The Nineteenth Byte

emanresu A

12:13 AM

Since the supposed tips for golfing in <all languages> question is really a "tips for golfing in C-like imperative praclangs", I had the idea of posting a tips question specifically for golfing languages - the sort of tricks that are generally applicable when you have extremely concise access to stuff like base conversion, complex array operations, specific mathematical operations, etc, especially when they're all the same length. Thoughts?

Many answers here are very far from applying to a majority of languages. — xigoi Feb 3, 2021 at 14:09

Unrelated String

Sounds like a good idea to me

noodle person

1:10 AM

+1

ATaco

CMC: Colour the input Pink. Bonus internet points for not just using ANSI escape codes.

Even more bonus points if it sparkles

Bubbler

1:27 AM

define "sparkles"

SO does have doing something close in css

ATaco

I was thinking more random tiny flashes, but let your creative spirit shine

Bbrk24

@ATaco JS: console.log('%c%s','color:pink',prompt())

%c is "CSS"

lyxal

5:29 AM

Either people have misunderstood the meaning of "Pros", or only masochists enjoy using Mongoose

The Empty String Photographer

6:17 AM

@att Humans are considered electrical devices as they have nerves which use electricity.

Unrelated String

6:39 AM

Looked at some size charts because I was considering buying another T-shirt online and realized... by chest measurement, I'm literally on the small end of medium, and this whole time I've been treating larges as snug

I guess losing 21 pounds in the last 3 months'll do that :P

Dredged up an ancient medium from my dresser and it's a very comfortable fit... actually uncanny seeing sleeves that don't just kinda droop and hang there...

Not sure if I like it or not LMAO

Themoonisacheese

7:11 AM

> well documented
> actually terrible documentation

Unrelated String

JSON

l4m2

Any language with more freedom than C++?

att

7:34 AM

in what sense

192927376337929292283737373773

7:57 AM

Interestingly global ignore does not work with transcripts.

@TheEmptyStringPhotographer Just make a program to support computers.

Sandbox Posts

9:28 AM

0

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Raster peekaboo - do you see me or not? The input is any kind of quadratic raster representation, any side-length (within reasonable limits), it can be a csv, a string, a bmp, ...; The input contains the following distinct entities (representations defined by the solution, BYOP-Bring your own pro...

emanresu A

9:48 AM

Didn't we have a codidact challenges feed here at some point?

Oh also codidact somehow inherited the same mathjax rendering search bug from SE lol

caird coinheringaahin g

@emanresuA We did, seems to have vanished tho

emanresu A

... I swear if some SE employee sneakily removed it for "advertising external sites"...

caird coinheringaahin g

Can't see any change to feeds in chat search

Feeds

emanresu A has made a change to the feeds posted into this room

emanresu A

Anyway I've put it back

... did it just vanish again?

caird coinheringaahin g

9:52 AM

Yes

emanresu A

._.

caird coinheringaahin g

Are codidact feeds banned??

Feeds

emanresu A has made a change to the feeds posted into this room

emanresu A

So in theory this should magically disappear in a moment

... yep

caird coinheringaahin g

Mother Meta?

emanresu A

9:53 AM

I'll do a little more testing in a test room first but yeah

caird coinheringaahin g

Actually, lemme try something

Add in the feed again

Feeds

emanresu A has made a change to the feeds posted into this room

emanresu A

Ah, event logging?

caird coinheringaahin g

Nah, creating the feed as a user (chat.stackexchange.com/users/-1262/feeds-5582#)

Still removes it

emanresu A

It's possible that it's just feeds external to SE

Or that someone goofed and broke feed modification and no one's noticed for the past four months

For the record here's the feed we had posting it: chat.stackexchange.com/users/-1164/codidact-posts

caird coinheringaahin g

9:57 AM

It's last post was June 30th: chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/240?m=65880553#65880553

emanresu A

Or maybe that's an entirely different one because it definitely posted more than two messages

nvm

weird, in my test room nothing seems to have changed

One possibility is that they put a hard cap of 6 on the number of feeds recently as part of the chat restructure

But that doesn't make much sense considering the codidact feed predates hello world / similar

@cairdcoinheringaahing The only feed-related bug report I can find on MM is from before then:

18

Q: Feeds do not seem to post updates in chat

The last feed activity in The Meta Room on Stack Overflow is from 2024-06-14. The bot has not posted about new questions in the room since then, even though there have been at least 13 more. Some from the same day as the last post. This affects https://chat.stackoverflow.com it does not affect ht...

And that's clearly unrelated to feeds being shadow-removed

Also, fun fact: there's no frontend char limit on the feed url box and you just get a 500 if you attempt to add a too-long URL

Themoonisacheese

fun

emanresu A

~~I wonder what happens if I put 4 million As in there~~

everything seems to work fine in my test room... I'ma do a little more fiddling here

Feeds

emanresu A has made a change to the feeds posted into this room

Themoonisacheese

most normal 1rep puzzling.SE user: i.sstatic.net/yPXCvh0w.png

emanresu A

10:10 AM

Aand the codidact feed got randomly removed and the random google.com one didn't :\

I'm trying to find a website aside from codidact with a functional RSS feed and I feel old

Themoonisacheese

lemmy has rss feeds :)

emanresu A

Would you mind posting a functional RSS feed url here please

Anything will do, I just need to test whether it's specifically codidact

Redz

@emanresuA How did you get that to work in the first place anyway?

emanresu A

Chat has a weird featureish called "long replies" where multiline replies starting with a newline get markdown formatting

Might've been patched now

in theory this _should_ be formatted properly
*fingers crossed*

It appears they did patch it

Anyway guess what happens when you have a server trying to format a 4-million-char string in a way that bypasses all existing length limits

Redz

Ah

Another chat feature makes sense

emanresu A

10:29 AM

an example of a functional one

Redz

cool

lyxal

10:44 AM

@emanresuA how long does it take to disappear?

caird coinheringaahin g

Seems to be around 30 seconds?

lyxal

Odd, I tried it in my own testing room and it's still there

Feeds

lyxal has made a change to the feeds posted into this room

emanresu A

same, it's specifically here for some reason

lyxal

Gonna see if it goes away again

caird coinheringaahin g

10:47 AM

It's gone

emanresu A

Weird request but would you mind trying it in TGC

caird coinheringaahin g

Specifically, the Codidact one, not the Google one

lyxal

One tick

Added

Still there

Feeds

emanresu A has made a change to the feeds posted into this room

emanresu A

One more test: is it specifically this feed or just codidact being blacklisted in general

Feeds

10:50 AM

lyxal has made a change to the feeds posted into this room

lyxal

Also testing a normal feed

Feeds

lyxal has made a change to the feeds posted into this room

lyxal

I edited the google one into the codegolf.codidact.com/categories/49/feed.rss

emanresu A

Interesting, seems to be staying (I'll leave it for a bit though)

Interestingly that seems to have not formatted the title correctly - where it would be "codidact new posts" or whatever it's just the URL

Once again chat feeds are cursed and no one uses them enough to realise

lyxal

@emanresuA iirc titles are set when it's turned into a user

I did not make it a user

emanresu A

10:56 AM

But when directly adding the codidact feed without making it a user it formatted the title

(how do you make it a user anyway?)

caird coinheringaahin g

Mods do it

We have a "Create New User" button next to each feed

emanresu A

Ah

Feeds

emanresu A has made a change to the feeds posted into this room

lyxal

11 powers :p

emanresu A

So yeah if I add a new version of the codidact feed it gets correctly formatted

caird coinheringaahin g

10:57 AM

192927376337929292283737373773

Do we wait.

lyxal

@emanresuA doesn't in my testing room

emanresu A

wat

lyxal

emanresu A

... doesn't in mine either

lyxal

10:59 AM

Perhaps somehow in the formatting it causes an error

caird coinheringaahin g

Okay, someone take this to meta, either CGCC or Main

I'm gonna nuke all the extra feeds, cause there's plenty of evidence around now

Feeds

caird coinheringaahin g has stopped a feed from being posted into this room

emanresu A

Aight, I have half a MM post already, one moment

Feeds

caird coinheringaahin g has stopped a feed from being posted into this room

lyxal

My money is on weird bug causing it to auto delete because something is wrong with formatting

Error correction rather than something sinister

emanresu A

11:01 AM

I sure hope that's the case

lyxal

@cairdcoinheringaahing noooo my free advertising 😭 :p

@emanresuA can't wait to see some of the mse regulars have a field day with this :p

emanresu A

Also I'm pretty sure we discovered at least three other minor bugs with the RSS feeds along the way :p

192927376337929292283737373773

This is a secret plot by the Stack Exchange company. You cannot suppress me anymore. I know everything on this. You cannot censor me ANYMORE!

DOWN WITH THE DEEP STATE!

emanresu A

There's a bit more testing I'd like to do for the sake of curiosity, but we've done enough and this is enough for a bug report

... huh

Also is this new? (the suggested tags thing)

lyxal

11:21 AM

@emanresuA well that's definitely fixed because I used a .atom feed while testing

emanresu A

Anyway uh yeah

0

Q: Adding a specific feed to a specific chatroom randomly deletes it

In Code Golf's main chatroom, The Nineteenth Byte, we used to have a feed posting new challenges from our sister site Code Golf Codidact, specifically the RSS feed https://codegolf.codidact.com/categories/49/feed.rss. Up until a month or two ago, this worked, but somewhere between June 30th and t...

bug chat feed

rydwolf

Just got here what's up with the feeds?

emanresu A

many things

Our codidact feed disappeared like a month ago and we're trying to figure out why/how

rydwolf

I can add another feed to NPSP if y'all want

emanresu A

We'll see - If all it is is a bug that's quickly patched, there's not much point and we can just re-add it, but if it's just ignored for a while sure

rydwolf

11:35 AM

I guess another option would be just echoing the RSS feed on another domain, maybe with a formatting change if SE can't understand something about codidact's exact formatting

'cause I realized a full on bot would be unable to do one boxing like the RSS feeds can do

emanresu A

... right, unless you did something really janky with giving a bot mod powers and making it edit a feeds message that it forced to be posted

... why do I even have ideas

rydwolf

I think in my senior year of college, I'm gonna try to teach a student-taught course on code golf

emanresu A

Ooooooh

rydwolf

12:19 PM

CMSR: Sympathy is a Knife by Charli XCX

The rest of the album isn't much my taste but this one song is like the exact sorta ear-candy emo shit that makes NeX GEn so good

Themoonisacheese

12:53 PM

didn't someone make a chat.SE android app somewhat recently? what happened with that?

Unrelated String

1:43 PM

Are those new rydwolf pronouns I smell

lyxal

no

web.archive.org/web/20240229195420/https://…

> (he/him, they/them is also fine)

been like that for years

Unrelated String

Ah

So just condensing that :P

(because I swear the chat bio was just he/him last I checked)

lyxal

2:32 PM

@user get in here

new attempt from SE to activate you just dropped

rydwolf

3:08 PM

I feel like there's a semantic difference between (he/him, they/them is also fine) and he/they, idrk tho

Also I love the objectifying corporate language of "acquiring" and "activating" users lmao

Seggan

@Bbrk24 oh wow never realized that existed

@TheEmptyStringPhotographer humans are not devices

Ginger

@rydwolf funnier interpretation: user is a SE sleeper agent

rydwolf

@Seggan yeah I think I once knew but that's so wacky

@Ginger user is a transformer

we all think he's a human-shaped robot, but he's actually going to turn into a car

Ginger

I may have initially parsed that as "transformer (electrical component)" and not "transformer (cartoon robot)"

rydwolf

user is tightly wound and makes scary buzzing noises when hooked up to the grid

Ginger

3:14 PM

same

Themoonisacheese

@lyxal i want to reply so bad because i feel like my perspective makes sense as a newly activated user but i feel like that's just yelling into the void

rydwolf

Do it, worst case scenario you get some meta rep :p

Unrelated String

@rydwolf Yeah, like "I prefer he/him or otherwise accord it the status of my canonical pronoun set, but will take absolutely no offense to they/them" versus giving both sets similar status

rydwolf

yep

Unrelated String

And the latter also carries the sort of pragmatic implication that "I feel like both sets reflect my identity to some respect", as opposed to "one set directly reflects my identity but I don't really care"

The Empty String Photographer

3:30 PM

@Seggan they use electricity so I’m afraid they count as electronic devices. They can also perform computations.

Themoonisacheese

i should have left work 40 minutes ago but wrote this instead meta.stackexchange.com/a/402814/1144159

i feel like it is very much too rambly but hey

The Empty String Photographer

4:15 PM

Why are chat priveliges at 20 rep?

Why can’t they be something like 5 rep?

rydwolf

What would y'all say my skills and strengths are?

I'm remarkably good at forgetting everything about myself as soon as I need to write a resume

user

4:35 PM

@lyxal Good, good, my time has come. For years, I have waited, but now, finally, I can do whatever I want

Which means I will continue doing what I was doing before because I'm lazy af

@rydwolf Quick learner, won't give up in the face of really stupid decisions by other people

Ginger

~~or your own stupid decisions~~

user

lol

Just say stupid decisions and don't let them know they're your own

rydwolf

Actually that could kinda fall under "quick learner"..."I learn by failing quickly"

user

Genius

The only way to grow is by making mistakes, and let me tell you, I'm a grower

rydwolf

user

4:38 PM

I'm reading that as "I am Spong, from the kingdom of Knowledge. I am here to challenge whoever is currently in this position"

@Ginger I do sleep a lot

rydwolf

5:41 PM

What adjective should I put before "student" in my resume?

Tried "chaotic-neutral", "self-replicating", and "indivisible, under god, with liberty and justice for all" but none worked that well

we love gooble

"Industrious and multi-disciplinary" sounds kinda sick actually

That would be a good word for that one xkcd...

"industrious as shit" brings up two results and "fucking industrious" brings up hentai

I don't know what else I expected

rydwolf

6:11 PM

Movie plot: One of the government's top agents, an intimidating, sharply dressed man with decades of experience as a spy and hitman, is sent to do a multiple-years-long mission with the fate of the country at stake. Only issue is, for some reason, the only way his handlers can communicate with him is via a 6-year old, who can teleport, but can't bring any objects along. The spy has to get a normal job, live a normal-looking life, and carry out an intensely demanding secret operation, (1/2)

but all of his orders and support are filtered through a 6-year old

So he shows up to job interviews with a resume typed by a kindergartener, has a credit card that's a stick figure drawn on a piece of cardstock that the NSA somehow made actually work, etc.

And since he's a brilliant and experienced agent, he manages to hide it all under a very comical veil of incompetence, and only saves the day through sheer luck (saving the CEO of the company that he bombed an interview on from a date that's going terribly and getting hired for PR, for example), which increasingly infuriates him due to his incredible skill going to waste

Maybe throw in a love interest too to make it even more chaotic

192927376337929292283737373773

Or better plot idea.

That I cannot say here.

rydwolf

why's that?

rydwolf

7:09 PM

so I might've rearranged a few words without rereading the paragraph and implied I have a decade of professional experience in software lmao

luckily I caught it before the career fair (but not before wasting 2 color print credits)

Ginger

I love how there are three different tools for doing incremental parsing of programming languages in the browser and they all use different grammar files

- lezer (codemirror)
- tree-sitter (vscode)
- whatever highlight.js is on

rydwolf

I can see at least four ways this could go

ᵃᵗ ˡᵉᵃˢᵗ ᵒⁿᵉ ᶦⁿᵛᵒˡᵛᵉˢ ᵃ ᵖᵃᶜᵏᵃᵍᵉ ᵐᵃⁿᵃᵍᵉʳ

Ginger

what would those ways be :p

rydwolf

- You making a converter between the existing formats
- You making a custom fourth format and compilers which turn it into the existing ones
- You making some sort of abstract monstrosity that accepts meta-grammar files that describe new grammar file formats, and a package manager for those
- The above just being a complaint and not advance warning of some project

do you think superman has lezer vidsion

Ginger

7:24 PM

well, the reason this is bothering me is the example program on the Vyxal website

which is currently a read-only CodeMirror instance

rydwolf

ahhh

Ginger

because our syntax highlighting is a lezer grammar which isn't compatible (afaik) with anything except codemirror, because nobody bothered to make it compatible

rydwolf

How complex is the grammar?

Ginger

and including a giant library exclusively to generate some HTML and CSS that will never change feels like overkill

rydwolf

Back-end rendering with Node.js maybe?

Ginger

7:26 PM

@rydwolf not too complex, but we already have a Scala parser and a Lezer grammar and I'd rather not add a secret third thing

@rydwolf we're hosting on Pages, there's no backend :p

The Empty String Photographer

Welcome to the Centrist Democratic People’s Coding Duchy Republic of Code Golf And Coding Challenges Coding Messaging Board Country! I officially declare this as an independent state with me as the 1st president! Next election taking place in 100,000 years.

Ginger

what I'm considering doing is making a Webpack plugin which renders the HTML when the site is compiled

rydwolf

Render once then copy-and-paste the styled spans? :p

Ginger

but that's proving to be difficult

rydwolf

oh or that, which is more maintainable lol

Ginger

7:27 PM

@rydwolf don't tempt me lol

rydwolf

Doing work on the client that could be done on the server or at build time is a big pet peeve for me (main reason I dislike mathjax), so I support your endeavor

Ginger

the problem with Webpack loaders- well, for this usecase- is that they accept one (1) input and return one (1) output

and I need three inputs: the code, a parser, and a highlighter

the highlighter can be kept in the config file, but the parser needs to be generated from the grammar, which is actually something we're doing already

so I have to figure out how to use the parser that we're generating in my loader

Webpack is pretty smart, I think if I can wire up a dependency between the grammar file and the code file it'll only compile the grammar once

but the challenge is doing that

@rydwolf one of the reasons the new interpreter loads in half the time of the old one despite being an order of magnitude larger by SLOC is that the old one used no build tools whatsoever and as a consequence was written like a college website from 2010 that started life as a student's CS project and metastasized into an unmaintainable horror

DLosc

@TheEmptyStringPhotographer The presidency is gonna be vacant for quite a while then

@rydwolf IDK if "chaotic-neutral" would get you a job, but I think it's the most accurate

Ginger

true

The Empty String Photographer

When is the next best-of post?

I want to nominate categories for “Best chat message” or “Best chat conversation”

DLosc

7:45 PM

@rydwolf This makes me think of Civilization III. "Hail rydwolf, leader of the Industrious and Militaristic Americans. It is the year 4000 BC..."

rydwolf

8:36 PM

included one additional v(t) in a differential equation by mistake and that's 30m of my life I'll never get back

rydwolf

10:08 PM

@DLosc Not if I learn to do mitosis

rydwolf

11:25 PM

Don't you just hate when you're out doing whatever and get sidetracked helping the navy run 911 laps around gesling stadium

oh and spacex

they did a recruiting event lol

two separate events I should clarify

spacex then navy

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