Good morning all. If anybody knows if I can ask questions related to GPU and AMD Crossfire on main site? Or should I ask on SuperUser?

@Vikas SuperUser would probably be better ye

Can we discuss pc hardware in this room? Or not recommended?

@Vikas Sure.

Okay.

So friends I just came to know that there's actually a difference (apart from integrated GPU) between 5600G and 5600X processor. There isn't much performance difference in gaming, but I just came to know 5600G don't support PCI 4.0 parts like ssd and gpu which have PCI 4.0 standards

Now I want to know, is PCI 4.0 common in present? Or PCI 3.0 still okay?

And all GPUs have both 3.0 and 4.0 options or latest and future GPU will only have 4.0 standards?

@Vikas it is the new standard, so the GPUs in a year or so will likely be PCI 4.0

@Nzall So I feel buying 5600G isn't a good decision because I will have limitations in upgrading later? (Now I'm surprised people on YouTube easily say you can upgrade desktop easily). If I want PCI 4.0 gpu in future (maybe they launch some cheap GPUs with 4.0), so I would have to replace my processor too! 😯

@Vikas I honestly am the wrong person to ask

Okay, but after knowing this PCI truth, I feel my decision might not be good.

I thought I would be settled for 4-5 years once I build pc with 5600G.

Honestly, I recommend you go to a dedicated PC build help site like the /r/buildapc or /r/pcmasterrace subreddits on Reddit

Because this is getting way to technical I feel

And they will be able to help you better

Like, there are way more dedicated sites for hardware that will have experts who don't need to Google every question you have

😛 👍🏼

Nzall a simple question: That day you said just to choose a fast enough RAM. Did you mean choosing fast in terms of MHz?

If you type @Nzall it'll actually notify him so he sees you messaged him.

The way you did it he could miss it.

@Vikas Yes, but technically it's not MHz, it's Mega operations per second. But that's just a technical difference. If you're going for an AMD CPU, you want something that's fast enough, because the difference in speed between the lowest of 2133 and a more acceptable 3200 or 3600 can be as much as 20%

In testing, they've generally seen that for the 5600G that you want, 3200 speed is best

Beyond that, if you got a choice, you should look at the timings (the ##-##-##-## values you see listed) and go with lower there, but this matters a lot less than the speed itself

@Nzall Okay. I just checked what I had shortlisted. I've already shortlisted a 3200 MHz DDR4 Ram. Should be fine?

And what's timings? Is it marked on RAM?

@Vikas should be fine. where the timings are listed depends on the RAM module, but you can generally find them on the manufacturer website

Which ones do you have shortlisted?

@Nzall module means? RAM or the motherboard RAM slot?

@Nzall this amazon.in/HyperX-3200MHz-Desktop-Memory-HX432C16FB3/dp/…

Another choice is: Corsair Vengeance LPX 8GB

both 3200 Mhz, looks same

Because there's something you should keep in mind: some RAM manufacturers have resorted to a hidden downgrade on their RAM where they use half the RAM chips per module but with double the capacity, which may end up hindering performance greatly

ah

That is EXACTLY one of the chips I was talking about

kingston.com/dataSheets/HX432C16FB3_8.pdf

If you look at the images on page 2, you can see that the HyperX modules only have memory nodes on 1 side

Ideally, you want to avoid that

@Nzall And what about this? amazon.in/CORSAIR-Vengeance-1x8GB-3200MHZ-Desktop/dp/B07PNW4Q3F/…

They've done tests and it can reduce your performance by about 20%

oh

Also, I just checked you need to check timings using an application. so I think I can't check it before buying

@Vikas no, the timings are listed on the Amazon listing

oh, wait, I'm mistaken

You need to look up the timings on the manufacturer's site

The Corsair ones are 16-20-20-38

which is pretty good AFAIK

@Nzall Uhm I still don't get it. You mean those golden pins are only on one side?

@Vikas The golden pins are on both sides

It's the black rectangles I mean

@Nzall Yeah, but

let me check again

Those are only on 1 side

It might be easier if you compare them to the ones with 16 modules: kingston.com/dataSheets/HX432C16FB3_16.pdf

@Nzall oh yeah I can see that now. So it reduces speed when it's only one one side?

yeah, often significantly

That's a video on the topic

@Nzall will see

@Nzall 1 black square = 1 module? The black square is called module?

Not a single youtuber told about this thing. But I guess if I opt for those rams which have both sides rectangles, it would be very expensive?

@Vikas yeah, those black squares are the memory modules. they're effectively the memory, the rest around it is just there to make the modules work

oh okay

@Vikas not necessarily

I thought those golden pins are memory 🤣

No, those are the connectors

yeah makes sense

are you sure 16 module is better than 8?

oh wait

my bad

Yes, 16 modules are better than 8

BUT

I misread

?

That one with 16 modules is a 16 GB RAM stick , not an 8 GB stick

@Nzall Oops!

So 8 gb can never have 16 modules?

I have no idea, I think it depends

I think it depends on the brand etc

hard to say

I'll check the video you shared, maybe it clears

The LTT video is also about a different type of RAM, which is smaller in form factor and specifically designed for laptops

okay

In those, the difference is between 4 and 8 chip modules, not 8 and 16

let's ignore that video then

yeah, probably

wait i'll watch it anyway, will learn something

@Nzall Okay, I saw the rams he shown. I think you were somewhat right about those modules on one side and both sides

@Vikas yeah, and you'll see the fast stick has 8 modules instead of 4

because both rams were 8 gb and one has 4 modules and other has 8

@Nzall so is it possible i can find an 8 gb ram with 16 modules (that is both sides)?

@Vikas I don't think so, because those modules are already 1 GB each. It's just that specifically for SODIMM, the RAM stick format for laptops, they created special double size modules so they can reduce the height of the stick in case they have tight space requirements

@Nzall I am understanding the concept now . . .

I think RAM sticks with 16 modules are generally 32 GB sticks or 16 GB sticks, likely not 8

yeah

i'm trying to understand 1xR8 and R16 right now

Nzall I think 1Rx16 means less chips and 1Rx8 means more chips in simple terms?

Provided memory size is same.

Yes I was right! 1Rx16 means less chips means more compact and less speed @Nzall if I understood correctly.

Yeah, the x8 and x16 reference to the density of the RAM per rank

cool.

Ideally you want 1Rx8 RAM sticks

Google should be able to tell you if a stick fits that profile

@Nzall means?

Amazon has given this information on product page

ah, okay

but not availabe with Corsair ram

@Nzall Also, if you use dual channels rams, one has 1Rx8 and other is 1Rx16, will they work?

I have no idea. it probably will work, but the speed might be problematic

yeah could be issues

Have you ever build pc?

No, not yet

I'm planning to sometime late 2022/early2023

That explains memory ranks

You generally want more ranks

@Nzall lol you must be waiting for gpu

@Vikas yeah, exactly

I'm a bit pessimistic so . . .

I'm hoping GPU prices start to clear up around the time the Geforce 4000 series and Radeon 7000 series are out

@Nzall won't 4000 be even more modern and expensive?

Also I didn't know 4000 is coming

@Vikas potentially, but it'll also be faster

Yeah, Nvidia and AMD release a new generation of GPUs roughly every other year

Okay, I'll hope that 1660 prices drop around that time

I'd recommend to not pin your shopping list to a specific brand or model of GPU. There might be a better upcoming GPU for a price you can afford, depending on what the manufacturers are working on.

@Vikas yeah, it should

@Nzall most expensive thing in my build right now would be cpu and motherboard. I don't worry about other stuff much as they are not costly.

Intel GPU are also coming next year

yeah, that too

thing is

if I look at the performance leaks for the next couple generations of hardware, they're just mental

Talking about 50-90% faster performance from one generation to the next

mental?

you mean intel are ultra fast?

No, both AMD and Intel are having massive improvements

ok

it's just that the speed increase for the next gen when compared to the current gen is on a scale we have rarely seen before

i wonder why intel is so late in all this

I'm not sure

Intel has long been languishing on their 14nm process

but they now have an improved version of their 10nm process with special tech, and it appears to slap

also I feel, next 5 years will see significant change in gaming as compared to last 10 years. I feel games will be in 3d or virtual reality after 5 years. So we can't plan a good future proof pc at all

@Vikas yeah, exactly. well, not the 3D or VR stuff

if we see 2010 era, I don't see significant change till today. just the graphics has improved. but in next 5, they can be much more significant change .

But I have been recommended by enthusiasts to not go for a 2000 EUR computer to last 6-8 years, but rather to get a 1000 EUR computer to last me 3-4 years, and then after that another 1000 EUR computer to last another 3-4 years

Because according to rumors and leaks, 2020 is gonna be a massive decade in terms of performance

@Nzall I also learnt this lesson from my current laptop. I bought expensive laptop but during the pandemic i realized it's overpriced and i'm stuck with it. instead i should have bought a cheaper yet powerful gaming laptop. which would also last same.

Dell is so expensive and less powerful

asus would have been cheaper, reliable and powerful

@Vikas NEVER EVER buy Dell

@Nzall Sure. Never again.

Dell is fucking overpriced as hell

@Nzall Dell is actually really popular in corporate environments since they have really good warranty and support services for businesses.

yeah, my work monitors are all dells