2:00 PM
TBH, I think you are wasting time trying to implement a tiebreaker like this.

really?
I should just do it randomly?

The whole point of the other 99% of the process is so that the tiebreaker is almost never used.

@Zgarb I've been looking at the seemingly chaotic map `f(x) = x - 1/x` ... You don't happen to know if it has a name and has been studied (or where to look)? I can't find it in Wikipedia's list of chaotic maps, and I want to make sure the chaos I'm seeing doesn't really from floating point inaccuracies blowing up.

The tiebreaker only exists because one of the requirements of a voting procedure is to assign a strict order in all cases.
Even when the votes are tied.

its also fun to write difficult algorithms :P

2:02 PM
Is this for your KotH thing?

yeah

Random tiebreakers have been fairly well received in the past
But... that was because losing one of your team of 100 people didn't matter much

I say, in a case like A>B>C>D, D>E>A, you just randomly pick between the interpretations.
Or, if there's any sense of "margin of victory" go with that.

well, its actually, really hard to handle that case
because, I have a list of equality groups
so to break an equality group, I need to put it somewhere
so I would need to assign "E" to a random equality group
I think if I don't have complete ballots, I'm just going to do random tiebreakers

Suggestion: take each pair of candidates in the new ballot, randomize that list, and enforce them in that order.
D>E, E>A, D>A ---> randomize ---> E>A, D>A, D>E ---> E>A is enforced

2:09 PM
oh, I had another question. Often times we care about results being reproducible, which means that I'm allowing random to be seeded
should I use the seeded random to generate the tournaments, or only to run the games?

@NathanMerrill Your games need to be deterministic, according to my Koth standards. Use seeded random to run the games.

right, but do you also care about the tournaments being deterministic?
(the orderings of the games)

@NathanMerrill try looking over this page, there's some pseudocode on it: alumnus.caltech.edu/~seppley/MAM%20procedure%20definition.htm

but thank you

okay
What do think of the randomize list idea above?

2:16 PM
it would work, but too complicated for what I want to do
I'd have to maintain a set of "added candidates", and if they are in that set, randomly determine where they go
it has a couple of (workable) problems, such as: what if its E>B?
assuming first ballot of A>B>C>D

At this point, it's probably best just to make a random tiebreaker.

exactly

Then do that.

`function tiebreaker(candidates){return "TimmyD wins!"}`

@TimmyD Invalid.

2:26 PM
It's pseudocode.
Implementation is left as an exercise for the reader.

Reason 1: Tiebreaker is biased towards 1 specific candidates.
Reason 2: No usage of the candidates parameter.

Reason 3: Invalid return type (str but needed int).
@TimmyD Was funny but not now.

ಠ_ಠ ... xkcd is always funny ... ಠ_ಠ

@TimmyD But using xkcd in code golf is never funny.

2:30 PM
Good thing this isn't a code golf answer, then, but rather a KotH framework. ;-)

@zyabin101 Valid 1: It still is a tiebreaker
Valid 2: you don't HAVE to use your parameters, even if it is ugly to not

@Katenkyo Invalid 4: It is not a valid tiebreaker per the three reasons above.

Valid 3: no return type specified

@Katenkyo Returned value is index of the winning candidate, which is int.

@zyabin101 How did you interpret that out of that pseudocode?

2:35 PM
@zyabin101 a string is perfectly acceptable as a return in this case in my language(Lua) :D

57% of the respondents to the straw poll use Windows. :D

Windows is a great OS, user-friendly and widely spread

PowerShell is great and does all things.

Yes, really usefull
The problem comes when you have to build a script that could be used on some old winXP computers... Still have to write those in Batch :/

Why no one talks with Marky? ;(

### ♦Beep Boop Maggot

Bot testing

2:50 PM
He `_UNK`ed at me too much

@TimmyD Yeah, the same way as windows.
I would use powershell if it didn't mean using windows, sorry.

@EasterlyIrk you don't need to use PowerShell if you don't use Windows, that's a nonsense ^^
PowerShell's object can sometimes be great, but it can become much more complicated than a bash script where you only handle strings

3:05 PM
Yeah, it's a tradeoff. Personally, I like not having to calculate out a `grep` or regex statement everytime I'm passing info from command to command

Are snippets allowed by default? i.e. only run in a REPL?

@TimmyD Yeah, that's pretty nice, but have you tried manipulating Export-CSV for instance.... A hell lot more complicated than just formating datas by hand...

Marky is being annoying again.
ಠ_____________UNK__________________ಠ

It's too bad that you're forced to be in the bot chat rooms

I GOT IT
HE _UNKED
@feersum Me, or Marky?
@CoolestVeto sorry to inform you that vitsy won't be president, but Trump probably will.

3:21 PM
@CᴏɴᴏʀO'Bʀɪᴇɴ I posted cat and TM in NTFJ.

@CᴏɴᴏʀO'Bʀɪᴇɴ how to print stuff in jolf?

I also have a 106-byte solution to "Hello, World!". Would you like me to post that separately, or update your solution with it?

From a moment in our life when stars abounded:
@CᴏɴᴏʀO'Bʀɪᴇɴ correction: How to get the full list of printable chars? please tell me you remembered a short variable for that.

@Katenkyo I have. (I've actually created several custom reports for internal use here at work.) Not sure what sorts of difficulty you're having, but it's not terribly complicated. It's much like other things in PowerShell, and strongly follows GIGO principles.

@EasterlyIrk I'm having trouble just getting a double-digit number :P

3:34 PM
@TimmyD My troubles was about the layer of complication needed, for instance, a simple matrix of value cannot be passed to it, you have to use a custom PSObject... which is sad :/

Oh, yeah. But, that follows standard PowerShell pipeline practices, so I can see why they designed it that way, but you're right -- "just export the damn matrix" is cumbersome

This type of things fall under the category of "too lazy implementing multiple types of input" for me

`(\$matrix |%{\$I=\$_;(0..\$_.count|%{\$I[\$_]})-join','})-join"`n" | Out-File foo.csv`

@MartinBüttner I must admit that continuous dynamics is not my strong point... but a quick search for famous chaotic systems didn't turn up anything.

Or alternatively ...
`(\$matrix |%{(\$_|%{\$_})-join','})-join"`n" | Out-File foo.csv`

3:42 PM
@TimmyD Exactly what I did, except you'd want to `| Out-File foo.csv -Encode UTF-8` because some program that may use this CSV won't support an other type of encoding

Sure sure

1

This is a window: --- | | --- Let's add some walls |. Put two spaces on either side of it so that the window has plenty of room. | --- | | | | | | --- | Now let's add a roof and a ceiling. To keep the window in the middle of the room, let's add one more row above it and below it. ---...

@NewMainPosts This challenge looks fun to do, but don't have the time right now :'(

4:01 PM
@ETHproductions :(
@CᴏɴᴏʀO'Bʀɪᴇɴ witness our complaints.

Question: when BigDecimal refers to precision, does that mean the number of decimal places beneath the decimal point or the total number of places?

IDK

@CoolestVeto I think it correspond to the total number of places (the total size of this type is bigger than a Float or Double)

Ew. ಠ_ಠ That means I have to manually find the lowest precision.

Moreover, I don't see how you could increase the number of decimal places without increasing the total number of places, as decimal numbers are encoded like scientific numbers

4:10 PM
Whats a good word for "the function a line of a program is in"? The surrounding function? The current function?

@HelkaHomba I ' m not sure what you mean...

The current enviroment?

@Katenkyo e.g. "When the `return` statement is encountered the ______ function ends it's execution*

s/_____//
Just the function.

4:13 PM
enclosing

@feersum I like that, thanks

`return new Rational(this.mainComp.multiply(augend.divisor).add(augend.mainComp.multiply(divisor)), this.divisor.multiply(augend.divisor));`
This is totally logical code, what are you talking about?
XD

Oh, Hi VTC

ohai
How's it going?

4:16 PM
@CoolestVeto oh dear

Why is everyone changing their names after I did?

@CoolestVeto my longest return statement ever was approximately 300 char long...

@Katenkyo I probably could do that, but I'm not sure I want to ternary that much...
@HelkaHomba We did it in your honor. o~o
Also because I always change, once per month.

@CoolestVeto return "Ternary is love" `and` "Ternary is life" `or` "What about quadnary?"

ಠ_ಠ

4:19 PM
This is probably my longest return statement.
`if(Polygon.npoints < 3) return new Polygon(new int[]{image.getMinX(),image.getMinX() + image.getWidth(), image.getMinX(), image.getMinX() + image.getWidth()},new int[]{image.getMinY(), image.getMinY(),image.getMinY() - image.getHeight(),image.getMinY() - image.getHeight()},4);`

@Katenkyo Fun fact: that's correct AppleScript syntax.
@AquaTart O.o

Runner up:
`return (e instanceof EntityPlayer ? MatrixUtil.binarySearch(entities, e, ServerGlobals.g) : meniscus - 1);`
Doubles as making no sense whatsoever

@CoolestVeto That's also correct (and the only) lua syntax for a ternary :)
@AquaTart you were lazy about reducing it x)

This was before code golf.

Question: what's the proper method for applying modulo to fractions?

4:20 PM
The "everything is an expression" part of F# makes this a bit... unfair, I guess?

Who names variables `meniscus` and `waldo` anyways

@CoolestVeto modulo only apply to integers

Since it means that I've written functions where the return is technically just one biiig expression =P

Clearly I was drunk or something

Also, I have to go, by everyone :)

4:21 PM
@Katenkyo bai
Perhaps not modulo, but the remainder of division, then.

Collection initialization comes to mind, too

9 answers away from code golf silver.

```let someRandomFunction a b c =
match a, b, c with
| Some a, _, _ ->
[|
a
2
3
|]
| _, Some b, Some c ->
[|
1
b
c
|]
| _, _, _ ->
Array.empty```
That's technically just one return statement, the `match`

Are those... errors? D:

4:29 PM
Yup.

Ouch =P

@CoolestVeto Subtract out the number until you can't anymore like normal. e.g. `7 mod 2 = 5 mod 2 = 3 mod 2 = 1 -> `7.8 mod 2.2 = 5.6 mod 2.2 = 3.4 mod 2.2 = 1.2`

@HelkaHomba I found a builtin class. x.x
I was implementing BigRational... when it already existed.
>.> Abandoned.

wat

4:45 PM
@CoolestVeto Dude in a boat.
`o-)`

ERRORS FIXED.
(and the bug testing begins...)

@flawr I starred all three of them.

Lol, I unstarred all of them^^
But I was admittedly the first one to star them, so it is nice to see what dynamic we've got here=)

* 10 ಠ_ಠ - 18h ago by Zach Gates
* 10 ಠ_ಠ - 18h ago by Zach Gates
* 9 ಠ_ಠ - 18h ago by Zach Gates

4:49 PM
That third one is just stupid, so I didn't star it.

@MorganThrapp Agreed. Darn repost.

@Roujo Plus, the kerning is all wrong on that one.

* 11 ಠ_ಠ - 18h ago by Zach Gates
* 10 ಠ_ಠ - 18h ago by Zach Gates
* 10 ಠ_ಠ - 18h ago by Zach Gates

@AlexA. This one is for you: youtube.com/watch?v=WUk4yYvK09k

4:52 PM
My new Marky brain isn't being very nice so far:
in Beep Boop Maggot, 47 secs ago, by Marky Markov
@SetBigO you're not a good man.
:/

@SetBigO Bigot.SE

Oh that's nice.

Anyway: How frequently can you change your SE name?

>_>
Once every 30 days.

ninja'd

4:53 PM
That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

@SetBigO Right, all you're doing is changing your parent user, isn't it =P

I'm not sure if I'm not sure if that's a good way to do it, but I'm not sure what you mean.

```		case "prime":
Apfloat n = top();
rmtop();
if (n.truncate().compareTo(n) != 0) {
push(new Apfloat(0));
break;
}
if (n.compareTo(new Apfloat(2)) < 0) {
push(new Apfloat(0));
break;
} else if (n.compareTo(new Apfloat(2)) == 0 || n.compareTo(new Apfloat(3)) == 0) {
push(new Apfloat(1));
break;
} else if (n.mod(new Apfloat(2)).compareTo(Apfloat.ZERO) == 0 || n.mod(new Apfloat(3)).compareTo(Apfloat.ZERO) == 0) {
push(new Apfloat(0));
break;
}
AAAAAH!
Prime testing is the worst now.

A pint is an eighth of a gallon. You shouldn't need sqrt() to figure it out :P

ಠ_ಠ

5:03 PM
[Meanwhile, in the metric system]

This is legitimately awful.
It's going to be nightmarish figuring this out. :I

@Roujo Hmm, maybe, maybe not.

@Roujo Ordering a half-liter of beer/ale just doesn't have the same charm.

@SetBigO True enough. Which is why you order 500 cl! =D

ಠ_ಠ It's still losing precision.

5:06 PM
500 cl? Isn't that, like, a lot?

cl = cubic liters?

It's outputting stuff like 6e1. ಠ_ಠ

I know of cc = cubic centimeters.

I assumed centiliters (even though I know nobody who uses that), but that would still be 5 liters o_o

haha, yeah

5:07 PM
@Roujo This should be mL.

Litres is capital.

@EasterlyIrk Explain?
Is @CoolestVeto VTC?

/me forces 100 long precision.
@CᴏɴᴏʀO'Bʀɪᴇɴ ya. :D

I like the name! And profile pic too!

5:13 PM
@SetBigO Right, dammit. It should be 50 cl.

Meanwhile, in imperial it's "a pint" :P

Yeah, I agree entirely =P

Metric is great for some things, don't get me wrong. But some things really are simpler in imperial.

And have a couple at home, too
@SetBigO Agreed. Which is why we use both here in Canada! =P
In Québec, anyway
Distances? Kilometers. Height? Feet and inches.
Product weight? Kilograms. Personal weight? Pounds.
Temperature? Ehhh... Body temp is either Celcius or Fahrenheit, depending on age. Outside temp is Celcius, unless we're talking about the water in the pool in which cas it's Fahrenheit
Speed is in km/h, but the vernacular still contains expressions like "a hundred miles per hour" to indicate something that's really fast
Bagged milk comes in gallons, although they're marked in liters. Boxed milk is in liters entirely. Beer is in pints...

That's worse than all-imperial.

5:26 PM
This is bs.
I converted to Apfloat and it doesn't work.
So now, after I deleted my own Rational type, I have to make it again, because the program doesn't do what the API says it should.
I hate everything.

Moral of the story: don't delete your stuff?

I suppose.
I'm gonna go for a bit so I don't do this:

5:48 PM
@CoolestVeto Source control ftw?

@Roujo It was mid-update. Eh. It's not really necessary yet.

@SetBigO Does your kid enjoy playing magic? And how old is he again?
I'm trying to give advice based on experience (since MTG is kind of an investment)

I haven't started him on it yet, but he's nine.
I think he'd like it more in a couple years.

> Introduce your kids to Magic. That way they'll be too poor to do drugs.

I have a crapload of cards he can learn with, though, so the initial investment isn't so high.

5:57 PM
Ah, okay. I thought you introduced it to him already
I thought you were a good father

He used to play the Pokemon TCG with me ;)

Did he like it?
And do you remember how old he was?

Yea, but not many of his friends play, and there's only so many times you can play with Dad, if you know what I mean.
Umm, 7-8.
@BrainLot Also, there's this:
in Beep Boop Maggot, 1 hour ago, by Marky Markov
@SetBigO you're not a good man.
So now I'm questioning myself.

He really should run for president

I'd vote for him, but I'm not sure if he can. I'm fairly certain he's not 35 yet.

6:02 PM
Just set the clock on your machine to 2051

Oh, good point.
He's not having it.

62% of 21 respondents use Windows.

Not really, because the poll doesn't allow you to check multiple options. I use both Linux and Windows for various things, but I could only choose one so I chose not-windows, like any sane person would.
It's more like 62% chose windows as their favorite, regardless of what they might use.

I think a sane person would choose the one they use a majority of the time.
Unless the poll was "Which one is your favorite?"

@BrainLot I use linux at home and windows for work, so I'm honestly not sure which is the majority :/
If I could have checked both, I would have. But with the options the way they are, it gets skewed no matter what I choose.

6:10 PM
I should probably regularly do surveys.

Only if they're worded/set up better than this one >_>

I love the new captcha. Check the box for I am not a robot

Yea, it's much better than reading people's house numbers.

I'm guessing it checks the path that your mouse took and the exact spot that it clicked to determine whether or not you are a robot

Pretty much, along with timing and such. I read an article on it when they announced it a while ago.

6:13 PM
I read an article on bot detection in some game I was playing a long time ago

I've played around with bot detection, but never deep. Just really obvious stuff (for an MMO private server).

I love the use of asterisks in this email from Papa Johns:
Small 1-Topping *Pizza &
a 20oz. Drink
For Only \$7.00
Valid 10:30 a.m - 3:00 p.m ONLY
*A Small 1-Topping Pizza & 20oz. Drink
Just to show that I didn't grab text from different parts of the ad lol

@BrainLot hahaha

Woo, Shtriped finally has complete documentation!

there are likely bugs, but I finally got it written

10
this was waiting on the kitchen table when I got home today

6:55 PM
That is awesome. :D

@MartinBüttner :O

it was (warm) chocolate pudding with some cocoa on top

my girlfriend

is SO already sending out swag?
ah cool :P

6:59 PM
@NathanMerrill Mmm, edible swag...

I got that cocoa stencil a while ago

also, I just looked at your picture (like, actually looked at it), and you look nothing like I expected