/dev/chat - 2014-08-30

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3:24 AM

@AvinashRaj - I looked back at what you guys were talking about. If it still matters, this works:

sed '/foobar1/!H;//!{$!d};x;$s//&\n bar foo/;/./!d' <<\DATA
foobar1
barfoo
foobar1
foobar1
foobar1
gadjjjdjj
DATA

It prints:

foobar1
barfoo
foobar1
foobar1
foobar1
 bar foo
gadjjjdjj

I think that's what you meant by add a \n bar foo after the last foobar1 anyway.

Every time sed finds a line matching foobar1 it swaps hold and pattern spaces. All other lines but the last are appended to hold space then deleted. On the last line it substitutes foobar1\n bar foo for the first occurring foobar1 in pattern space - which is the last foobar1 in input because all others have already been printed.

13 hours later…

4:32 PM

Installing mysql-server in a debian chroot

[FAIL] Starting MySQL database server: mysqld . . . . . . . . . . . . . . failed!
invoke-rc.d: initscript mysql, action "start" failed.
dpkg: error processing mysql-server-5.5 (--configure):
subprocess installed post-installation script returned error exit status 1

Does this require a special device or something?

@FaheemMitha dpkg --configure mysql-server-5.5

?

@Braiam Ok, but I don't see why that would change anything

Yes, same result as expected. also with apt-get -f install. Which all do the same things

ok, doesn't present anything before the "fail"?

@Braiam nope

might be an artifact of running in the chroot

hmm, same problem on the main system. weird

5:05 PM

Possible it doesn't like my password for some reason. It popped up a message saying it couldn't set the password. But I had just nuked (--purge) every mysql related.

5:18 PM

Is there a way to see my fan speed, when I cannot find my fan with pwmconfig ?

Like where would I even look to find this out.?

@NoTime is possible that Linux just don't know how to read those sensors, hence ignores them

@Braiam Ok well I am trying to see my GPU temp, and look at my fan speed, to see if that is what is causing crashes. CPU temp seems find (within regular temp), but I can't find anything to monitor fan or GPU that works, as psensors/lm-sensors not detecting GPU or fan.

AMD or Nvidia?

no clue how to get in there. It says Intel Ivybridge Mobile.. let me do lspci again

yeah it's all intel

so assuming nvidia?

sorry I forgot Mobile in that. It's a netbook so I am wondering right now... could my CPU and GPU work together?

@braiam Ok so.. forget GPU. It's integrated into CPU (I didn't know that happened). I guess I have to figure out where the fan is now

You DEMAND it, do you? Well of course, if you're going to DEMAND it then that makes all the difference. What exactly are you going to do if your DEMAND is not met? — Jon Skeet 19 mins ago

5:28 PM

?

5:51 PM

skeet skeet

@Seth - what happened to Charles?

hm?

If this is a U&L site specific question then I'm not sure I can answer it.

@Seth - I meant you. You used to have Charles Darwin in the avatar thing.

You've since... evolved?

I'll understand though if the answer is beyond your authority, of course.

oh, lol. That wasn't Charles Darwin, that was Lord (William) Kelvin.

gee, those two sure look alike.

And that is precisely the reason I changed, people either got confused or made all these wild guesses, and I had to explain it again and again ;p

6:02 PM

So you thought a mustard-in-beer blob would be more approachable?

For what it's worth, nobody ever bothers me about what my avatar means.

I'm sure they don't ;)

anyway, all's well with you?

yep, doing fine. You?

ditto that, and glad to hear it.

Good, good :)

6:07 PM

it is cool to think about Darwin evolving into a mustard-in-beer blob, though.

6:43 PM

@Seth You should have used a Simpson's character.

Just added 5 issues in a row. smuxi.im/projects/smuxi/issues

7:02 PM

Anyone game for a weird python error?

@FaheemMitha - but aren't they all?

@mikeserv Not really.

Python is a relatively civilized and sane language.

That's not saying much, in a world that includes PHP and C++

@FaheemMitha - not its tracebacks.

@mikeserv I beg to disagree. Ever tried to get R to produce tracebacks?

Never tried to get R to do anything. Its wikipedia page was more than enough to put me off.

7:08 PM

@mikeserv Very sensible. Don't use R if you can avoid it. Unfortunately, it is often not possible to avoid it.

There is a very funny site called aargh if you want to be amused

tim-smith.us/arrgh

"R is a shockingly dreadful language for an exceptionally useful data analysis environment. The more you learn about the R language, the worse it will feel. The development environment suffers from literally decades of accretion of stupid hacks from a community containing, to a first-order approximation, zero software engineers. R makes me want to kick things almost every time I use it."

That summarizes it quite nicely, though I don't know about the "shockingly dreadful ". IN a world that includes... But I've said that already.

"accretion of stupid hacks", "first-order approximation, zero software engineers", that's all quite accurate.

hahahahahahaa

from a community containing, to a first-order approximation, zero software engineers.

The devs are all (or almost all) academic statisticians, and are quite arrogant.

Where did it come from then?

@mikeserv Long story.

Yeah, like I said, wikipedia told the story I didn't want to hear.

7:12 PM

Two statisticians got together in NZ and decided to cobble together a clone of an academic data analysis environment called S.

it's just funny to think of someone engineering a language that is not a software engineer.

And "cobbled" is the operative word. It makes Python look like like it was Divinely Created.

that sounds like awk. Its roots were very humble.

The devs were shocked and amazed that anyone found a use for it at first.

Then, it, like, really, really took off. It's now the standard for academic research computing.

python has that google guy...

I forget his name. I think he died recently...

hmm... I think wikipedia used to have an R history section that no longer appears to be there...

7:20 PM

@mikeserv The founder of Python works at Google - Rossum. Very much alive, afaik. Not that old.

Guido van Rossum

Guido van Rossum (born 31 January 1956) is a Dutch computer programmer who is best known as the author of the Python programming language. In the Python community, Van Rossum is known as a "Benevolent Dictator For Life" (BDFL), meaning that he continues to oversee the Python development process, making decisions where necessary. He was employed by Google from 2005 until 7 December 2012, where he spent half his time developing the Python language. In January 2013, Van Rossum started working for Dropbox. == Biography == Van Rossum was born and grew up in the Netherlands, where he received a masters...

@FaheemMitha: Guido now work at Dropbox :)

I thought he died? hmm... I watched an hour-long talk from him at a python conference on youtube once. funny guy. it was fairly recent - a couple,three years old.

@Gnouc I know.

it seemed... apologetic, though. he spent a lot of time talking about how python doesn't do multithreading or compiling.

I wonder how much use these people really are to a company.

Presumably they do a lot of consulting.

@mikeserv Sure, Python is very limited in many ways. It's also dreadfully slow.

Though R is even slower.

7:24 PM

Yeah, that's what he was apologizing for.

For example it has a hardwired recursion depth limit for no reason.

I ran into this around 2004, but I don't think it has changed.

Maybe it has. He also spent a lot of time telling every one to get off their asses and do 3.0 already.

But it is easy and pleasant to use, scales up reasonably well for more complex usage, and people like it. It's sort of a cousin of Common Lisp, and as such, is reasonably expressive

I like it - it did all my math homework in college.

@mikeserv Maybe. I tried to change the recursion limit and got it to segfault. I then reported it to the Python devs, and they told me to go away.

Apparently I was abusing Python...

@mikeserv Yes, it is good for stuff like that. There is now quite a big ecosystem around it.

7:27 PM

psst... guido... it's that fh guy again... shit. just tell him to go away and do 3.0 already...

Russ Allbery just went to work for Dropbox too. Just learned that a few days ago.

@mikeserv R's documentation is also quite bad, if you have ever looked at any of their "help" pages.

I tried complaining about it once. They got all offended.

You do a lot of complaining?

@mikeserv Not a lot. This particular conversation took place in like 2000 or something. Maybe earlier.

In fairness, free software projects like patches. But in this case, I don't know if they would have taken patches. And back then, I wasn't confident enough to try offering patches anyway.

Professional sw engineers are often more reasonable people than academics.

@FaheemMitha I was just teasing you, man. I think there's nothing better that can be done for a software project of any kind than a docs bug report.

@mikeserv Well, it was not really a good bug report. Quite non-specific. Today I would do better. But I don't think I'm brave enough to try.

More knowledgeable, less foolhardy.

It's probably still in my email somewhere, I expect.

7:49 PM

@FaheemMitha - pro rodeo clowns are often more reasonable than academics.

8:04 PM

@FaheemMitha don't complain, submit a patch :)

@casey Long time ago. Like I said.

@mikeserv True dat.

@casey ok, nothing better but one thing.

@mikeserv ?

I said a docs bug report is the best thing. I was wrong. A docs patch is better.

@mikeserv ah. yes, sure.

8:16 PM

yea, a patch may not get you anywhere, but it does but a little more pressure on the dev to act on it over just a report.

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