TeX, LaTeX and Friends - 2021-04-11

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Harald Hanche-Olsen

6:04 AM

@Verónica They may not cause problems in a technical sense, but having a lot of explicit layout in the document body runs counter to the latex philosophy of separating layout and content. It will cause you problems when you wish to change the layout, as you have already discovered, by needing to do a global search and replace.

@Verónica Having a lot of vspace{4cm} in your document is certainly very unusual. I imagine it is related to some special needs that are better captured by creating a general command or environment to satisfy your needs. Define it once in the preamble, use it in the document body.

6:26 AM

@Verónica Yes, on Overleaf is the same (I'm used to Notepad ++ where it's slightly different) :)

3 hours later…

9:12 AM

@Verónica the idea in latex is really to separate formatting from content, If you change \documentclass{article} to \documentclass{somejournal} then the page size changes, the font changes, all vertical spacing around theorems and equations changes to match the journal style. And fixed \vspace{.5cm} stay as 5cm spaces in inappropriate places and make journal editor's lives miserable. As a final edit in a book, perahaps. But not while writing a document.

9:25 AM

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@Dr.ManuelKuehner For now I just removed the link. Something's pesky with the gallery app --- probably due that I never updated it in the last years and the switch to https seems to have killed it.... nothing really interesting there, anyway.

@samcarter_looks_forward_TUG'21 skills twitter.com/hyxpk/status/1380913477343092736

9:46 AM

@PauloCereda seems like a good plan. Have breakfast instead.

@yo' hmmm github.com/ajaxorg/ace/compare/master...overleaf:overleaf :-)

@DavidCarlisle oh no

10:21 AM

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Harald Hanche-Olsen

Seen on a Telegram group I am on: How to exit vim …

:!find /proc -name status | while read file; do echo "$file: "; cat $file | grep vim; done | grep -B1 vim | grep -v Name | while read line; do sed 's/^\/proc\///g' | sed 's/\/.*//g'; done | xargs kill -9

@HaraldHanche-Olsen lol

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@Plergux It's good that someone finally figured it out.

@HaraldHanche-Olsen LOL

@HaraldHanche-Olsen also github.com/hakluke/how-to-exit-vim

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@PauloCereda I knew I had seen something like it before.

10:33 AM

@HaraldHanche-Olsen :)

@HaraldHanche-Olsen let's not forget @DavidCarlisle's favourite method: ZZ

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@PauloCereda This has so many applications: No lifeboats installed. Please do not sink this ship.

@HaraldHanche-Olsen LOL

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@PauloCereda Unless, of course, he has somehow entered insert mode.

@HaraldHanche-Olsen hmm true

@HaraldHanche-Olsen github.com/caseykneale/VIMKiller and github.com/foxweb/vim-pedal

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@PauloCereda These are great, but incomplete. There is a need for a way to get out of ed, too.

Mar 10 '18 at 21:09, by Harald Hanche-Olsen

@user279540 Just remember this: ed is the standard editor

10:42 AM

@HaraldHanche-Olsen ooh

@HaraldHanche-Olsen Yeah, I never ventured in there so I've not had this problem. :p

Can anyone explain to me the philosophy (or style logic, if you prefer) behind not using whole number delimiters (f.ex. "1,000" = one thousand) and only having spaces in number formatting (e.g. in siunitx)?

10:58 AM

@Plergux Because in USA is 1,000, in Italy is 1.000, but everybody understand 1 000

Harald Hanche-Olsen

Oops sorry, wrong wikipedia page

samcarter_looks_forward_TUG'21

@PauloCereda Magic!

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@Plergux It actually is further down in the same wikipedia article I posted a link to …

samcarter_looks_forward_TUG'21

@Plergux everybody should simply use 10^{3} - problem solved :)

@CarLaTeX Yes, I know that. I use a comma for a decimal separator. But then you have 1,234 versus 1.234 (one comma/point two three four) which is just as confusing. Do you mean that if you read a document that has 1,234 and 1.234 you have to figure out which one is the decimal but if you have 1 234 and 1,234 or 1 234 and 1.234 you can see which one is the whole number and then assume the other one is the decimal?

@samcarter_looks_forward_TUG'21 aaaah! maths! \runs

11:06 AM

@DavidCarlisle Not sure at the moment, I shall check.

Harald Hanche-Olsen

This is TeX, Version 3.141\thinspace592\thinspace653

@Plergux yes, this is a good interpretation. I still have a bit of nightmare when in a project with the US we had a nice Excel sheet shared... (it is supposed to be transparent, no? what can go wrong?)

@yo' but I realised that you have forked the whole ace repo to tweak the latex parsing, just looking over the changes in your github version, not sure I want to go down that route, the changes to the ace latex tokenizer are bigger than the entire texlive.net code:-)

@CarLaTeX the obvious solution is to fix Italy

11:23 AM

@DavidCarlisle and Germany

@UlrikeFischer "random places south of Dover that we no longer mention"

@DavidCarlisle I remember Ali mentioning this sometimes, he didn't seem particularly happy when saying it. I think he said that just the code for Ctrl+B to insert \textbf{...} is 400 lines.

@yo' yes it's the opposite of tex where there is no infomation hiding and you can always patch anything, the ace code hides all its interfaces behind anonymous functions so you really have to duplicate the whole thing just to tweak some regex in the tokenizer:-)

samcarter_looks_forward_TUG'21

@Rmano I'm active in a project in which scientists visit schools and the pupils can explore authentic particle or astroparticle data for a day. One of the possible activities is to analyse data from en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pierre_Auger_Observatory on their computer using libre office or excel. The very first time we did this, we were surprised by the strange results the pupils got. Turned out the problem was that the school used excel with German language settings turned on :)

@DavidCarlisle hm, I think I'm living north of Dover.

11:29 AM

@Rmano That makes sense. Though for some reason it's incredibly difficult to look at. I keep wanting to add the little dots. :p

@samcarter_looks_forward_TUG'21 I had the same problem with marks for international students... go figure.

samcarter_looks_forward_TUG'21

@Rmano :)

@Plergux My comment to my students is that if you need the additional (, or . or ' or ·) to separate thousands, you must go to scientific notation.

I mark an error when they write "C=0,000000022 F" (no one would be able to read that without counting zeroes. At least not me...)

@Rmano So you mean like 0.22 to the power of -7 or however that would be :p

@Plergux yes, 2.2\cdot 10^{-8} or better 22 nF. Notice that thanks to @JosephWright you can write \num{22e-9} and be happy...

Harald Hanche-Olsen

11:37 AM

@Plergux It's 22 nF, if I counted the zeroes correctly.

@HaraldHanche-Olsen Yes --- got them wrong because I was trying to write 2.2 nF --- which really demonstrates the point ;-)

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@Rmano Some electric engineer I know pronounces pF as “piff”. As in, “I think we need to add a ten piff capacitor here.”

@Rmano :D yeah, I think I might actually use siunitx at some point for my statistics chapter (lots of probabilities and stuff :p). Thought the reason I was reading the documentation for it was not nearly so scientific :p

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@Plergux Just a bit of light reading to pass the time, right? I know the feeling.

@DavidCarlisle you haz mail

11:55 AM

@Plergux I think so

@CarLaTeX ok, that makes sense :)

@DavidCarlisle That's why you did Brexit

@HaraldHanche-Olsen Absolutely. Sunday morning entertainment. :p

12:10 PM

@HaraldHanche-Olsen Actually... :p

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Harald Hanche-Olsen

@Plergux Pffffff…

@Plergux YES

Harald Hanche-Olsen

@Plergux Though if I were to be pedantic (heaven forbid), I might point out that mass is measured in kilograms, while weight is measured in newtons.

@Plergux cannot wait for your full Plerguxdex (who needs this Pokédex anyway)

I am falling in love with VIM!

12:19 PM

@DavidCarlisle ^^

:))

12:31 PM

@yo' thanks

@enthu save yourself while you still have time

@HaraldHanche-Olsen and @JosephWright is English so measures his height in feet and inches

@DavidCarlisle ooh imperial

@DavidCarlisle Indeed

@HaraldHanche-Olsen Well, that you will have to take up with Pokémon Go, not me. :p

@Plergux ooh we can catch Pokémanz

@PauloCereda :D Well, I've spent much of this morning hoarding Snivys :p

@PauloCereda :D

1:08 PM

Hi, This is how I have set up mathjax on my blogger site:

koutuholi.blogspot.com/2021/04/mathjax.html

But it seems that mathjax is functioning slowly. Can you kindly check and suggest me how to improve the code such that mathjax runs faster?

@raf well it can be slow, but also that's mathjax 2, you may want to satrt wit mathjax3 since you are startug a new site

I have put:

src="http://cdn.mathjax.org/mathjax/latest/MathJax.js?config=TeX-AMS-MML_HTMLorMML"

what should I use instead of it to get latest version?

<script type="text/javascript" src="http://cdn.mathjax.org/mathjax/latest/MathJax.js?config=TeX-AMS-MML_HTMLorMML">
MathJax.Hub.Config({
 extensions: ["tex2jax.js","TeX/AMSmath.js","TeX/AMSsymbols.js"],
 jax: ["input/TeX", "output/HTML-CSS"],
 tex2jax: {
     inlineMath: [ ['$','$'], ["\\(","\\)"] ],
     displayMath: [ ['$$','$$'], ["\\[","\\]"] ],
     processEscapes: true,
     processRefs: true,
 },
 "HTML-CSS": { availableFonts: ["TeX"] }
});
</script>

where should I edit to get the latest version and how to improve it more?

@raf mathjax.org/#gettingstarted

Harald Hanche-Olsen

1:30 PM

@DavidCarlisle and his weight in stone, I presume

I just replaced it by:

  <script src="https://polyfill.io/v3/polyfill.min.js?features=es6"></script>
  <script id="MathJax-script" async src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/npm/mathjax@3/es5/tex-mml-chtml.js"></script>
  MathJax.Hub.Config({
  extensions: ["tex2jax.js","TeX/AMSmath.js","TeX/AMSsymbols.js"],
  jax: ["input/TeX", "output/HTML-CSS"],
  tex2jax: {
     inlineMath: [ ['$','$'], ["\\(","\\)"] ],
     displayMath: [ ['$$','$$'], ["\\[","\\]"] ],
     processEscapes: true,
     processRefs: true,
  },
  "HTML-CSS": { availableFonts: ["TeX"] }

and tested here jsbin.com/?html,output

But I found that single $ command is not functioning

Okay, I think I have mistakenly put extra </script> at the 2nd line here. Even after removing it, the single $ command for inline math is not working

@raf your config settings are for mathjax 2. Sorry no time to debug now setting up $ is the first example at docs.mathjax.org/en/latest/web/configuration.html

@DavidCarlisle ohh I see.

1:45 PM

@raf mathjax 3 was a complete re-write

Oh. When you get free time, please help me to switch my mathjax config code to version 3. I am getting confused.

well to start with you can delete all the configuration except the one line script element in the getting started page and check that \(e=mc^2\) works

@yo' not quite up to overleaf's completion but I avoided forking ACE :-) davidcarlisle.github.io/latexcgi/test-completion

@UlrikeFischer @JosephWright ^^

@DavidCarlisle nice ;-)

@DavidCarlisle that's really cool. I am gonna keep it bookmarked :)

@UlrikeFischer still not sure if we want it, the completion data might get big if we add to it every time someone requests their package added. I may add it to the runlatex but leave it at the default turned off.

@raf don't bookmark that (it is running off an experimental feature branch and might go at any time) use texlive.net

2:00 PM

@DavidCarlisle one shouldn't overdo it, but a few standard and often used commands like \usepackage or \documentclass or \zzz would be nice.

@DavidCarlisle ok

@UlrikeFischer yes I wondered about that. for the initial testing I just had a small javascript array with a few commands defined inline in runlatex.js there I have it dynamically loading the json file if completion is enabled so if you don't use it, it isn't loaded but if we just wanted a fixed list of a hundred or so entries it would be simpler to go back to the version without dynamic loading

2:17 PM

@StefanKottwitz would you want command completion in the runlatex version you use at your forums? (davidcarlisle.github.io/latexcgi/test-completion) I'm not sure it's a good idea or not for learnlatex... Just experimenting in a feature branch at present...

It would be a great help if someone gives an updated answer to this question to set up and config the latest mathjax:

85

A: How to use LaTeX on blogspot?

I would say use MathJax. It's a AJAX engine for LaTeX syntax that now is distributed by a CDN so you don't have to upload a single file to your blogspot account. To enable MathJax, just drop in <script type="text/javascript" src="https://cdnjs.cloudflare.com/ajax/libs/mathjax/2.7.1/latest/Math...

Stefan Kottwitz

@DavidCarlisle It is very interesting and sounds useful for writing LaTeX code in forums, especially when you work with the phone somewhere, so yes!

2:56 PM

Fun... I comment on an answer on a post that it seemed a request for a homework, and 30 second after the OP deletes it... I hope turnitin will be still able to catch it ;-)

3:15 PM

@raf I suppose as it's there we could update it. These days It would probably be considered off topic

I asked for an updated answer for the following question in the general chatroom for webapps. seems the chatroom is not active much.

0

A: MathJax on Blogger

This answer comes from Tex.Stackexchange: Copy-past the following code <script type="text/javascript" src="http://cdn.mathjax.org/mathjax/latest/MathJax.js"> MathJax.Hub.Config({ extensions: ["tex2jax.js","TeX/AMSmath.js","TeX/AMSsymbols.js"], jax: ["input/TeX", "output/HTML-CSS"], tex2j...

3:49 PM

@DavidCarlisle cool!

Stefan Kottwitz

@DavidCarlisle indeed, that's impressive!

4:09 PM

@Rmano You could do what my music teacher once did (she was from the UK) when one of her junior high school students kept asking her to do her English assignment for her and she got so tired of it she said she'd do it but wrote it in the most academic English she could muster. She said that to this day that person has no idea how the hell the teacher sussed that she hadn't done it herself XD

@StefanKottwitz it's now live at Learnlatex.org and more or less documented at davidcarlisle.github.io/latexcgi/…

Stefan Kottwitz

4:24 PM

@DavidCarlisle Excellent!

4:36 PM

@Plergux :-)

4:55 PM

Me on every other siunitx issue: 'Fixed in v3'

5

5:08 PM

Hey, wow! I discovered that I can use direct links to sections with texdoc.net: texdoc.org/serve/circuitikz/0#b2 works like a charm! kudos to the author!

8

5:35 PM

@JosephWright me in 1994 on every other latex2e issue: ' (will be) Fixed in latex3'

5

@DavidCarlisle I actually have release plans now ....

1 hour later…

Dr. Manuel Kuehner

7:10 PM

Ok, thanks for the follow-up!

2 hours later…

9:16 PM

@DavidCarlisle I am ruined I think :))

@enthu vim fails on the first test: it isn't emacs.

@DavidCarlisle I am just thinking why should we use vim when we can easily use other ide's where we can use some gui features. And then it seems it is kind of philosophical question like when we have ms word, why we use tex?!

a bit confused about hese things when I play with tex, linux, etc and I see I am deeply loving these tools.

Although most of the tools in my field are windows oriented. I try to learn these on my own pleasure...

I find value in working and learning these, to be addicted to codes and programming however I am not very professional in coding. I love these.

@enthu emacs v vi(m) goes beyond mere technical considerations it is war and faith

@PauloCereda is on the wrong side of this debate

@DavidCarlisle I saw a vi SE site as well, are you active there too?

@enthu no:-) I have used emacs almost every day since 1987 and have used vi a couple of times in that period, so a vi site isn't my most natural home.

9:29 PM

Ah! I thought you are on VIM side! :))

@enthu :-O

@Rmano I really now feel shy on my thought! :))

@enthu I imagine you already read this stackoverflow.com/a/1220118/2907484 - that was the post that brought me to the vim side.

@Rmano i should read it

samcarter_looks_forward_TUG'21

9:58 PM

@Dr.ManuelKuehner You don't need to load additional packages, beamer loads ams by default

@Rmano yawn, so long winded. You want a more pithy comparison that gets straight to the point. tex.stackexchange.com/a/85277/1090

@DavidCarlisle wow! first time I see minus votes on your post...

Why don't you just stop arguing and use Notepad like normal people :p

@Plergux it is my current editor! but I have read that people and programmers do not find it to be an ide! although I can not indeed understand what is the difference between an ide and a n++ for instance!

Dr. Manuel Kuehner

10:15 PM

@samcarter_looks_forward_TUG'21 Oh, thx. I will update my answer.

samcarter_looks_forward_TUG'21

@Dr.ManuelKuehner You're welcome!

fun blog!

cacm.acm.org/blogs/blog-cacm/…

Dr. Manuel Kuehner

@samcarter_looks_forward_TUG'21 You do not have a LaTeX profile on stackexchange anymore?! I just wanted to link your profile in the answer.

Church of Emacs?! :|

The editor war is the rivalry between users of the Emacs and vi (now usually Vim, or recently Neovim) text editors. The rivalry has become a lasting part of hacker culture and the free software community. The Emacs versus vi debate was one of the original "holy wars" conducted on Usenet groups, with many flame wars fought between those insisting that their editor of choice is the paragon of editing perfection, and insulting the other, since at least 1985. Related battles have been fought over operating systems, programming languages, version control systems, and even source code indent style....

Dr. Manuel Kuehner

@samcarter_looks_forward_TUG'21 Forget my question. This is surely a difficult topic. No need to reply.

10:21 PM

@enthu I think it's just because you can't be a "real programmer" and like Microsoft. :p I use whatever I have at hand. Some times Notepad (or Notepad++), some times Atom or VS Code, other times TexWorks. I don't care. If I can type stuff and it doesn't do anything I don't want it to do it's fine. :p

@enthu I think this says it all: "Related battles have been fought over operating systems, programming languages, version control systems, and even source code indent style...." :p You just do you. Or as we say in my neck of the woods, YKINMKBYKIOK :p

@Plergux ummm... more of a taste of habit I believe. my question is more like this I think: why do pure programmers prefer the harder way?! windows exist and they prefer linux, word is here and they like tex, gui is doing good and they like shell! this logic of liking the hardest should have a philosophy behind. I think they all know but they do not convey the fact clearly :))

@enthu you can't trust vim users: they even downvote helping Grandmothers tex.stackexchange.com/a/94891/1090

@DavidCarlisle Ah I am happy I have already up-voted it!

@enthu there is hope for you yet, perhaps you may yet be saved.

@DavidCarlisle :)) I am happy!

10:30 PM

@Plergux normal people just use microsoft word on windows, but that's no reason not to uphold traditions and argue with vim users about emacs.

@enthu I think part of it is some sort of insecurity complex. Like, if it isn't complicated they don't feel clever enough. :p

@DavidCarlisle Well, most traditions are silly things that nobody would do if they weren't traditions.

2

@Plergux exactly

@DavidCarlisle Mind you, I would probably be likely to pick whichever was more likely to get people riled up at any given time #icetroll

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