TeX, LaTeX and Friends

Q: Is there a TikZ equivalent to the PSTricks \ncbar command?

@cmhughes Thanks! I'm working on a better version with an output that resembles a brace …

Great: ! Package tikz Error: Cannot parse this coordinate.

Hm, I can't get a straight vertical line. Sometimes …

cmhughes

@Qrrbrbirlbel i wonder if this one might help with your straight bars

16

Although I now use TikZ, every so often I find myself looking for very useful PSTricks commands which don't seem to exist in TikZ. The pst-node package has an \ncbar command which allows one to connect two nodes with arms dropping down, typically at a 90 degree angle. Here's an example: \docum...

tikz-pgf pstricks

@cmhughes It probably could, but I can't think straight at 3:15 am and with a cold, so …

! Package pgfkeys Error: I do not know the key '/tikz/0' and I am going to ignore it. Perhaps you misspelled it.

A: Tikz - How to overlay Decorations over longtable

1:40 AM

4

Update I guess one could produce page-breaking real braces, where the lengths of the parts on each page is calculated and this length is added to the current page y value to draw outside of the paper. (Drawing two braces with their full lengths, but only a part of them is on the paper.) Code \...

@cmhughes I've updated my answer with something to work with.

For real braces I have something very similar and simpler in mind, it's just a few calculations but it's to late to do some serious pgfing.

(I'm not good on (graphical) design, anyway, so maybe there is a more beautiful way ;))

@all What about a tikzmark tag?

or tikz-mark …

\bedtrue \bye

8:22 AM

@egreg I’ve just noticed that the newunicodechar package doesn’t work with the inputenx package. The inputenx package loads the inputenc package, but doesn’t pass the utf8 option to the latter.

@Qrrbrbirlbel The general policy has been that tags should reflect the question rather than the answer. So if a question is about tikzmark then it could have such a tag but if the answer happens to use it then not. (absolute-positioning might be a better tag)

@egreg Minimal example:

\documentclass{article}

\usepackage[utf8]{inputenx}

\usepackage{newunicodechar}

\begin{document}

\end{document}

@egreg My current workaround is something like

\usepackage{etoolbox}

\csletcs{opt@inputenc.sty}{opt@inputenx.sty}

\usepackage{newunicodechar}

egreg

9:12 AM

@mhp Thanks, I'll give a try to see what can be done

@PeterGrill as requested: tex.stackexchange.com/questions/39149/…

Joseph Wright

@DavidCarlisle That's insane

topskip

9:27 AM

@JosephWright I agree...

@JosephWright I thought it was a distinct improvement.

@Experts Just want to check something about expansion and \write. The trick with \label to get the actual page number works because the "whatsit" is expanded at shipout when the page number is known. Is that right? (Does TeX keep track of which whatsits are on which page and only do the \write corresponding to stuff that is actually on the page and not just on the current vlist?)

@AndrewStacey yes (unless it's an \immediate\write in which case it just writes the stuff at that point and doesn't make a whatsit node)

@AndrewStacey latex plays games here to get the local definition in just the right place (the \endgroup for the group with teh definition of \protect needed is added by \aftergroup which always takes a moment or two to think about

@DavidCarlisle Right, so if I want to save something to the auxfile that includes the current page number I put \thepage in the \write and don't do it immediately. But if there's something that I want in there that is known at call time (ie when the \write is assembled) then I need to expand it there and then: the \write expansion will be too late.

@egreg Another question: Do you plan to release a new version of the regexpatch package?

9:38 AM

seems like Chris (or Frank?) were scratching their head at the time:-)

\begingroup % the \endgroup is put in by \aftergroup
\let \protect \noexpand
\@resetactivechars
\global\let\@@if@newlist\if@newlist
\global\@newlistfalse
\@parboxrestore
\shipout \vbox{%
\set@typeset@protect
\aftergroup \endgroup
\aftergroup \set@typeset@protect
% correct? or just restore by ending
% the group?

There are not many places where comments survive into latex.ltx:-)

@PauloCereda Seeing the question about longtable and tikz: it's cleverly hidden in catcode changes but I've finally decoded the start of longtable. In "normal" LaTeX it reads \@ifpackageloaded{tikz}{\kill\duck}{}

@AndrewStacey Oh no! Poor duck! :)

@DavidCarlisle And people say that LaTeX is convoluted!

@AndrewStacey yes, or do an immediate\write which is simpler in some ways except latex doesnt have a protected@immediate@write (except \typeout)

@AndrewStacey It would have been easier to understand in xii dialect tikz

My coat of arms attempt. :)

Of course, not TeX-related. I'm not versed in the fine TikZ-fu arts.

9:46 AM

@DavidCarlisle But if I want to mix the two: get something known right now and the page number don't I need to delay the write?

@AndrewStacey yes

@DavidCarlisle Good. Experiment agrees (once I realised that I should use \lipsum* instead of \lipsum to avoid \par and ensure my macro was read before the page break decided).

@DavidCarlisle I can now officially add you to the list of people who have contributed to the dread \tikzmark macro.

percusse

@PauloCereda I think that's very good. If you have the tree figure I can give you the TikZ part so that's one unanswered question :)

Also we can place it inside the ones in here tex.stackexchange.com/questions/75638/…

@percusse Can't you just use an L-system tree?

percusse

@AndrewStacey Ooh wicked !

a big step for TikZ kind but no added value for the logo hence I like it :)

9:56 AM

@percusse :P

@AndrewStacey would you like to give me access to the code repository so I can reformat the tikz code in a more pleasing manner?

@DavidCarlisle We could write a command line format tex2xii :)

egreg

@mhp I must find the courage to confront with it.

@egreg: ready for tomorrow? :)

10:25 AM

Vanilla Ice nooooo! Damn you iTunes!

@egreg So many changes in the L3 kernel?

in From Answers to Packages, 12 secs ago, by Andrew Stacey

New improved \tikzmark: now remembers page numbers (thanks to @DavidCarlise).

@DavidCarlisle bazaar.launchpad.net/~tex-sx/tex-sx/development/files

11:00 AM

@AndrewStacey ##################################

egreg

11:23 AM

@PauloCereda Yes, but I have the seminar in less than 3 hours. My rep now is a palindrome in base 100: 129912

@egreg Wow! :)

1:22 PM

@AndrewStacey tikzmark is growing :D

But this is what I get with your example, it still uses the position on the current site rather on the imaginary outside of the paper... but nonetheless, the library will be helpful.

Uhh, my mistake ...

@Qrrbrbirlbel Hope so! I put this bit in after seeing that question so if it isn't useful in answering then it needs changing!

I guess, what I was expecting to see, was something like:

%\immediate\write18{tex tikzmark.dtx}
\documentclass{article}
\usepackage{tikz}
\usetikzlibrary{tikzmark}

\tikzset{
  next page=below,
}

\usepackage{lipsum}

\begin{document}
\tikz[overlay,remember picture,ultra thick,red] \draw (pic cs:a) -- (pic cs:b);
A\tikzmark{a} tikzmark

\lipsum[1-4]
\lipsum[4]
\lipsum*[4]
\tikzmark{b}%

\lipsum[1]
\tikz[overlay,remember picture,ultra thick,red] \draw (pic cs:a) -- (pic cs:b);
\end{document}

@Qrrbrbirlbel Do you mean that you were expecting to see that as the example or that you expected the example to produce that code?

(By "example" I mean tikzmark_test.tex)

@AndrewStacey Well, one of the lines already used pic cs:d on the other page, I was expecting to see a line that completes the path on the other page.

I should have read the code before complaining, though ;)

@Qrrbrbirlbel Ah, I see. The second line was to show that when the code was on the same page as the coordinate then the extra page-handling stuff didn't get in the way. (This was purely for myself - I frequently write code with only the vaguest idea what it will do. Then I test it. If it doesn't do what I expect then I start changing it. If it does, I wait for someone else to complain.)

So anything with _test.tex in the Launchpad directory is just that: my testing file. I put them in as examples of code for others, but they aren't particularly meant as exemplary examples.

1:37 PM

Hm, the next page key is interesting:

\documentclass{article}
\usepackage{tikz}
\usetikzlibrary{tikzmark}
\tikzset{next page=right}
\usepackage{lipsum}
\begin{document}
\tikz[overlay,remember picture,ultra thick,red] \draw (pic cs:a) -- (pic cs:b);
\tikz[overlay,remember picture,ultra thick,green,next page=below] \draw (pic cs:a) -- (pic cs:b);
A\tikzmark{a} tikzmark

\lipsum[1-4]
\lipsum[4]
\lipsum*[4]
\tikzmark{b}%

\lipsum[1]
\tikz[overlay,remember picture,ultra thick,red] \draw (pic cs:a) -- (pic cs:b);
\tikz[overlay,remember picture,ultra thick,green,next page=below] \draw (pic cs:a) -- (pic cs:b);

You should include something like “If it doesn't look right, compile again, at least twice.” in the documentation. :)

I have the feeling that all my hard work from yesterday was for nothing. Your library will replace 80% of my macros :D

@Qrrbrbirlbel "If at first you don't succeed, run pdflatex, run pdflatex, and run pdflatex again."

@AndrewStacey By the way, the .dtx asks for your _example that at least I couldn't find in the directory. I just ignored it, but it may prevent others of using it.

@Qrrbrbirlbel Good catch. I'll add the picture.

@Qrrbrbirlbel I don't think so - I haven't studied your code in depth but most of the drawing stuff will be the same, won't it?

@AndrewStacey I'll have to rewrite some stuff because your \tikzmark doesn't take any additional placement options …

I'm also not so pgf-ish to write every option as an /key/ :(

I already put my \tikzmark in the margin, I can still do this but I don't know if it'll work with the page-remembering stuff...

(but first: food)

Can this be combined with something like atbegshi so that you don't have to re`\draw` the stuff on every page?

2:01 PM

@Qrrbrbirlbel The optional parameter can be whatever drawing stuff you want, such as \coordinate (something) at (somewhere). The point of not putting that in is that without it one can use the mark before it is defined (on the second run) but the stuff inside can only ever be used afterwards. My thinking was that you use the coordinate provided by the \tikzmark as the "origin" and then in the drawing command you would do any shifting necessary.

@AndrewStacey Yes, of course, that should work, too.

@Qrrbrbirlbel That would be worth investigating, certainly. It would be nice to have a method that didn't need repeating but noticed that it was using coordinates from different pages and inserted stuff on every page in between.

@AndrewStacey Either way, it is certainly outside of my skillset. :(

3:10 PM

@AndrewStacey If I write \tikzmark[\coordinate (aa) at (-1em,0);]{a} where will (pic cs:a)be?

3:20 PM

Hm, I don't like the output of the bracedecoration :(

@Qrrbrbirlbel (pic cs:a) will always be at the origin of the saved picture.

@Qrrbrbirlbel What don't you like about it?

@AndrewStacey It works better with a bigger amplitude.

Compare with amplitude=.5em

Maybe I'll re-add my inital "brace"

3:50 PM

@Qrrbrbirlbel Pick your favourite.

@AndrewStacey How?

It still has to look good if the brace is very long, doesn't have to scale with the length ... (or you can only add maybe two to three braces in the margin)

Hm, the placement of the node over the middle part is weird.

4:16 PM

@PeterGrill !

@DavidCarlisle Yeah, I should not have given you the idea about posting the xmas tree!!

@PeterGrill I got a badge for that as well:-)

@DavidCarlisle What!! There is a badge for getting more rep than me!!!

@PeterGrill No for resurrecting dead trees (Necromancer)

Is it just me, or is the "c" too close to the "t" in $y = c t H(t)$ .

4:29 PM

@PeterGrill Nuh, $y = c \, t H(t)$ does look better.

@DavidCarlisle Hey, but I am still in the top 10 (now that you promoted me to a mathematician)..

@Qrrbrbirlbel Yeah, but found it strange to have to do that in this case.

@Qrrbrbirlbel Depends which one you like best. 1, 4, 5 are done with my calligraphy package. 2 is the "standard" brace decoration. 3 and 6 are huge delimiters.

@PeterGrill it does look a bit close (compared to the H which gets a kern before the (. TeX isn't doing anything here though this is the font metrics at play (or rather not at play as no special kerning is specified for ct or th) There are other math fonts to try....

@DavidCarlisle Haven't delved into switching fonts --- been saving that for when I need to procrastinate and don't have internet access so can't TeX.SE.

@PeterGrill on the other hand what's it supposed to mean c\ times t \times (H(x)) ?

4:38 PM

@DavidCarlisle Huh? Are you trying to demote me from being a mathmatician now??

A product of c, t, H(t)?

Mathematicians always define c = 1 anyway.

@PeterGrill just trying to check whether the c t H are intended to be separate identifiers or whether it's a mult-letter identifier "ct" (in which case you are using the wrong font)

@AndrewStacey Oh, no, not a multi-letter variable. (and c=1 most of the time, but not necessarily).

@AndrewStacey I'm testing your braces now. Apart from some error messages relatex to spath it has some better braces (although the line width option doesn't work)...