The Nineteenth Byte

https://tio.run/##RdVLjhsxDEXReVbRS1BJ4m87mWcWoJfvVOvyKfDAIqoAHTzS9N8/v7@/P5/x9fN53s/7/YvT8zW7mufZ6mqdane1z5vWlZ1n3pWfKrqKU@XPHW@Vp6p@Vtw4dH0LLudBJ9CD6BHpPZz3hTqHtxbrPZzn3pc/yB7R3sN5nqqTWrxzePOQb@Kb8s3O6waGb8o3yWzuvn/im/JNfFPBTaeWb5LdlG/im/JN8lvyLbq55Fvkt2bfv7qjt6Xkt5TfoqtLvkVfl3wL35Jvkd@Sb@Fb8i18e/T9G9@Wb@Pbym9P3pdv98zdocO35dvkt@Xb9HfLt8lva/g207fl2/TXlJ/RX5PP8Jl8Rn4mn@Ez@Yz@2v1ZkJ9p/gyfyWfkZ8rP8Jl8Rn4un5Ofy@fMn8vn5OfyOf11zZ/jc/mc/Pz@cOmvy@fk5/I5/XX5HF/IF@QX8gW@0PwF@YV8gS@UX9DfkC/whXzRm@WuFnwhX@AL@YL@puYvyS/lS3yp/JL8Ur6kvylf4kv5El/Kl/hSvuzdd5cf/U35kvxK@RX5lXzF/JV8RX4lX5FfyVf0t@Qr5q80f4Wv5Ct…

its a sample program that prints "Hello, World!"

1653 bytes

I think ASCII-only made a 1300 byte one

My guess is that it could be golfed to 700 bytes at the minimum

Rick

this will require some higher abstraction

MilkyWay90

@Rick Exactly

And I don't think the negative tape even works as expected, as shown here

It should print )(, but it prints just (

Rick

we can use bit operations to keep track of the bits

o wait

MilkyWay90

@Rick 3328 bytes for that

>3328

And that counts upto 255

And that's just to keep the number in memory (in the states)

Rick

can you use methods like Binary, Hanoi, and Sierpinski

MilkyWay90

12:59 AM

@Rick Sierpinski wouldn't work

It's a one dimensional tape, where all the memory is

I'll give you a tutorial

Did you see the Turing Machine video I sent you?

Rick

yeah

MilkyWay90

Okay, so you know how Turing Machines work, right?

Or do you need clarification?

Because the whole programming language is basically a Turing Machine

hence the name "Turing Machine But Way Worse"

with "Way Worse" meaning "Supports Input And Output While Supporting Halting"

Rick

researching it right now.

MilkyWay90

Turing Machines?

Or the programming language?

@Rick There is no documentation other than the source code for the programming language (because I was too lazy), but Turing Machines are well-documented

Rick

well the rules seem simple, can you move back and forth or just one direction

MilkyWay90

1:05 AM

@Rick Back and forth

There are a few simple changes in TMBWW (Turing Machine But Way Worse)

Rick

and the only information we can store is 1 or 0 binary right

MilkyWay90

yeah

At the beginning, the input gets stored into the tape like so:

hi

Rick

do we have any memory, you mentioned 8 bits

MilkyWay90

01101000 and 001101001

01101000001101001

So the tape is ...01101000001101001..

@Rick You can encode memory on the states

but the common way is to store it on the tape

Rick

just for clarifications, we can store this many bits 01101000001101001 separate from the tape

MilkyWay90

1:09 AM

@Rick No, only when the input is hi

h and i are 01101000 and 001101001 respectively

then you concatenate the two strings

Rick

but can we store anything, do we have any memory

MilkyWay90

which makes the tape <insert infinity 0s here>01101000001101001<insert infinity zeros here>

@Rick Yeah, the tape is the memory

the robot can modify bits in the tape, right

then move left/right

Rick

ya but we can't store anything to use as a reference point right

MilkyWay90

@Rick No

But you can move along the tape then detect the exact string that the reference point is (for example moving right until you find the bits 0, 1, 0, 1, 0, 1 in a row)

Then that can be your reference point

Since being able to simulate a Turing Machine is the literal definition of a Turing Complete programming language, TMBWW is Turing Complete

Rick

but how would you know that you crossed the second 01 vs the first 01

MilkyWay90

1:13 AM

@Rick You have to find those bits in a row

for example

in TMBWW psuedo code

lets say its at the beginning of the reference point: 0 1 0 1 0 1 and the bot is at the first

*first zero

Rick

ok

MilkyWay90

Then

If bit == 0 and state == 0 move right (this is the first bit of the reference point)

Else bit==1 and state == 0 this is not the reference point, 0 is the first bit of the reference point, not 1

Then once you've moved right

(assuming that the bit is 0)

If bit == 1 and state == 1

move right

(this is the second bit of the reference point)

Else if it is bit == 0, this is not the reference point

Rick

do we know the indexes as we are moving along the tape

MilkyWay90

not the program, no

but its in the debug info

ASCII_only included a debugger

Set me set an example program

Rick

so the index is apart of the information

MilkyWay90

1:18 AM

no

The program does not know the index

you cannot use it in a program

theres no way of getting it

unless you make a counter variable to keep track of the index every time you moved

Rick

ok so in essence there is really just a graph with pointers

to the next element

MilkyWay90

yeah i guess so

Let me pull up a truth machine in TMBWW

0

A: Implement a Truth-Machine

Turing Machine But Way Worse, 139 bytes 0 0 0 1 1 0 0 0 1 0 1 2 0 0 1 2 1 1 3 0 0 1 3 1 1 4 0 0 0 4 0 1 5 0 0 0 5 0 1 6 0 0 0 6 0 1 7 0 0 0 7 0 1 8 1 1 1 7 1 0 8 1 0 0 8 0 1 7 1 0 Try it online!

tio.run/##Lc25DQAgDAPAnikYgR/…

Here is the syntax of TMBWW

Rick

let's try to classify this graph. is it directed or undirect

MilkyWay90

0/1 <an char> 0/1 0/1
^ ^ ^ ^
If bit == 0/1 and state == <an char> replace bit with 0/1 move left/right

@Rick I don't understand what that means

Sorry, I only just got to Algebra 2

Rick

no worries, you don't really need much math. concepts are quite simple

MilkyWay90

1:24 AM

I'm sure @ASCII-only could explain better, but he/she's not here

okay

Rick

yea probably best to wait for ASC
,I might end up confusing both of us lol

MilkyWay90

ok

I'll just give a TIO link

For the syntax

tio.run/##dU67DoMwDNz7Fd46hu6FX0EmhCYSGGSu/…

I could've sworn I gave an in-depth explanation to somebody else, though

@Rick I'll try finding it

Although I forget whether it was on TNB or warzone.com

Oh wait, nationstates.net

Rick

but check t his out, I turned ASC Achilles python to Js and fixed a small duplicated error
https://tio.run/##lVLBTsMwDL33Kx4HUJKVsQ4hIXXdj1Q9JF02ytoUpR0cRr99OMmWjROikZrE9rOfn/MuP@VQ2@ZjfDT9Rp9OdW@GETsUYF0Kw1GscUxAX7NlBmt0HB15S0Ne2ruqXFTe//XWtJoZHqJDDP0orgPuYWKg1ePBGnT@MiVTEmpuYs1/lrxjncvP8fBAcWtcKEQauACfDBw2j@4/KwSKt6xRFNRUZF07WJb6VSWtHn2iZ39yqRZJIJkRqYBoyXqczmZG3GfIuBBLLl6xcm2QpUCWop5/HIY3QubJtrfMZZSEXea0reBxdJzNeBRLCjF/IS0yT3LBqeDYmIMODbsEihKgLmXl0MCNitmNai7SFpDCLSVUdGwJvmMyVTyaBjJtfpuIicWKVML3t/dBcXdUQrBs/vTMrxTBcS3rPuWbz/Gb@nUMnl5pKye7pcQpZJVDWS33IXTKaTa@A/KrVPpIxuhRHXGRcY/GoOXHiyJtuack…

MilkyWay90

Nice!

Cool

Rick

However, I think ASC is still shorter

MilkyWay90

1:34 AM

ok

Be right back, have to eat dinner

Rick

https://tio.run/##lVLBTsMwDL33Kx4HUJKVsQ4hIXXdj1Q9JF02ytoUpR0cRr99OMmWjROikZrE9rOfn/MuP@VQ2@ZjfDT9Rp9OdW@GETsUYF0Kw1GscUxAX7NlBmt0HB15S0Ne2ruqXFTe//XWtJoZHqJDDP0orgPuYWKg1ePBGnT@MiVTEmpuYs1/lrxjncvP8fBAcWtcKEQauACfDBw2j@4/KwSKt6xRFNRUZF07WJb6VSWtHn2iZ39yqRZJIJkRqYBoyXqczmZG3GfIuBBLLl6xcm2QpUCWop5/HIY3QubJtrfMZZSEXea0reBxdJzNeBRLCjF/IS0yT3LBqeDYmIMODbsEihKgLmXl0MCNitmNai7SFpDCLSVUdGwJvmMyVTyaBjJtfpuIicWKVML3t/dBcXdUQrBs/vTMrxTBcS3rPuWbz/Gb@nUMnl5pKye7pcQpZJVDWS33IXTKaTa@A/KrVPpIxuhRHXGRcY/GoOXHiyJtuackG013fb6cx62miTMeH42bqM2DgAWUpzn0rZ63/Y5Znkyn0w8

sorry that link was broken this one works ^

ASCII-only

@Rick how would it be undirected

@MilkyWay90 exactly as it says

@Rick ew.

Rick

1:52 AM

@ASCII-only ew! ew! you mean "omg this is amazing "

ASCII-only

it's badly golfed :|

Rick

@ASCII-only how is it badly golfed, its the exact same code you had

MilkyWay90

im back

ASCII-only

@Rick it's badly golfed

you can't just port Python to JS

and expect it to be golfy

MilkyWay90

@ASCII-only seconded

tio.run/##PY/JDYAwEAP/…

@ASCII-only The debug tape is 00000[0]00000000000111100100000000

Yet it has the lines:

0 13 1 0 14 0 0

and

0 15 1 0 16 0 0

And when you look at the debug tape from -8 backward, it's all 0s

Rick

1:59 AM

@ASCII-only that is a very confusing statement. python and js are so similar I don't think the techniques really matter that much. maybe if you were using Haskell .

MilkyWay90

@Rick There are much different golfing techniques in JS and Python

ASCII-only

i haven't even finished golfing...
https://tio.run/##VVHBcoIwEL3zFXtxJhsoik5nOobVD2E4JIhKJYsTtT0o325DqNpuDuy89/L2ZfnUX/pUueZ4fuNuU9/vOxI2YaQVr@x6JzixuOSxmTAubbT5K9iMAk/dbjYnXlsiXgZ0yhhVVGRJOKWytFBMs2jbOaEUXqOWrn30vW/aWggbZyjlXH7kjDaOkyo9Xk57kaEK@rY@gwaCufKfHCzEkPk2jr0N@Gq2QkuZvsMEMiAimGHV8bnhS62CYDAw3gCqQpfDbYCAj@OzX5uH0hFoORwjzZPY@us7oRODT@jkoc1/yCdxkBMw3G6BA4NDa6QUWTpd4CsiILzGDmUgpuFd/6MP1b/iFa70UwvnjRPQpQLjan0Ypb2KvHJ4gedNooNSCP@vro8tHqBhaPH6WEhbHErl6vPFMZi@R4FlMSuDHXvaqXFjBCbkOnVtnbbdTjiM@vv9Bw

. . .

MilkyWay90

And you can just remove the indentation, right?

But I've only coded in JS for a month

Rick

@ASCII-only I can convert that exactly one second

MilkyWay90

3 years ago

ASCII-only

2:01 AM

also... i didn't even golf the python one

Rick

@ASCII-only do your worst! I triple dog challenge your golfyness :)

MilkyWay90

@Rick Ooooh is a golf war going on?

ASCII-only

like... there's a useless function in there

also i was writing it for performance not golfiness

Rick

@ASCII-only bring it on. Code wars!! XD

MilkyWay90

“Golf! ”×1000

"Hold my Jelly!""Hold my 05AB1E!"

Rick

2:06 AM

but no outside libraries

ASCII-only

uhm

how does your JS thing sort it

MilkyWay90

ASCII-only uses base-250 compression. It's super effective

Rick uses eval assignment. It's not so effective

Rick has fainted!

ASCII-only has won!

Rick

@ASCII-only muahahaha I'm not using any libraries I'll tell you that much

MilkyWay90

But wait..

Rick turns his Python program into a Pyth program! It does critical damage!

ASCII-only compressed his entire program to 2 bytes!

Rick uses the -5389349085309480983rweaflfnmgsFl flag to golf his code to 0 bytes

ASCII-only downvotes his trivial answer!

ASCII-only uses a JQuery plugin to golf his code to -1 bytes

Rick makes negative protons to reduce his code to -2e100 bytes using code-bowling!

But Rick already fainted, oh well

ASCII-ONLY WINS THE MATCH

Rick

@MilkyWay90 anti-protons

MilkyWay90

2:12 AM

@Rick Oh so that's the name

I forgot it

I thought I saw the term in a YT video, though

@ASCII-only aren't you proud of winning the match

I take that as a yes

ASCII-only

accidentally refreshed so i had to redo it, but... 271 for now

MilkyWay90

nationstates.net/page=display_region_rmb/…

@Rick ^

Scroll to the "Semi-Turing Machine"

Rick

@ASCII-only this will take me some time, I'll be back!

MilkyWay90

the post is made by "Ashanara", my nation in nationstates (the flag is the same as my codegolf.se icon)

Rick

@MilkyWay90 will read

MilkyWay90

2:20 AM

@Rick It doesn't explain the I/O of TMBWW, since it is about another program I made, but it will give you the basics

ASCII-only

@Rick 244

MilkyWay90

Anyways got to go now

Do @MilkyWay90 for any clarifications you need

ASCII-only

240

238

Rick

2:35 AM

@ASCII-only ok, your not trying to make it any smaller than this right.

ASCII-only

for now, no

Rick

cool, but this is really small. I might have something in a day or two.

ASCII-only

:P

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Why is ais523 showing up as user62131 for me?

Ørjan Johansen

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@MilkyWay90 Because he deleted his original account.

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100 rep for an answer to Shortest code to produce non-deterministic output in Tamsin The Tamsin specification describes no mechanism for non-determinism. However, there is a compiler from Tamsin to C; it might be possible to use a bug in this compiler to generate C code that invokes undefined be...

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@ØrjanJohansen oh, ok

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-1

Q: Tips for golfing in Turing Machine But Way Worse

What are some tips for golfing in Turing Machine But Way Worse, a language made by MilkyWay90? Tips should be Turing Machine But Way Worse-specific and not be trivial (For examples that you shouldn't post, removing unnecessary whitespace or using shorter state names).

tips

MilkyWay90

3:47 PM

Wait a minute, why the downvote?

I'm guessing it's because there's not many submissions

and it lacks documentation

MilkyWay90

4:46 PM

Using systems of equations, my question got +1 and -1

MilkyWay90

4:59 PM

5x - 2y = 3

x - y = 0

PhiNotPi

5:49 PM

@MilkyWay90 stackapps.com/questions/3082/view-vote-totals-without-1000-rep

MilkyWay90

@PhiNotPi oh, cool

PhiNotPi

Tech question for tech people:

I recently acquired a new laptop. It's very nice. It came with linux installed, but I want to dual-boot windows on it, so that I can run certain programs and games that only work on windows. It's not a "gaming laptop" but I do want to at least attempt to play some resource-demanding games on it, since my previous laptop simply couldn't. Memory/storage wise, it has 32 GB of RAM, a 250 GB NVMe SSD, and a 1 TB hybrid drive. How should I do my partitioning/memory management?

El'endia Starman

6:14 PM

100 GB for Linux, 200 GB for Windows, 700 GB for everything that isn't OS-related, maybe?

MilkyWay90

@PhiNotPi Seems good enough to run a Windows virtual machine, right?

Anonymous

6:26 PM

@MilkyWay90 VMs are the worst option when performance is a concern

PhiNotPi

Let's say that I wanted to play a 60 GB steam game. For best performance I feel like that is something that should be running from the SSD, right? The main thing I don't quite understand are the requirements as to which OSs can install programs on which partitions, vs read/write media on which partitions.

Anonymous

@PhiNotPi Linux can access all partitions natively. Windows can only access NTFS and FAT partitions natively (though you can install kernel drivers for ext4). I'd suggest 100 GB SSD + 100 GB HDD exclusively for Linux, 150 GB SSD exclusively for Windows, and the rest of the HDD to be shared space.

Anonymous

To do that, you'll need a 100 GB ext4 partition on the SSD, a 150 GB NTFS partition on the SSD, a 100 GB ext4 (or NTFS, but ext4 would be better) partition on the HDD, and the rest of the HDD as NTFS.

Anonymous

Then set up your Linux volumes so that / is on the SSD and /home is on the HDD, and set up Windows so that C: is on the SSD and your home directory and all of your library folders are on the HDD.

PhiNotPi

This laptop came with linux (Ubuntu-derivative) preinstalled. There's not a separate /home partition, right now there's just a 240 GB filesystem partition, and swap/recovery partitions.

Anonymous

6:39 PM

Ugh

PhiNotPi

It looks like it's not too complicated to move it. But then I think your plan should work... my goal would be to have linux programs on the SSD, other linux data on the HDD, then most windows programs on the SSD, then other programs (remainder of game library) and data on the shared HDD partition.

Thanks for your tips.

Anonymous

You're welcome

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@flawr reddit does magic

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@Riker oh man, that's so cool:)

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El'endia Starman

10:28 PM

@Riker That subthread was amusing but the parent thread/post was fascinating.

MilkyWay90

10:42 PM

tio.run/…

Done with the hard part

I am trying to N(e(s(t))) a string

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