The Periodic Table

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

10:14 AM

@Jasmine for being confused? :)

Piomicron

1:55 PM

Is there a place I can find biologically important, newly-discovered small organic molecules with chirality?

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

2:32 PM

-9

Q: Why does Mithoron keep putting questions as off-topic?

Whatever question I ask, he put the question as off topic.I don't know why.If I ask what is crystal lattice and tag solid-state,he will put that as offtopic.I wonder if he has no other job.Compared to the questions he downvotes, he answers very less.Please save me from mithoron.

discussion

Hnhhhnhnhnhn

Sorry, I shouldn't be laughing.

. . .

paracetamol

Gives @M.A.R. a noogie

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

HAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA

paracetamol

Jul 12 at 13:23, by paracetamol

> Please save me from mithoron.

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Gives @para a punchy

paracetamol

Reels from the punchy

rt.com/news/433598-ap-misquote-isreal-nukes

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

2:35 PM

SAVE ME FROM @MITH

paracetamol

Hmm, can't seem to find any videos on Iran by Boris :3

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Throws @M.A.R. a rope

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

@paracetamol Mith is an H NMR peak, not IR peak

paracetamol

._.

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

@paracetamol nomnom thanks

Oh God this keyboard is sure gonna get some getting used to

paracetamol

... rope laced with rat poison

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

2:37 PM

You should be a painkiller not a pain in the ass

paracetamol

Touche ;-)

rt.com/usa/433572-democrats-trump-putin-translator

> What did Trump promise Putin? Bring his interpreter to Congress & find out, Democrats insist

XD

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Ah, politics

I wouldn't wanna start an argument that I feel would go awry

paracetamol

It's a charade, not politics :P

Moot point, I know ^

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ I know that feel :3

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

@Martin-マーチン Was that someone that comes to chat?

I should have a little talk with them

paracetamol

<--- Just posting a few (interesting) articles as I see them O:)

rt.com/usa/433577-us-army-emoji-fail

> ‘Trigger happy killers’: US Army gets furious response after it tries to celebrate Emoji Day

@M.A.R. Don't want a discussion on it, but I think you might like reading this one: rt.com/op-ed/431630-uk-skripal-case-failure

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

2:54 PM

@paracetamol Meh

Opinions opinions

paracetamol

O:)

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

In the end, 80 of the people that make the news are arseholes

The other 20 percent don't make the interesting news anyway

paracetamol

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Only?

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

I am being generous today

paracetamol

I see X3

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

2:56 PM

240 percent?

paracetamol

^ A wee bit too much? :3

I was thinking 99.9%

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

You're reading the wrong newspapers then

paracetamol

On re-reading that, I should've just stuck with "arsehole" ._.

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Every now and then, you find your faith in humanity restored by someone doing something good

@paracetamol Yeah you really like going Xrated

paracetamol

Like...when you give me half your rep? O:)

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

2:58 PM

Although you should be careful when others are around

paracetamol

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Purses lips

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

@paracetamol No you be the good guy

paracetamol

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Point

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ I was...never the good guy...

Gazes forlornly out the window

Wipes a tear

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

So you're that serial downvoter

paracetamol

Eh? What downvoter?

And no, no I'm not XD

I mean...there's always someone who downvotes my posts, but I assume you're talking about something more recent?

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

3:01 PM

@paracetamol Smart move, downvoter

paracetamol

X3

Hmm, no mention of a serial downvoter on meta...

._.

^ Just in case you're actually serious XD

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

As serious as I may be, I can't see that image

So I'm gonna assume the worst about it

paracetamol

._.

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

i.stack.imgur.com/NmhMp.jpg UR FACE

paracetamol

:O

Hides behind a towel

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

3:07 PM

Now that's better. We're neutralized

paracetamol

I see X3

@M.A.R. Know what "Twelve Months" sounds like in Estonian? >:-D

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Sounds like a year?

paracetamol

Try telling that to the Estonians X3

(Hint: Use Google Translate)

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Should invite one to chat first

paracetamol

translate.google.ae/…

X3

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

3:10 PM

Facepalm

paracetamol

(Click the "Lisen" button)

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Fufufufu :3

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Such dreams I had for what you could become

paracetamol

So did I :3

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Well I did become a dialysis patient

And you're still wasting time on the internet

paracetamol

Buys next ticket to Tabriz

Convinces self to donate a kidney to @M.A.R.

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

3:12 PM

Buying tickets is not an achievement

paracetamol

But getting a dialysis is? ;P

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

@paracetamol Ew no I don't want that

XD

@paracetamol Yes.

I see! :O

3:13 PM

Life noob

I am level 49 in life now

paracetamol

Whimpers

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Hmm...

Drinks water

Takes a leak

Drinks again

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

And I have legendary items

paracetamol

Repeats cycle

...to farm life xp

Gets to lvl 200

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Good luck with that

paracetamol

Thanks :3

rt.com/news/433608-vida-subasic-victory-bus-fall

What a goal X3

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

3:17 PM

Tip: If enemy used sarcasm attack, the best response is another sarcasm attack

Not gullibility shield

paracetamol

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Bu..but..my guileless chest-plate does a pretty good job at defence :(

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Your feelings armor still gets a hit and needs repairing

paracetamol

True, but I only need a stick of shashlik and a hug to repair that...so not too worrisome O:)

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

No hugs or protein foods in boss levels though

You won't make it past the first boss: Internet troll

paracetamol

But, I can just summon a second troll, and the two can duke it out while I stroll past :3

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

3:23 PM

That's a level 24 magic spell

You get it after beating the third boss

College professor

paracetamol

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ True, but you can also summon it if you have a lvl 3 in summoning ;-)

runescape.wikia.com/wiki/Summoning

gateprep

What is a first order phase transition?

paracetamol

57

Q: First and second order phase transitions

Recently I've been puzzling over the definitions of first and second order phase transitions. The Wikipedia article starts by explaining that Ehrenfest's original definition was that a first-order transition exhibits a discontinuity in the first derivative of the free energy with respect to some ...

statistical-mechanics resource-recommendations phase-transition symmetry-breaking

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

@paracetamol Traitor

paracetamol

I had no choice, I swear! :'(

@M.A.R. Then again, you can always dance your way past bosses :3

Dschinghis Khan - Moskau (lyrics)

►

Mithoron

3:54 PM

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ I did actually laugh on this meta post :D

Gaurang Tandon

4:07 PM

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ it was me ;) IIRC i flagged a couple of such comments on that day

Bounty Hunter

4:20 PM

2

Q: What is the mechanism for the oxidative cleavage of diketones via permanganate under basic/hot conditions?

The products of the reaction are carboxylates. What exactly would cause the alkyne to cleave?

reaction-mechanism organic-oxidation

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

6:08 PM

OK so

I dunno why I'm confusing myself, but this doesn't seem to work out

So the pKa of H3O+ is -1.7.

10^(1.7) ~ 50

And 50 moles per liter of H3O+ would make up the whole liter

But this doesn't make sense, since the solution should have as much hydronium as water

I feel stupid

Dangit, where am I going wrong with this?

gateprep

7:23 PM

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ

Can u explain me why we Relate themodynamic potential with volume during phase transition?

Anybody

@Abcd If you are active and willing u may answer also..Basically I have know @M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ though chat before thats why I mentioned him..

Abcd

inactive ,not willing to answer, please don't ping me with questions from above high-school level stuff.

I dont know all that college stuff and I told you that before as well

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

7:58 PM

@gateprep Does this help you? Other than that, I don't know or have forgotten about phase transitions

Mithoron

8:11 PM

So happy nobody pings me for hw-dumps :>

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Huh? 55 moles of water. There's only tiny amount of hydronium

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

@Mithoron At a pH equal to the pKa of hydronium?

@Mithoron Mith I haz question pls

Mithoron

Gah! Me eyez! :D

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ There's no such pH

Unless maybe in things like superionic water

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

So you can or cannot have a solution with as much H3O+ as water?

Mithoron

In normal water there could be maybe 10-15 moles of H3O+ per liter

In strong acid with low molar mass

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Hmph

So the flaw in my reasoning was such a condition doesn't exist?

'cause at pH -1.7, the molar conc. of H3O+ seems impossible

Mithoron

8:18 PM

There was this high ph wait a sec.

86

Q: Is a negative pH level physically possible?

A friend of mine was looking over the definition of pH, and wondering if it is possible to have a negative pH level. From the equation below, it certainly seems possible—just have a $1.1$ (or something $\gt 1$) molar solution of $\ce{H+}$ ions: $$\text{pH} = -\log([\ce{H+}])$$ (Where $[\ce{X}]$ d...

acid-base equilibrium ph

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

@Mithoron rereads

So basically, Greg's answer says "don't calculate in high concentrations you idiot"

To me, I mean

Mithoron

Pretty much

this mention of -3.6 is pretty silly though

With pH lower then 0 one should rather use Hammett H0 function

Mithoron

8:36 PM

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Why did you think about this 55 mole acid though?

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

@Mithoron Just came to mind

I'm gonna revisit Clayden now that I'm free from ridiculous university entrance exams

And patiently study it.

I saw the chapter on acids and it came to mind

Man I've forgotten a lot!

Mithoron

Hmm, with ionic water there could be indeed very high conc. of H3O+

Under high pressure and temp. weird things happen

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Maybe I should have posted something on the main site? Haven't posted in a long time

Mithoron

Dunno

I've spontaneously answered on M&TV SE today

only 1 upvote but a bit of fun

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

That stuff gets weird if you answer for upvotes

One post now and then and it's pure fun

Mithoron

8:42 PM

Hmm, this rep. thing is total failure of system

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Nah, lots of induced excitement for little whine

The pros outweigh the cons by a large margin

Unless the atmosphere becomes "oh no SO is too harsh", which it does become from time to time

Mithoron

Pretty sad those votes are only tangentially related to quality

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Pretty natural humanity of the votes so, I guess one of the things we have to accept

All you can do is educate, and the few people that are educated make a bigger difference than you think

Because they're usually the regulars.

OK, I wanna post the question. Maybe I should keep it in the form of the seeming contradiction I posted @Mith?

Mithoron

I don't think so still didn't get that

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Get what? The seeming contradiction?

Mithoron

8:50 PM

Umm, what was it all about :D

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

So, if we can achieve pH -1.7, there will be more than 50 moles per liter of H3O+. This means with a density of around 1, you get that the whole solution is H3O+. Although it should be half the solution since pH = pKa.

So either whatever anion of strong acid is present has dramatically increased density

Which is unlikely

Or something else has happened

Like Trump Putin summit

Wait, OK, now things make more sense

Mithoron

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Well yeah that's pretty much why you can't have such acidic solution

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

If the equilibrium is shifted and the acid is no longer so cool, maybe such H3O+ concentration is possible?

Nah, still weird

@Mithoron So no way you can have that?

Even with a damn lot of HClO4?

Mithoron

Well, if there was some weird stuff like (H3O+)2 BeF4 (2-) crystal

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Dang that's so cool

Mithoron

8:57 PM

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Well the thing is as you add acid you get to equimolar and then you have more acid then water

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

@Mithoron It's just the calculation doesn't seem to work out

Mithoron

Acid still gets stronger and stronger but pH is getting lower

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

We are at the equivalence thingy

And I just can't think of a scenario with a 55 mole per liter H3O+

I'm like a chemist chasing his own tail

Maybe I should just blame it on the logarithm. It produces too many decimals

Stupid mathematicians with their functions

Mithoron

Well, if acid had lower molar mass then water, and there was volume contraction... But afaik there's no such acid

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

BTW, I still haven't gotten to watch Infinity War

Mithoron

9:02 PM

There's HF with molar mass about equal to water, but it's unusual

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ I watched but bad quality

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

@Mithoron VTC as a duplicate of water

@Mithoron Oh, I never watch in less quality than 1080p

Patiently wait 18 hours for the film to download with Iranian internet

Mithoron

Hahaha

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

That's like spoiling the film for yourself

Mithoron

Well, I could download hd version in an hour, but only dumb headcam or other was there

And the movie isn't particularly good either

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Aw come on. Next you say Inception wasn't good

People keep looking down on superhero genre but I prefer a film like Logan to most other dark films

Mithoron

9:08 PM

Well, Logan was OK

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Holy crap, then what's a good movie in your opinion?

Mithoron

Hmm...

:DD

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Boyhood was very good

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Haven't seen it

Yeah, sounds like a very good movie

Adding it to my list

Mithoron

Well, I'm getting more and more picky with age :D

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Have you seen any of the new Planet of the Apes movies?

Mithoron

9:14 PM

only first, I though for some time to see rest

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

@Mithoron Well, I'm personally a grumpy critic, but I call those great movies, and a meh movie can be a good movie in my eyes

Mithoron

I'm very grumpy :D

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

@Mithoron Oh man, you're missing out. The other two are actually the awesome ones

So I'm really in the not-dumber-and-slightly-smart movie watcher category

Mithoron

:D

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Of course, for example, the very same thing that makes The Dark Knight look clunky and messy to some people is an inevitable result of making a movie with the content of three philosophy books

Mithoron

9:17 PM

Hmm?

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

So if I see the movie is smart, I acknowledge and usually try to overlook the shortcomings

So Logan becomes an almost flawless movie in my eyes, and that's why I enjoy it as much as I can

My point is that I don't find the critic mode to be worth not enjoying the movie to its fullest

Mithoron

Hmm, I saw Dark Night a long time ago but it didn't seem too philosophical

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

BRB

Back

Mithoron

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ I think I got smarter and smarter category, but you have time ;)

Rather above Nolan's film already.

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

@Mithoron Maybe you feel that way because there were so many philosophical concepts that neither were attended to in detail

I tend to study Islamic philosophy from time to time, and I see many of the concepts mentioned in different philosophical books

Mithoron

9:27 PM

Dunno

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

And Islamic philosophy is more awesome than you think

Unfortunately, stuff like that is only available in Arabic and Persian

Mithoron

Read a bit of intro to philosophy but wasn't satisfied

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

I really wanted to know how cool scientists of Islamic times which tended to be philosophers as well proved God's existence to a 21st century kid which knows and has heard about the atheist west

And apparently according to a cool philosopher (Motahari) I still have to learn some logician stuff first

Mithoron

God's existence or non-existance is unprovable and that's a very good thing

Otherwise there would be little place for faith

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

He claimed in one of the books I read (which was really a transcript of his debates with Tehran university teachers) something like "You think this atheist author read Islamic philosophy and debunked the existence of God? Hell no, and I can tell that by reading his book. I see he hasn't understood what I have"

@Mithoron Actually, he did explicitly say God's existence has been proven by pure logic but it's high level

Mithoron

9:34 PM

Atheism is only a different kind of faith

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

And I can't really dismiss that remark because 1. he's not having a debate with some dumbass in the street and

2. Islamic sciences and philosophy was flourishing when the Europe was in medieval hibernation. So much of that science is lost to Europeans and generally the western world

@Mithoron I typically take a stance similar to yours on this, but I'm really interested to find out about that proof

But I have no idea where to look in the sea of old books in Arabic

Mithoron

Don't overestimate philosophers. they tend to make dubious and overly complicated reasonings

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

What hurts the theist side of the debate really bad is their use of arguments that are inherently invalid to atheists

@Mithoron I agree. The real problem here is 95 percent of philosophers are full of shit

And as you said, use dubious arguments.

Mithoron

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Actually tomism developed in middle ages, giving maybe most famous proofs for existence, but all of them fell

Nietzsche made rather short work of them afaik

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

So I read one theologian's book, and he says, trying to prove that Muhammad was a prophet sent by God: "we know that these special supernatural connections were made, and we know he wasn't stupid or crazy . . . "

We know, we know. No, someone who doesn't believe in him doesn't know.

Mithoron

9:41 PM

@Piomicron o/

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

@Mithoron That's precisely the problem. The little work one man has done is his life is incomparable to what a whole civilization did

Mithoron

Don't worry, this is Philosophy.SE chat ;)

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

I know of atheists that questioned the existence of God in Islamic societies at around 800.

LegionMammal978

A small IUPAC nomenclature question: would acetylene and tert-butyl be the only two retained preferred names for unbranched hydrocarbons in general?

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

They were called "molahede"

@LegionMammal978 I doubt that

Mithoron

9:45 PM

On the other hand maybe we'll pretend it is ^ :>

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

But what's the hype about PIN anyway? If a chemist can call the compound sec-butyl, you can too whether it's PIN or not

@Mithoron What is?

Mithoron

@M.A.R.ಠ_ಠ Then we would have no reason to reply

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

@Mithoron What? Which message are you referring to?

Mithoron

@LegionMammal978 sigh t-butyl is neither hydrocarbon (only group) nor unbranched

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Philosophy or IUPAC nomenclature?

Oh

Mithoron

9:51 PM

Also I doubt acetylene is PIN

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

So, as I was saying, it's logical to think, that, after the rules got a bit loose and people were allowed to think, which resulted in atheists called "molahede" opening up space for themselves in the Islamic society, Islamic theologians thought of responses to their questioning of God's existence

And no one in the 21st century world reads about those responses

So we can't assume the popular Christian theologian position that you can't prove God, hence you should have faith

Unless we read those responses

Overly complicated doesn't matter, but dubious does

And unfortunately, dubious responses are debunked by atheists, and the atheist debunks are debunked by atheologians, and the loop continues.

No one ends up returning home happy

Mithoron

Modern philosophy got rather far away beyond this.

The thing is our own language hinders us

What does it even mean "to exist" for example?

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

@Mithoron That's probably related to one way of proving God

Mithoron

I don't see why God wouldn't be above our logic and reasongs

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

A common theme is the guy sees a physical law, and says "OK, so this law governs these phenomena. God doesn't do that, so he can't exist"

While this can't be right

@Mithoron It probably is, because our prophet has a saying that "think about everything, but don't think about what God is"

Which makes the Motahari assertion that God's existence has been proved by pure logic more interesting

And I've read a couple of his books. He knows what he's talking about

Always using correct reasoning, never bullshit

That rare 5 percent of the philosophers

Mithoron

10:02 PM

And being almighty may implicate being over exist/not exist logic

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Well, I know for a fact that proving he exists is probably done by the limits and laws of this world, so doesn't necessarily indicate what he is

@Mithoron Yay for the topic getting confusing

On 2:33 a.m. too

Mithoron

:D

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

I should really ~~get some sleep~~ read more Clayden

Mithoron

Mhm, it's only after midnight here but still got tired

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Thinking about this stuff ultimately ends with me ignoring the whole subject, while it could have consequences in our everyday lives. At least for me

Unless I find a good book about the Islamic response to atheism. And not the half-chewed, questionable response in our high school theology textbooks

I talk a lot. Do I talk a lot? Yeah, I talk a lot

Mithoron

10:10 PM

Hmm, need to finish this stupid Wikipedia article, so see you soon!

M.A.R. ಠ_ಠ

Night

LegionMammal978

10:51 PM

@Mithoron Regarding this, acetylene's retained per P-31.1.2.1 in my Blue Book, but it cannot be substituted

Transcript for