The Nineteenth Byte - 2021-12-09 (page 1 of 2)

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12:00 AM

0

Q: AoCG2021 Day 9: Spiral memory stress test

Part of Advent of Code Golf 2021 event. See the linked meta post for details. Related to AoC2017 Day 3, Part 2. You come across an experimental new kind of memory stored on an infinite two-dimensional grid. Each square on the grid is allocated in a spiral pattern starting at a location marked 1 ...

OldSandboxPosts

1:00 AM

Sandbox posts last active a week ago: Construct a Heptagon avoiding compass use

@OldSandboxPosts destroy a square requiring sextant abuse

idk that's a hard one

1:30 AM

LostCMC: 50% chance to print "Joe Mama" otherwise "Joe Biden" Or Do This

1:58 AM

Is anyone else finding they can't upvote things on mobile?

And is anyone else unable to see the vote breakdown on mobile?

caird coinheringaahing

The app, or the website?

Cause I can do both (iPhone 8) on both

codegolf.stackexchange.com/users/92901/dingus?tab=reputation What does "User was removed" mean?

caird coinheringaahing

It means that a user got deleted, and, when some users are deleted, the votes they cast are reversed

ok

caird coinheringaahing

Whoever that user was that got deleted, they seems to have voted a lot, most people with 10k+ rep seem to have lost some rep

There has been a new update to the activity page that just made it a whole lot better

2:07 AM

@cairdcoinheringaahing why downvotes?

caird coinheringaahing

Because a lot of people disliked the changes they made

@cairdcoinheringaahing Ooh, an new entry on my "bad changes" list…

caird coinheringaahing

@Adám Is this your "you didn't get feedback first" list? Cause they did get feedback, twice, and have changed the updates to reflect that feedback

Ah yes, I see that now.

there is Close votes in review queues

caird coinheringaahing

2:11 AM

I still think the badge box is too cramped, and that the boxes are overall a downgrade from the old list, but its much better back as a two column style

@Fmbalbuena Yes, there are 7 review queues, including close votes and reopen votes

@cairdcoinheringaahing both, and this is on Android

Well looks like I can on the app but it takes a while to load on the app

Redwolf Programs

I'm torn betwene an upvote and a downvote for the activity page

I'll go with a meh

It's not as bad as before, and +1 for listening to the community, but -1 because I hate the changes

It's way better for mobile users though

Having said that...

user image

Thank you SE very cool

caird coinheringaahing

Spaces are overrated anyway :P

2:26 AM

I wonder how it looks on watches

Redwolf Programs

If I had a time machine, I know stopping WWII is probably the "right" thing to do, but I might get distracted and hunt down the grandfather of whoever made IE

IE is just the golfscript of internet browsers

@lyxal LookAAppropriateForCodeGolf.

user image

Looks like the changes are a little broken when viewed on a smartwatch

But they're mostly fine

Hm, golfing languages and APL(-derivative)s should be able to fit meaningful amounts of code on a smartwatch…

2:33 AM

i'm glad the golfers on smart watches are gonna have a good time

@lyxal What's the resolution?

@Adám I'm not exactly sure, but I think it's 40mm x 40mm

That's the size.

1.6" screen size and 301PPI

Square?

340×340. Thanks.

2:37 AM

@Adám yep

I was wondering why 301 and not 300, but that's because that's the closes rounded value.

How does tryapl.org look?

@Adám completely unusable

I figured.

user image

Oh, that's actually not so bad.

2:44 AM

The keyboard takes up most of the space

I mean, yes, that's unusable, but it shows that a meaningful amount of APL can appear, so it is possible to build something for watches.

But 1.6"? Are the glyphs readable at that size?

I think so

on a smartwatch, sometimes barely

apl code should be displayable at a decent size with a scrollable interface

1 hour later…

caird coinheringaahing

4:01 AM

Is FLT strong enough to prove that no such positive integers a, b, c, d, n, with n > 2 exist, such that a^n + b^n + c^n = d^n?

I want to say yes, there are no such integers, but I can't think of an obvious proof, and googling just gives me proofs for FLT with n = 3

@cairdcoinheringaahing can d = 1?

Actually nvm

Doesn't matter

@cairdcoinheringaahing also there are integers that satisfy that equation

Redwolf Programs

@cairdcoinheringaahing Why do you ask?

@cairdcoinheringaahing a = 3, b = 4, c = 5, d = 6, n = 3

source

caird coinheringaahing

@RedwolfPrograms You can use FLT to prove that 2^{1/n} is irrational for all n > 2. I was wondering if that generalises to x^{1/b}, which in turn requires generalising FLT to x sums

Redwolf Programs

Oh I was asking about an earlier message

caird coinheringaahing

4:12 AM

From September? Why? :P

Redwolf Programs

I'd meant to ask earlier but I was busy

caird coinheringaahing

@lyxal Hmm, I dislike this

> earlier

2 months later

caird coinheringaahing

@RedwolfPrograms Seems like an expensive present for a 16th birthday present

Redwolf Programs

I mean they're like a few hundred dollars

4:13 AM

@cairdcoinheringaahing it really do be like that sometimes.

caird coinheringaahing

@RedwolfPrograms I think the most expensive birthday or Christmas present I've ever gotten was my laptop, and that was £250

Redwolf Programs

Huh

caird coinheringaahing

Guess we now know that Redowlf's rich :P

Redwolf Programs

I have ties with the mafia

Petition to make redwolf change name to redowlf

caird coinheringaahing

4:16 AM

This is at +6/-0, with the opposing opinion at +0/-0. Should we go ahead with it?

At the very least, establish the synonym, then draw up a list of challenges to be tagged?

@cairdcoinheringaahing I'd make it +7/-0 but SE bad on mobile

did it for you. yeah, i think we should go ahead with it

caird coinheringaahing

I think you might be the only one who can approve the synonym @hyper-neutrino :P

confirm 2048 → sliding-puzzle ?

Redwolf Programs

Should I make the tag?

Oh nvm

caird coinheringaahing

4:18 AM

(Barring other mods of course)

i don't need the tag to exist i think

i believe i can create a synonym out of thin air as long as the destination exists

alright, synonym exists now

@hyper-neutrino yes

Lol ninjad

@cairdcoinheringaahing yeah, it's not like anyone could have the required score... :p

Redwolf Programs

There's maybe 7 or 8 challenges that need to have the tag added. Should we do that all at once, or over time?

caird coinheringaahing

Fun fact: HN actually has the required score in sliding-puzzle to propose it :P

4:19 AM

wot

wait approving synonyms is based on score in the target?

Redwolf Programs

Yeah, otherwise it'd be nearly impossible

that's true

caird coinheringaahing

@RedwolfPrograms I think if we edit a list of challenges that need retagging into either the meta answer or the question, then we can edit a batch of them whenever, and we've got a list of those that need retagging

@RedwolfPrograms i think we should do 4 now and the rest later, or just wait until later

activity is a bit low now, but if we wait until high activity, we can probably just do them all and it'll get pushed off soon enough

caird coinheringaahing

@hyper-neutrino Yeah, you need a score of 5 in tag X to suggest Y be a synonym of X

4:21 AM

oh, okay

caird coinheringaahing

Time to suggest [code-golf] be a synonym of [popularity-contest] :P

@hyper-neutrino I had to go to the dark web to do it but I made it +8/-0

Redwolf Programs

lyxal, buying black market upvotes is wrong :p

Looks like SE mobile site is bad on chromium browsers

caird coinheringaahing

I do think that the most harm any mod could do to the site would be to do some merge of code-golf into a random tag, as it takes a single mod to do, and is irreversible

Redwolf Programs

4:23 AM

I'll be extra nice to the mods then :p

@RedwolfPrograms well it's what you have to do when you're locked out of legitimate votes

@cairdcoinheringaahing yep

most things are reversible or at least traceable

merges leave no revision history and are literally impossible to undo (without manually repairing every single question on the site)

Redwolf Programs

I suppose SE would have to step in and write a script to restore the tags based on a backup from some date in the past

yeah

Redwolf Programs

I'd imagine something that destructive would warrant an hour or so of a dev's time, and the script could always be kept for later

4:25 AM

SEDE + bot could probably fix older questions within a couple of days ('cos rate-limiting)

Are mod accounts rate-limited?

caird coinheringaahing

The only evidence that array-manipulation existed is the fact that HN made it a synonym when he merged it, rather than just outright nuke it

@emanresuA Pretty sure, yes

I know there's a rate limit on nuking accounts for example

yeah you can only destroy an account every 5 seconds

CMQ: does anyone use chrome/a chrome-based browser on Android? And if so, are you able to do things like upvote or access chat from the side menu?

codegolf.stackexchange.com/help/badges/68/…

literally mod abuse

caird coinheringaahing

@hyper-neutrino Fun fact: if you destroyed one user every 5 seconds (we'll ignore the fact that you can't destroy high rep users), it'd take you a week to destroy every user who currently has an account

Redwolf Programs

4:28 AM

@hyper-neutrino So it'd take you at least a couple of minutes to wipe out the entirety of CGCC's most active userbase, very effective rate limiting lol

ninja'd with more accurate stats

oh wait only active userbase

i mean, i can't destroy them anyway, but i assume the ratelimit applies to deletions

@lyxal asking because I'm wondering if I should open an issue on MSE

caird coinheringaahing

@hyper-neutrino JoKing and CJY are the only mods to not have that badge

i don't think i've deleted many users. gonna have to check the 2021 Stack Exchange Rewind

caird coinheringaahing

And me, Redwolf, primo, mbomb and Peter are the only non-mods to have it :P

4:30 AM

yeah, literally moderator abuse, smh my head

caird coinheringaahing

shaking smh my smh head

and yet it's a bronze badge. lol (tbf maybe that's just cuz our site doesn't need it often? or we have had a lot of meta discussions about synonyms/merging and then just let mods hammer it)

caird coinheringaahing

Tag synonyms are a neglected bit of the tag system anyway

I noticed mathematics and suggested as a synonym like 6 months before it got approved, and IIRC, that only happened cause I posted on meta about a tag cleanup and DJ approved the 5 or so pending synonyms

I have suggested 3 approved tag synonyms, which is second behind Martin with 7. No one else has more than 2

4:44 AM

@emanresuA after i posted the challenge; i started playing around with brainf**k lol

Oh lol :P

5:03 AM

CMQ: Should I sandbox a question, asking to implement perlin noise?

caird coinheringaahing

> Should I sandbox a question

Yes

caird coinheringaahing

5:32 AM

OT1H: Give answers much more freedom in how to represent their inputs, as the input doesn't work with normal floats
OTOH: I know someone's going to be a smartass and says that their input format is just whatever is required so that `eval` is a valid submission ಠ_ಠ

1 hour later…

6:57 AM

CMQ: What should happen if i sort a 2d array?

probably just sort them lexicographically

lexicographically?

order by first value, then if tie, second value, then if tie, third value, etc.

is it better to flatten → sort?

Unrelated String

no

sorting a list of lists can be pretty useful

also consistent with what i would assume the behavior is with strings

7:08 AM

how to determine if a list is homogenous?

[[2 3 4 5 6 7]
[8 0 2 3 4 5]
[2 3 4 5 6 7]
[8 0 2 3 4 5]
[2 3 4 5 6 7]]

^ example of homogenous list

7:38 AM

this looks good

@PyGamer0 What does that mean? Even depth?

@Adám yes

@PyGamer0 0≤≡ in APL.

@PyGamer0 When in doubt regarding multi-dimensional arrays, follow APL :-) And yes, the answer is to sort lexicographically.

@Adám ok

7:54 AM

@emanresuA codegolf.stackexchange.com/a/237888

8:07 AM

Wow. Just wow.

HOW did no one see that?

lol I was surprised it stayed safe for so long

but I guess the 2D-like layout was enough of a red herring

ykw you can have a 50 rep bounty for that

haha ok thanks

I spent about an hour looking on esolangs for stack-based / similar languages that worked for this, and all along it was Jelly.

Also, that helped me discover another Vyxal bug

Try it online!

do yall have any better pretty printing ideas?

8:20 AM

@PyGamer0 Put each sublist on its own line.

@emanresuA what was it?

^ is broken

ah

@Adám Try it online!?

@PyGamer0 I'd put a space before [4

8:24 AM

will take a lot of work to do so

;-)

how about BQN style printing?

if this is for flax i recommend simply printing the json string of it

Use Vyxal (matrices only)

@Razetime Nah, use flax's array format then

BQN style printing works but isn't great for golfing

8:27 AM

@PyGamer0 I can show you my APL code that does it.

It is almost entirely regexes.

@emanresuA isn't that just.. python arrays

@Adám yes can you show

@Razetime yes

JS←{
    ⍺←⍬
    js←1 ⎕JSON⍠'Compact' 0⍠'HighRank' 'Split'⍠'Dialect'('JSON',⍕⍺)⍠'Null'⎕NULL⊢⍵
    js←'\[\s*[-\d.E, \r]+\s*\]|\[\s+|\s+]|{\s+}'⎕R{⍵.Match~' ',⎕UCS 13}⍠'Mode' 'D'⊢js ⍝ inline lists of numbers
    ⍝ remove , before ] and } EXCEPT in strings, so we match strings (stackoverflow.com/q/32155133) and keep them as-is, then match ,] and ,}
    js←'(("|'')(((?=\\)\\([''"\\\/bfnrtv0]|u[0-9a-fA-F]{4}))|[^''"\\\0-\x1F\x7F]+)*\2)' ',(]|})'⎕R'&' '\1'⊢js
    '^(  )+'⎕R{' '⍴⍨0.5×≢⍵.Match}js

ah that's pretty similar

@Adám can you send a tio link

8:35 AM

TIO uses an old version that can't do this.

tryapl?

aplgolf?

Should work with minimal changes. Hang on.

8:49 AM

@PyGamer0 is.gd/apl2json

Why PC is bad in CGCC?

(Popularity contest)

it isn't very objectively ratable

-12

Q: Reverse and error!

You have to write a program, if its source code is reversed, then it will error. For example, if your source is ABC, then reversing it and writing CBA should crash/throw an error. And ABC itself should be a vaild program (I mean your primary source should be a valid program). Output of the main s...

code-golf source-layout error-message

^ This challenge is very easy

@Fmbalbuena Try it online!, reversed: Try it online!

@PyGamer0 lol Try it online!, reversed: Try it online!

2 bytes

do you know?

9:11 AM

CMQ: How to remove a message in esolangs.org?

@Fmbalbuena It is just a normal MediaWiki, so edit the page, remove the words, and submit.

@Adám and there is second way to remove.

Not that I know of.

Well, if the entire thing you want removed was a single edit with nothing else changed a that time, you can roll back the specific edit.

@Adám is asking to admin of esolangs.org

ok so i have to gtg

9:47 AM

I kinda want to bully CR with this

@ThomasWard I suspect it is doable using dicts

10:02 AM

Why is someone using the jelly codepage for assembly?

@cairdcoinheringaahing should I take that as a challenge?

@emanresuA because it's just a convenient way of compactly representing packed binary data without needing unprintables, I guess

¯\_(ツ)_/¯ true

@Adám does that email address bounce for you? Asking because I haven't received anything yet and I don't know if there's any problems.

@lyxal Oh, it'll be a little while. The problems are not ready before January.

@Adám phew I was worried for a moment that something had gone wrong. Good to know that it's just a matter of waiting :)

10:17 AM

o/

@Adám How does Try it online! look?

@emanresuA ø/

3rd one looks ok, the others… hard to understand.

Commas would help, I think.

ok

Try it online!?

Yeah. Would be nice if corresponding commas could line up, but even without that, this is nice.

> corresponding commas could line up,

wdym

oh do you mean rjusting the columns when they are different widths?

yeah it would look better

alright back to the drawig board

arghsohardishouldplayvideogames

10:40 AM

Good output formatting is surprisingly hard.

how about removing the spaces: Try it online!

I like that. Makes the arrays seem more connected.

how about removing the numbers: Try it online! :p

@Adám 👍

i will remove spaces

[       1,
 [    2,3,
  [4,5]  ],6,
       [7]  ]

or maybe

[1       ,
 [2    ,3,
  [4,5]  ],6,
  [7]       ]

For reference, my code makes it:

[1,
 [2,
  3,
  [4,5]],
 6,
 [7]]

I.e. only the leaves are inlined.

11:04 AM

what about something like:

⟨ 1 |
  ⟨ 2 | 3
    ⟨ 4 | 5 ⟩
  ⟩ |
 6 |
  ⟨ 7 ⟩
⟩

(obviously the brackets and pipes can be changed)

or maybe

⟨ 1
| ⟨ 2 | 3
   | ⟨ 4 | 5 ⟩
  ⟩
| 6
| ⟨ 7 ⟩
⟩

@lyxal Sure, that works too, but the spacing looks off. Shouldn't 6 be indented one more space?

@lyxal Ooh, that'd be nice with the lines connected:

⟨ 1
│ ⟨ 2 | 3
│ │ ⟨ 4 | 5 ⟩
│ ⟩
| 6
│ ⟨ 7 ⟩
⟩

ooh that is nice

wait why are your pipes different to mine?

I used line drawing chars.

ah

it's so close to being valid vyxal syntax too

except for the fact there's a few extra pipes, it'd create the original list

┌
│ 1
│ ┌
│ │ 2 | 3
│ │ [ 4 | 5 ]
│ └
| 6
│ [ 7 ]
└

11:09 AM

dang someone should make a challenge here about printing lists like that

@lyxal Well, it is a little like a partial form of:

┌─┬─────────┬─┬─┐
│1│┌─┬─┬───┐│6│7│
│ ││2│3│4 5││ │ │
│ │└─┴─┴───┘│ │ │
└─┴─────────┴─┴─┘

Hm, that doesn't show 7 being a list…

┌───────────────────────┐
│   ┌───────────┐   ┌─┐ │
│ 1 │     ┌───┐ │ 6 │7│ │
│   │ 2 3 │4 5│ │   └─┘ │
│   │     └───┘ │       │
│   └───────────┘       │
└───────────────────────┘

Maybe better if vertically centred?

┌───────────────────────┐
│   ┌───────────┐       │
│   │     ┌───┐ │   ┌─┐ │
│ 1 │ 2 3 │4 5│ │ 6 │7│ │
│   │     └───┘ │   └─┘ │
│   └───────────┘       │
└───────────────────────┘

@lyxal How's that?

that does look good

However, it is entirely linear, so doesn't work so well for matrices.

caird coinheringaahing

@lyxal I believe there's a similar challenge about printing BQN arrays

11:30 AM

@cairdcoinheringaahing thats why i started this in the first place lol

i wanted a better representation of arrays

@Adám (doesnt look very good on a dumb android browser that doesnt allow changing fonts)

⍨

what if i print the same way as apl

]box on

caird coinheringaahing

I have to say, I love the fact that whenever a post here is necro-bumped, people almost always "revive" it for a little bit and post a couple new answers. Makes it feel like necro-bumping isn't a bad thing

@PyGamer0 You know about -style= right?

@Adám ....i think i have seen it somewhere

what are the possible options?

11:38 AM

@PyGamer0 Did you APLcart it? Then click (?)

@cairdcoinheringaahing that doesn't print with the same formatting

12:02 PM

  File "<string>", line 23, in VAR_g
NameError: name 'VAR_g' is not defined

thank you python very cool

what it's erroring on:

def VAR_g(arg_stack, self, arity=-1, ctx=None):
    this = VAR_g

which usually works

12:47 PM

@Adám this looks a lot better

1 hour later…

2:13 PM

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Title: Convert superscript numbers to normal numbers Introduction My gnome friends are writing a programming language and have asked for my help. Due to their size, the gnomes can only handle small superscript numbers instead of big numbers. However, the language they're writing the interpreter i...

cmq isnt there a field where "weird" is actually a technical term? i remember reading that somewhere but its impossible to google

@thejonymyster Nuclear physics: quarks or some other sub-atomic particle's behaviour.

There's also "charm" and more.

@thejonymyster Not "weird", but rather "strange", but I think I've seen "weird", maybe as a synonym.

In particle physics, strangeness ("S") is a property of particles, expressed as a quantum number, for describing decay of particles in strong and electromagnetic interactions which occur in a short period of time. The strangeness of a particle is defined as: S = − ( n s − n s ¯ ) {\displaystyle S=-(n_{s}-n_{\bar {s}})}...

@thejonymyster Mathematics?

In number theory, a weird number is a natural number that is abundant but not semiperfect.In other words, the sum of the proper divisors (divisors including 1 but not itself) of the number is greater than the number, but no subset of those divisors sums to the number itself. == Examples == The smallest weird number is 70. Its proper divisors are 1, 2, 5, 7, 10, 14, and 35; these sum to 74, but no subset of these sums to 70. The number 12, for example, is abundant but not weird, because the proper divisors of 12 are 1, 2, 3, 4, and 6, which sum to 16; but 2 + 4 + 6 = 12. The first few weird numbers...

2:33 PM

thank u i was probably thinking of quarks

weird number is a good addition but theyll name classes of numbers just about anything so its less notable lolol

@Adám cant you create a keyboard layout for bqn?

@PyGamer0 What type do you have in mind?

the thing that bqn is good for: making a lot of faces :p

@Adám wdym?

like your altgr layouts for apl

Ah, sure, I could. It is quite easy, but a bit of work.

ok

2:41 PM

And a bit more work than usual because I know the APL layout by heart, while I'd have to look everything up for BQN.

On top of that, I can hardly do it during work hours…

something something just use ahk

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Nth FizzBuzz Number code-golf Introduction Everyone knows the FizzBuzz sequence. It goes something like this: 1 2 Fizz 4 Buzz Fizz 7 8 Fizz Buzz 11 Fizz 13 14 FizzBuzz . . . In case you don't know, if the number is divisible by 3, it's Fizz. If it is divisible by 5, it's Buzz. If it is doesn't b...

@Adám hm ok

only for windows right?

@Fmbalbuena Python, 2 bytes: id

i think i might be able to make then using msklc

2:44 PM

That's what I do. You can even create the layout file outself, and just use MSKLC to build.

Just look at my existing files. Very self-explanatory format.

well so are you going to make the layout, (i want to try)?

@Adám ^^^?

Go for it!

ok

i will start tomorrow

3:00 PM

wait

@Razetime have you already created a layout for bqn?

1

Q: Custom keyboard layout does not display double struck characters

I have created a custom layout with Microsoft Keyboard Layout Creator (MSKLC) When I press AltGr+keyCombo, it is supposed to map to a BQN symbol. These symbols are generally related to math notation, and have high unicode values. My problem after installing my created layout is that the keyboard ...

windows-10 keyboard keyboard-layout

Ah, MSKLC (and possibly Windows itself) probably only supports BMP.

Microsoft was an early adopter of Unicode, before UTF-8 existed.

idea: train an LSTM NN to solve all
MCQ tests

Aaroneous Miller

3:48 PM

Should answers like this be edited to use a fenced code box?

i see no harm it doing so in a normal edit especially since the question is currently on the front page anyway

but I probably wouldn't accept a suggested edit for it (although i don't think that meets the requirement for suggesting, so they'd have to improve something else and then it might pass)

@AaroneousMiller I see the value of using inline code there, as BF can wrap without issues, and scrolling here doesn't add anything.

4:07 PM

can someone tell my why Julia uses * for string concatenation and ^ for string repetition?

Unrelated String

...*what*

why

why would it do that

because the creator decided on it that way? :P

also good day TNB

> The set of all strings S together with the string concatenation operator * forms a free monoid. Whenever a free monoid is not commutative, the operation is typically represented as \cdot, *, or a similar symbol, rather than +, which usually implies commutativity.

@PyGamer0 I used autohotkey as you can see in the answer

and now i just use wincompose because it's simpler to have that and the apl layout together

so no altgr layout

?

4:21 PM

autohotkey provides altgr

but it will clash with your apl layout

and what is wincompose

mlochbaum.github.io/BQN/editors/index.html

whoa github just updated

they changed stars

and they added lists

the UI?

so i can group my favourites

@Razetime yeah

create list doesnt work :/

ok i am gonna go bye

ö/

4:56 PM

@UnrelatedString the next AOC will be to complete implementing Perhaps

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The Nineteenth Byte

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