The Nineteenth Byte

mbomb007

12:10 AM

I just gained 2 gold badges in 5 minutes, and I passed ~500K reached on PPCG

Christopher Peart

Nice

DJMcMayhem

@mbomb007 Wow. Which badges?

mbomb007

Fanatic and Copy Editor

Pavel

99/100 for Fanatic

Christopher Peart

Anyone know a good IDE for python

and not VIm or

Eric

Pavel

12:12 AM

@ChristopherPeart Pycharm

mbomb007

@ChristopherPeart TIO

DJMcMayhem

> Eric

Lol

Christopher Peart

Installing eric is a pain

I have to install other stuff

And the downloads are huge

mbomb007

Yeah, Eric just won't shut up while you're trying to install him.

Pavel

Jetbrains IDEs are great

DJMcMayhem

12:14 AM

Oh, I didn't realize Eric was a real thing. I thought you typo'd emacs

Pavel

Pycharm m8

mbomb007

For a second I thought that @ChristopherPeart was Calvin's Hobbies

due to the avatar, of course

Christopher Peart

:P

Nah I just really like that comic

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

What in the heck just happened? I want you to write a program that will bleep out the H-word, regardless of where it occurs, whether it is inside of another word or a stand-alone word, whether capitalized or not. Input and Output The inputs and outputs of your program may be any of the followi...

Pavel

@mbomb007 That's Helka Homba, right?

mbomb007

12:16 AM

Yeah

Christopher Peart

So instead of programming today I spent it installing IDE's

AKA eric but it was a pain to install

PSA: youtube.com/watch?v=-XNDM4eAn1U

New Main Posts

12:38 AM

2

Q: Anagram Factors

On a recent episode of QI, the first 5 multiples of 142857 were described as anagrams of the original number. Of course, anyone with more than a passing knowledge of that number will know that those numbers are actually cyclic, not just anagrams. But that got me thinking. Please write a program ...

Christopher Peart

1:01 AM

1 year of foxtrot more and will have finished all of them in one day

foxtrot.com/2012/07/01/backlit

^^Jelly in a nutshell

Pavel

What does that have to do with Jelly?

Christopher Peart

You can screw up in ways you never thought possible

Check that

I can screw up in ways never known to man

Christopher Peart

1:26 AM

uhhhhhh

guys

I finished

One day

Every online foxtrot

send help

Destructible Watermelon

no

you already finished it didn't you?

Christopher Peart

Yeah

Destructible Watermelon

why would you need help?

Christopher Peart

Idk what to do now

Destructible Watermelon

binge read xkcd maybe

play nethack?

Christopher Peart

1:27 AM

Done

I read all XKCD

Destructible Watermelon

also I'm playing a zen run on nethack

Christopher Peart

gotta go to bed actually

Destructible Watermelon

doing better than usual

ATaco

SMBC?

Christopher Peart

Goodnight

Pavel

1:30 AM

Channelate

"Comics that make you fell drunk when you aren't"

Destructible Watermelon

1:41 AM

oh crap. some nymph or something stole a fire wand

New Main Posts

0

Q: Notcalc (Calculate the wrong answer)

Goal: Given two natural numbers (integers from 0 to infinity), output a number that is not the sum of those numbers, but is the sum of a different combination of natural numbers. Examples (TI-Basic): A+B+1 not(A+B) Non Examples: A+B-1 (for inputs 0,0, it returns ~1, which cannot be a sum ...

code-golf number

Destructible Watermelon

I got swarmed by a bunch of enemies and died

didn't help that the incubus removed my armor...

second best playthrough

Pavel

Have you played Realm of the Mad God?

Destructible Watermelon

I think

it kind of sucked

  2       1548  __-Sam-Hum-Fem-Law was poisoned in The
                Dungeons of Doom on level 5.  Poisoned by a killer
                bee.                                                    -  [66]

apparently I play better when I'm blind

I think I died from bad luck, but I don't know

Pavel

@DestructibleWatermelon No, it's great. You probably tried to go inland to fast died.

Destructible Watermelon

1:55 AM

no, it was just boring

I don't remember dying

wat

holy crap

omgubuntu.co.uk/2016/08/download-arc-theme-windows-10

Pavel

^-^

PhiNotPi

2:24 AM

This is totally the wrong room to ask this... but how does one write in "active voice" but without using the pronouns "I" "we" etc.?

Pavel

What are you trying to rewrite in active voice?

Destructible Watermelon

@PhiNotPi "The dog bit the postal carrier."

is in active voice

basically just don't use "by the"

@PhiNotPi write it from third person

PhiNotPi

This is for a lab report. For an example of why I'm running into issues, consider the two sentences "The sampling rate was set to 20 Hz" vs. "We set the sampling rate to 20 Hz." The first is passive (I think) while the second uses a pronoun.

wat

why do you need active voice?

Destructible Watermelon

^ ninja

I was about to say that

Pavel

2:30 AM

Generally, you're expected to use passive voice in no more than 5% of sentences.

Destructible Watermelon

yeah, but it is a pretty dumb rule

Pavel

Still, a requirement is a requirement.

PhiNotPi

The main reason is that the instructions tell me to use active voice... but also tell me not to use pronouns.

Destructible Watermelon

do you have one of those teachers who gets upset when someone uses a preposition at the end of a sentence?

@PhiNotPi maybe you should ask why they have such a dumb rule

maybe you can write "having set the sampling rate to 20 hertz, etc. etc."

PhiNotPi

@DestructibleWatermelon I really should.

Destructible Watermelon

2:33 AM

if they question you on why it seems unnatural, point out passive voice exists for a reason

ATaco

Quick, Someone find me an esolang in which a blank program compares two numbers.

Destructible Watermelon

no

Pavel

Nope, don't know of any.

PhiNotPi

That's gonna be a stretch.

Destructible Watermelon

define compares number

ATaco

2:35 AM

Return a unique output if they're equal and a different unique output if they're not.

Destructible Watermelon

define find?

Pavel

Is this for a challenge?

ATaco

...Maybe

Destructible Watermelon

if not input(): print(input()==input())
else: print(":)")

for some value of find

ATaco

That's slightly larger than 0 bytes.

Pavel

2:37 AM

It's the interpreter

Not the program

ATaco

Alright, the language needs to be older than the challenge.

Destructible Watermelon

esolangs.org/wiki/Baby_Language ?

ATaco

Well, if you find one, Claim your victory on This challenge:

codegolf.stackexchange.com/questions/109865/…

Destructible Watermelon

why is it that english teachers like making up BS rules anyway?

Pavel

So that your writing is better.

Destructible Watermelon

2:44 AM

no, that would be a rule that makes sense

ATaco

That rule is a good rule for teaching persuasive writing.

Destructible Watermelon

Mignon Fogarty also points out that "passive sentences aren't incorrect",[26] and "If you don't know who is responsible for an action, passive voice can be the best choice."[6][d]

Common English usage misconceptions

This list comprises widespread modern beliefs about English language usage that are documented by a reliable source to be myths or misconceptions. With no authoritative language academy, guidance on English language usage can come from many sources. This can create problems, as described by Reginald Close: Teachers and textbook writers often invent rules which their students and readers repeat and perpetuate. These rules are usually statements about English usage which the authors imagine to be, as a rule, true. But statements of this kind are extremely difficult to formulate both simply a...

ATaco

That's also true.

But generally, in persuasive writing, you're know the object responsible, and active is better fitted.

Pavel

It's not incorrect, but it doesn't make for good writing if used a lot.

ATaco

But what do I know? I'm a Taco.

Destructible Watermelon

2:50 AM

@Pavel well guess what? his teacher didn't say "use passive voice sparingly", did they?

Pavel

This is a lab report, I thought it goes without saying that any restriction on writing style by a science teacher is pointless?

ATaco

Teachers are taught to teach using methods of teaching that have been practiced to be the best they can be.

Destructible Watermelon

but why are dumb arbitrary rules that have no founding in reality there?

to confuse the student?

doesn't english have enough actual rules?

ATaco

English doesn't have any actual rules.

Pavel

Clearly you haven't seen how many 'actual rules' you can cram into other languages.

ATaco

2:57 AM

"Yaint"

Destructible Watermelon

@ATaco it actually does

they just don't teach many of them

Pavel

Yes they do

Destructible Watermelon

because they're too busy teaching fake rules I guess

ATaco

English is quite a nice language in regards to not enforcing anything.

Destructible Watermelon

I know stuff about subjunctives

but I didn't get taught them in school

Pavel

2:57 AM

@ATaco That's awful, never use that.

ATaco

But it's golfy!

"You all are not" vs "Yaint"

Destructible Watermelon

on some other note

Pavel

"Y'all aren't'' is valid English.

Destructible Watermelon

what annoys me is when people use "whom" as if it is just a fancy variant of "who"

Mistah Figgins

@Pavel It is because people use it

@DestructibleWatermelon I agree

ATaco

2:59 AM

"Y'a'int"

Destructible Watermelon

it's pretentious and stupid all crammed into one

Pavel

No.

ATaco

I'd've

Mistah Figgins

If the answer to "Do people understand me when I say x?" is "yes", it's valid

Maybe not formal, but valid

ATaco

English is the best golf language.

Destructible Watermelon

3:00 AM

@ATaco no, that'd be chinese

Pavel

@MistahFiggins That's not how it works.

Destructible Watermelon

except for the fact that ascii is english characters

Mistah Figgins

@Pavel How do you define what constitutes as "valid" English

Pavel

@DestructibleWatermelon Not necessarily, they need to use 3-4 bytes per character.

Destructible Watermelon

3-4 bytes?

that'd be even better

you need to use ~5 bytes per word in english

with more words too

ATaco

3:01 AM

你們都不是 15 Bytes, Yaint 5 bytes.

Destructible Watermelon

@ATaco yaint makes 0 sense though

that'd be like going

Pavel

I suppose we do ignore StdErr output on this site.

ATaco

It makes perfect sense.

Destructible Watermelon

asdjsadkhgas - some golf language where this is actually valid, foo bytes

%@$ - python, 3 bytes

Pavel

That's a comment.

Mistah Figgins

3:03 AM

@DestructibleWatermelon contraction of "you aint" which is a contraction of "you are not"

ATaco

"You all are not" breaks down into "Y'all ain't" which further breaks down into "Y`a'in't"

Destructible Watermelon

well, don't they teach you anything at school?

you use apostrophes in contractions!

Mistah Figgins

i think youre wrong, i dont think theyre necessary. :P /s

Pavel

If you leave out the apostrophe, you'll be understood, but you'll generate more warnings than C.

ATaco

Also, the English is you all are not which is only 13 bytes, 2 less than the Chinese.

Pavel

3:06 AM

Have you tried UTF-16?

You can get the Chinese down to 10 bytes.

DJMcMayhem

Vim tied retina. :)

Pavel

@DJMcMayhem Tied Retina for what?

DJMcMayhem

The notcalc challenge

Pavel

Well, it's not really a number based challenge, is it? You're just comparing Strings for equality.

DJMcMayhem

No, no need to compare them

Pavel

3:11 AM

Regex, 7 bytes: (.+) \0

Anonymous

3:47 AM

Jan 27 at 3:03, by Mego

It's one thing to have actual criticisms against Node to use in making jokes. It's another thing entirely to blindly mimic what others say in an attempt to be funny.

Anonymous

s/Node/English/

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Create a Simple Dog Program Your challenge is to write a Dog program. A dog program is a program that waits until a cat program is run and interrupts it with a bark causing it to fail. Cat Program A cat program, for the uninitiated, should take input and output it. You may write your own cat...

ATaco

@Mego I'm confident when I say that English's rules are only for Literature, and in common use, the rules fly out the window.

Anonymous

@ATaco They're not even for literature. Plenty of authors make common "errors" in their writing that almost nobody realizes are "errors". I use "errors" in quotes because the only true error in language is failing to communicate what you intend to communicate.

ATaco

Very well said.

Pavel

4:14 AM

@Mego I'd say we were having an actual, reasonable discussion about English grammar. I'm not sure why you're complaining.

Sherlock9

4:57 AM

I've discovered an error in my answer to the aesthetically pleasing divisor tree challenge that is going to take so long to fix, that it is tempting just to modify the specification, since I'm the only answer using ASCII art so far

The trouble this would be modifying the specification four months later

Pavel

Aren't there only two answers?

Sherlock9

Yes there are. Mine and another with a graphical-output answer

Pavel

So changing the spec won't break any existing answers.

Which means it's allowed

Sherlock9

It still feels like cheating because the part of the spec I need to change is "Any two nodes on the same level of the tree should have a minimum of two spaces between them. At the same time, any two nodes on the same level of the tree should have as few spaces between them as possible."

The "as few spaces between nodes" part is going to murder me

I could say any two branches should have as few spaces between them

... That would probably look nicer actually

Pavel

It'll be fine.

Sherlock9

5:07 AM

Alright, then. Brb editing

Pavel

5:17 AM

Does while :;if pgrep -x "cat" > /dev/null; echo yip! look like valid Bash? I'm kind of new to it.

Matthew Roh

5:32 AM

I dont know

But I wouldn't mind trying it

(I have Linux Subsystem for Windows)

betseg

@Pavel needs do-done

while condition; do etc; done

Pavel

Right. I can't actually run bash right now.

Does if need do-done?

betseg

It needs then

Riker

@flawr omfg r/dndgreentext is amazing

Can't link BC mobile

betseg

if foo; then bar; else baz; ^^^

ATaco

5:38 AM

Oh, I've got Moderator tools now.

Pavel

while :;do if pgrep -x "cat" > /dev/null; then echo yip!;done

betseg

No idea what pgrep -x "cat" does, but loop looks OK to me

ATaco

Process, Exists cat
if (ErrorLevel){
    Process, Close cat
    MsgBox yip!
}

Autohotkey Solution

Pavel

@betseg It gives the pid of every process called cat, that is it checks if cat is running.

betseg

Oh, for the dog challenge thing

Pavel

5:42 AM

@ATaco Fails if the program being cat'd contains just yip!

ATaco

MsgBox doesn't STDOUT it.

It interupts Uniquely.

Pavel

Huh, I wonder if that's valid.

I had the brilliant idea of alias cat='echo yip!' but no, doesn't quite work.

betseg

It's like #define in C

ATaco

alias cat="echo yip!>borf.txt"

(Fails if yip! is cat'd and piped to borf.txt)

Pavel

You aren't allowed to write to files

Anonymous

5:47 AM

@Sherlock9 It would be cheating IMO if you merely changed the rules to accompany your answer. However, since your rule change also has the benefit of making nicer-looking output, and probably will make it easier for other answers as well, I think it's fine.

wat

Why is hackintosh so hard D:

I keep running into the error "Still waiting for root device" and garbled text

Anonymous

Because Apple really really really doesn't want people installing OS X on non-Apple devices

wat

Someone even made a guide for my exact laptop with the exact version I want to install

insanelymac.com/forum/topic/…

Pavel

It's hard on purpose.

wat

but it's still doing this BS thing that I can't explain.

ugh... time to start patching the DSDT. I don't even know what the DSDT is

Pavel

5:49 AM

You should stop installing Mac

It isn't healthy.

wat

don't worry I'm doing it on a different hard drive

Anonymous

Apple is all about the aesthetics (to the point where their stuff is nearly form over function), so they want to lock down the hardware as much as possible so they don't have as many variables and thus can make aesthetically-pleasing software easier

Anonymous

@wat That is a very very bad idea

betseg

@Pavel I think this works: tio.run/nexus/…

Anonymous

Modifying a mobo's firmware is a great way to brick it

wat

5:50 AM

I got a version of OSX working (Yosemite Zone) but I would like to do a legal-ish hackintosh

Pavel

No, they want to force people to buy they're computers. Simple as that.

wat

@Mego No, that's not the...

Basically you use a bootloader called Clover that injects the correct information, basically fakes out the OS to make it seeApple hardware

Right now I have it set to a MacBookPro6,2 which has almost the same hardware as my laptop

Anonymous

I don't know why I typed hard drive instead of mobo. I guess I was connecting that thought to my recent hard drive issues (which turned out to be a faulty pin on the power connector)

wat

I need to patch the dsdt.aml file that it loads to get it to recognize the USB controller that my flash drive is connected to so that it can load the installer

The guide explains most of this but people are still having issues. I've crawled over SO MANY forum posts

@Pavel their**

Anonymous

At some point you have to ask yourself if it's worth the effort :P

wat

5:55 AM

yeah probably not

Still doing it though

Beats math homework

Pavel

@wat Sorry, I'm on my phone.

wat

@Pavel ok its fine

Pavel

The question is why Mac is being installed.

wat

because I want to

also, trying to investigate certificate issues with my website on mac

Pavel

Ah

Sherlock9

6:07 AM

@Mego See I was worried about part one. That was very close to my original intent. Everything after was rationalization, and I'm lucky that it does make for nicer output and easier answering in the future

My original intent being "This is going to be a royal pain in the ass. What's the smallest edit I can make so I don't have to do this?"

Pavel

I just noticed that someone starred the recent NewSandboxedPosts post for the dog program, but didn't upvote the actual post >_>

Destructible Watermelon

because it's interesting but not ready yet?

Pavel

6:27 AM

I've been following a chain of crossed out 4 is still regular 4 ;( links, and I'm wondering where the end is supposed to be.

Oh no found it.

wat

well, I patched the DSDT.

let's see what happens

Pavel

Did it work?

wat

just testing

Pavel

a-~b evaluates to a+b+1 in Java. Is this normal or do I not understand bitwise not?

wat

OMGWTF IT ACTUALLY KINDA WORKS

it got past where it was crashing before

Pavel

6:33 AM

Well, getting to post is half the battle!

wat

YESS THE INSTALLER SHOWED UP

Pavel

Good for you

wat

erasing HDD and installing now! This is awesome!

Pavel

Incoming bork in 3...2...1...

wat

only the keyboard does not work

let me hook up a USB one

Pavel

6:35 AM

There it is!

wat

works

Pavel

Stop crushing my memes ;-;

wat

Installing now, "about 8 minutes remaining"

I don't really believe it but still

Pavel

Do you have the correct video drivers and everything?

wat

yeah nvidia is pretty well supported since the MacBookPro6,2 has nvidia drivers

I am not looking forward to configuring kexts

Atleast you can install updates with this method...

also, after this finishes and is confirmed working, I am taking a disk image

Pavel

6:43 AM

Probably smart

wat

or not, I don't have 160GB space left. Looks like I took too many disk images

Pavel

How many do you need ..?

wat

160GB

that is the size of my HDD in my laptop right now

Pavel

No, how many disk images do you need.

I mean really, it's not a common thing you generally need to do.

wat

a few

Pavel

6:46 AM

You could probably kill some old ones.

Matthew Roh

tru

Pavel

Wait, didn't you just wipe this drive?

wat

there's my old Windows installation that I wiped (160GB), my flash drive that I wiped to install OSX and will restore soon (64GB), all my VMs, etc.

@Pavel yeah but it was the one that had Yosemite Zone on it (a hackintosh distro)

Distros are illegal and so I did not want to continue using one

Pavel

You should switch OSs less frequently.

wat

@Pavel I have 3 hard drives that I swap out. Windows, Linux, and now Mac

I don't use the Windows one much because it glitches out my display when it goes to sleep

Pavel

6:50 AM

Maybe you should clear it?

If you need Windows, try a fresh install.

wat

I did that

That's why I have a disk image of my old Windows install

Matthew Roh

Also you might feel better to dual boot

wat

@MatthewRoh not enough storage space

Matthew Roh

oh really

wat

all my laptop hard drives are <500GB

Pavel

6:51 AM

OSes don't take up 250 GB

Matthew Roh

If I were you I would get an external hard drive

wat

one is 120GB, one is 160GB, one is 320GB

@Pavel My files do

@MatthewRoh Why?

Matthew Roh

Cause why not

wat

This laptop only supports up to USB 2.0

also, no $$$$

Pavel

Sata to USB adapter?

Then you can reuse your existing drives.

Matthew Roh

6:53 AM

That sounds legit

also I found pcie to usb adapters which looks legit

wat

I have an eSATA port though, so I can just get a SATA to eSATA cable and then get a SATA to eSATA adapter for my desktop.

Also, I can use an express card.

Matthew Roh

~~Just no M.2 to usb adapters pls~~

wat

@MatthewRoh why not?

Matthew Roh

idk really

wat

an M.2 card with a USB header on it seems really helpful for ex. Mini ITX desktops or for someone who doesn't want to use PCIE slots

Matthew Roh

6:55 AM

never have found one

Pavel

@wat Huh, external SATA of any kind is unusual.

But convenient, in this case.

wat

@MatthewRoh huh?

what do you mean?

also why do you keep crossing things out

meh

...you're 13, right?

right

6:57 AM

i see

Matthew Roh

I hate those screws which looks like the flag of israel

there is not even a screwdriver which fits in

(no, not even hexagonal ones)

wat

(honestly at 15 i'm not much better)

@MatthewRoh Torx?

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