TeX, LaTeX and Friends - 2021-10-22

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4:32 AM

I can't believe the UK main health agency uses MS word for writing scientific paper instead of Latex! OMG . I was watching this video from the UK and saw this. Which is clearly written using Word.

user image

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I can spot a word generated document from one mile away.

No one in the UK health dept. knows how to use Latex?

2 hours later…

6:11 AM

@Nasser I think it's like the 90% of the offices on the Earth

7:02 AM

@CarLaTeX I can understand run-of-the mill office workers using Word and not Latex. But this is a major scientific institute, writing a scientific paper written by may be people with 10 PhD's. And it uses Word. I found it strange.

7:15 AM

@Nasser Pretty standard. One sees InDesign for more 'fancy' docs, and yesterday I spotted a PDF from a think-tank using Drupal (so presumably HTML-to-PDF), but Word is the mainstay for work-based documents in both the public and private sectors

7:39 AM

@JosephWright ...and you have to admit that the online collaborative features for writing docs are quite powerful. If the structure is not complex and if you do not have too many formulas/figures it is quite effective --- we use it for research proposals quite a lot. Even if in my group 50% use LaTeX then for articles, 100% is able to participate on simple word documents...

@JosephWright that was meant for @Nasser sorry

8:17 AM

@samcarter Marei is awesome. :)

@PauloCereda Yes, indeed! I thought the package was dead and was so desperate that I actually included a very basic version of this feature in the latest beamer version github.com/josephwright/beamer/pull/704/commits/…

.. but having the package back with all the cool features is of course much better!

@samcarter ooh

Stefan Kottwitz

8:35 AM

@AlanMunn The bar tester should order a beer); DROP TABLE inventory;--

@Nasser do you think many medical journals accept latex rather than word? Why should government departments be different?

@DavidCarlisle Strange that none of these anti-vax people give "this study was written in word" as argument - would be more substantiate than their current reasons :)

@Nasser theverge.com/2020/8/6/21355674/…

9:01 AM

@samcarter one committee changes a couple of dozen gene names to cope with excel errors. Nothing compared to an entire country stopping putting spaces between words so latex dropping spaces after command names isn't an issue.

@DavidCarlisle We're just following your advise to not use xspace :)

@samcarter ooh

2 hours later…

10:48 AM

@PauloCereda LOL. Totally asking someone if they've seen my "specta-clees" next time I lose my glasses XD

@samcarter Too true!

@Plergux ooh

11:20 AM

@PauloCereda reddit.com/r/ItHadToBeBrazil/comments/lo4efl/brazilian_pet

sad news that scientific word just went out of business. The best software which generates Latex using GUI. https://www.mackichan.com/

I am still using 5.5. They made horrible mistake 10 years ago and changed to version 6.0 with completely new design that no one wanted. They went to XML I think, instead of Latex as the basic format. It had so many bugs for many years. So I stayed with 5.5 which I use everyday. They have free versions now on the site if someone wants to download the software for free.

Here is discussion about it news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27819736 for me, SW is the most important software on my computer actually. As I use it to write all my Latex documents which has lots of math in it, as it makes it very easy. Without it I am lost.

11:37 AM

@samcarter oh my

@samcarter :D

1 hour later…

1:10 PM

@JosephWright What to do with github.com/josephwright/beamer/issues/715 ? Label as wontfix?

@Nasser ah didn't know that, not exactly surprising but it was nice while it lasted. Oh actually I guess I did read that earlier, just forgotten

@JosephWright Should github.com/josephwright/beamer/issues/658 be closed as "answered"?

1:51 PM

@JosephWright Do you have any opinion on github.com/josephwright/beamer/issues/659 ? I would tend to label this as wontfix. In theory one could fix this by storing a copy of black when beamer is loaded and then use the stored colour for fadings etc. However this seems to be a very special edge case and I'm a bit afraid working around it might cause some problems with colour spaces etc. in the future.

2:22 PM

@samcarter Yes

@samcarter Done

@JosephWright Please, do you have an idea who is responsible for compiling latex from sources? We would pretty much enjoy having some additions to the binaries :D I'm sure we'd not be the only ones to benefit from these additions :)

Phelype Oleinik

@yo' The people in the tlbuild list are the ones who build the engines for TeX Live, but suggestions for extensions usually go to the tex-live mailing list

@PhelypeOleinik cool! Thanks :)

@JosephWright 👍

@yo' you mean compiled on additional platforms, or adding extensions to the language?

2:35 PM

@DavidCarlisle an extension to -recorder basically, so niether really :)

@yo' just tell @PhelypeOleinik to add it (he was last one to touch \input) :-)

@DavidCarlisle Cool!

Phelype Oleinik

@DavidCarlisle Not cool!

:)

@PhelypeOleinik oh no!

@PhelypeOleinik Hot?

2:37 PM

@samcarter oh :)

Jun 29 '17 at 16:15, by Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle you are not mean :)

Phelype Oleinik

@samcarter on no, winter is ~~coming~~ leaving

(in the upside-down part of the world, at least)

@PhelypeOleinik oh where are you?

@PhelypeOleinik :P

@yo' I tried my first overleaf tl2021 project, using longtable as well, ? don't suppose you want to know what happened?

2:41 PM

@DavidCarlisle what happened?

\documentclass{article}

\usepackage{unicodefonttable}

\begin{document}

\displayfonttable{Noto Sans CJK JP}
\end{document}

@UlrikeFischer no output :-)

@DavidCarlisle if it was different from what happened in tl2020 and different from what you expected, I want to know :D otherwise I don't care :D

@yo' define "expected"

@DavidCarlisle large font?

@DavidCarlisle "expected" = "what should happen in a local installation" probably

2:43 PM

@yo' the package was installed in texlive this morning (It's Frank's) this information may affect your expectation:-)

`unicodefonttable.sty' not found.

@DavidCarlisle ah ok. That's cheating

Phelype Oleinik

@yo' Brazil

Jun 29 '17 at 16:15, by Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle you are not mean :)

For the record, I take it as expected by definition :)

@UlrikeFischer large ish but works quite well makes a 65 page table.

2:45 PM

@PhelypeOleinik oh cool! Anyway, our idea is if -recorder could (maybe under some extra flag like -recorder=2) record not only opens but also closes, and if an open happens, record the line in the current file where that happened. Do you think that's doable? (Not saying it should be done...)

Phelype Oleinik

@yo' Likely doable. At that level we probably know where we are in the file stack, so likely easy

@PhelypeOleinik ok cool :-) I'll keep it in mind (we had only a heckathon project that would have benefitted from this, so nothing we need really, it would only be cool)

Phelype Oleinik

@yo' The problem, I think, would be \input vs. \openin. With \input you have an ordered stack of open/close, but with \openin you have one open, then arbitrarily many accesses with \read, and only then a close. Probably doable, but the output would be confusing, I think

The ultimate goal is to provide better error locations for LaTeX errors. Currently we rely on logs parsing to do that, but logs are ... unreliable at best :D So if someone knew how to make logs more robust to parsing, that would be also great and much easier probably :D

@yo' do you use --file-line-error ?

2:50 PM

@DavidCarlisle that's a good question. We probably do not, and that would help a lot!

(and it shows how we have a case of complete blindness/dumbness as I'm of course aware of that option)

@yo' I am the ultimate rubber duck

Phelype Oleinik

@yo' Karl and I talked about adding some primitives to get better knowledge of where we are in the input stack, but since then I didn't have much time to work on that. But that would probably not help you a lot with error detection (David's suggestion is likely better)

@PhelypeOleinik you'd just need to distinquish opens/closes with \input and \openin I think

Phelype Oleinik

@DavidCarlisle dinner

@PhelypeOleinik pwnd

Phelype Oleinik

2:52 PM

oh, rubber

ew

@PhelypeOleinik serves you right for being mean

Phelype Oleinik

Aug 1 '19 at 12:32, by Paulo Cereda

@PhelypeOleinik You are not mean. :)

@PhelypeOleinik don't believe everything you read on the internet

Phelype Oleinik

Jan 2 at 22:24, by David Carlisle

@LaTeXereXeTaL must be true if you read it on the internet

@PhelypeOleinik oh no

3:10 PM

@yo' now that you have a more current system you could use \RequirePackage{structuredlog}

@UlrikeFischer We can't really plug it in user projects I'm afraid, that would be over the line of user control probably

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2

@PauloCereda ^^^ from the menu of a traditional roman restaurant

3:24 PM

@UlrikeFischer @CarLaTeX will be disappointed there's no pineapple

@DavidCarlisle they probably hid it under the nutella.

@DavidCarlisle it is really nice.

@UlrikeFischer I got that ping and thought you meant the nutella pizza!

@yo' Why going through all this trouble if your users then just ignore the error messages? :)

@samcarter to be fair the new error indicator is a lot better than the old one

@DavidCarlisle ;-) We didn't try it but Paulo will probably agree with the other impretation.

3:35 PM

@samcarter it's for being happy about the few percent that do care. You know, rejoice for a single soul saved!

the indicator might be better, the users are not :) Had a discussion with an user the other day who claimed that
\documentclass{article}
\usepackage{caption}
\usepackage[center]{caption}
\begin{document}
content...
\end{document}
did not cause an error in Overleaf

@yo' :)

3:55 PM

@UlrikeFischer YEEEES

Is there any existing solution for synctex terminal vim and zathura? tex.stackexchange.com/questions/2941/… and tex.stackexchange.com/questions/584529/… both only have gvim solution.

Searching online only give gvim solution too.

Looks like I'll have to write my own

@PauloCereda I think you would say that the solution to all vim questions is to use emacs?

Too lazy to relearn

Perhaps it's not that hard, my configuration is somewhat modeless-oriented already

@DavidCarlisle oh no

@UlrikeFischer I would say something about the word "traditional"

4:21 PM

@CarLaTeX It was very traditional: full of italian people including a large group celebrating an 80 anniversary or something like, no tourist except us ;-) And it appears in a Visconti film.

@UlrikeFischer With a Nutella pizza contamination

@CarLaTeX The times they are a-changing.

@AlanMunn Indeed, Nutella pizza is not traditional

4:37 PM

@UlrikeFischer -- "Really nice" -- Is that the whole establishment or the nutella pizza?

@barbarabeeton that was a comment to a quite unrelated remark of David (about Frank's new package).

@UlrikeFischer -- Oh. (I must learn to pay better attention.) Well, the nutella pizza is one that I *wouldn't" suggest putting anchovies on.

@JosephWright color nodes and box re-arrangements... tex.stackexchange.com/a/619883/1090

Phelype Oleinik

4:54 PM

\H@old@sectm@m,% memoir+hyperref (what a mess...)

:)

@DavidCarlisle that is bad for the reading order and copy & paste too.

@PhelypeOleinik ?

Phelype Oleinik

@UlrikeFischer Found that in biblatex.sty

@UlrikeFischer Someone venting their frustration

5:17 PM

@JosephWright twitter.com/NintendoAmerica/status/1451596571758538756

5:29 PM

Nutella pizza is good

5:42 PM

Kann ein Känguru höher als ein Haus springen? Ja! Weil ein Haus nicht springen kann.

ooh

Phelype Oleinik

6:09 PM

@PauloCereda oh, Kangaroos with springs

@PhelypeOleinik ooh

@PauloCereda LOL

2 hours later…

8:19 PM

Hello, in the following file, how can I solve the pause problem? Please help Thanks

% !TeX TS-program = xelatex
\documentclass{beamer}
\usepackage[RTLdocument=on]{bidi}
\raggedleft

\begin{document}

\begin{frame}
slide1
\pause
slide1-2
\pause
slide1-3
\end{frame}

\end{document}

8:41 PM

@M.Ahmadi You can avoid the spaces with:

% !TeX TS-program = xelatex
\documentclass{beamer}
\usepackage[RTLdocument=on]{bidi}
\raggedleft


\begin{document}

\begin{frame}
\only<+->{slide1}
\only<+->{slide1-2}
\only<+->{slide1-3}
\end{frame}

\end{document}

(\pause is a very crude command, you'll have much more control if you use \only and similar commands)

@samcarter Thanks, I guess the right-to-left text vote is a problem of macros

in file befor \end{frame} solve with \pause[0]

edit : @samcarter Thanks, I guess for the right-to-left text the problem is macro

\documentclass{beamer}
\usepackage[RTLdocument=on]{bidi}
\raggedleft

\begin{document}

\begin{frame}
slide1
\pause
slide1-2
\pause
slide1-3
\pause[0]
\end{frame}

\end{document}

It is possible for the right-to-left text to solve this problem automatically

@M.Ahmadi Even in LTR text, it is usually better to avoid pause

@samcarter Thanks. whith change output:

\makeatletter
\renewcommand<>{\beamer@noargsonslide}{%
\beamer@endpause%
\alt#1%
{\beamer@startcovered\gdef\beamer@endpause{\beamer@endcovered}}%
{\beamer@spacingcover\gdef\beamer@endpause{\beamer@spacingcover}}%
}
\makeatother

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