I have recently earned my masters degree, before applying for a phd position, I want to work for some years...
and I do not have any job experience. But I have some experience in the softwares in my major and have published some academic papers related to my MSc thesis
@user1502 As a golden rule, don't EVER resign at your current position or make mention of looking for a new position or bring up your notice period unless you have a signed offer from the new employer.
@user1502 In your case, simply negotiate your starting period with the new employer. Point out that their offer also specifies a 3 month notice period and it would be weird/unkind of them not to give your current employer the same courtesy they would expect of you in the future.
@EnthusiasticStudent What is your reason for going for a PhD? And why do you want to work for some years first? Financial reasons?
@Lilienthal I really love research, but now that I am trying to find a PhD position, I have some difficulty, some universities do not have empty positions, or they can not support me with funding/scholarship. I see that I am just missing time on PhD. So I decided to work...
Also, I am now about 27, and I only studied and I have not any job experience....
@EnthusiasticStudent You're not very different from most recent graduates. You should be looking for entry-level positions, preferably related to the field you studied.
As for finding a PhD position or other things related to that you'd best ask on Academia's chat but I assume you know that. :)
@Lilienthal I currently have the problem that I do not know whether studying PhD will help me with my future career or not... I have the feeling that spending some year on PhD will put me out of my major market...
@EnthusiasticStudent Generally, you should only go for a PhD if your choice of career requires it (very, very few do) or if you want to continue in research or academia.
The reason is that 99% of people who delay their entry into the job market spend that time not earning or earning a great deal less than they would have been, end up starting on their work career later and most don't get a significantly higher salary because of their PhD.
As I understand it, in the US people with PhDs also have more trouble finding a job because of the "overqualified" concept as well as hiring managers considering it weird for people to spend all that time and money on a PhD program for the reasons I gave.
That last point seems to be less of an issue if you're in a country with significantly cheaper education like many in mainland Europe, at least in my experience.
But the other points remain.
This has been discussed previously on Academia though I can't seem to find it, I recommend asking there and they might be able to dig up the question.
It was something like "Should I go for a PhD if I don't want to continue in research"
In the end, if you would derive significant satisfaction from getting to do research then it's up to you to balance that against the loss in income and a shortened career.
I will finish my masters soon and I'm considering the idea of continuing with a PhD.
My assumption is the process for job search after my PhD would be different, because I have a different and more specialized skillset.
When applying for jobs after graduation:
Should I look for junior positi...
I've heard stories of how people looking for jobs have been turned down by companies because they are over-qualified, even when they are willing to take a (sometime substantial) pay-cut.
Why do companies not want to hire people who are over-qualified for the job? Wouldn't it make sense for a com...
Can a phd degree have a negative impact on your career in the industry?
Absolutely.
A stigma attached to PhD's (right or wrong) in software development is that they have trouble actually writing code. Much of the PhD path is mathematics and writing papers describing the mathematics, which (...
These are also useful reading. Look/ask on academia for questions from the academic perspective.
Yes, I received a call from them. Told them about me being in a project, so they probably won't leave me before 3 months. They said, keep us in bcc this whole time, and its OK if they leave you after completing 3 months.
I have an offer mail, isn't it as good as a signed offer?
@user1502 In general, no. But whether that offer mail counts as a form of contract with legal value depends on your jurisdiction. In the US most employees don't have a contract but they do sign an offer letter as I understand it.
@Lilienthal I am sorry that I am replying late, I was not at my desk. Thank you so much for the points you mentioned and the questions you conveyed here....
@EnthusiasticStudent Not a problem, we call it chat but it feels more like a play-by-email sometimes. And you're welcome, I hope you find some of the questions on this site (and Academia) useful in your decision.
One point I should add: consider talking to a "guidance counselor" or something similar. Most universities have them and they can generally explain pros and cons of doing a PhD.
Some countries also have similar services I think, though some only have those up to high school level.
@Lilienthal Not all the people kindly spend time to guide others... You are great... thanks.
@Lilienthal Probably I should spend some time reading those content and questions online
and spend some more time to decide over doing a phd or not
However, I think that having a masters degree, and MBA and Project Management Certificates, will give me enough career opportunities which doing PhD may put me out of the market for some years... I have the feeling that this is the right time to start working...
I really like doing PhD, specially it's Dr. title, but sometimes people should choose and leave their interests to build a better future for themselves...
@EnthusiasticStudent You raise good points, but as I mentioned only you can really judge what the best choice is when it comes to your career, education and personal happiness.
It's good to talk things like this over with family or close friends if you have them, I find that explaining options and my thinking on things helps me form a better idea of them even if the other person is only there to listen.
What jobs do they do?
Most important thing to know
All the below hinges on your PhD research/work being relevant and allowing you to add value to a company.
Being super awesome at something that no one makes money off doesn't help you. Spending your 4-5 years of your PhD being a Teaching Assi...
I know a PhD is supposed to be an apprenticeship for future researchers. But what if you enjoy getting the PhD, but have no intention of doing research in the future? It seems like being a professor is really stressful and there is a lot of competition, and same thing for other sorts of non-gra...
So, there is a question posed recently concerning how an applicant may have messed up faking a drug test. The only other question under this tag is closed as off topic. Since there is very little advise we can give for positive drug test results, and the question will probably be very subjective ...
My grandma gave me her pee to put in a condom so i can pass my drug screen for work, the temperature of her pee was fine and what not, but while i was in the process i noticed there wasnt enough pee in the cup. it wasnt to the "line" idk why but i panicked and peed about half an inch in the cup. ...
@Lilienthal I dont understand the piling on of the downvotes on the duplicates. Its not a bad question just a dupicate of a similar question
@Lilienthal Its sad to see how this user was treated. New users should be given a bit more rope than established users who should know how the system works and are just ignoring the rules. This is a situation where the community drove a new user away from SE because the user did not understand but attempted to ask some decent questions. Its sad if you ask me.
Especially since its not like these were questions on how to exploit the system or be a jerk. They were questions about how to do difficult things the right way
http://workplace.stackexchange.com/users/40274/jack-d-ripper
This user was not attempting to ask bad questions or question on how to exploit or get around the system. He was asking questions about understanding how to negotiate some difficult situations. I see no reason for the excessive down ...
@Chad @Chad In my defense, I assumed it was a joke question, hence my joke answer (which I fully expected to be deleted). In hindsight I should have realised that all sorts of people find their way to this site and I should have resisted the temptation.
But to be entirely frank and honest, if the OP's situation was genuine, I'm not sure if the site would be better off for having him as a member. I realise that's a rather elitist remark and we should cut the "newbs" some slack but the behaviour demonstrated by that poster is so unethical, bizarre, and evidence of poor judgement that I feel I should point it out.
I think it might be worth bringing up on meta though, as a distinct topic from your current post on new users.
Though I feel compelled to point out that you also replied in jocular fashion to my joke answer, so perhaps we both suffered a temporary lapse in judgement. :)
As for Jack though, I'm following MaskedMan and Joe impression that he was really just here to have people validate his misguided notions on how the workplace works.
I can't recall any users here being openly dismissive or hostile, but there were plenty of direct and blunt responses.
Seems like one such comment of mine was also deleted. :)
I guess my opinion is that if people demonstrate a lack of respect for both the site, our guidelines and rules, and our userbase along with a refusal to adjust their behaviour then there comes a point where you stop assuming good faith and the kid gloves come off.
Though the latter is more the domain of the moderators than the users who should just keep flagging, voting and commenting as they have been, even if those comments are in vain.
I'm having some troubles finding work. I'm a good, hard-working and honest worker who has a ton of experience in several areas. I won't list them, but I suspect that my issues with finding work are related to a 10 year break I took. From the moment I left school up until 2005, I had been through ...
For the first three years of my career, was always employed. Then, after I got laid off because the last company I worked for went under, I couldn't motivate myself to look for work for one year and six months. This was due to untreated depression, which also made it very difficult to manage the...
I am recent science graduate. I am now employed with this insurance company just this week as a clerk in actuarial department. I thought through this, I can be promoted into a real actuary. This is the ONLY reason why I accepted the job in the first place. I asked my manager since I am not a math...
It is convenient to cherry-pick instances when people responded rudely, while ignoring all the helpful comments. That just makes one sound like a crybaby in addition to being a superhero with need for validation (whoa, this gets interesting!) :)
@enderland Yeah, and that downvoting has been a problem affecting multiple users, not just him. There tends to be a lot of irresponsible downvoting here, it is one of my pet peeves on this site.
@Chad What question are you referring to? On his latest question, I see a bunch of comments asking why he wants to do this, and giving him advice on what else he should have done/should do, but nothing which sounds like, "leave this place, you don't know the rules". Perhaps I don't see some deleted comments there?
FWIW, I did not downvote his question, and my comment was genuinely intended to know why he wants to hide his resignation from the manager, since that might be relevant to his solution.
Somewhat related: How to Deliver Resignation Letter To My Boss Who is Not Located on Site.
At the company I work for, I have a boss (the president of the company) and a supervisor. Unlike the related question above, I do not have the option of contacting my boss other than via e-mail. The boss w...
Its not every comment but there are enough of them. I dont think the snubbing was necessiarily intentional but for someone who doesnt understand the rules it can fell like it
Its not you its me... I just dont find you attractive any more. Ohh wait thats how to break up over text.
I don't see the reason/need for most of the downvotes. A lot of it looked more like "I'll keep rephrasing as new questions since I didn't like the answer/advice", which led to closing as duplicate of various existing questions.
@Chad My point is that at least on his latest question nobody told him "you don't know the rules of this site". All the comments were about his question. Unless you are referring to some other question, I don't see any "rude assholes" there.
I'm wondering if there was partly a culture gap between questions/comments. Which would need help figuring out how to turn the question into something valid. Most of the comments were in line with clarifying the question, or providing partial advise to figure out where the question could go.
@JonathanLeech-Pepin The op seems like he was genuinely trying to work with the site and no one reached out with comments on how to make the question better but there seemed like plenty of you need to learn the rules comments
with out directly saying that
Comments are intended for improving quesitons. not for making snide comments(im as guilty as any probably) or discussion. We are using comments completely wrong since there is no or very little improvement comments and lots of discussion
If you are expecting professional advice, then you should have written your question in standard written English, not unprofessional brv8shnz. — tchristAug 21 at 4:19
The above comment, which chastises OP for not using "standard English" has received 3 upvotes. That is a problem.
Granted that SE is an English site, but if people not well versed with English come along, the first reaction shouldn't be to chase them out of town with torches and spades.
@user1502 I am sorry, I have lost your question amidst all the Jack D Ripper drama. :D I looked through the chat history, and could only find "what should I write in the resignation mail?" Is that what you are referring to?
@user1502 I would leave the resignation email a standard resignation letter (indicating what is needed). If possible, I would try to reach out by telephone or video-conference to add any expanded information and/or request any changes to the standard
@user1502 No, no, no, no, no. Don't do that over email. That kind of thing should be done F2F, or if that is absolutely impossible, then over the phone.
Once you come to some sort of agreement or understanding, then reformulate that in an email "As per our discussion" or something of the sort to ensure the agreement is in writing (but already discussed verbally to avoid the back and forth.
@Chad well that might depend, @user1502 is in India and going above the chain of command like that (not sure what the relationship between @user1502 and the CTO is) might not be wise
@Chad I would have said right thing to do is talk to your supervisor/manager. If they cannot make the decision they will either a) reach out to someone who can or b) advise you who to reach out to.
I was reporting to Person A who reported to the CTO, just a couple of days back, the the CTO's wife (who is a project manager) asked me to work on her project as there was less work.
@enderland @user1502 Not sure what "India thing" you guys are talking about. While escalation is not taken kindly, it is usually "okayish" if you have tried resolving the issue the best you could with your supervisor before going to the level above. I guess that's how it works in the US too?
Be sure that is the official procedure. Your resignation could be considered "invalid" because you submitted it to the wrong person, that person being the CTO notwithstanding.
Don't go by what people tell you to do, do what you are expected to do.
:)
If you want to be successful in the IT industry in India, you have to grow a very thick skin.
@user1502 Then it is all the more important that you talk to the CTO about your situation. If you were resigning with the "normal" notice period, it would be fine to send an email.
But your case is different, you want a reduced notice period, which they are under no obligation to grant you.
@user1502 If you do it through mail(or email) you reduce your chances from almost none to 0. Its easier to say no in an email than to the person directly
@Chad Yeah, but the relieving letter scenario is not as horrible as the posts on SE suggest. India is also well known for its high attrition rate, which wouldn't be possible if getting the godddamned relieving letter was so hard.
There are a few dubious companies which use every tactic possible to cover up their mediocre management policies, the relieving letter being just one of them.
@MaskedMan India is very, very hierarchical when it comes to all facets of life and especially the workplace. The quirks of its caste system, even in "modern" companies, is an additional complication.
@MaskedMan As I recall the issue was not with his poor English skills but with his poor formatting and typing skills. He proceeded to defend himself by saying that he was typing on a phone while in the same breath accusing every commenter of being prejudiced and unprofessional(!) for requesting that he put some actual effort into his posts.
All SE sites that are not language-specific are English only by design and the expected standard is that users formulate their question to the best of their ability. By Jack's own admission his questions do not reach that standard.
I haven't seen a single user being treated condescendingly or dismissively for having a poor grasp of English but still trying his best to get his question out there so people can help out.
All those users have had people put in hard work in comments and edits to clarify the user's question and help him out, even if the question ends up being off-topic.
But when people vomit their thoughts into their phone and expect us to "just make sense of it because that's what you're here for" then I can see how people will react very bluntly.
And if those users persist with their behaviour and are seemingly making every effort to ignore well-meaning advice and endless pointers about site guidelines, duplicate question policies and topicality then it's only natural for some people to assume bad faith and react accordingly.
But I feel like I keep rehashing the same topic here, I recall bringing this up a few days ago when Jack first hit the scene as it were.
Ugh, I see the rationale behind SE not allowing the editing of comments after 5 minutes but it's bloody annoying. I usually end up deleting valid comments myself if I spot a typo. If I repost it I'd just be pinging the user again for no reason or messing up the comment chain. :|
@Lilienthal Thats the thing. There were none of those type of comments. They were critical of the OP for not conforming with out informing the op of the guidelines. The posts may have been intended to help but many of them came across to me as trying to criticize.
I will concede that there is probably an above average chance that the op would not have been savable. But there is no attempt, and to me that is unacceptable, we have to do better. I include myself in that we
Site users aren't there to "save" users though, they have limited ways to communicate with them and there only real responsibility is to comment on questions to try to clarify intent and salvage a question if it can be saved.
All of Jack's questions were either off-topic or duplicates and the comments reflect as much.
I'm not seeing any really problematic comments, except for perhaps some that can now be taken out of context after Jack apparently went on a deletion spree and the mods pruned a number of others.
The downvotes weren't constructive. But I suspect they were downvoting the attitude/repetition by the same user, rather than downvoting the question (which does not make it right in the slightest).
The mass downvotes (though I'm seeing less than 10 on most) were presumably because his questions were A) not useful, and B) showed a complete lack of effort on part of the OP
@Chad If you look at his 3 non-negative questions: The comments were pushing towards making it constructive, pushing it towards a question that had a place. (I can't see deleted conversations in the comments so don't know if the pruned portions support that statement)
Closing them as off topic pending edits that would make them useable was valid, and correct. (I'm ignoring the downvoted ones since we've already established that there is an issue in those cases)
I am recent science graduate. I am now employed with this insurance company just this week as a clerk in actuarial department. I thought through this, I can be promoted into a real actuary. This is the ONLY reason why I accepted the job in the first place. I asked my manager since I am not a math...
@JackD.Ripper - we can't advise on what to do, only give advice on what you are thinking of doing. e.g. you could resign and get another different job, resign and try and get the job you thought you were getting, get the job then resign, get the qualifications you need to progress etc. You need to think of what the options are, then we can feedback on them. — The Wandering Dev ManagerAug 19 at 12:24
the next one Jane edited 15 minutes after it was posted
+0/-3 | How to go on interviews while on resignation period without offending my manager? [duplicate] +4/-2 | Why do some companies not allow part time second jobs? [closed] [off-topic] +2/-6 | Pro help: How to sneak out for an interview when I am still newly employed? [duplicate] +4/-4 | HRs and Employers: Are the chances of telling that an interviewee can start working after a month low? Is one month too long for them? [closed] [off-topic] +2/-6 | How to ethically resign after working less than a month? [duplicate] [off-topic]
I'm seeing a maximum of 6 downvotes. That does not qualify as "downvoting the hell out of" to me.
voting to close as off topic - "Rather than explaining why your situation is terrible, or why your boss/coworker makes you unhappy, explain what you want to do to make it better" — The Wandering Dev ManagerAug 19 at 10:36
There is no need for that comment... it shows in the close tally
Hey I am voting to close this because it reads like a rant to me. I dont know if that was the intent and if not could you edit the question to focus more on the question you want to ask and less on the bad parts of your situation
@enderland I believe it since im guessing they were Joe S
Doesn't it automatically add the vote-to-close comment when using those custom ones? (So that it gives an indication of what would need to be done to improve it)
I work for a small IT consulting company that is privately owned. I am a software developer on a team of 7 people. Right now I am working typically between 9am and 6pm, just like everyone else on my team. Recently my manager has come up with the idea of having a rotating on call schedule comprise...
@Chad I guess this is a philosophical question then: is it better to not try to advise people their question is being close-voted, or is it better to do so prior to question closure?
the whole intent is to hide that from new users so they do not get frustrated. There is no reason to post that comment other than to rub the op's nose in it IMO
To be honest, it's starting to seem like you're trying to argue against a process that is ingrained in how StackExchange works globally. And this chat is not the place to have that argument.
@JonathanLeech-Pepin I'm not sure for a new user. As a veteran user I get the system and want that information, but if I have no idea how things work... I can see where @Chad is coming from
Also just a general note, probably the best way to change a site culture in this regard is to be the change you want to see, too - comments are visible for everyone else, too
You believe that the comments Jack received were too critical and not nice enough. I believe that is not the case.
Unless you can point out repeated infractions of actual rules (and not just your interpretation of them) by multiple commenters on Jack's post then I'm just going to withdraw from this discussion as I see no further point in it.
I believe that SOMEONE should have posted using a more cordial and helpful method yes. Especially since curt and condecending was not productive in any of the other questions he posted either
@Lilienthal Thats my point. Its not that the rules are being egrariously broken. But everyone seems to be on the dark side rather than a balance of straight talk and nice and helpful
it's important to note that people respect someone who takes a fall for a fellow employee as much or more than a run of the mill competent employee. This depends very, very, VERY greatly based on what region of the world you are in. If the OP is in India (as their profile suggests), this is absolutely not the case. — enderland ♦50 secs ago
I feel like I'm going to become the "Indian work culture is different" evangelist here lol
@enderland ROFL I know what you mean. I hate seeing comments and answers assuming that what is true in the US is true in India. They have no idea how much different of a world India is
I am still pissed about that walk away comment. I am going to leave and try to cool off.
@Chad You realise that that deleted comment still showed up in my notifications right? I mentioned closing chat to save you the trouble of waiting for me to reply as I wanted to actually get on with watching my movie. My entire point was that our opinions differ so greatly on this matter that I didn't think there was any further merit in me arguing my side of it. Your comment just confirms that the previous hour was also a waste of my time.
You keep parading the "Be nice" policy around. I suggest you practice what you preach.
Hey guys... I haven't read everything that's been going on in here, but one clarification: you should never assume that you have seen every communication with a user. "Nobody did X" is something you can never know. You can only say "I didn't see anybody do X". Remember that there are other chat rooms, some private; that comments get deleted; and that there are other channels.
Can a phd degree have a negative impact on your career in the industry?
Absolutely.
A stigma attached to PhD's (right or wrong) in software development is that they have trouble actually writing code. Much of the PhD path is mathematics and writing papers describing the mathematics, which (...
should i be worried?
Yes. I think urine a lot of trouble.
http://workplace.stackexchange.com/users/40274/jack-d-ripper
This user was not attempting to ask bad questions or question on how to exploit or get around the system. He was asking questions about understanding how to negotiate some difficult situations. I see no reason for the excessive down ...
The Water Cooler
The Water Cooler