« first day (650 days earlier)      last day (3171 days later) » 
00:00 - 20:0020:00 - 00:00

12:10 AM
Hey guys, for your reference, if we get slammed by hot questions again in the future and start racking up bad answers, Shog has enabled question protection by trusted users without having to wait 24 hours just for TWP. With Great Power Comes Great Responsibility, so don't abuse it or he'll revoke it.
12:56 AM
Lots of bad answers that should be voted down on this question:
Q: How do I keep the passion and energy up after 17 years of writing software?

ipaulI'm in my mid-forties (wife, mortgage, kid in private school, etc.) and I'm feeling a little burned out on web application programming. It's my main marketable skill (and also my biggest hobby) so I don't think I'm going to choose a new career yet. I've been programming for 17 years. I actuall...

(one more close vote would be nice too, if such is your desire)
1:07 AM
This one too:
Q: Cheating in a phone interview

SongoI'm going to interview someone on the phone, I have been involved in a few in-person interviews before but this is my first phone interview so I have some concerns about the process. It's a technical interview for a software developer position. What if the interviewee had some notes with him dur...

1:19 AM
So many of the answers on the above question are just miserable repeats of answers that already came, and the original question is unclear on what it's actually asking. It seems to have turned in to generic "how should you interview" advice which isn't what the question should be addressing.
1:34 AM
I've protected the first question on the list as it is picking up a lot of pretty bad repetitive answers...
5 hours later…
6:21 AM
@jmac recently, I got a habit to vote up Stack Overflow questions and answers from the hot list, to "off-load" part of lemmings attention from smaller sites. With their moderation, these are hopefully less of a problem to them...
@djechlin the difficulty is that no other site is SO. No other site has the number of active moderators to protect questions quickly, 20k+ users to delete bad answers, and the shear volume of other posts to cover up some of the damage on the front page. On smaller sites, we may be lucky if there's a mod on at that time, or a 20k+ user (much less three) and the front page moves at a glacial pace compared to SO. What works for SO doesn't necessarily work for the other, smaller sites. — MichaelT Jan 10 at 17:28
1 hour later…
7:44 AM
@gnat Shog disagrees with you unfortunately. He thinks that despite SO having a lot more users, it also has a lot more problems with spam and other miscellany balancing it out. I think moderation is affected by economies of scale, but I'm going to wait until there are a few more numbers.
8:38 AM
@jmac well frankly, Shog's disagreement here worries me least of all. Unlike me, he has tools and means to solve the problem at the roots (you know, that feature request:). As long as SE team doesn't give a shit, you know, I try to do what is possible for a regular user trying to protect sites I like...
Q: Reorder questions picked for hot list based on adjusted hotness score (discard some answers by voting evidence)

gnatExecutive Summary The 100 questions are selected for the "Hot Network Questions" list displayed in the sidebar of each site. These questions are designed to showcase other sites in the Stack Exchange network. Those questions should act as ambassadors from that site to the Stack Exchange Network...

1 hour later…
9:58 AM
@gnat Yeah, I disagree with him too, but his feeling is that it can be handled by site mods, or by finding someone with the power to moderate across the network. Which it can be. Once the next data dump to the explorer comes out, I'll do some digging in to the impact of high-volume questions on site moderation burden to at least try to point out that it is a problem.
@jmac if it can be handled that way, I would be more than happy - i wouldn't even bother with these dead end MSO feature requests. Thing is though, we tried it at Programmers for at least a year (maybe more, I seem to be not the first to notice issues with hot questions there) - and it doesn't work...
Q: Answers quality in hot questions

gnatFor few recent months, I've got a habit of downvoting answers which quality doesn't look OK to me. These probably can be generally described as low effort and/or these lacking relevance to question asked. Opinionated slogans, claims that are not backed up by appropriate references or by ...

What is especially depressing is that regular ways to deal with this kind of issues just don't work. It's typically not difficult to edit the question to repel garbage answers, I can easily name a handful of active regulars who can and do just that.

Thing is though, it takes some time to figure how to clean up ambiguous wording while preserving the essence of original. In regular questions this works like a charm, but when editing a hot one, I often find out that when I'm done with edit, someone already posted an answer that invalidates my edit. And answer that exploits another minor ambig
I think the general way it should work is:
1) Hot Question Detected
2) Question Auto-Protected
3) 2 Trusted Users (or 1 Mod) can Unprotect
4) Visit volume compared against average
5) If Visit Volume (or post volume) is increased by over some fixed amount, community managers are informed (through a notification on the mod thingie, or by e-mail, or by a ping to their normal inbox, whatever)
6) They pop in to chat and say, *"What can we do for you?"*
How did this get an upvote...?
Q: What should be the title of "Thank you" email?

PM 77-1How should I title my "thank you" e-mail after technical phone interview? Is just "thank you" itself enough? Is there some accepted practice?

1 hour later…
11:21 AM
Good morning folks.
11:36 AM
Is there a script that automatically turns questions into community wikis?
@HugoRocha Good morning :)
1 hour later…
12:45 PM
@jmac detection part is going to be tricky, regular questions hit and leave list frequently, how to find out which are in the need of special moderation efforts?
other than that, sounds like a reasonable approach. Having a question that has got like 5-10-20K views in a day laying around unattended is an open invitation to trouble
12:57 PM
@CMW If a question gets over X answers (X depending on the site, I think for us it's 15 or 20), all answers get converted
1:16 PM
Ah, I see. Thanks!
2:16 PM
@jmac it's 15. Funny that I just posted a meta post asking to unwiki a question :)
Sometimes we just need to wait for the universe to throw the info, we're looking for, right at us
2:36 PM
Hi Jinxed, welcome to the Workplace. I edited your question slightly to make it a bit more on topic and less of a poll (questions which are effectively polls are not really on topic). Feel free to edit if this changes your intent too much and welcome! — enderland 7 secs ago
I think this question is a great question
2:50 PM
@jmac benefit of the proposed modification to hotness formula is that it offers auto-correction instead of manual moderation. Think of it, imagine typical lemmings-infected question with 10 answers scored like 10,9,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0. It's hot, very hot - all 10 answers qualify for the score, it can't be hotter than that. Now, imagine next passer-by coming in and, upvoting top answers, like they always do: 11,10,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0. Oops, now only 2 of the answers qualify for the score...
...question magically cools down and gets lower at the list - that's the idea. You see, the very force that makes so much damage now, suddenly works toward correcting things, towards taming the damage. With new formula, even individual voting of site / tag regulars can make a desired difference. Again, imagine something like 9,8,1,1,1,1,1,1,0,0 - all 10 answers qualify, it's very hot...
...Here comes in regular, votes up top answers and votes down randomly upvoted garbage: 10,9,0,0,0,0,0,0,0,0 - you see, it cools down, only 2 answers qualify for the score
@gnat Don't get me wrong -- I agree with your method! I just would like a shorter term solution that doesn't require significant dev time, just a bit more TLC from the community managers.
@enderland CW can come about from 15 answers, or it can come about from over 10(?) edits in the case of a question, just FYI. I think mods can remove the CW flag, so we'll see what they say in this case, but personally I think it sets a bad precedent in the sense that I don't want to see everyone asking for their questions to be un-CW (otherwise what is the point in having the switch over in the first place?)
@jmac I see. As a shorter term, your approach makes good sense
@gnat The issue as I see it is that the SE team, for whatever reason, does not see heavy traffic to smaller sites as a long-term issue. They think that it's a small blip on the radar that can be handled with the tools available. To get it fixed, the first thing is to make sure they see that it is a strain on the community moderation efforts
maybe then we can get them to fix the cause rather than the symptoms.
@jmac is there an easy query to check how many CW questions we have? I don't think we have a whole ton
@enderland Not now we don't, but in the future people will find that post, dig it up, and wave it at the mods. Just sayin'. I think there is a type of post that is CW, you can check the data.se documentation, but I think it is some special flag you can search for.
looks like post type 5 is CW, but you know more about SQL than I do.
3:26 PM
@jmac that looks a bit more annoyingly complicated. I'm curious though, might try to build a query :D
I'm not sure how to get a link to the post there, though
ah. nm, fixed it
man I like writing queries
A: What is a 'friendly' way to let managers know that having good developers is a privilege?

kleinegIt can be very hard for a non-developer to measure progress. This is an issue whether you are working from home or sitting right next to your boss. I would suggest journaling all your time both in and out of the office. You can put in details of bugs fixed, features implemented, improvements in c...

delete votes?
3:50 PM
is there supposed to be a button for delete votes?
@CMW you might not have enough rep?
@enderland Ah, that's what 'extended privileges' means
@CMW ah. maybe deleting answers is not part of the 500 rep one?
hacking away at queries again enderland? :P
@enderland apparently not
hi @RhysW
3:54 PM
@RhysW lol I was writing one for the SE data explorer. I've been doing some for my work
ooh. could also be because I used up my delete votes for the day...
@CMW hey there
@enderland I've been writing a lot more queries lately too
they're everywhere 0.o
it's something I enjoy a fair bit
yeah, some of these ones are more complex than what im used to so its taking lots of testing too
testing queries is...weird to do
yeah I bet
4:01 PM
you end up running loads of subqueries :D
There's just something fun about doing database types of things
select * from world where Stuff = fun
Q: Programming hardware: wedding ring

Brian M. Hunt Originally posted to programmers.stackexchange.com Are there any wedding rings that are particularly well suited to jobs that require quite a bit of typing, such as software developers? The problem I am experiencing is that most rings interfere with my typing. It seems a particularly thin a...

is there any reason not to delete this?
has the delete votes requirement gone up?
it was at 1 delete vote, i clicked delete, it said 7 more votes needed, but if you hover over it, it says one more needed
how odd
@RhysW you had 7 remaining, the questino now needs 1 more to be deleted
4:15 PM
perhaps i misred, that sounds more likely
though i could have sworn it said 7 more needed to delete this question
Yes - the figure is your delete votes.
@ChrisF You are everywhere today :P
I just cast the 3rd and final vote needed to actually delete the question.
@RhysW I came in here looking for mods. But as they're not around I'll go again.
Nope, just us users :P
@ChrisF we don't normally have mods here in chat, unfortunately
4:19 PM
oh @jmac became a lightbulb
@enderland Ah. I'll ping them in the mod room then. Thanks.
so... apparently I don't get delete votes on community wikis but do on other posts? does that make sense?
woa! So much activity!
4:48 PM
Q: Is it ethical to write answers to work-relevant Stack Exchange questions on the clock?

ThunderforgeFirst off, this is intended to be an extension to the question "Is it ethical to read programming books on the clock?". I do realize the irony of asking this on Stack Exchange itself, but hey, I'm not on the clock right now. I am a programmer who, like many of my colleages, oftentimes gets stuck...

downvote/delete vote party?
5:01 PM
A: Is it ethical to write answers to work-relevant Stack Exchange questions on the clock?

18446744073709551615The best way to keep useful fragments of code for future use is to publish them on Stack Overflow. This happens because you find documents in the 'net faster than in your home directory. So, if you just publish solutions to your own questions: yes, it is ethical enough.

you're a good judge
keep your good work
I'm running out of flags. Gotta reload!
5:16 PM
@HugoRocha Thanks :)
@CMW I want to vote to undelete just so i can upvote your comment then revote to delete the answer :P
hey! Just realised im mentioned in the starred message :L
grumble grumble @Jmac grumble grumble :P This job actually gives me lots of work to keep me too busy to check SE during the day :P
5:41 PM
@RhysW Aww, thanks :D
6:19 PM
welcome @Rachel! long time no see around these parts ;)
you enjoying the new job?
@enderland Hey, I totally forgot I joined this chat room :P)
Yes, I'm enjoying the new job. Learning a lot
Great to hear!
6:39 PM
What is your job? You're enjoying? You became a street judge then?
@HugoRocha I'm a programmer :)
whispers same thing
.Net programmer right now, although I would feel comfortable picking up other languages anytime
got a job at Citigroup a few months ago :)
@CMW What type of programmer? And why are you whispering?
I was whispering to @HugoRocha
I'm doing Ruby/Rails
A lot of people can't speak highly enough of Ruby/Rails, I'll have to try it out sometime
I love working with WPF, but sadly this job is only winforms
6:46 PM
I don't know either of those. Last time I touched anything .net-y was 9 years ago with mono
coincidentally the same time I first started writing ruby code :D
haha .Net 9 years ago must have been truely horrific
well, mono was
I was told, mono is (or was) the ugly step child of .Net.
I kinda want to go back to programming in a more real language
more real than?
6:49 PM
one of the funniest languages, I think. Saw some VBA code once, if I remember correctly, that used german Umlauts in variable names and methods.
my main problem is it's not easy to do a lot of stuff which I really miss from other languages
@Rachel WPF reminds me of Java's AWT/SWT from its 'pedia page
@enderland what would you rather work with?
@CMW I'm not sure. I do enjoy my job a lot right now
I'm not really interested in relocating, at all, and I work for a pretty good company too
so it's a bit more of a "meh, comes with the territory" type of thing :)
ah, too bad. I wanted to lure you to Berlin ;-)
@CMW hahaha, it'd take less luring than you think
I like Germany
I've lived there multiple times in my life too
6:59 PM
Oh hell. Question titles are killing me today
"What to do if jobs seem like they will rot your brain"
There are a ton of jobs that rot you're brain... that's why you're paid to do them
true, I think
@enderland Apparently everybody in IT seems to like Germany. So where is everybody? confusilated
I'm thinking in particular of tedious boring jobs like factory work where you do the same thing every day all day long
@CMW I lived in Dortmund a summer a few years ago, and was in Goettingen for about a year and a half when I was younger
If you know anything about the Air Force, I grew up 15 km away from Ramstein
7:02 PM
neato. I was in Mannheim for about 2 weeks a couple summers ago for work
which... is close-but-not-that-close :)
Yeah. my commute right now is 30 miles by car ;)
I think though @CMW, most companies everywhere are in the "where is everybody?" when it applies to IT/software people
Amen to that.
can I have a 'Dafuq?' flag please?
@enderland my commute is close to an hour, or longer if traffic or the weather is bad
but I'm allowed to work from home too :)
@Rachel mine is only 40 minutes. Except for last thursday driving home through a blizzard, that took a bit longer :P
7:06 PM
Is it just me, or is there no specific question in this question?
Q: What to do if jobs seem like they will rot your brain

EMSI've encountered many jobs that purport to be very technically challenging and full of rewarding problem-solving opportunities. Yet few have ever delivered on this promise, and even when they have it is usually transient and happens by accident. My current job is like this: I feel like all of the...

no, I voted to close as unclear
My commute is 35 minutes... for 4 miles...
ok, I was going to go with Too Broad
@CMW walking?
but was waiting to see if OP would respond and/or edit
7:08 PM
now that you can retract CVs I'm all about throwing them on these sorts of questions ASAP
@enderland public transportation
my career goals longer term include either working from home some as @Rachel can or being able to walk/bike to work. get a bike! :P
I got one. But we also have pavements covered in a .5 cm of ice at the moment
I wouldn't mind being close enough to bike to work, but the weather and roads around here aren't really bike-friendly
btw biking takes just about as long
7:11 PM
@Rachel I don't see that edit being helpful
I just realized we have 4 questions in the hot list
basically the Q asks, "how can I find a job I like [when I'm super egotistical]?"
@enderland It does kind of help, it's basically asking how to find out exactly what a company offers as opposed to what it is only advertising to offer
basically, what kind of questions can you ask in an interview to find out X
although imo the question still needs a complete rewrite to remove unnecessary "fluff"
I rather want to strip away everything but the TL;DR
Ha, I was about to write the exact same thing
Did that for a different question on friday, and it didn't turn out too bad
7:18 PM
I'm making an edit now to do something like that...
Aaaaaaand I'm back
You're a programmer .... you're using .net to make a program to automate the judgement process?
Okay, I'm done with dredd references for the day
good edit @Rachel
I dredd the fool (mix all the references)
haha all your dread references are lost on me, sorry :)
7:23 PM
dread... dredd.... dread is dredd, dredd is dread...
I've voted to reopen the question now, however if OP decides to start editing a ton of useless egotistical crap back in I'd rather see if left closed :)
Q: How can I find out what sort of creative opportunities a company offers?

EMSMany jobs claim to offer intellectual fulfillment, problem-solving opportunities, and freedom to use creative decision-making to steer one's own work. Yet in my experience, few jobs actually offer this. I've been conducting a job search for about 8 months now, and I've rejected a few late stage...

And it's okay. But the point is: Dredd is a judge, and while we work for a better site, we have to make some judgements call's. Like you just did... :)
@Rachel agreed
Somehow, that question is bothering me
haha it still might not be suitable for the site, but it doesn't offend me as much as the original revision did :)
7:26 PM
@HugoRocha check the revisions :)
sigh as much as I like my new job, it really bores me at times
I'm used to being busy, and I need more work to do!
@Rachel make a .net open source app in your free time! :D
@HugoRocha What free time...
Unfortunately, I'd rather be playing video games than programming. So my free time is usually spent not-programming. I need to find someone rich to fund my programming projects, then I can devote 40+ hours a week to them ;)
a question needs 5 re-open votes, too, right?
I've got an answer lined up, that I want to post
@CMW usually yes, or 1 moderator vote
7:33 PM
I think if it's been closed/reopened multiple times, the # of votes needed to re-close or re-open might go up
O my
why have I read that revision?
The revision has...
rotted my brain!
drum roll
ba-dum tss
Rachel, you did a great job
thanks ;)
Still not sure if it's good enough for WP.SE, but given the right answer it could be an appropriate question
7:35 PM
Ah, I know now what's bothering me about the question
Q: How do I deal with hiring reservations when resume is affected by brainsizing?

anonI have found job hunting difficult, and after an interview where an interviewer basically told me "You don't fit my preconceptions," tried to salvage by writing the only "thank-you letter" of its kind that I wrote showing anger as a way of communicating: Dear [Name, Name, Name, Name, and Name];...

providing it doesn't turn into a ton of "here's a question you can ask: xxxxxx" sort of answers
I see.. :O
I've got the right answer already hides
hahahaha is that guy serious?
I would suspect a troll, but I try to maintain Innocent Until Proven Guilty
Brainsizing is a seriously problem!
And a word!
I try to mantain Guilty until judgement.
And Judgement provides guilty equally to all!
- Dredd
7:38 PM
so much for being done with references
(you have been judged)
I could not resist! D:
Anyway. I do suspect really a troll. No?
I mean, it's the same question principles. And the objective... seems the same?
oh wait, that sounds like a different author
I had assumed it was the same person
It is a different author; But even so, i'm assuming both are trolls, that is.
well the one has a SO account with some decent rep on it, so its unlikely it's a troll account
Frankly I'm afraid that brainsizing piece is not at all written by a troll
but by someone who's really serious about what they wrote
7:42 PM
I wouldn't be suprirsed if that brainsizing one was a genuine question
@Rachel Hey there rachel! long time no see
I would D:
there are some extremely sheltered or misinformed people out there, who live in their own little bubble
Hi @RhysW :)
there are poeple out there who are so big-headed (pun intended) that they really see the world that way
(I'll be perfectly honest, I was once an idiot-user too at one point who asked some stupid questions and had some stupid misconceptions)
7:43 PM
I see... :O
we disussing the brainsizing one again?
the word is really funny tho
@RhysW not discussing, It just came up
@RhysW this question came up, and lead to that one being linked
ooh ill have a read then
7:44 PM
lol i can see where this is going from paragraph one
I believe that I am comfortably within the top 1% of the top 1%, at least in terms of education, awards, publications, and the actual work I have produced on the job. And even given that, it's still the case that 99+% of what I'm asked to do is not interesting. Unfortunately, my preferences are more or less intrinsically set up such that this is unacceptable to me. I've tried for a long time to "just be OK with it" and it's clear to me, from a cognitive health point of view, that I am not physically capable of that. — EMS 46 mins ago
top 1%
top kek
I think this comment was what brought about the brainsizing question link
7:45 PM
'You guys need to provide me with intersting stuff' 'what do you mean its partly my responsibility too?' 'I dont understand, why wont you forget about the work you NEED and give me the work i WANT'
I was going to say a dredd reference again
@Rachel I actually overlooked that comment. Maybe it's the same guy after all
I'll hold on that for now
The only point i would have to offer to this person is some jobs like google offer a 20% time, so if he wants challenging work of his own during that time he should find a company that offers it
I don't mind the shortening, but the last paragraph is not exactly right. I am not trying to solicit help on how to determine if a company just pays lip service to innovation / fulfilling intellectual work. I believe it's not too hard to figure that out. I am more asking: given than so many companies only offer brain-rotting work, how does one efficiently locate companies that do offer genuine opportunities for fulfilling work? Once I'm at the stage of asking them questions myself, I can usually tell pretty easily, which has led to a lot of stressful wasted time on my part. — EMS 5 mins ago
I don't think there is a way to find that out without asking... is there?
7:48 PM
Oh, so that guy want us to tell him, how to figure out if a company will be catering to his whims without even asking them
@Rachel Hope they tell you without you asking, or hope that they left up diagrams in the interview room detailing their plans of course!
he's looking for a sugar daddy. o.0
I think he's looking for a site he can google that says "Company A is great to work for because it allows you to do whatever you want" or "Company B sucks because there's no creative opportunity"
mommy, whatever
no such thing
that's the whole point of the interview process - to determine if the job is right for you and if you're right for the job
7:49 PM
@Rachel he might get lucky on glassdoor or something, but whether or not you trust those reviews is another matter
there is a site where employee can rate companies
can't remember the name
maybe that's what he's looking for
perhaps, but even so that's very skewed
the only responses you'll probably find are people with an axe to grind, or people trying to promote the company
which might balance out for bigger companies
and answers can vary greatly based on department or where inside the company you work
not to mention people go out of their way to leave bad reviews, not so much for good reviews
7:51 PM
which are also less likely to just let someone do whatever they want within the company
I saw a site like that for the company I'm at now, and there were wildly varying opinoins on it
Thinking about it, the ridiculous part of that question is not even the fact that he wants the company to allow him to do whatever he feels like
the ridiculous part is, he's looking for a fairy that just presents him with such an opportunity without even searching...
Yeah, I don't really care if it stays closed, but I figured I'd at least make an attempt to salvage it as there is a hint of something useful in the question :)
and you said you had an answer ready :)
I do
to your question though, not to his
" he's looking for a fairy"
7:55 PM
the irony is, he wants to find hard work without doing any hard work to find it the irony is bittersweet
Excuse me
I am still laughing
They're mostly the same, with the minor difference that he wants an answer unrelated to the interview, while I think that's not possible and that the interview is the best place to get an answer to a question like that
I'm hoping he'll see the wisdom in our ways and ask better questions in the future ;)
That's the imporant difference :)
@Rachel very slim chance i fear :P
I'm hoping on that too... but....
but......... I guess half life 3 will happen before that
7:57 PM
half life 3 confirmed
i bet we can calculate when it will be out
figure out the time between 1 and 2
use that on an exponential graph to figure out the time between 2 and 3
i bet too! Why do you think there's warhammer 40.000? They're fighting over half life 3!
something tells me it will be like an actual half life decay of an element
how long was it between 1 and 2? 6 years?
so between 2 and 3 should be 12 years i guess
7:59 PM
find an element with a half-life of 6 years, move one to the right, read its half-life. there you go
enderland is lost
(I'm guessing something like 623 years)
so i reckon we are looking at 2016 for half life 3 :D
sigh I almost feel like submitting this to the Daily WTF... Me: "I'm concerned about the fact you have created a database table with a foreign key linking to an EDITABLE field in another table. If someone edits that field, all the records in this table will be invalidated". Boss/PM: "That is by design"
@Rachel that sounds very familiar :/
7:59 PM
@Rachel lol
00:00 - 20:0020:00 - 00:00

« first day (650 days earlier)      last day (3171 days later) »