The Bridge

@GnomeSlice It's usually not directly picking on someone (though sometimes it is). It's mostly just "Trash team" and stuff like that before they ragequit

Ave

Yes!

Wrigglenite

1:09 PM

I'll always recommend Terraria as a co-op game

GnomeSlice

@MechMK1 what kind of games are you both into?

Ave

Borderlands 1/2/TPS are all AMAZING

MechMK1

@Jutschge I'm not such a fan of Gearbox

Sterno

Though if the team is failing and they hear a female voice, you get a lot of comments about female gamers

Ave

but yeah gearbox is a pain

Wrigglenite

1:09 PM

Divinity Original Sin 2 is fun too

MechMK1

We did play Terraria and Minecraft. It was a lot of fun

Yuuki

@GnomeSlice Yeah, the other thing is that even if you have a toxic person in your game, if they're in your group they're more likely to direct toxicity towards someone else rather than someone in their group.

MechMK1

we're waiting for GTFO to be released

Jutschge

@Wrigglenite This games destroys friendships in COOP :<

GnomeSlice

@Sterno yeah.. my girlfriend stays out of team chat even in QP

Mostly just everyone wants to talk to her lol

MechMK1

1:09 PM

I loved Payday 2, before...well...the thing happened

Sterno

Like seriously I can't believe how much anti-women and racist shit kids say. The weird part is I don't think most of them are like hardcore racist or anything... they just like saying shit to troll people. Which I guess is still racist, but I think you know what I mean

Wrigglenite

@Jutschge Not as badly as Monopoly

Yuuki

@GnomeSlice Yep, pretty sure my sister only uses group voice chat.

Jutschge

In divinity 2 we always combined poison flasks with red dye and then we gave the "healing potions" to others

MechMK1

@Sterno I understand you. My girlfriend constantly gets annoyed in TF2

"Are you playing medic just so you can heal your boyfriend?"

Ave

1:10 PM

ahh, this conversation reminds me that I'll get harassed when I stream publicly again

which is always fun

twitch chasers > *

Wrigglenite

Always good to be reminded that people are the worst

GnomeSlice

@MechMK1 lol. Well.. my girlfriend plays Mercy just so she can heal me 😛

MechMK1

Man, people...

@GnomeSlice My girlfriend is actually quite a skilled medic, and always tries her hardest to heal even the least skilled players

Sterno

And as soon as you're like "Hey, maybe you could not be a sexist asshole" the response is "OMG ARE YOU WHITE KNIGHTING SHE ISN'T GOING TO SLEEP WITH YOU DUDE"

A) She's my wife, so she probably will
B) No, I just don't like assholes

GnomeSlice

@Sterno hue

MechMK1

1:12 PM

But for some reason, every server has ThatOneSoldier™ who thinks the medic only exists to heal him, and he will scream at the medic constantly until either a.) the medic leaves or b.) he gets tired and leaves.

Sterno

In Overwatch, ThatOneSoldier is ThatOneGenji

GnomeSlice

TF2 sucks

@Sterno or hanzo

MechMK1

@GnomeSlice :(

GnomeSlice

@MechMK1 I stand by it lol

Ave

Hanzo switch pls

MechMK1

1:13 PM

I like it

Sterno

"Yeah, I know I'm in the back line and their entire team is between you and me, but could you please run through them all to heal me so I don't need to take 2 seconds to pick up the health pack"

GnomeSlice

I tried to get into that game a long time ago and yeah the community was terrible and the game just didn't do it for me

Ave

there's some amazing maps

GnomeSlice

Personally

Ave

It's a fun game

MechMK1

1:14 PM

TF2 has quite a steep learning curve

It has its flaws, yes

Frank

@MechMK1 Maybe a different solution, but have you tried MMO's?

Or have I missed that somewhere in the transcript?

Sterno

I thought TF2 was just a hat-wearing simulator now

GnomeSlice

Titanfall 2 held me as a multiplayer shooter for a loooong time. Overwatch too

MechMK1

Yes, and it's not really for us

Jutschge

I'm just godawful at shooters. I only play Warframe and Borderlands (and those are PVE/Coop)

Frank

1:15 PM

@Sterno With the occasional shooty bits.

MechMK1

@Sterno No, the game is still very active. This entire "tf2 is all friendly" is a meme

Frank

@MechMK1 My wife and I love RPGs, so FF14 is a natural fit for us.

Sterno

I haven't played TF2 since people were still too dumb to spy check

MechMK1

My gf isn't into it, I asked her

Yuuki

@MechMK1 And ThatOneSoldier also rocket jumps like a maniac expecting the Medic with literally no mobility to stay attached.

MechMK1

1:16 PM

@Sterno Which is why KP_3 binds to classswitch Pyro for me :D

GnomeSlice

@MechMK1 do you guys normally play shooters?

What about destiny?

Or the division

MechMK1

@GnomeSlice We played some KF2

GnomeSlice

Killing floor 2 I assume?

MechMK1

Yes

GnomeSlice

It's okay. Gets old

Solid for a while though

MechMK1

1:16 PM

Left 4 Dead 2 as well

Yuuki

Destiny 2 is going partially F2P so you could give that a try.

GnomeSlice

Takes too long to progress

MechMK1

Eh, I really dont like the way Destiny is designed

I avoid loot boxes wherever I go

Jutschge

Another fun game I can recommend is Vermintide 2. It's Left 4 Dead in the Warhammer universe

GnomeSlice

Do you like story/adventure games?

MechMK1

1:17 PM

Yes, we did play it

GnomeSlice

A Way Out was amazing. Played that with my girlfriend

MechMK1

I actually like it a lot

Yuuki

@MechMK1 Like... the cosmetic engrams?

MechMK1

We played part 1 a lot

GnomeSlice

We're partway through Beyond Two Souls as well

MechMK1

1:18 PM

@Yuuki Yes, just in general loot boxes and MTX wherever they are

My thing with Vermintide 2 is that it just gets repetitive quick

We got it when it came out, and like a week later we had all the missions done

GnomeSlice

My roommate was extolling The Division 2 to me for a while

Yuuki

Doesn't DBD have a cosmetics shop?

GnomeSlice

And he only plays co-op

Ave

I have a problem with microtransactions

GnomeSlice

With his buddies

MechMK1

1:19 PM

Yes, but the cosmetics there are horrible

Ave

so! I don't avoid games with microtransactions / lootboxes

MechMK1

Like, artstyle-breakingly horrible

Frank

Monster Hunter is where it's at.

Jutschge

@Frank Agreed

Yuuki

@MechMK1 So... microtransactions are okay as long as the quality is terribad?

MechMK1

1:20 PM

The thing is, we played DBD long, long before MTX were added

GnomeSlice

The Division 2: 20 Minutes of Co-op Mission Gameplay - IGN First

►

MechMK1

And if the developers promoted them more aggressively, I would have stopped

Just like I stopped Payday 2 after they promoted lootboxes

Yuuki

@GnomeSlice I haven't played that in a really long time.

GnomeSlice

@Yuuki it looked really good

MechMK1

To me, Lootboxes and MTX are always a big negative, and a game has to be very compelling for me to accept them as part of the game

GnomeSlice

1:20 PM

I watched my roommate play it a few times

Yuuki

IIRC, the specializations didn't feel all that great. And the numbers game takes a bit to understand.

MechMK1

If the game incorporates them into its progression, as e.g. battlefront 2 did, then it's an absolute no for me

GnomeSlice

Nintendo is doubling down on making developers disclose loot box drop rates

MechMK1

Depends on how specifically they do it

Do they need to disclose every single item? or are "categories" enough

Sterno

I like KF1 better than KF2

MechMK1

1:22 PM

Because if I have a 0.01% chance of getting a legendary skin, that doesn't mean I get a legendary skin for a character I play, or even the skin I want

GnomeSlice

@Sterno killing floor 1 felt way too dated to me even when it was released

Frank

@GnomeSlice Sure. But all the numbers make people's eyes glaze over.

GnomeSlice

@Frank oh no, it's one of those?

Frank

And even there, it still can be misleading, depending on how it's presented.

For example, the Gundam Builders game for mobile follows the classic gacha model, and does disclose the drop rates.

But makes it super hard to tell what the real chance is; loot quality is divided by percentage, and then by item.

Somehow, those percentages go above 100%, and the disclaimer even says so.

MechMK1

Probably because of some "the chances are tailored to each individual player" kind of thing

Frank

1:30 PM

@MechMK1 Then it's not accurate data, and there's no reason to show drop rates to begin with.

MechMK1

Absolutely

But these companies do those things out of legal requirement, not because they want to

Lazers 2.0

0

Q: Japanese words that Recette shouts when place item

What Japanese sentense/phrase that Recette shouts when place an item in her shop? I hear the words nani-kuo-sen-me .... a-do---- ni? What is it? This is nagging me for several years. If possible, please answer it Japanese character. You can hear it at . (1...

recettear-an-item-shops-tale

MechMK1

As far as I know, china requires loot box drop rates to be disclosed

Frank

@MechMK1 And false data doesn't meet those legal requirements.

Otherwise, they could just say the super rare item everyone wants has a 99% chance to drop, and yet, nobody gets it.

MechMK1

No, but they can add a lot of fine print, which, if analyzed carefully enough, may disclose the item

@Frank And this is the crux of the argument: Who exactly verifies that those things are correct

They could publish what players have received, but then again who says that that is the truth

Frank

1:33 PM

Right now, nobody; it's taken on trust.

MechMK1

Which is why I find this lootbox model completely abhorrent

I pay for a chance, not for a product

Invader Skoodge

Lootboxes are a plague.

8

Frank

And that's the problem; publishers are cracking down on showing those drop rates, but trust the developer to be honest about it.

The, "self-regulation" is an attempt to head off real regulation, with real legal repercussions.

MechMK1

I honestly doubt that publishers do this of their own free will

They make way too much money off of it

Frank

@MechMK1 And will make exactly none if countries outlaw them entirely.

MechMK1

1:34 PM

I think Nintendo is pushing for it because they can see the gambling regulation coming in

@Frank Which I am all for, to be honest

Frank

So, yes, they're doing it because it keeps the gravy train going.

@MechMK1 Oh, don't get me wrong; so am I.

MechMK1

If there is any way for players to buy loot boxes, directly or indirectly, then they should be outlawed

Frank

Loot boxes can go die in a fire.

MechMK1

I mean, I am trying to stay on the "lootbox" side of things, not necessarily politics. Sorry if I dragged the conversation off-topic

Frank

→ 28 messages moved to This Is Fine

No worries; I did, too. Nothing wrong with it, just gotta move it.

MechMK1

1:44 PM

It's the first time being active here, so please forgive me if I don't know the etiquette here

Frank

@MechMK1 It's fine. We just try to keep politics out.

MechMK1

Understandable

It's a sensitive topic afterall

Frank

It tends to get a bit heavy when it's discussed, so it drags things down.

MechMK1

To speak more about videogames, has anyone played Cultist Simulator here?

How did you like it?

Invader Skoodge

@MechMK1 I haven't but I'm really interested in it.

MechMK1

1:47 PM

I can highly recommend it

Even though the start is a bit rough

Yuuki

@MechMK1 A bit. It's weird.

Took a few do-overs until I figured out what I was doing.

MechMK1

Yes, I think the choice of having no tutorial at all was not very good

Or the choice to not being able to pick your legacy freely

Yuuki

Not sure I like the timed aspect.

MechMK1

That you lose a coin every minute?

Unionhawk

earlygame osrs ironman money making is fun :)

I love thieving

good skill

(I do unironically love being able to make way more money now than I ever could as a kid lol)

MechMK1

1:53 PM

It's so unreal

As a kid I got 25€ per month and now I get 100x as much and it feels so weird

Yuuki

@MechMK1 Among other things. I'd prefer a turn-based system.

MechMK1

Yes, the constant pause unpause can be a bit weird, but I have gotten some good moments out of it

Jutschge

@Unionhawk Earlygame Ironman is the best. Also questing as an IM

You actually have to use shops. It was such a weird experience

MechMK1

For instance, when I had some notoriety on the board and my evidence was about to expire. And I quickly started painting with it to "hide" the notoriety from the detective

Unionhawk

about to finally be a mithril champion minus the shield plus an adamant sword :)

(and buying runes for mage and hopefully the rune scimitar)

Jutschge

1:57 PM

iirc I never had a rune scimmy. I just went for the longsword and DScimmy after

GnomeSlice

@MechMK1 must be nice

Jutschge

I might have one now from slayer. But I definitely haven't trained with one.

Aaaah I should play again. I actually might do some slayer tonight.

MechMK1

@GnomeSlice 9 hours a day take its toll, and if you have to pay for all living expenses of 2 people, the amount of money left at the end of the day isn't that much

Unionhawk

yeah that's 17k in like half an hour, way more money than I've ever had on this account

HAM stores are powerful

and smelly because the guards keep raw chickens and anchovies in their pockets apparently

Jutschge

Ardy knights must be the richest guys in osrs. I mean they literally get pickpocketed for a couple of billion gold per hour

Frank

2:03 PM

@MechMK1 Yeah, I know what you mean.

Nzall

@Unionhawk I like making a lot more money too, but I tend to be somewhat wasteful with it at times

Like, I don't even blink at spending 15 EUR on Sushi for lunch

Though I don't do that every day

Unionhawk

I like that two separate people decided to disconnect that from above context lol

Nzall

but yeah, I do tend to easily lose sight of how much I spend at once

Unionhawk

or accidentally did I suppose

Jutschge

Yeah I was just thinking... Isn't he talking about osrs?

Unionhawk

2:07 PM

I do also like having real money

Jutschge

TIL @uni makes his money IRL from thieving

Nzall

oh, you're talking about a game

Elva

@Unionhawk or just didn't at all see the context! :p

Nzall

It's quite different in games: I don't like farming or grinding for ingame money, so I tend to end up broke quite easily

Jutschge

@Nzall In rs it's pretty fun. In WoW I'd be broke if there were no customers for M+ boosting

Unionhawk

2:09 PM

This gamemode is way different so I get to experience a different piece of content that I never touched on main

Jutschge

I never farmed gold in WoW.

Lazers 2.0

1

Q: Rimworld: Changing colonies seems wasteful?

Im still new to the game, but I seem to get a lot of "so and so needs help over at X location" which seems to usually require me uprooting my colony to live elsewhere. I've done this a few times and honestly it seems like a waste. Does it make more sense to stay put or what? Because the game see...

rimworld

Jutschge

@Unionhawk how much HP do you have atm?

GnomeSlice

@MechMK1 I work full time as well, but I make less than that. I live in a shitty basement

Jutschge

I can really recommend Wintertodt for ironmen. You'll get a ton of money and 99 doesn't take too long

Actually 99 FM is probably the quickest way to get an obby cape equivalent on an IM

MechMK1

2:13 PM

@GnomeSlice Depends on the job, and on the company. I'd change jobs in a second if it meant earning less, but having better work-life balance

Nzall

@Jutschge I loved WoD and Legion because it was trivial to get massive amounts of gold from your garrison and your order hall. And then in BfA there are no such easy methods to make gold

So I end up either having to buy tokens to stay afloat, or fly around Nazjatar for 15 hours to get the same value

Jutschge

@Nzall You can always flip stuff in the AH

It's boring but effective

And not really a lot of effort required

Nzall

@Jutschge My server is low pop, and on the low edge of low pop AFAIK. Flipping isn't really feasible if you don't have the market for it

Unionhawk

@Jutschge 24, I know I should do wt but I literally can not be asked

plus you also need to have higher levels for the loot to be worth anything?

that minigame scaling with your hp is stupid

Jutschge

@Nzall I mean you can build a monopoly if you do it right :P On our server a guy from my guild managed to do it

Unionhawk

2:18 PM

hit the level 3 hcims with a 10 imo

Jutschge

He literally controlled the AH across 3 lowpop servers. About 120m gold

Fortunately we got a discount lol

@Unionhawk the loot is pretty much always worth it. Sure you could go for higher fishing/herblore but from 50-99 you'll get a ton of stuff anyways

I did it with 15hp. i think you can have up to 17 or 18 for the lowest damage.

But man I've seen a lot of HCs lose their status there in that time lol

Unionhawk

good

Nzall

Especially considering how at least on my server, there are not really any profitable flips. Benthic gear basically takes a dump on crafted PvP gear for new alts, so that market is basically ruined; Gems are worthless on my server; Enchants don't really have the same impact now that it's just 4 slots at most; And every single Flask and potion is valued below the price of the herbs needed to make it

Unionhawk

I do have a house now so I probably should do it

but ugh

Jutschge

It's actually not as bad as I initially thought. FM was my first 99

Unionhawk

2:22 PM

It's pretty bad

Strength on main will probably be my first

Jutschge

On my main my highest skill is 86 afaik

kinda sad lol

Nzall

Like, Flasks are consistently selling at 50% material value

Jutschge

@Nzall I mean you can still buy everything and sell at a higher price if there's not that much going on

What server do you play on?

Nzall

Kor'Gall EU

And that won't work if you need to buy 160K worth of Flasks and need to repost them for twice their price just to break even

theunderminejournal.com/#eu/korgall

Lazers 2.0

0

Q: Folders & plugins minecraft server, cant delete files

I cant delete maps or plugins on my server, its keep comming back when i restart the server, help me

minecraft hosting server-administration

Memor-X

2:50 PM

whelp, Windows has updated and it only took like 2-3 hours

maybe next time i should reschedule it to a weekend so it'll run while i'm on a console

Invader Skoodge

I had my work laptop (mac) force update in the middle of me interviewing someone a few weeks ago.

It was not ideal.

Mage Xy

Anyone try the new No Man's Sky update that came out recently (Beyond)? I think the devs did a pretty good job improving the game since its rocky launch. I've played around 20 hours on a new save and I'm maybe a quarter of the way through all the content (I'm guessing)

It's a little grindy, but in the same way Minecraft is, IMO. You set your own goals and have to figure out the most efficient way to achieve them.

Memor-X

3:07 PM

yeh i'm torn whether to get the game or not. if i get it i validate devs promising the world, releasing shit and making it better over time

Elise

@Memor-X I don't think you're validating anything by getting it at this point

they promised a great game, didn't deliver, you didn't buy it. The game is good now, so you reward that by buying the game now

pretty sure it's also cheaper now than it was at launch

SaintWacko

@MageXy I just bought it after this update and I'm really enjoying it

Nzall

@Memor-X If you look at it from a different perspective, you're promoting devs owning up to their mistakes, putting in effort to make things right and making amends with their community.

3

Mage Xy

3:35 PM

The devs released all the updates for free, which to me shows good faith. They knew they messed up the launch, and they spent a lot of effort adding in the missing parts. While I think they could have handled the botched release A LOT better (by not lying about included features, for starters), I'm neutral toward the company now because at least they put their money where their mouth is and continued updating the game to where it is today.

Yuuki

@MageXy cough cough Anthem cough

Frank

Yay. Recruiter contact, manage to get range out of him, it's insultingly low. Bin opportunity.

Lazers 2.0

3:50 PM

0

Q: I can't update minecraft to 1.13 ios

My Minecraft on my iPhone is still on the 1.12 edition and i would like to update it to 1.13 but I can't because it's not showing that I can update it. this is really annoying. please, can someone help?

minecraft-pocket-edition

Yuuki

Ah, so this is how conspiracy theorists start.

Dragonrage

PSA: Docker is magic

Yuuki

I click on a bunch of space/astronomy-related articles and now Google is suggesting "'UFOs' are coming out of black holes and altering galaxies forever" by Fox News.

2

@Dragonrage Some of my co-workers are actually having problems with Docker right now.

Although I think that's mostly because our internet here sucks.

pppery

No one said that magic has to work 100% of the time

Mage Xy

Or that magic was a good thing to begin with :)

Dragonrage

3:57 PM

@Yuuki they need to receive more dark arts training

Yuuki

Part of me wants to click on that Fox News article just to see how crazy it is, but I don't want to wind up tumbling out of a rabbit hole spouting off about how the Russians secretly engineered the drastic fall in the quality of Bioware's recent games.

Unionhawk

I mean I could have told you that

GnomeSlice

@Yuuki I read tons of space stuff and I've never seen that one lol

@InvaderSkoodge lol uh..

You can't stop it?

😅

Saw some people talking about Cultist Simulator. Looks like Underhand on mobile. Huh.

That game was okay, I don't think I beat it though

Invader Skoodge

4:14 PM

@GnomeSlice No it just literally shut down as I was typing.

GnomeSlice

That's what you wanted though, right? Apple knows best

😁

DOOM eternal to have even longer campaign than DOOM 2016

Yuuki

GnomeSlice

18-22 hr estimated

@Yuuki lmao

Mage Xy

@Yuuki whoa wtf I just posted that to my work's slack channel like 30 seconds ago. Are you hacking my computer? xD

SaintWacko

@MageXy Nah, you guys both just found it on Reddit :P

Mage Xy

4:24 PM

Gasp, Reddit at work? I would never! I am a professional after all

covertly closes firefox tab

Yuuki

4:45 PM

FYI for anyone who loves chicken sandwiches and also has a moral compass: Popeye's chicken sandwich > Chik-Fil-A.

Unionhawk

It's so good

Yuuki

Although they appear to have given me the regular and not the spicy.

Which is a minor disappointment.

Unionhawk

it's also not under Fair Food Program boycott like Wendy's

and is better than that one too

I thought the chicken discourse was overhyped but no

Yuuki

@Unionhawk Isn't that because Popeye's doesn't use tomatoes (to my knowledge)?

Unionhawk

@Yuuki I mean that and also because Wendy's is just the current target

them and kroger

even YUM brands are on board (though the scope of that is just taco bell)

Invader Skoodge

4:50 PM

There's a Lidl supermarket near me that has had union protesters outside literally every day since it opened like 8 months ago.

I don't think it's doing anything.

Unionhawk

UFCW is pretty hit or miss but they hit pretty hard in Boston with stop n shop

they just also miss pretty hard a lot

Invader Skoodge

I wonder if whatever this "Fair Food Program" is doing to Wendy's is similar, because I haven't ever heard of it before right now.

Unionhawk

So, yes, in that this style of corporate campaign is usually not the most effective

It's gotten a handful but it's not surprising that it's kind of stalled out with Kroger etc

Yuuki

I imagine that corporations wouldn't exactly help publicize union victories.

Unionhawk

Whole Foods was a big get though

they've been helping expand the program outside just tomatoes

also that there is a town called union, nj is NOT helping my google searching

thanks google for correctly associating "UFCW" there, not helpful this time

Invader Skoodge

4:56 PM

Union is also a county in NJ.

Unionhawk

I eventually found it, "ufcw" in the search probably helped

Lazers 2.0

5:09 PM

0

Q: Having an issue with Cid’s weapon upgrade quest?

So, I decided to start playing FFXV again after a 2.5 year break...and I have 3 quest in my quest list for Cid to upgrade weapons. Went and got the items for it, yet he still just goes through his rotation of sayings when I got to talk to him. I noticed I don’t have the weapons in my inventory th...

final-fantasy-15

Lazers 2.0

5:49 PM

0

Q: Tablist problems!

i got problems with my taglist, when im in game: My Tablist only show white names, i have do the prefix & surffix as you can se in the chat on the picture.

minecraft-server minecraft-console

0

Q: Roblox - Symbol associated with other users names?

While playing Roblox my son and I started to notice the symbol below associated with some users names: I can't seem to figure out or locate information on what it means. Even weirder: When I tried to copy it off the webpage the symbol won't highlight as text or a graphic, my HTML isn't good ...

roblox

Yuuki

6:24 PM

> I hear Canadian fast food is particularly bad for your health.
> You gotta watch what you poutine your body.

cc @GodEmperorDune @Wipqozn @Ash

Unionhawk

ooo I think I have a use for some c# 7 sugar

nice

(specifically, I think I get to use if (thing is MoreSpecificThing specificThing), which does the is check and casts it in one stroke)

Frank

@Unionhawk And if it can't be cast to to MoreSpecificThing?

Unionhawk

Then it doesn't try casting and returns false

moving on to the else here

murgatroid99

@Unionhawk And then within the if body you have a reference to specificThing which has type MoreSpecificThing?

Unionhawk

@murgatroid99 Yep

Mage Xy

6:36 PM

It's nice because unlike the as keyword, you don't have to check for null, it's all handled automagically.

Unionhawk

Yeah, is checks to see if a cast is possible (and then does it if you give it a variable name like this too), as tries to cast it but returns null if it can't, and straight casting it errors if it can't

there are situations for each really

Mage Xy

I think (but can't verify atm) that straight casting is the fastest of the three, with the downside that it errors if done incorrectly, like you said

Unionhawk

I believe so

I'd have to find that section in Jon Skeet's book again

Wipqozn

@Yuuki Excellent

Tim Stone

Probably, but as and a cast are both single opcode operations

Unionhawk

6:50 PM

I'm glad I'm out of pluralsight credit because my eyes were glazing over going through IL stuff in advanced C#

Transcript for