TeX, LaTeX and Friends

12:49 AM

@Canageek No problem. If only Boris Johnson would do the same ....

1:00 AM

@DavidCarlisle After all that, my forest turned out too wide and I couldn't use the coffins after all. However, my other document presumably breaks with 2020, so I'll need it there. Thanks!

David Carlisle

@cfr coffins in general will work OK, coffins with lists in them less so, sorry about that, it managed to pass all our tests except the one Joseph just added which is a copy of your test file so it stays fixed:-)

cfr

@PauloCereda You don't like them? I think they're fantastic. One of the most useful l3 thingies.

David Carlisle

@cfr he's just scared of what's inside

cfr

@DavidCarlisle When you say they'll work OK, but not with lists, do you mean they won't work with lists after the fix? Or they just won't work with lists until a/the fix?

My other document also has lists. That's why I know it'll break: it is exactly the same thing: lists on the left and forests on the right.

\NewDocumentCommand\twotoo{m+m+mo}{%
  \medskip\par\noindent
  \SetVerticalCoffin\lcoffin{.5\textwidth}{\linewidth=\hsize#2}% workaround for TL2020 bug from David Carlisle
  \SetVerticalCoffin\fcoffin{.48\textwidth}{{\centering #3\par}\IfValueT{#4}{\noindent[#4]}}%
  \JoinCoffins\lcoffin[r,vc]\fcoffin[l,vc](.02\textwidth,0pt)%
  \SetHorizontalCoffin\fcoffin{\textsf{Question #1}}%
  \JoinCoffins\lcoffin[t,l]\fcoffin[t,l](0pt,\baselineskip)%
  \TypesetCoffin\lcoffin[T,l]\medskip\par%
}

#2 always is a list in this document :(.

David Carlisle

@cfr no they will work fine after the fix, the code didn't change at all, it's just that when it got preloaded into the format \linewidth isn't defined so it made a version of the definition (suitable for plain tex) that just set \hsize` so adding the linewidth setting should give exactly the old behaviour (and we should get a patch level 3 format out next week that adjusts teh test for "latex" so it works again)

cfr

1:09 AM

@DavidCarlisle Glad it's useful.

@DavidCarlisle Oh, good. I thought that's what you meant, but the 'will' had me worried.

David Carlisle

@cfr sorry I meant if you use the existing broken definition in other documents (like every one in our test suite apparently) that have coffins without lists then they will work OK. \linewidth is (mostly) just used in lists

@cfr I am sure this comment would read better as workaround for TL2020 bug, fix from David Carlisle :-)

cfr

@DavidCarlisle I use them all over, though mostly the expl3 syntax, but you're right. I don't put lists in them all the time. (But I use lists for formalising arguments a lot.)

@DavidCarlisle I meant the workaround ;).

@DavidCarlisle It's only so I know who to blame if it breaks.

David Carlisle

@cfr Ulrike

cfr

@DavidCarlisle New version:

\NewDocumentCommand\twotoo{m+m+mo}{%
  \medskip\par\noindent
  \SetVerticalCoffin\lcoffin{.5\textwidth}{\linewidth=\hsize#2}% workaround from David Carlisle for TL2020 bug
  \SetVerticalCoffin\fcoffin{.48\textwidth}{{\centering #3\par}\IfValueT{#4}{\noindent[#4]}}%
  \JoinCoffins\lcoffin[r,vc]\fcoffin[l,vc](.02\textwidth,0pt)%
  \SetHorizontalCoffin\fcoffin{\textsf{Question #1}}%
  \JoinCoffins\lcoffin[t,l]\fcoffin[t,l](0pt,\baselineskip)%
  \TypesetCoffin\lcoffin[T,l]\medskip\par%
}

David Carlisle

:-) good night

cfr

1:16 AM

@DavidCarlisle Nos da!

@DavidCarlisle Should have stuck to commenting my files bilingually.

Plergux

6:01 AM

@HaraldHanche-Olsen All days are organised TV station free. :) We watch what we want, when we want. :p

@HaraldHanche-Olsen for us, that is. :)

@barbarabeeton :D It's got pickled everything. :p Whey was a very readily available liquid for preserving food, so you can get pickled slátur (haggis) in two varieties (liver and blood); pickled meat in various guises (flanks, both straight up and pressed, and "head-jam"), as well as the piece de resistance: pickled rams testicles. :p

@cfr Bore da! :p

Paulo Cereda

7:59 AM

@cfr cwac! Oh I do, it's because there's something in the works about them. :)

ooh and quack

@samcarter_preparing_for_xmas ooh

Plergux

baa! or... bwaa!?

Paulo Cereda

@Plergux ooh welsh sheep... or welsheep? :)

Plergux

8:18 AM

@PauloCereda :p quite possibly. I was encouraging the kid to learn Danish (just started learning it at school) by getting him into Duolingo. And I thought I might as well do one myself, to remember reminding him. So I picked Welsh. :p I can say "Bore da, Paulo! Sut dych chi?" but not much more :p

"Hmmm.... I should probably redo that Zipf plot, it's a bit blurry. I wonder if I could use that pgfplots thing... Holy hell, the manual is longer than my thesis!!!" \faints

Paulo Cereda

@Plergux ooh Cymru

@DavidCarlisle meanwhile, % arara: context :)

Ulrike Fischer

9:08 AM

@AlexG I wonder if you have an idea how to set the pdf version in the tex file when using dvips?

David Carlisle

9:31 AM

@PauloCereda tell that to @yo'

David Carlisle

9:41 AM

@UlrikeFischer got rid of zzz.log so you see the real errors now in the context example overleaf.com/read/gqkyhmftnrrw

David Carlisle

10:02 AM

@UlrikeFischer looks like we failed to get that to work last time we looked at that:

Jan 19 at 13:00, by David Carlisle

@UlrikeFischer but I can't get latex-dvips-ps2pdf to work without specifying 2.0 on the commandline for ps2pdf I thought <</CompatibilityLevel 2.0>> setdistillerparams would work but it's accepted by gs but seems to be ignored (and the helpful manual for setdistillerparams says "PostScript language programs that use these operators must not assume that any particular key is present in the dictionary returned by currentdistillerparams, or that setdistillerparams has any particular side effects."

AlexG

@UlrikeFischer I ran a test with ps2pdfwr and putting, e. g., <</CompatibilityLevel 1.2>> setdistillerparams into the PS file. setdistillerparams seems to be ignored, as @David told. Also, any commandline setting via -dCompatibilityLevel=... greater than 1.7 is ignored.

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle The IoT TL images have support for all the TeX tooling available.

David Carlisle

38 mins ago, by David Carlisle

@PauloCereda tell that to @yo'

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle IoT will always be the underdog in the TeX world, it seems

David Carlisle

@PauloCereda all you need to do is set up a server using the iot images, and get 6 million people to have accounts on that server

@PauloCereda not so much an underdog, more an island.

@yo' I have context working at overleaf now, no worse than the documented platex support, just a three line latexmkrc file overleaf.com/read/gqkyhmftnrrw

@Skillmon wow regex, so massive overkill:-) I hate to think how many more expansions that takes rather than the one expansion that I suggested:-)

Skillmon

10:26 AM

@DavidCarlisle I know, but this way he can use \mythetitle everywhere without having to locally redefine \\ everytime.

@DavidCarlisle (sorry, that I don't always code for maximum performance...)

David Carlisle

@Skillmon yes I just thought it funny coming from you who quibbles about me using an extra \expandafter here and there:-)

Ulrike Fischer

@AlexG yes, sorry I should have mentioned this, I know that the "simple" things don't work, I tried them some time ago. I wonder if you saw some "new" trick. We can't be the only one wanting to set this in the postscript and not per command line (and wanting to set version 2.0).

@DavidCarlisle how does it work? Why doesn't latexmk gets confused anymore?

Skillmon

@DavidCarlisle I know, sorry for nagging here and there :)

@DavidCarlisle also, feel free to post the \unskip\space\ignorespace solution :) I promise you'll get a vote from me.

David Carlisle

@UlrikeFischer the main thing was that context doesn't seem to pick up the --output-directory flag so the log files were not being written where overleaf expected (not as I thought that the format was too bad) so now I use its --result option in place of --jobname so it writes output.log and output.pdf then just need to move them to the /compile directpry an dit all works, more or less.

AlexG

@UlrikeFischer Maybe, someone subscribed to gs-devel mailing list could ask there?

Ulrike Fischer

10:38 AM

@DavidCarlisle so a variant of "tools not finding their input in output directories"?

David Carlisle

@UlrikeFischer output directories should never have been implemented:-)

Ulrike Fischer

@DavidCarlisle like spaces in pathes. But people love them. ;-(

Paulo Cereda

@DavidCarlisle pray tell gitlab.com/islandoftex/arara/-/issues/46

@UlrikeFischer spaces between words, surely not a German trend. :)

David Carlisle

@PauloCereda This starts with the Vimtex vim package starting from the wrong place, what do people expect:-)

Skillmon

11:00 AM

@DavidCarlisle as promised.

@Skillmon :-)

Welcome, @nbro!

Hello

@Skillmon only fair to reciprocate

Skillmon

@DavidCarlisle ohh, I'm flattered :)

/blush

David Carlisle

11:15 AM

@Skillmon of course it's not actually deserved, if that helps your embarrassment. I just didn't want to be seen as unfair:-)

2

Skillmon

@DavidCarlisle you're so considering!

Ulrike Fischer

@DavidCarlisle all important packages mentioned in the tug message ;-)

David Carlisle

@UlrikeFischer ooh first place in the list

Ulrike Fischer

@DavidCarlisle sorted by age?

Skillmon

11:46 AM

Need some help about a design question. Which of the following two would you prefer?

Plergux

@Skillmon Hmmm... At first glance, the first one. But I suppose that in the second the first url belongs to Tobias but Jonathan has no corresponding one, and the ones after are the urls that they have in common. Which seems more intuitive but doesn't look as good. :p

Skillmon

@Plergux exactly my problem... :)

Plergux

@Skillmon I think I would probably rather go with "looks good" :p If people go "ooh!" and then look at the urls properly they'll see it soon enough anyway. :p

Ulrike Fischer

@Skillmon none, the names are to much to the right, they don't look centered. If Tobias name where more right, it would look less unbalanced, and then the web address would not stick out so much.

Skillmon

12:08 PM

@UlrikeFischer the gap between the names is centred, it looks unbalanced just because my name is so much longer.

Ulrike Fischer

@Skillmon yes I know. Technically it is centered, but not visually. Gaps count much less than black ink.

David Carlisle

@UlrikeFischer importance I assumed

Skillmon

@UlrikeFischer agreed. Producing third example (but first, lunch)

David Carlisle

12:24 PM

@Skillmon seriously I'd add a URL for you or (better) drop the one for Tobias. How many contact address do you need on a latex package? It will always look unbalanced if you don't use the same address forms.

Ulrike Fischer

12:38 PM

@Skillmon you should also remove the /en (or as suggested by David drop the address)

Skillmon

@UlrikeFischer well, unlike me, Tobias has a website that advertises his services as a (TeX)designer. I will not remove that link from one of his packages.

Ulrike Fischer

@Skillmon yes, I know. But you can get it from the mail address (or find the mail on the website).

@Skillmon or you could link to ctan.org/author/spratte

Skillmon

1:01 PM

@UlrikeFischer either that or just stack the authors vertically with a \medskip.

Skillmon

1:13 PM

@UlrikeFischer including a link for myself as well (the CTAN one), gives an even more unbalanced look (no matter whether I centre the gap or the block as a whole), I think I'll stick to the vertically stacked variant.

samcarter_preparing_for_xmas

@Skillmon Simply ask your co-author to change his name :) A double name should make the title look much more balanced :)

Skillmon

@samcarter_preparing_for_xmas that seems like the easiest solution indeed. But I don't consider myself a co-author. He's the author, I just do some maintaining. That might change in the future (I'm currently trying to rewrite the package), but that's how I see it for now.

4

yo'

@DavidCarlisle ~~I get compile timeouts on it?!~~ Must have been a blip, works now.

@DavidCarlisle btw, there is a clear and justified pushback to supporting ConTeXt officially, e.g. with a Menu option: when you support it, you have to support it.

AlexG

1:32 PM

@Skillmon I'd prefer this one.

yo'

@AlexG +1 @Skillmon

Skillmon

@AlexG yes, that's the one I'll stick with, thanks for the input (also thanks to @Plergux, @yo', @UlrikeFischer, @DavidCarlisle, and @samcarter_preparing_for_xmas)

Plergux

@Skillmon You're welcome. That's what this place is for, right? :p

Skillmon

@Plergux no, this place was made only to remind @CarLaTeX that there is pineapple pizza. I'm 100% sure that's the purpose of this chat.

Plergux

@Skillmon lol, no objection from me. The world needs to to know the beauty of pineapple pizza :p