The Nineteenth Byte

Syxer

10:00 PM

@Sparr Thus the reason for advertising - asking for people to sign up and such.

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

A language isn't inherently better than another if both are turing complete

Martin Ender

@RohanJhunjhunwala I don't think they're perfect yet, but they're definitely influenced by what features are commonly needed in this community

Sparr

@RohanJhunjhunwala the last couple of years of golf-specific esolangs that pack in overloading are much denser than the stuff of even a few years ago

@RohanJhunjhunwala that's nonsense. look up "turing tarpit". there are languages that are turing complete but intentionally hard to accomplish things in. and I don't mean hard like brainfuck. I mean hard, in ways that make brainfuck look like python.

Martin Ender

@Sparr you could just put it up for votes in the community ads

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@MartinEnder sorry, I misused the word perfect, but I meant to ask if they are compact enough to be considered similarly close to optimal?

Syxer

10:01 PM

@MartinEnder <- This is what I mean. @Sparr

That formatting was terrible, apologies.

Sparr

@MartinEnder I don't even know what that means

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@Sparr oh, yes of course There are harder languages. But I meant that people often fight over "Language A is better than B" and there usually is no right answer. There are turing Tarpits like malbodge that are so hard that programming something reasonable might take until the heat death of the universe

Sparr

blog.stackoverflow.com/2011/05/community-promotion-ads ?

DJMcMayhem

@RohanJhunjhunwala but the thing is, "optimal" is heavily influenced by the task

TùxCräftîñg

37

Q: Community Promotion Ads - 2016

You've graduated... a while ago. This is quite overdue, but let us not wait any longer. We present to you, Community Promotion Ads! What are Community Promotion Ads? Community Promotion Ads are community-vetted advertisements that will show up on the main site, in the right sidebar. The purpose...

@Sparr

Sparr

10:02 PM

@DJMcMayhem optimal as measured by every codegolf question ever asked anywhere before is a pretty decent generalized "optimal"

Syxer

@Sparr I assume that you would make this non-revenue generating, yes?

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@DJMcMayhem yup, I agree it depends on where u optimize the language spec towards

Martin Ender

@RohanJhunjhunwala that's really hard to say. An optimal language would have every byte stream be a valid program with useful programs corresponding to short byte streams without many equivalent programs.

Sparr

@Syxer probably under the wing of some non profit organization

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@MartinEnder yeah

Martin Ender

10:03 PM

As impressive as Jelly is, I'm sure there is a lot of room between it and this (unachievable) optimum

Syxer

@MartinEnder Don't forget about METALANG.

Sparr

"a lot of room" is relative, and I'd say not linearly

Syxer

Or is that an infinite number of languages? I don't properly remember.

TùxCräftîñg

for the every byte stream being a valid and useful program, this look like a meta-lang

Sparr

Jelly and the other "every operator works on every type and does something useful" compactified languages are at least halfway from python to optimal

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

10:04 PM

Certainly

Sparr

I've been intrigued by the different languages' decisions about what constants to include as single characters

Syxer

Meta question AWAY!:

0

Q: Site ads based on conferences made by users of said site

I come over from PPCG, and a few of the people in chat are talking about organizing a conference of sorts. This conference would have direct links to the PPCG site (what with coming from the site and all). Say that a conference was to be held by a SE user relating to an SE site, with no revenue ...

discussion support advertising community-promotion-ads

Sparr

most of them have a byte for the integer ten

some have twelve through fifteen, or twenty through hundred by tens

some have a constant for the string "abcd...z"

TùxCräftîñg

i think the minimum constants are: 10, 100, empty string, pi, phi, lowercase/uppercase/both alphabet

Martin Ender

@Sparr Jelly has powers of 10

Syxer

10:08 PM

Don't forget about multi-stacking! (although it has proven ineffective for me so far. :( )

@TùxCräftîñg I have two of these :D

TùxCräftîñg

which cnostants?

DJMcMayhem

I have 0 of them... ;_;

TùxCräftîñg

;_;

Syxer

@TùxCräftîñg 10 and pi. No strings can really be a "constant" in my language since everything is considered as a float.

TùxCräftîñg

ak

DJMcMayhem

10:10 PM

Everything's a float? O_o well that's new

DLosc

@TùxCräftîñg Not sure why phi is on this list; but other than that, Pip has all of these.

flawr

@DJMcMayhem Everything afloat? No, everything drowning.

DLosc

(Though uppercase alphabet and pi are two bytes each.)

orlp

chat mini challenge, write the shortest C expression given variable x, y such that

TùxCräftîñg

solution: COME TO THE DARK SIDE... Ư̢̨̨̯̠͖̟̰͚̌̎̉̈̀̾̓̾̒ͅÑ̮̖̜͔̝̗͙̝̫̈͂̂̎̑͑̓̒͝ͅI̜͍̭̞̣̹̞͙̹͑͐͑͒̉̉̋̄̊͠ͅC̰͓̥̫̟̱̅̊͆͛̓̀̓̍́͋‌̱͎̥̣Ơ̹̖̮̬̹̱̰̪̠̌̌̏͌̍̈́̓͘͠ͅD̡̠̲̘̦̩͙̼̻̖̉̎̂͋̾̃̓̈̌͠E̢̠̱̺̗̣͕͇̟̼͑̌̏͒͒̈́̒͘̚͝

orlp

10:11 PM

x  y   r
2, 1 = 0
0, 3 = 0
1, 3 = 4
2, 0 = 4
3, 1 = 8
0, 2 = 8
1, 2 = 12
3, 0 = 12

you can ignore any other input combinations

DJMcMayhem

wat

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

0

A: Site ads based on conferences made by users of said site

Yes A sight specific "community promotion add" is created with the primary intention of promoting a community, and serving content which the users of that community would be interested in. If an add about a conference receives enough votes to be displayed, then I see no reason to exclude it from...

flawr

@TùxCräftîñg Does Unicode have a side other than the dark one?

4

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

</self-promtion>

MY first meta answer

TùxCräftîñg

@flawr idk why i added of

Syxer

10:12 PM

@DJMcMayhem Not really - I just round and cast for strings.

DLosc

@orlp This looks familiar. Is it for the pipes screensaver question?

orlp

@DLosc yes

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

No love for my meta answer?

Sparr

@TùxCräftîñg phi seems arbitrary. it's 2-4 characters to compute in most dense esolangs. why not e?

DJMcMayhem

It's like 2 minutes old, give us some time to read it

TùxCräftîñg

10:14 PM

becuz phi is a greek letter and greek iz cool

Syxer

@TùxCräftîñg I actually do have e as well. >.>

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@DJMcMayhem oh, sorry

TùxCräftîñg

@RohanJhunjhunwala why do you wirte sight instead of ~~sight~~ site everywhere?

Sparr

@orlp I'll try that...

Rohan Jhunjhunwala

@TùxCräftîñg idk

Syxer

10:19 PM

wow look at that meta rep

@Downgoat I found you in a HNP!

Sparr

@orlp first try: x+y==3?x%2?12:0:x%3>0?4:8

Syxer

@Sparr I would be very interested in assisting with the creation of this conference. Shall I make a chat room?

orlp

@Sparr can be shortened a bit

x+y^3?x%3?4:8:x%2*12

Sparr

sure

DJMcMayhem

Alright @Syxer Answered

Sparr

10:28 PM

I was looking down the avenue of an answer of the format 4*...

hoping to add together a few boolean values to get 0/1/2/3

@Syxer probably not [yet]. stackexchange chat isn't a good format for planning events

if this happens, there will be a mailing list

Beta Decay

Hey, as long as I get the inputs together, this challenge is ready to go isn't it?

13

A: Sandbox for Proposed Challenges

Is it a bird, is it a plane? code-challenge image Challenge Supplied an image, you must determine if the subject of the image is a bird or a plane. If the image is a bird, your program must output bird and if the image is a plane, your program must output plane Your program must produce...

Syxer

@Sparr Ping me in chat or something with a link if you decide to go through with this, I'd love to see this through. :)

Sparr

will do

Syxer

@BetaDecay test-battery?

flawr

@BetaDecay I have another input for you:

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