The Nineteenth Byte

zyabin101

9:02 PM

@ErikGolferエリックゴルファー You hacked into /opt/?!

Dennis

@Downgoat status-declined

Hacked? If /opt wasn't world readable, how would you be able to run programs?

zyabin101

Oh.

Dennis

@betseg Link me to it please, preferrably in talk.tryitonline.net.

ErikGolferエリックゴルファー

@zyabin101 tio.run/nexus/bash#@59TrKCfX1Dy/z8A

quartata

9:40 PM

My evidently too subtle way of asking y'all to stop constructing random sentences about goats and pinging people

7

Anonymous

Can we please do something about the noise? I don't really care if the noise-makers stop on their own or are kicked, but the last page or so of the transcript is nearly 100% noise.

Dennis

What Mego said.

quartata

@Mego Judging by the disappearing avatars I think action has already been taken

Gabriel Benamy

What do you mean by noise?

Dennis

Mindless chatter about goats and cheeses.

Anonymous

9:47 PM

@GabrielBenamy Look at the messages and ask yourself, "does this add anything to the room?" If the answer is no, it's noise.

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

"0 seconds" :P

Anonymous

What really irks me is it's always the same 2-5 users

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@Mego 2-5 is a big range.

Anonymous

(2-5 because the number of them that are online and spewing nonsense into the chat varies throughout the day)

Dennis

I'd trash the nonsense, but it's not possible from mobile.

TuxCopter

9:49 PM

Switch to the computer interface?

Anonymous

Unfortunately you're the only mod/RO around

Anonymous

You could use the desktop site and trash it

quartata

@TuxCopter Really hard on a phone

Anonymous

But trying to use the desktop chat on mobile is terrible

quartata

I've tried myself

TuxCopter

9:50 PM

But I guess it's near to unusable on mobile

Dennis

Not the only one.

@Mego Nope. You have to hold down Shift or Ctrl to trash multiple messages.

Anonymous

@Dennis Eugh

Dennis

Yeah...

TuxCopter

@Dennis ...

El'endia Starman

→ 39 messages moved to Trash

Anonymous

9:51 PM

@El'endiaStarman <3

Anonymous

Thanks friend

El'endia Starman

And yeah, it's basically impossible to trash more than one message from mobile. Even with the desktop site.

Anonymous

@ErikGolferエリックゴルファー Must you and zyabin point that out every single time?

TuxCopter

SE should really enhance the chat interface

El'endia Starman

@ErikGolferエリックゴルファー Side effect of moving messages.

TuxCopter

9:52 PM

@ErikGolferエリックゴルファー -.-

Anonymous

You're just making more noise, which will mean more trashed messages, which means more invites...

Anonymous

If you don't want to be invited to the Trash room, don't fill up the chat with nonsense

Anonymous

It's that simple

quartata

Just did a benchmark and I'm kind of astounded how slow exceptions are in C++.

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@Dennis Okay, now what was that second kick for?

El'endia Starman

9:54 PM

@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC Wasn't him.

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@El'endiaStarman It was you?

El'endia Starman

I kicked you because you clearly didn't learn anything from the first kick.

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@El'endiaStarman Why not?

quartata

My own version with long jumps adds a little extra overhead but is way faster when an exception is actually thrown

Benchmark                 Time           CPU Iterations
-------------------------------------------------------
benchmark_main/1         14 ns         14 ns   51302699
benchmark_main/0         19 ns         19 ns   36378579

Doorknob

@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC Well, you're the only one who can answer that question, aren't you?

quartata

9:55 PM

vs

Benchmark                 Time           CPU Iterations
-------------------------------------------------------
benchmark_main/1         10 ns         10 ns   69624244
benchmark_main/0       1818 ns       1820 ns     372752

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

I posted a pic showing why SE should round up their kick times

El'endia Starman

@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC Your reaction to the kick was more like "oh lol I got kicked" than "oh shoot, I should probably be less noisy".

Anonymous

@El'endiaStarman I forgot the URL for your chat data explorer - could you link it for me?

quartata

Anyone know why that is exactly?

I read about how exceptions work internally and they shouldn't be that bad.

Maybe I'm benchmarking wrong

Anonymous

Maybe really bad branch prediction?

El'endia Starman

9:56 PM

@Mego TNBDE

Anonymous

@El'endiaStarman Thanks

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@El'endiaStarman I should've waited to post that pic to prevent connotations

quartata

@Mego It doesn't branch I'm told

El'endia Starman

Also, it's the second result on Google for "TNBDE" for me, which is cool.

2

quartata

Instead the compiler builds a table of places to go after an exception, so there's no overhead when you enter the try and nothing bad happens

Anonymous

9:57 PM

@El'endiaStarman I couldn't remember the acronym :P

Anonymous

@quartata I dunno then. Probably extra safety features that you're leaving out in your benchmark

El'endia Starman

@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC The picture wasn't the only thing. You responded to Mego saying "it's the same 2-5 users each time" with "2-5 is a big range", which was not a constructive comment.

quartata

Yeah, my version has an enum for exceptions, they're not objects. but I can't see that possibly adding that much

catch only gets a pointer back so it's not copying anything

Anonymous

Blame gremlins, I guess

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@El'endiaStarman ok

El'endia Starman

10:00 PM

I mostly just care about whether you're going to add more value to TNB or add more noise.

quartata

@Mego Gonna try a better benchmark here

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@El'endiaStarman OK, I'll think a little before I hit send next time

El'endia Starman

@Mego What sort of query were you thinking of making (or running)?

@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC Yes, please.

Anonymous

@El'endiaStarman Nothing yet. I'm organizing my bookmarks and realized I didn't have one for TNBDE.

El'endia Starman

@Mego Oh, yippee! :P

Anonymous

10:03 PM

Alright now, calm down Anakin. You're going to make repressed memories resurface.

El'endia Starman

> I don't like sand. It's rough and irritating and it gets everywhere!

Fatalize

that's why he didn't get on Scarrif

too much sand

El'endia Starman

Eyyy fellow person who watched Rogue One! :D

Fatalize

probably watched it before you, was out on the 14th here

Ha!

El'endia Starman

>_<

At least I got to watch it as part of a company holiday party. :D

flawr

10:05 PM

Oh, how's your job going by the way??

El'endia Starman

It's awesome. :D

flawr

On a scale from 1 to 10?

El'endia Starman

Perks are great and the work I'm doing feels very natural. Mostly because I've been doing similar stuff for the last eight years or so...

@flawr Mmm, probably a 9. Maybe a 10. I don't really know for sure what a 10 would be like.

Fatalize

How many days off do you have?

flawr

That's cool, and the people are great?

@El'endiaStarman I forgot to specify a base I just noticed.

El'endia Starman

10:07 PM

@flawr People seem great so far.

quartata

Are you working primarily with Django?

flawr

@El'endiaStarman Usually the most important factor in my experience:)

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@El'endiaStarman How time-pressured are you, from 1 to 10? (5 being having to occasionally take a task home)

El'endia Starman

@Fatalize I think I get 1.67 days off per month, and then there's paid holidays from WB and Agora gives me an additional week of vacation time.

betseg

Good night

Fatalize

10:08 PM

"1.67 days off per month" wat

so 20.04 days?

El'endia Starman

@Fatalize Yes, 20 days off per year.

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

+ extra 7

Fatalize

"I would like to take 0.96 hour off please"

El'endia Starman

@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC Hmm, 3 I guess. I brought my work laptop computer home this weekend mostly because I still wanted to do a little work.

why

10:09 PM

@El'endiaStarman Getting stuff done before it's due is always nice :)

El'endia Starman

@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC More like 20+10+7 altogether (considering paid holidays).

n4melyh4xor

"you think we can't → we'll always find a way (math logic)"

thanks excel, really didn't see that

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@El'endiaStarman Wait, so almost 1/10 of the year?

El'endia Starman

@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC The project I'm working on doesn't really have a due date. It's just forecasted to take roughly three months altogether. I did the first step in about a week or so.

n4melyh4xor

speaking of excel, I have this shitty word/phrase/pun/whatchamacallit

wanna hear it?

El'endia Starman

10:12 PM

Puns are always welcome.

n4melyh4xor

...I excel at Excel but I can't access Access

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@El'endiaStarman So, what do you actually do?

Associate Software Engineer vs. Regular Software Engineer

TuxCopter

TIL in vim a macro name can be any letter, not just q

I feel stupid to learn this only now .-.

El'endia Starman

@quartata Actually, no. They rolled their own request manager (is that the right term?) that's probably more like Flask. I've been working on moving their internal API from being usable only by their website to being usable externally.

quartata

@El'endiaStarman Interesting.

El'endia Starman

10:14 PM

@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC I think that at this point, the difference is primarily experience and pay. There aren't really any clear boundaries between the work people do, though they usually get assigned work in certain areas.

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@El'endiaStarman What are you usually assigned to then?

El'endia Starman

@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC Right now I'm working on opening up their internal API so it's externally accessible.

And writing tests. Lots of tests. :P

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

does it involve databases alot?

El'endia Starman

I haven't been doing any direct database work, but I did/do need to have some idea of how they work.

Looking back at the whiteboarding part of my interview, they were mostly interested in how I did regarding the flow and exchange of ideas. Apparently, I did pretty well at that.

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

Management is doing something weird.

Gotta write docs?

El'endia Starman

10:18 PM

Haven't had to write any docs yet, though I'm sure I will.

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@El'endiaStarman How do they do VCS?

TuxCopter

You ask a lot of questions

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

GH? PRs? Issues?

@TuxCopter yes, yes I do.

TuxCopter

GH is not a VCS. Git is a VCS.

El'endia Starman

@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC Git.

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

10:24 PM

@El'endiaStarman Direct commit? Issue management? Branching?

Flp.Tkc

@ETHproductions is it intentional that you can get NaN in cubix like this?

El'endia Starman

@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC Branches with QA before merging.

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@TuxCopter GitHub, BitBucket, custom git server, etc.? (cannot find a noun that can describe all those things, so question is in form of list with etc.)

TuxCopter

GH is a git server

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

...

@TuxCopter not a custom git server

TuxCopter

10:27 PM

Depend on how you define 'custom'

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@TuxCopter Translation: 429 Too Many Requests

El'endia Starman

I think of GitHub as a very convenient wrapper of sorts on git. It's not necessary to do version control, even among multiple people.

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

451 Unavailable For Legal Reasons (translated from) NDA

GitHub is the best.

@El'endiaStarman what do they use?

El'endia Starman

GitHub. :P

TuxCopter

@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC Please let's not start a flame war

Doorknob

10:29 PM

I did a practice programming exercise in O(1), and when I looked at the analysis the solution they gave was O(n^3). >_<

5

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@TuxCopter Didn't know that was a battle.

El'endia Starman

@Doorknob Mayhaps you've accrued too much programming experience... :P

TuxCopter

You said 'GitHub is the best'

El'endia Starman

What was the exercise?

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@TuxCopter Didn't know github vs. bitbucket vs. whatever was a thing

@Doorknob You should probably get off that site...

TuxCopter

10:30 PM

It is probably a thing

@Doorknob ... .-.

ErikGolferエリックゴルファー

@Doorknob O(1)? Wow, that's really evil. I don't think anyone would have ever done that in O(1).

Doorknob

@El'endiaStarman This one

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@Doorknob You're doing the same ones I am!

The intended solution is to match the level of real contestants at that level though

Doorknob

The training site doesn't let you progress to harder problems until you've solved all the ones before :P

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

I'm actually trying to compete - the real thing is tomorrow

Doorknob

10:33 PM

The real thing has started already!

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

I know, I'm starting tomorrow.

El'endia Starman

@Doorknob Oh yeah, I can see how you'd get an O(1) solution.

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

Move to a higher tier of problems

Doorknob

@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC I did bronze and silver yesterday, but I'm kinda scared to move on to gold so I'm going through the training problems first :P

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@Doorknob You'd probably be in the team if it weren't for your age

Doorknob

10:36 PM

What team? (Also, isn't this whole thing intended for high schoolers?)

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@Doorknob the international team; high school or lower

El'endia Starman

@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC: I am starting to find your obsession disturbing.

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@El'endiaStarman I was trying to get to your website and found that.

TuxCopter

Huh ɾ renders with an understroke in gvim

Doorknob

@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC Oh. I probably would have done this earlier if I knew it existed, but I doubt I would have been able to get anywhere near that far anyway

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

10:40 PM

@Doorknob Pst... any tips for me? (on doing USACO)

Doorknob

I dunno, like I said, this is my first time and I haven't started gold yet :P

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@Doorknob I'm trying to beat bronze... (after the tier change)

Last problem I tried, I got an O(n) solution but it took me over 3 hours to code

Three hour time limit on the real thing.

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

10:54 PM

I looked at the intended solution and the algorithm was exactly the same, but the code was wayyyyyy shorter

New Main Posts

0

Q: Column-wise Sum

Given a nonempty list of nonempty rows of numbers, compute the column wise sum, which is another list that has the length of the longest input row. The first entry of the output list is the sum of all the first entires of the input rows, the second one is the sum of all the second elements (if av...

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

@Doorknob

New Main Posts

11:13 PM

1

Q: Output subdivisions of international standard paper sizes

ISO Paper Sizes Defined: The A series paper sizes are defined by the following requirements: The length divided by the width is the square root of 2. The A0 size has an area of 1 unit. Each subsequent size A(n) is defined as A(n-1) cut in half parallel to its shorter sides. Task: given an ...

code-golf graphical-output recursion

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

11:38 PM

Is putting this as background plot in a challenge a bad idea?

> In the nation of Occupied Americastan, there are two parties: goats and ducks.

Fatalize

If this is the background, then yes absolutely

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

In a quote box, without critical information.

Dennis

Wrapping the challenge in a story isn't necesarrily a bad thing, but consider that most users on main aren't TNB regulars, and even those are starting to get tired of goats.

And I'm saying starting to to be polite.

El'endia Starman

To put it another way, "goat" is the new "avocad".

flawr

Please do not summon the dead.

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

11:51 PM

@Dennis I need two non-political party names.

New Sandboxed Posts

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Yahtzee - The optimal strategy This is just a very rough idea, and there's a whole lot missing. I'm just curious if this can be a good idea: The Yahtzee score card is known to most. If not, please have a look at the link. The way I usually play this game is called "Free", as opposed to "Forc...

flawr

@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC birthday- and bachelors-

Dennis

@noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC Then be original and make something up. The Free People of Americastan and the Americastanian Liberation Front or whatever.

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

Is "rams" and "monkeys" good?

@Dennis Hm, good idea.

"Americastanian Liberation Front" should be the name of the rebel group.

Dennis

Has the advantage of the ALF acronym.

noɥʇʎPʎzɐɹC

11:54 PM

## *Briefing:*

> **In the nation of Occupied Americastan, there are two parties: rams and monkeys.**
>
> ---
> *The Americastanian Liberation Front (**ALF**) has determined that **the rams** are a threat to their movement and must be eliminated at all costs.*

@Dennis I'm having some trouble... any good names?

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