waterloo later.[7] One version of SCRIPT was created at MIT and the AA/CS at UW took over project development in 1974. The program was first used at UW in 1975. In the 1970s, SCRIPT was the only practical way to word process and format documents using a computer. By the late 1980s, the SCRIPT system had been extended to incorporate various upgrades

@PauloCereda OK, I reddit. I won't reply, because it's all OK!

@Brent.Longborough Thanks again for sharing your wisdom. :)

@DavidCarlisle That's interesting. I started using Script in IBM in 1976; I think it was derived from Waterloo Script via MIT and CMS

... but I soon got fed up with that and moved to GML, which had just been introduced.

A bit later I was slightly involved in the specification of (IBM's internal use) ISIL, what later transformed into Bookmaster

@Brent.Longborough we should have a family tree of typesetting systems question to answer:-)

@DavidCarlisle Yes! (Though there'll be a lot of semi-religious flame wars)

@PauloCereda :T)

@Brent.Longborough ooh the bat-signal!

@PauloCereda Yes

:c}

@PauloCereda : Why "oops"? I only just had the idea myself, so I'm just as oops as u LOL

@Brent.Longborough I'm sure I moved a card to the bottom. :) I thought it was a LIFO instead of a FIFO. :)

@PauloCereda Oh, no, <usage> should be LIFO, I think, but when the list goes off the bottom of the page, we probably want the oldest entries hidden, rather than the newest. No?

@Brent.Longborough Oh my! I'm confused. :P

@PauloCereda Calma. Just think of it as a LIFO queue, moving from 15 minutes of new fame at the top, moving down to sad oblivion scrolled off the bottom.

@Brent.Longborough :)

@PauloCereda Anyway, I think the absolutely last intention of the Trello peuple was to get us all existentially stressed-out like this :)))

@Brent.Longborough LOL

EuroTeX in one week!

@Mr.Gundla Yay!

@Mr.Gundla "Eurotex International Limited completed a contract placed by a leading UK Government Support Agency to supply a fully refurbished and factory tested Paxman"

@Mr.Gundla I think your keynote is ready, right?! :)

@Brent.Longborough Pacman?! :D

@PauloCereda no, no, and I don't have time this week. Luckily the travel there is 8hours, so I have plenty of time for it :)

@Mr.Gundla Google is not your friend, sometimes.

@Mr.Gundla Oh my! :)

ntg.nl/eurotex2012 :)

@PauloCereda No, Jeremy Paxman is a famous TV journalist

@PauloCereda my son has autumn holidays and he's here in my apartment.

And we have to play football all the time. Now he's playing with my iPad ...

@Mr.Gundla Yay! :)

(I hope somebody here watches Family Guy to get the reference.) :)

@PauloCereda Have to save that for my presentation

@Mr.Gundla Uh-oh. :)

@PauloCereda Nôo, we need more Lemon Hyperref

@Brent.Longborough LMAO

Professor Knuth he no home!

Consuela rules! (but only with booktabs)

@Brent.Longborough "- Can I leave a note?" "- No. No." :)

Hello

Hope you're feeling better than me

Hi Tom! What happened?

Is there anybody French around?

(I hope not, or I'd have somehow to hide the following message from them)

French people are so fucking idiots!

They don't know what "I have a VISA" means: it means "I can pay whatever, whereever", everywhere but in France.

In the other words, don't ever try to be with no cash in France, you cannot even buy a baguette, because "we accept cards from 10 Euro")

@tohecz Sounds about right: try paying in the UK for anything under £5 by card, and see how you get on in small shops :-)

(Often £10, but £5 is really a realistic minimum)

@JosephWright I really don't understand it, the Visa/MasterCard company takes percents not fixed tariff, so what is the fucking problem?!

@tohecz But the banks take a fixed fee on top

Per-transaction, same as for any other business banking

@JosephWright I'm sure this is not true, card transactions are completely different

The problem is that getting money in cash machine with my Czech card costs me approx. 5 EUR plus some percents

@tohecz At least in the UK that's my understanding of how it works. Occasionally you see places that explain why there is a minimum charge.

@JosephWright Yes, the banks make a fortune out of this. Besides charging the merchants way over the actual cost of processing (think cost vs price of SMS messages), they save fortunes on cash handling

There's also rounding, I guess. You can't take less than 1 [unit] per transaction, so if you take a percentage for small transactions you either loose out (unlikely for a bank), or have a floor.

@JosephWright that is strange, my moms works in a pharmacy in Czech Rep. and I know they have no problem with small amounts (other than that it takes longer to pay), because they simply count the money "+4%" and thats all

in the other words, I'm a bit starving

and I'm really looking forward to tomorrow, when I'm supposed to get my first scholarship, and to the authorities saying "but we cannot give you your money".

@tohecz I will have to concur with Joseph Wright, in DK there is also a small tariff on the card payment side. However, many businesses offer to pay that tariff. That means that they can decide how a minimum payment is required. Of course they could choose to let the customer pay it all, but that is another matter. :)

@zeroth ok, I wasn't aware of the details. But still, it's screwed. I know that Czech shopkeepers generally don't like you to pay small amounts by card, because it's more time-consumig. On the other hand, the "consensual minimal amount" is around 70 CZK = 3 EUR

@tohecz ok, that is nice, generally it is not a problem in DK, however, small businesses are likely to have a "minimum expendture" amount. I can see it is annoying if you are not used to it! Hope you got something to eat anyway!

And for example I have a "contactless" Czech credit card which can be used to pay up to 500 CZK (20 EUR) only by holding it next to the terminal. It works in some shops and I'm often paying around 30 CZK (less than 1.50EUR) this way.

Btw, I'm now really unhappy that I don't have a CitiBank card, because that one is fine for usage in French ATM

@tohecz yes those systems are very nice! I would really like that in DK, but.... We don't.... :(

(and thanks, I'm feeling better after having coffee and ice-cream)

hehe! Great!

It's a new thing, I have my VISA for 8 months and when I got it, only like two shopping companies had these special terminals.

I saw it exists in France as well, but I haven't yet tried to use my Czech card there...

@PauloCereda: Did you notice the updated translation file?

@Brent.Longborough: :T)

@MarcoDaniel I'll work with the repo in some minutes. :)

@PauloCereda (T:

@MarcoDaniel I did. I've already merged it to [brent]

@Brent.Longborough ;-) You are faster than @PauloCereda

@Brent.Longborough So I only have to merge [brent]? :)

@MarcoDaniel Not faster than you on the Autobahn. :)

@egreg Sometimes blame ;-(

@PauloCereda No I haven't actually completed the merge - I just made a booboo and am fixing my repo

@egreg Overclocked VW 1960 Beetle. :)

@PauloCereda I think I may be doing it wrong. I've been merging both from [marco] and from [master]; I should probably be merging only from [master]. No harm done, but it's noise in the log. From now on, although I'll pull [marco], I'll not merge it.

@PauloCereda I had a very nice experience with a Beetle of the Sixties! We were on a motorway and the clutch suddenly broke. We could, in some way, arrive to a parking area, where we pushed the car jumping in like in bobsleigh runs and we could make several km in second gear. :)

It was a bright orange pure German Beetle with a German driver.

@egreg Oh! :)

@PauloCereda Those cars ran no matter what.

@egreg Indeed! :) My dad had a '68 Beetle. The car was a jack-of-all-trades. :)

@PauloCereda If I were you, I'd merge [marco] to [master], then [brent] to [master].

@Brent.Longborough Sounds like a plan. :)

... as that also adds stuff to the log which, for arara, might just be noise

@Brent.Longborough: there's a conflict merging [marco] and [master]. Help? :)

Oh. I got a conflict merging marco to brent. git status should show only one file. try it

@Brent.Longborough The problem is that Messages_de.input have edits.

I wonder if marco reset his HEAD after pushing?

@PauloCereda Are you using Smartgit?

@Brent.Longborough Heavens no. <3

@PauloCereda Give me a couple of minutes

@Brent.Longborough Don't worry. :) Feel free to merge [marco] and [brent] to [master], I won't get it right anyway. :)

@PauloCereda OK. First you need to do (on master) git reset --hard HEAD; it will throw away the uncommitted changes!

@Brent.Longborough Please do it, I'll screw up the repo. :)

@PauloCereda Then, just to be safe, do a git push on master. When that's done let me know

@PauloCereda Then I'll fix it

@Brent.Longborough I can't. It says the lock could not be renamed.

@PauloCereda Shall we take this to another chat?

@Brent.Longborough I hereby grant you the powers to solve this. :P

Pidgin?

@PauloCereda Yes

We need more noise here. :)

I only have 23k messages here.

@PeterGrill You may enjoy a generalized LaTeX3 solution to the row vector problem. Thanks for spotting the weaknesses.

:6325536: Cooll.. A combined row/column vector solution

Ok, never mind seem to work on my MAc, but not PC version (so something wrong with that installation).

Is this a "real question"?

@egreg Agreed, it doesn't look like a question for us. :)

@egreg I dunno, I think that there's no better site for such question.

and I consider it a good question, I've been asking myself on the best-practices for this many times

@JosephWright: Or who has special mod powers: The following two users need to be merged: tex.stackexchange.com/users/19191/daniel-harbour, tex.stackexchange.com/users/15004/daniel-harbour

ooh @PeterGrill has a new avatar today. :)

@PauloCereda What was your NAS drive again and are you happy with it?

@percusse Oh I don't have a NAS drive. :) Only some external drives. :)

@PauloCereda Oops, wrong memory

I have one Iomega eGo, two Seagates, one Samsung, one Hitashi and two or three "generic" drives. :)

Hi all. Can I put up a beginner question?

@nagylzs I'm so tempted to say no, and see what happens:-)

:-)

If you are serious... I can keep looking for the answer. :-)

The percent sign is supposed to be escaped with a backslash. That is \%. But does not seem to be working in math mode. $a^2 \%$

The introductionary guide says nothing about this exception.

@PeterGrill Done

And I could not find anything on this in amsdoc

@nagylzs We need an example: this will normally work

Maybe there is a percent symbol in mathsym ?

Example:

$5.41 \%$

I get a "missing { inserted" error

Hmmm

It must be something else. Removed the percent and still wrong. Sorry.

@nagylzs works for me (I just tried it)

@JosephWright, @AndrewStacey @PauloCereda @All blog editors: Can you please look at the blog section. Please feel free to make edits and corrections.

@nagylzs examples start with \documentclass and end \end{document}

Yes, it was something else.

Yes, sorry. I was writting before thinking. I supposed that the percent sign is special in math mode.

@nagylzs 9 times out of 10 when people post fragments, the error is in the bit not posted, that's why we always ask for complete documents:-)

But now I see it was a { brace (two pages above) that I accidentally left there.

everybody here is so nice

math.SE are vote nazis :s

@tohecz The quotation in this answer is epic

@HarishKumar Only one thing: make the link to the TeX-SX question a bit more friendly. Write it as [Question title](question link).

@PeterGrill Thank you, and it is, I'm applying to go to grad school in Chemistry

@egreg: can I only provide an English abstract to ArsTeXnica? My Italian is far from acceptable.

@PauloCereda The editors will be happy to translate yours.

@egreg ooh thank you very much. :)

@HarishKumar I've seen the draft. Could you imagine another example? I'll think to it. However, I'm always dubious in recommending packages by FC, not only because of the impossiblity to read the documentation (etextools is well known for the "peculiar features" in it).

I loved the detail about maryland (1921).

If I want to put images in another directory, can I just do images/filename.jpg for the images directly relative to the current?

@Gnintendo yes

@Gnintendo you can of course omit the .jpg usually and you can omit the images/ if the directory is in your tex input path or the graphics package \graphicspath

oh, how do I specify the graphics path in the graphics package?

@Gnintendo oh flip how do you expect me to remember, just because I wrote it?

I'll have a look

yes

:<

\graphicspath{{images/}}

note the two {{ as it is a list of directories each inside {}

@Gnintendo see grfguide (texdoc grfguide)

yeah, looking

thanks, btw

@Werner I was avoiding mentioning TX:-) thought he ought to master p columns first:-)

@DavidCarlisle True... if we had a question about that laying around, I would have pushed them that way.

Nothing came up though when I search for that.

I thought you had gone on to translate some algorithms into French, so I could sneak in an answer though...

...I was wrong. :-|

@Werner although X is probaby what he wants there so your answer was probably more helpful than my comment

@Werner you haven't seen my french:-)

@DavidCarlisle Here you have an opportunity to showcase that!

I printed a couple of pages that had some gray scale graphics on the University printer today, and they came out quite ugly. The printer seems to print gray scales by alternating between really small black and white dots. I've never really thought about this before, but I guess this is something that just mono-color printer does, right? Or should I expect the same result on a color printer?

Don't fully spoon-feed... just a little.

@Werner not in public (my sister might see it, or worse my niece) they are french and very unforgiving about my attempts

@DavidCarlisle He he. Now I'm even more interested! But as you know, once it's out there, it's out there.

@DavidCarlisle You have a French sister?

@egreg married/nationalized or whatever.

just set up a new git for my tex project

It was getting large so I needed to have some organization :P

It's midnight (here): youtube.com/watch?v=dZPdzQsHfEk&feature=related

@tohecz The copyright police is chasing after you. :)

@tohecz You can teach French to David

@egreg I'm not the one sharing :D

but it's a pity that a channel with complete TJ selection is down :(

@egreg I cannot, trust me ;D

New link: youtube.com/watch?v=LhzoeYRgvdw

@tohecz ah T & J.

@DavidCarlisle This one especially is so perfect :D

anyways, bedtime!

@tohecz One of the best.

@egreg the first part especially is good, the second part is a TJ must-be

@tohecz Did you find an organ to play in Paris?

@egreg no, but a piano

@tohecz Do your drills.

@egreg well, I can get there only once a week, and not really "practice", only to play a bit

@tohecz So have a good sleep.

I will I hope. and cross your fingers, tomorrow I'm going to deal with French authorities to get my money

@AndrewStacey: Changed appropriately.

@egreg Oh. There are some examples in the documentation. Actually I myself may not use it frequently. Can you please think of another example please. Let me search here also. One minute.

wheee, all setup: github.com/Gnintendo/Art-History-Study-Guide

@PauloCereda Yeah, don't know why it was changed. Last week I made a minor edit to my profile and it changed. But this I did not change anything so not sure what happened.

@DavidCarlisle: Re: Subscript spacing in equation, is there an issue using \! for negative space?

Upon re-reading it I guess that you did not mean to imply there was an issue with \!, but some negative same amount different than what is produced by a \!.. I guess I tend to read things too quickly and jump to conclusions, so if others don't have this issue then leave it as.

hey @PeterGrill

@Gnintendo hello

@egreg There are some 10-11 questions where the linegoal package is either mentioned or used. Will that be useful?