12:00 AM
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 19 mins ago, by instanceofTom
Question: With regards to questions like 'What is your favorite ___', most of the time they are deemed useless and closed, but occasionally there are useless questions that the community would still enjoy.
To quote Jeff Atwood: "it’s OK to err on the side of “fun” every now and then. " - http://blog.stackoverflow.com/2008/11/stack-overflow-is-you/
For example: John Skeet Facts (http://meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/9134/jon-skeet-facts)
How will you determine if a question is one that is worth keeping around (like John Skeet facts)? Or do you plan on trying to keep all of these questio…
To quote Jeff Atwood: "it’s OK to err on the side of “fun” every now and then. " - http://blog.stackoverflow.com/2008/11/stack-overflow-is-you/
For example: John Skeet Facts (http://meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/9134/jon-skeet-facts)
How will you determine if a question is one that is worth keeping around (like John Skeet facts)? Or do you plan on trying to keep all of these questio…
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 16 mins ago, by Renesis
@instanceofTom This is hypothetical so I'm not answering conclusively, but I think any question that is worth saving can probably be edited so that "favorite" is removed and a more useful description is added, such as "most helpful", "best", etc. This way there is an underlying goal to answering the question, rather than just the whim of the answerer.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 17 mins ago, by Mark Trapp
@instanceofTom A question is worth keeping around if the questions are of value to a programmer; that is, they help make someone's job better. "What's your favorite __?"-type questions rarely, if ever do that. Since Jeff made the statement you're quoting, several guidelines have been put into place to steer otherwise low-quality (but fun) questions from being completely irredeemable.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 17 mins ago, by Anna Lear
@instanceofTom Jon Skeet fans question now exists on Meta.SO, where I think it's more appropriate. Your question reminds me of this one from Meta.SO: http://meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/75715/why-isnt-meta-funny-anymore. In general, I think it's more important to stay on topic than to go off on "fun" tangents.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 17 mins ago, by Anna Lear
@instanceofTom Fun conversations can happen in chat, which would be a great place for that. The more social fun questions we leave open on the main site, the harder it will be to keep it focused and on-topic in the long run.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 16 mins ago, by Anna Lear
@instanceofTom That said, many questions can be edited into useful (but still fun/entertaining) form, and I'm all for doing that instead of blindly closing.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 16 mins ago, by Josh K
@instanceofTom There is a different between "fun" and "useless." That line (when it needs to be defined) is up to the community, and I probably would not use a force close vote on a question in the grey area
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 15 mins ago, by ChrisF
@instanceofTom There's "fun" and "fun". Personally I think the "Jon Skeet facts" is "noise or pointless" (to quote the MSO close reason), but it's a special case as it came from SO and was originally posted in a time when the rules on SO were looser than they are now. You can have humorous questions - but they have to have a point.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 21 mins ago, by Justin 'jjnguy' Nelson
How much time will you be able to spend moderating?
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 22 mins ago, by Josh K
@JustinjjnguyNelson I have 137 consecutive days on P.SE
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 23 mins ago, by Mark Trapp
@JustinjjnguyNelson I currently spend about an hour or so a day checking and following up on flags, or answering on meta. I don't see that changing.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 23 mins ago, by ChrisF
@JustinjjnguyNelson Too much ;) Seriously - I spend most lunch times on the network and a varying amount in the evenings and weekends so I get to see most of what goes on.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 22 mins ago, by Anna Lear
@JustinjjnguyNelson I'm here every day, multiple times a day. I'm also generally pretty responsible with my commitments, so I'll be visiting the site more consciously, since with mod powers it becomes a responsibility instead of just this thing I check sometimes.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 10 secs ago, by Renesis
I check the site often throughout waking hours in the US, and that will continue to be the case. I'm not sure how "much" time that will total, but during those hours I should be able to keep on top of most the activity coming in.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 28 mins ago, by Justin 'jjnguy' Nelson
If ever publicly called out for making bad decisions, how would you handle it?
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 27 mins ago, by Mark Trapp
@JustinjjnguyNelson If the person doing the calling out is interested in having a constructive dialogue about the issue, I make every effort to have that dialogue to make sure that person's concerns are understood and the problem addressed (it's happened a few times before and after becoming a moderator).
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 29 mins ago, by Josh K
@JustinjjnguyNelson Review the decision and why it was bad / good and what prompted the choice. Voicing these thoughts publicaly to the concerned party would probably be the best choice. If I'm every completely wrong I will acknowledge that.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 29 mins ago, by Renesis
@JustinjjnguyNelson I am pretty careful when acting, so if I was called out it would probably be for something I should have done rather than for acting hastily. In either case, I'd view it as a learning experience and find out what understanding I acted under that was viewed as wrong.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 29 mins ago, by Anna Lear
@JustinjjnguyNelson That depends. If I still think I'm right, then I'll explain the reasoning behind whatever the decision was but otherwise stand my ground. If I did, in fact, make a mistake, I will admit to it and try to correct it. In either case, I'll be aiming to have a constructive conversation about it. Flailing around helps noone.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 29 mins ago, by ChrisF
@JustinjjnguyNelson I have been already (some time ago). In that case I stood by my original decision but flagged the post for the other mods to look at and review. Unless I'd made a complete mess I'd probably do the same again.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 29 mins ago, by Rebecca Chernoff
If another mod closed a question (or any other mod action really) that you feel shouldn't have been closed (or whatever other action), how would you handle the situation?
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 31 mins ago, by Justin 'jjnguy' Nelson
Or more generally, how would you handle a dispute between yourself and another mod?
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 31 mins ago, by Josh K
@RebeccaChernoff Discuss it privately with the moderator.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 31 mins ago, by Josh K
I would generalize the issue away from a personal conflict and present it to Meta, after privately discussing it.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 31 mins ago, by Mark Trapp
@RebeccaChernoff Generally, I check with other moderators to see what their take is on the issue to make sure I'm not missing something (if another moderator made a decision, they did it for a good reason). After that, I discuss it with the moderator to see if we can come up with a resolution we can both agree on: hasn't failed yet.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 30 mins ago, by ChrisF
@JustinjjnguyNelson I'm with @JoshK on this one. Keep it private and work out why we'd come to this.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 31 mins ago, by Anna Lear
@RebeccaChernoff @JustinjjnguyNelson I'm not sure what avenues are available to diamond mods, but I remember hearing about a mod chat room? I'd contact the other mod privately and/or through that chat. If it's a dispute that can't be settled in private, ask another mod to mediate or present it on meta in a general form.\
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 30 mins ago, by ChrisF
@RebeccaChernoff In this specific case I think raising a flag for the other moderator(s) to see but keep it neutral. This shows that you think the decision was wrong. Hopefully that's as far as it will go.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 31 mins ago, by Justin 'jjnguy' Nelson
How do you feel about the (what seems to me as a ) relatively small turnout to this chat? Does it upset you? Are you phased by it at all?
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 31 mins ago, by Josh K
@JustinjjnguyNelson Lots of pressure off that's for sure. ;)
12:27 AM
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 31 mins ago, by Anna Lear
@JustinjjnguyNelson Doesn't surpise me. P.SE has a fairly small userbase still and I imagine timezones and other business make it more difficult for people to attend. I'm happy with the questions that were asked here and I'm glad to see there's a transcript that will be available.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 32 mins ago, by ChrisF
@JustinjjnguyNelson It is disappointing, but perhaps it shows that people are happy with the candidates.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 32 mins ago, by Mark Trapp
@JustinjjnguyNelson I'm barely keeping up with your questions as it is, so in that sense it's good. :) I think it's to be expected, especially based on the performance of the other sites' moderator elections. Low turnout in voting and participation is pretty common in all but a presidential election.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 31 mins ago, by Renesis
@RebeccaChernoff I believe that's exactly what the avenues for discussion, chat and meta, are for. If another mod believes the right action is the opposite of what I believe, then I take that to mean that there's more to uncover, and most likely I'd go to meta for that. As I said before, perhaps an edit would satisfy the moderator who views the post as problematic.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 31 mins ago, by Justin 'jjnguy' Nelson
How will you work to bring new users to the site? Or is this not the job of a moderator?
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 31 mins ago, by Mark Trapp
@JustinjjnguyNelson Promoting the growth of the site is one of the jobs of the moderator, but rather than be a cheerleader, I see a well-run site as a reason to come to the site in and of itself. That is, I subscribe to the Google-esque philosophy of websites: if you build it and it's good, they will come. Moderators are here to keep the site good.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 32 mins ago, by ChrisF
@JustinjjnguyNelson All users should be doing what they can to promote the site - I don't think moderators are anything special in that regard. The title has no meaning outside the Stack Exchange community
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 31 mins ago, by Anna Lear
@JustinjjnguyNelson I don't think moderators are really responsible for driving traffic to the site. Their job is to keep the site running as intended, so that new users find it helpful and stick around. That said, I link to interesting questions on Twitter on occasion and I plan to continue doing that.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 30 mins ago, by ChrisF
@JustinjjnguyNelson However, as @MarkTrapp says - it's our job to make sure the site's a nice place for people to visit. If it's not then they won't turn into regulars and help grow the site.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 30 mins ago, by Renesis
@JustinjjnguyNelson There are two things a moderator can do. One, they should be helping the SE community keep posts in the right place - and that would mean being active on those communities that occasionally receive posts that fit best in Programmers. Second, a moderator needs to be helpful to new users when a first question or answer is not great right off the bat. This is what comments are great for, and maybe even a helpful edit (with a good edit message explanation as well)
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 30 mins ago, by Rebecca Chernoff
Alright, if that's it for questions, shall we get final thoughts from the candidates?
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 30 mins ago, by ChrisF
I think I've said all I want to say. This has been interesting and shows that whoever gets elected I think the site's going to be in good hands.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 30 mins ago, by Mark Trapp
@RebeccaChernoff Final thoughts: I think after a lot of work, Programmers.SE is finally in a great place that everyone should be proud of, and we shouldn't do anything to buck that trend. I think whoever becomes the moderator will find it to be rewarding to help maintain one of the best sites on Stack Exchange.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 30 mins ago, by Mark Trapp
Yeah, thanks @RebeccaChernoff for organizing, @Josh for transcribing, @JustinjjnguyNelson and everyone else for coming and asking a ton of good questions!
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 30 mins ago, by Anna Lear
@RebeccaChernoff I don't have much else to add. ChrisF and Mark said it best. Thank you everybody for coming and asking/answering questions. This site is doing well and will only get better.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 28 mins ago, by Renesis
I'll be adding answers to questions I've missed on Meta. As far as final thoughts, I think that my #1 view on moderating Programmers is that the best way for a moderator to help Programmers become a great source of information is to remember that positive contributions are key, and removing negative contributions is hopefully a small part of the job. Ideally many of those negative posts can be turned into positive ones. I agree with others, I think P.SE is already going in a great direction.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 27 mins ago, by Anna Lear
I have to head out. Thanks again everybody. Other candidates: good luck, guys. May the best 3 mods win. :)
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 29 mins ago, by Rebecca Chernoff
Alright, thanks everyone for participating! Good luck to all the candidates. A summary will be posted to the meta question regarding the THC.
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 32 mins ago, by Josh
As before I would like to thank all the candidates for their participation, and I would like to extend a big thank you to @RebeccaChernoff for organizing and coordinating all these town halls!
And again, I would like to extend a huge thank you to @RebeccaChernoff for organizing all the Town Halls and generally being an awesome community leader!
2 hours later…
2:58 AM
in Programmers Town Hall Chat, 4 mins ago, by Peter Turner
I didn't want to bother anyone with transcribing my answers or cutting and pasting a million times so I followed Renesis' lead and posted the answers to questions I could find on http://meta.programmers.stackexchange.com/questions/1078/2011-moderator-elections-town-hall-chat-11pm-utc-on-the-2nd-happening-now/1092#1092
« first day
Transcript for
Feb2
Feb '113
♦ 
Programmers Town Hall Digest
The Town Hall Chat, but sorted with only questions and answers
