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9:00 PM
@RobertHarvey don't get me started
 
@enderland That was when people finally started taking me seriously.
 
my current company is so unbelievably "checklist oriented' for stuff like that
 
@JimmyHoffa Yeah, that kinda makes sense. You're wiring up a computation, but you don't get the result until you press "play."
Hi, Andy. Nice to see you again. — Robert Harvey 21 secs ago
Aand... Gone.
 
@RobertHarvey He has been welcomed by Oblivion...again
My next one will be "One needs to not troll in order to be a good programmer"
 
user55340
That's a new topic for him.
 
9:06 PM
@MichaelT Well he does claim to be a super-genius. Gotta change it up every now and then.
 
@RobertHarvey Yeah, and in that space before "play" - you have an extremely malleable thing in the computation, you can destructure it into parts, compose other parts onto it, it's an extremely general thing a computation. In LISP macros that's what everything is, and in Haskell that's what everything is.
 
Haskell is a Lisp macro? Oh, wait.
 
I just mean, everything is a computation from the perspective of a LISP macro, and throughout Haskell everything is a computation
 
Is there such a thing as a Haskell macro, or is Haskell so first-class that it doesn't need them?
 
You need uhh..what's that word? Homoidiosomething? Homoiconicity, that's the one
to do macros right
Haskell has TemplateHaskell and QuasiQuote Haskell, which give a type of pre-processing that can do what macros do in a sense
 
psr
9:13 PM
@WorldEngineer "The original programmers of the day used toggle switches, relays, vacuum tubes, and hand-assembled everything without Git". Now that sounds like a teenager. "Before cars people, I don't know, rode bikes or something."
 
but it's not the same at all without the homoiconicity
 
user55340
@JimmyHoffa I used that the other day... the word.
 
@psr The original programmers of the day were doing single batch programs in binary.
 
user55340
Why cpu level instruction level? Why not an interpreted language? Or a language with homoiconicity? — MichaelT 20 hours ago
 
psr
I expect Roslyn to fully as good as LISP macros.
 
9:15 PM
@psr I see what you did there.
Or, more accurately, I see what you there.
 
psr
@RobertHarvey Oh thank god. Let me know ASAP.
 
the homoiconicity means that the starting representation, the ending representation, and the code that alters them, are of the same form; This means macros can effect macros, and it gives the monadic generality that a macro's result can have a macro applied to it (like how a LINQ result is an IEnumerable which can have a LINQ function applied to it; recursively composing computations because of the uniformity)
Haskell isn't homoiconic
 
Meta macros. [sound of head exploding]
 
homoiconicity means that a given operation is closed over a given program space
 
@RobertHarvey like I said, recursion

Y-Combinator

Apr 16 '13 at 16:42, 28 seconds total – 2 messages, 1 user, 0 stars

Bookmarked Apr 16 '13 at 16:42 by Jimmy Hoffa

 
9:21 PM
It all has this quality of purity about it. A purity that begins to break down when you have to start dealing with the thorniness of real-world issues like CSS incompatibilities, the aesthetics of forms, and cats walking on keyboards.
 
@RobertHarvey IO must be done, but at least there are ways to put it behind a barrier so you can enjoy that purity in as much of your code as doesn't need to interoperate with other systems. Such as code that creates computations for interoperating. :)
 
9:46 PM
@JimmyHoffa:
@supercat: You must be referring to e.g. the ability to modify mutable elements of an immutable array in some languages, notably Java and C#. My point is that if you write your code in a way that achieves immutability (i.e. by not writing to mutable objects), then you obtain the benefits of immutability, even if you don't get the enforcement of immutability. — Robert Harvey 3 mins ago
 
10:30 PM
These non-underlined links on Google are really pissing me off.
 
10:50 PM
Must have gotten the idea from Stack Exchange.
 
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