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9:00 PM
Because it's compact @Charlie.
Because by definition charts must be homeomorphisms to open subsets of Euclidean space.
In calculus we are sloppy and "parametrize" the circle by $[0,2\pi)$, but that's not a manifold chart.
 
Heya Ted
 
Hello professor
 
Does anyone know: If $R$ is any commutative ring with identity, what the elements of $U(R[x])$ look like in general?
 
Isn't it the same as $U(R)$?
 
I think it's any polynomial with a unit in the constant term and a zero divisor as the leading coefficient, but it might be a bit different. Idk
 
9:15 PM
precisely those where the constant term is a unit in $R$ and the other coefficients are nilpotent
 
This is any commutative ring, so you can have zero divisors, which I think makes it more complicated.
Couldn't you have an idempotent as the leading coefficient?
 
you can't
well, unless it's $0$
 
I believe you. How do you go about showing it? What details might I be missing?
Also, lol
leading coefficient is always 0
 
$a_1,...,a_n$ nilpotent implies $a_1x+...+a_nx^n$ nilpotent implies $a_0+a_1x+...+a_nx^n$ unit as sum of unit and nilpotent element
for the other direction, you can do some ugly induction tinkering or do it the cool way by looking at the polynomial mod every prime ideal
 
Oh, the cool way sounds cool
 
9:24 PM
It is!
 
@TedShifrin ahhh of course thank you vm
 
So, we're modding out by the nilradical, in a way?
 
Drew a Riemann surface for my complex analysis assignment
 
you've finished real analysis, already?
 
That was in first year. I am in third year now.
 
9:34 PM
oh
 
Can't say I have learnt too much real analysis though
 
Balarka only does probability now
 
Tis true
Random geometry on random manifolds
Friendship ended with Gromov. Kolmogorov is my new friend
 
@Alessandro I think you'll be waiting a while for such a conferene
conference
 
9:39 PM
I don't think there's anyone interested in set theory here
it's all
differential geometry or number theory
 
nobody in Heidelberg does Grothendieck universes?
topos theory?
 
Our Alg2 lecturer introduced Grothendieck universes before he started category theory
 
see
thats set theory
 
hahaha
 
do you guys happen to know what an $o$-minimal structure is
 
9:41 PM
no
 
good
 
rofl
aight it's 23:40, time to start studying
 
3:12 here
boii
 
alright sorry mate, didn't know it was a competition
 
also i heard you're smoking again
 
9:42 PM
I'm smoking to get my nicotine supply until my new e-cig arrives rofl
 
i quit cold turkey
been 2 months since my last cig
 
that's cool man
Congrats
 
its also been 2 months since my throat felt normal
 
hahaha when you smoke so much throat aids is your new normal
 
yeah man
this sucks
 
9:44 PM
It takes time to adjust
 
i am having to replace smoking with gargling with antiseptics
how do people smoke like
10 years
2 years of a pack a day destroyed me
 
I enjoy the e-cig, it's far less carcinogenic than smoking and it satisfies my need to be doing something with my left hand while crying over psets
 
yeah its definitely more of an oral addiction/habit thing
 
They become hardened then die.
Face it smoking kills
 
aye, there's between 8 and 20mg of nicotine in a cigarette and I usually have 6mg in a full tank of liquid and never experienced any craving for cigarettes
 
9:47 PM
yup
it was very easy for me to quit psychologically, but my doctor could immediately tell me throat was going through withdrawal somehow
i dont get cravings at all
 
maybe a pack a day wasn't the best idea lol
 
tbf in Germany you can get packs of 40 and I went through a "pack" a day before switching to e-cig
 
@BalarkaSen more or less
why?
 
definition of a smoker is at least 10 pack years, where a pack means 20 cigarettes
in my country we have 10 cigarettes a pack
so technically im not even 1/20th a smoker or whatever
 
does smoking make you productive in math?
 
9:50 PM
all astronomical numbers to a non-smoker
 
@Thorgott yeah lmao
@Stupidquestioninc no lol
@EdwardEvans fuck dude
 
if I have a pack of cigarettes nearby I just chain smoke, regardless of how sick it makes me feel lol, it's definitely psychological
0 self-discipline
 
yeah its highly psychological
 
Yup
 
thankfully I haven't developed any form of heart issues (even tho I had been smoking at that level for about 5 years), and that's probably due to the amount of cardio I do, but my lungs scream if I stop cycling for like a week
facepalm
 
9:53 PM
how long have you been smoking
 
err
8 years
 
so you're not a smoker yet
 
hahahaha
 
you can quit, but dont go cold turkey like me maybe
its just not even about dying
everything kills
but i refuse to die because of a throat ulcer on steroids
 
yeah changing to e-cig for like 6 months has been crazy good; got my lung capacity back to a level that supported cycling up a mountain
but it's obv still not as good as just
not inhaling anything but fresh air
I'll just start sniffing glue instead
 
9:55 PM
e-cigs are definitely a level up, as is cycling in the mountains
where i am right now its always massively polluted
back in university the air used to be much cleaner
 
ah yeah
 
@EdwardEvans lmfao
 
lol staying at home to avoid corona induced respiratory problems and you end up getting respiratory problems from staying at home
 
i know a dude who pushed smack and then sniffed glue
 
damn
 
9:56 PM
his hands started melting, he said
@EdwardEvans EXACTLY
 
Starting young makes it harder to quite
again, psychological
 
its very easy to quit cigarettes. its hard to find a good reason as to why one should
i have found it; i am not planning to die sudden death due to oropharyngeal cancer
there are better ways to die
 
sounds like an extremely good reason
the cravings will never completely go away
 
did you use to be a smoker, skull?
 
10:04 PM
yup
 
makes sense
 
innocent fervent non-smoker
 
wb professor
 
Tanx
 
Hi @Ted
 
10:06 PM
hi @Ted
 
Hi, Edward and a Balarka
 
@skull the cravings are somehow due to association. if you do X while smoking very frequently, then quit, doing X will induce craving
at least thats what i have found
 
True, in the beginning...
 
@EdwardEvans what title?
 
The L-Function and $\varepsilon$-factor of a cuspidal representation of $\operatorname{GL}_2(F)$ and the converse theorem
 
10:11 PM
ah yes, "the converse theorem" because it's the converse to some theorem
quality naming
 
rofl
 
Probably an elementary topology question here: let's suppose I have a separable metric space $X$, and let $(x_n)_{n=1}^{\infty}$ be a dense sequence in $X$. My professor writes: $\forall \epsilon > 0, X = \bigcup_{n=1}^{\infty}B(x_n, \epsilon)$. Where can I find a reference for this result?
 
@Leaky that's just the title of my seminar talk tbf
 
@Clarinetist that's basically the definition of the sequence being dense
 
No reference, @Clarinet. Just one moment of thought.
 
10:13 PM
and also visualization
 
You could do contradiction if that's more intuitive.
 
K, I will have to sort through these definitions lol. Gosh. I really wish I had taken topology in my undergrad. My classmates are freaking out too.
 
This is just basic analysis, no topology.
 
huh, proving it directly is more intuitive to me
@Clarinetist it's very important to visualize the definitions
 
@Clarinet: What does dense mean (to you)?
 
10:15 PM
My prof had to remind us on Friday that every open set in $\mathbb{R}$ can be written as a union of open intervals.
I'm looking up the definition in Munkres
 
what course is this?
 
It's a measure theory class
 
Sounds like no one in your class has taken undergraduate analysis.
 
Meant for probability
 
it's just a bunch of formalizations
just memorize the results and forget the proofs
 
10:16 PM
Statistics majors often have no math background.
 
every open set can be written as union of balls, in any metric space
 
It's unfortunate, but it's quite true. You can get through the MS degree with linear algebra, calculus, and a lot of persistence @TedShifrin
 
In between every two numbers there is another
 
But if you're going to take measure theory to take graduate level probability, you need to fill in the prerequisites. You and all the rest of the horde.
 
I felt like I had a very strange background in my MS program because I had taken some analysis. Several PhD students hadn't taken any.
 
10:18 PM
@skull: "in between" is great for $\Bbb R$, not so great otherwise.
 
it's also true for Q
 
growls and snaps at Thor
 
So Munkres says here that $A \subset X$ is dense if $\bar{A} = X$. So if I'm understanding that, $\bar{A}$ is the closure of $A$. Now I gotta look that one up...
 
All this stuff should have been in undergrad analysis, at least in $\Bbb R$, if not in general metric spaces.
 
So the closure of $A$ is define as the intersection of all closed sets containing $A$
 
10:20 PM
If you have a point that's at least $\epsilon$ away from all the $x_n$, then it cannot be in the closure of $\{x_n\}$.
 
The treatment of metric spaces I had back in my second-semester real analysis was terrible, I'm just being honest
 
Better to think about limit points, @Clarinet. You're doing metric spaces.
The closure is the union of the set and its limit points.
Munkres ultimately proves that.
 
huh?
 
Theorem 17.6 in Munkres, thank you @Ted. So the closure of $\bar{A}$ is equal to the union of $A$ itself and the set of its limit points.

Thus, in the case of these dense subsets of $X$ denoted $(x_n)_{n=1}^{\infty}$, we know that their closures must be equal to the unions of the $x_n$s themselves as well as their corresponding limit points, resulting in those open balls.

I think that's right?
 
10:28 PM
@thorgott bad joke
 
Well, it doesn't result in open balls, @Clarinet.
 
@LeakyNun might get it
 
But did you read my sentence about 10 things up?
 
Had a feeling I was missing something there.
 
@BalarkaSen I don't
 
10:29 PM
oh come on
what rock do you live under
 
@BalarkaSen sad story about his brother :(
 
@Balarka, I don't know about Leaky, but I have been crushed under Trompolini rocks.
 
Yeah, if you have a point that's at least $\epsilon$ away from the $x_n$, it can't be in the closure of the $\{x_n\}$, so what you have as a result are open balls of length $\epsilon$ around each $x_n$
I think
 
You don't have open balls as a result of anything. I'm arguing that every point must be in that union.
 
@skullpatrol hm yeah i didnt know this
 
10:30 PM
@BalarkaSen you replied to a message about Q with a link containing the word "rational"?
 
thats not just "a link"
thats eliezer yudkowski's website
 
Directly, @Clarinet, if you take any ball of radius $\epsilon$ about an arbitrary point $x$, it must contain some $x_n$ (that's what being a limit point tells you). But this means, then, that $x$ is in $B(x_n,\epsilon)$.
 
Here's what I'm going to do - I'm going to finish scribing this lecture and probably just spend this week actually doing quality work on topology. Miraculously, I managed to finish my HW a week early (will have to check for typos soon), but it's really clear I'm going to have to get some of us together to spend a few nights reviewing topology. I need to understand these terms better and it can't wait much longer.
It's also really clear that I'm going to need to know much more than the basics.
I really wish I could have taken topology in my undergrad. It was only offered once every two years at my alma mater.
 
Measure theory can get intimidating with nested unions and intersections and infs and sups, so be prepared.
 
10:36 PM
@TedShifrin I'm aware of that. I did some reading on lim infs and lim sups this last summer. Perhaps I'm wrong, but I suspect the prof I have has opted to skip that material
It's really odd to me how diverse measure theory w/probability books are with the intro material
 
Well, I meant infs and sups, not liminfs and limsups, but ...
 
Some texts go all out into outer measure and the like, whereas others skip it entirely
Some texts cover $\pi$-systems and $\lambda$-systems, others don't
 
Those I've never heard of. Maybe that's a probability thing.
 
@TedShifrin I gather that they are. Same with Polish spaces.
 
Measure theory is simply a very technical subject
 
10:38 PM
Which I also had not heard of before you mentioned it here.
 
@TedShifrin Maybe you know them as Dynkin systems?
 
Yeah, I like integration theory, but I've never been fond of measure theory.
I only know Dynkin from Lie algebras, @Alessandro.
 
If I vaguely know what a Haar measure is by the end of the semester I’ll be happy
 
I'm sure the $\pi-\lambda$-theorem was in my probability II class
 
It was not in any of my probability courses. I learnt it in first year while I read Durrett
 
10:39 PM
yeah, those system thingies exist
I managed to do measure and integration theory without learning what they are, so probably not that important
 
Anyway, I've definitely had an appreciation for how tough this subject is now. It seems like you'd have to really know what you're doing if you're teaching this class given how different approaches can look. I can appreciate how difficult that is.
 
I read measure theory exactly once in life. It's surprisingly easy to avoid the details.
 
I learned it all for my analysis qualifying exam first quarter of grad school.
 
I honestly thought I was just incompetent given the fact that I have... what, 20 measure theory books in my shelf, have tried to read them, and often couldn't get past the first chapter
 
Same, @Clarinetist. I read measure theory off of the appendix of a probability book
 
10:41 PM
I don’t even have 20 books
 
It is impossible to read a measure theory book
 
@Clarinet: I'm sure you're at least as competent as the orange, narcissistic dictator.
 
a Haar measure is a non-trivial measure that is left-translation invariant, finite on compact sets and inner and outer regular
 
Lol @Ted
 
Ty I’m happy
 
10:41 PM
now if only I knew how to actually construct them
 
You do something with the countable basis of compact sets at the identity
 
something I always wanted to learn, but never got to so far
 
Actually what is regularity
 
I'm baffled at how difficult it is to read a measure theory book. Lots of people write such books like they're encyclopedias, like Billingsley
 
It should be like how one constructs Lebesgue
 
10:42 PM
The last three conditions are usually compacted into the single adjective "Radon"
 
@BalarkaSen watch me read Bogachev some day
 
@Thorgott You're not a human you're a mutant
 
Let's read Fremlin together @Thorgott
 
Gremlin
Two Gremlins reading Fremlin
 
Anyway, thanks all. I'm going to get back to scribing this lecture and taking some time after to dig in and understand the details
 
10:43 PM
@EdwardEvans Inner regularity means that the measure of a set is the sup of the measures of the compact sets it contains
 
translation: you can jiggy wiggy from the inside
 
I don't wanna read Fremlin
 
Outer regular you want the inf on the open supersets
 
F E D E R E R
 
I see
 
10:44 PM
^ this is how the book actually looks
 
I've read some segments on Fourier analysis in Fremlin and found them to be awkward
 
Basically you can approximate the measure of stuff by looking at simple sets
 
Federer, more like, no
 
Of course inner regularity is much more interesting when paired with "finite on compact sets"
 
Federer Ch 1 is actually pretty ok
I never read beyond that
 
10:45 PM
this is all extracted from the construction of Lebesgue measure right
 
I'd much much rather read Krantz&Parks Geometric Measure Theory
 
I would much rather not read GMT
 
no wait, it's called Geometric Integration Theory
 
F̸͍̭̑̊̒̃ ̴͎̤͘͠E̸̙͔͒̒ ̸͙̘̲̎̑̀́͜ͅĎ̶͐́̊͝ͅ ̴͇̺͍͂́̈́̓͑E̸̢̳͂͋͌͝ ̷̝̪̈́̓R̸̝̆͑̽̈́̀ ̴̦̞͇̯͕̍̐͗̀̔E̵̢͖̼̤̐̈́̿̚ ̴̰̪̱̋̀̍͌Ṙ̶͚̑͌
That's how the book actually looks
 
lmao
 
10:46 PM
@AlessandroCodenotti tbf everything in this Book seems to be done algebraically
 
Hahah
 
Which is strange given it’s a book on algebraic number theory
 
there is no numbers
theres only number fields
 
Haar measures are automatically positive on open sets
 
I'm 99% sure that all you need to know about Haar measures is that they exist for locally compact groups
Who cares about their construction
 
10:47 PM
Right
 
This is cool, because it's equivalent to null sets having dense complement
 
Why would you even need to know about locally compact groups
Compact Lie groups bois
Riemannian volume form
 
Their definition is „a right Haar integral is a linear functional satisfying axioms“
 
I think you can write down the Haar measure on a Lie group explicitly in some slick fashion rather easily
something something invariant forms
 
semisimple Lie group I can
 
10:48 PM
Ah yeah there's a correspondence between linear functionals and Radon measures
With adjectives on both sides
It's like the dual of $C(X)$ is some space of good measures for $X$ nice enough
Very precise statement, I know
 
Ok I need to sleep
Bye everyone
 
Left Haar integral is a non-Zero linear functional from the space of compactly supported locally constant functions on G to C satisfying some axioms
 
Oh wait Haar just have to be left invariant
Yeah I can do it on any Lie group
 
Aight night @AlessandroCodenotti
 
10:50 PM
cya, pal
 
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/… that's the thing I was trying to say
 
For a LCH space $X$, $C_0(X)^{\ast}$ is isometrically isomorphic to the space of complex Radon measures on $X$
 
Like every theorem named after Kakutani it is a scary theorem
 
Nerds
 
this doesn't look that scary
it's in Folland
which makes me think it's accessible
 
10:52 PM
Nah that's actually very reasonable
It's obvious that there should be some relation between measures and integration-like functionals
 
yeah
 
So there should be some theorem of this form
 
I was reading about projective varieties
 
what does "integration-like" mean
isn't it every
 
If you have $(X, \lambda)$ a probability measured space and you look at all a.c. probability measures on this space that's exactly the same as continuous functionals on $X$ which integrate to $1$
You'd imagine this extends somehow
 
10:55 PM
Now if you space is nice enough this space of measure is metrized by the Prokhorov metric
And convergence in this metric is weak convergence
 
@Balarka that sounds more like Radon-Nikodym to me
 
Which ties in with the fact that the unit ball in the weak topology is metrizable even though the whole dual isn't I guess
 
@Thorgott yeah thats RN
 
but Riesz rep is about functionals on $C_0(X)$, not $X$ itself, that's the difference (I think?)
 
That’s a lot of Slavic names
 
10:57 PM
right yeah
 
I should read Folland
 
i asked alessandro a long question in my first year about all these arrows between these various spaces and he told me "Riesz-Markov-Kakutani"
i dunno man these are nice but how do i use it to prove stuff you know
 
I have no memories of this
Not without my lawyer
 
If In doubt, follow your nose
- Gandalf in the mines of Moria
 
i misread "Gandalf" as "Gelfand"
 
11:00 PM
Hahaha
 
Ok time to sleep
bye
 
LOL
good night
 
11:23 PM
Hello guys, I've got a question. In proof that is relying on induction, does the inductive step have to work for the base case of the proof as well?
 
rephrase
 
let's say we are dealing with a proof by induction, then show that P(0) holds, then in the inductive hypothesis assume that P(i) holds for i = {0, ..., n} for some n and then in the inductive step we use an argument that if we would plug n = 0 (i.e, P(0)) then we get something that is not in the inductive hypothesis (i.e., P(-1))
would this be considered to be a flaw in the proof, or since we have the base P(0) and we showed it holds, it will be considered valid?
 
Good evening everyone!
 
OK, no, that's not how inductive proofs work
you prove $P(0)$ as the base case, yes, and then for the inductive step, you must prove the implication $P(i) \implies P(i+1)$
This proves $P(k)$ for all $k \in \mathbb{N} \cup \{0\}$. Can you see why that works?
 
Quick question: is this just floating-point error, exp(x) approximation error, cos(x) approximation error, some combination of these, or what? desmos.com/calculator/9wvgqabq3y
I decided to try and just work on improving my existing approximation.
Ok I'm convinced that's probably just FP error down at 10^-15 there
 
11:47 PM
@JoeShmo Yes, I understand this part, I am just a little confused about the case (edge case?) I mentioned above
 
I'm not sure what you're talking about above
 
Sorry, let me try to clarify
 
perhaps an example of a proof you're stuck on would help
what you said is most certainly not how inductive proofs work.
if it helps
 
Sure, I am going to try and write it up
 
For those of you who are familiar with topology, are precompact sets generally covered in a first course in general topology?
I can't find this concept in Munkres.
 
11:51 PM
I don't even know what that is
 
compact closure
 
I have no idea what that is, @Clarinetist, and if it's not in Munkers that's telling
 
i think we discussed precompactness in the small amount of functional analysis I did at the start of this semester
 
Holy cow, so my prof IS bringing in stuff from functional analysis. He did mention a few things from there -_-
 
(so it's probably not relevant for a first course in topology)
 
11:52 PM
Ah, I see
just say compact closure, that's not too long
 
well
 
topology already suffers from too much terminology
 
a precompact set is one whose closure is compact
compact closure is probably a stupid thing to call it
 
@EdwardEvans Do you have suggestions for a functional analysis book for complete idiots? Lol.
 
no, I mean just say "subspace with compact closure"
 
11:53 PM
I see lol
@Clarinetist I had a literature reference from the course
 
I'm busy trying to remember which separation axiom T3.4957298475 was
 
I'll look it up again, there's a standard reference
 
there is no functional analysis for complete idiots
 
there is no functional analysis
it's a scam
 
y?
 
11:54 PM
D. Werner Functional Analysis
idk if that has an English translation
 
rudin
 
TIL that Rudin has a functional analysis book
How in the world did he have that much time
 
if Grandpa Rudin is for idiots, I wanna be an idiot
 
relinks the 2000 page topology notes
 
@JoeShmo If we are trying to prove for example that $T(k)$ represents the equality $i^k = 1, i \neq 0$. Would the following proof fail for $i = 0$ ($T(0)$)? Here is the proof: BS: $T(0): i^0=1$ is certainly true. IH: Suppose $0 \leq j < k$. IC: Note that $i^k \frac{i^{k-1}i^{k-1}}{i^{k-2}}$ by exponents rules, thus, $k = k-1+k-1-(k-2)$. Now, turn you attention to $k-1 < k$ and $k-2 < k$ so we can apply our IH and get $i^{k-1}=i^{k-2} \Rightarrow i^k = 1$
 
11:56 PM
no no, I said before that there is no functional analysis for idiots
 
Anyway, I really wish this measure theory prof would just keep to one textbook. As I type this, I have about 15 textbooks out, mix of measure theory and topology books
 
Satz 5.4. Sei X ein Banachraum und sei T ∈ L(X). Dann the Spektrum σ(T)
ist kompakt und satisfies
looool
this was in my functional analysis notes
 
lol why?
did prof have a thick deutsch accent?
 
I study in Germany and the prof was German
lolk
 
dann the Spektrum ist kompakt lmao
 
11:59 PM
oic
 
und satisfies
 
und satisfies
I will never be able to write and satisfies ever again, thanks.
 
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