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6:00 PM
@Slereah aah gamedev has the best bug descriptions
 
There, fixed
Wrong section on the sprite set for the up animation :p
 
Off-by-one?
 
in a game I'm working on, some cars leaves milk all over the place
 
Do go on
 
Milk, the new biofuel!
 
6:01 PM
@Lasse I don't want to sound rude, so please take this in good faith. There are a lot of relevant topics to game design that are too advanced for here. People wouldn't follow, there's no point to sharing. That's fine! We all start somewhere, but you know what I mean.
 
I am intrigued now
 
If someone developed a really cool and useful heuristic for squad-tactics, I'd want to hear all about that and that would be a long convo.
 
@AlecTeal I agree with the point, but I don't agree with the conclusion; That's not a bad thing, assuming the people that don't understand won't derail the conversation much
 
I don't care if it's a long conversation, it can still be here
 
But the people here are generally very good at googling first and asking second if they don't understand an active topic
 
6:02 PM
Say someone was struggling with RTS AI - we talk about neural networks and how they actually worked in SCII. All that good stuff. That was the motivation for it.
@KevinvanderVelden they're not. I learned that with Almo's "I'll help this new guy with pointer stuff" while not knowing what a pointer was (really, I can probably find the logs), there were *s and &s everywhere. Questions like "is a pointer basically an address" and stuff like that, I want that to stay here.
 
I want everything to stay here
 
@AlecTeal was that interrupting a different topic though? I wasn't there for that
 
@Lasse I hypothesised from the lack of new blood (despite the growth of the user base) that people like me were actually being scared off because... this isn't the best chat (there's a lot of what reddit would call "circlejerks" and such) hence the second room, where I've invited the odd user.
 
@Lasse You can't just say 'some cars leave milk all over the place' and not explain it.
 
@Lokkij I thought I explained it, it's a new biofuel! The sellers think it's great because you have to go to the pumps every few days otherwise it smells terrible
 
6:06 PM
It's more interesting if left unexplained
 
@KevinvanderVelden it became a hot topic for 3 hours. I got bored and left half way through, was still going later. Now I'm not against people learning to program and stuff, and I think they should be welcome to a gamedev site. However I want a chat I check the scrollback for.
 
@AlecTeal well, the problem is, there's just not enough people to support 2 chats
 
@KevinvanderVelden I doubt that, I've been talking to people from comments and dragging them there, also Skype and emails and there's no overlap with those in here so far. As I said before I don't want this spilling over there.
I also don't want a discussion on it. I wanted to try, see what happened, and that was really it. If I get bored and forget, so be it. If it dies, nothing ventured.
As I said, mountains out of molehills.
 
Well, I can see JoshPetrie's viewpoint now
That sounds like actively trying to split the community in 2
Which, you know, the community would generally consider a bad thing
 
By bringing new blood into a separate chat room?
 
6:09 PM
Yes
 
They should be brought here
 
You don't think that if the new people like it, they may spill out in here?
 
I can see Alec's point. I don't see much harm in trying it out, honestly.
 
@Lokkij what would happen if it succeeded though?
Then we'd have 2 chatrooms for the same thing for no good (as far as I can tell) reason
 
I might have a third room to hang out in! ;)
 
6:11 PM
@KevinvanderVelden mathoverflow and math.se coincide well.
One is for "hardcore maths" and the other one is for my maths :P
 
I can see that some people who dislike the character of this room might like to join the 'more serious' room.
 
There are some users who overlap, and who switch back and forth, the odd cross post. This is smaller than that.
 
@AlecTeal they also have a larger target audience than chat =p
 
Is it best to have separate sprites for objects at rest and in movement
Currently the sprite at rest is just frame 0 of the movement sprite
 
Both have advantages
Same sprite means (probably) less resources required
 
6:13 PM
@KevinvanderVelden not if they don't follow it. Mathoverflow is for maths I cannot even read. If you don't know the basics (which is fine) you shouldn't be there. we have math.se for that.
 
I don't think many people in here will leave this room, though it could detract new people from coming into this room (which might be bad, because this room would be the more newbie-friendly room).
 
1
Q: How to make a timed delay between two lines of code in C#?

user3583094So let's say I have one line of code, and then another. How would I make a delay between those two lines of code. In case it matters any, I'm also doing this for Unity3D. I've looked everywhere, but nothing will work. Things like System.Threading.Thread.Sleep(5000); work, but they block off th...

Le sigh
Soooo many times has this been asked
 
@Lokkij this chat is linked on the site, the first on the list sorted by activity and alphabetically.
But if that was a problem, it could be addressed later.
Right now, the people like me (again, take it in good faith) are 'scared off' - I've just given it an extra hard go by clicking the "create new room" button.
 
True. I don't see much harm in trying your proposal (even though I think it might very well fail).
 
@Lokkij by every metric it is failing, what's annoying is I cannot be left to fail by Josh.
 
6:16 PM
@AlecTeal scared off ?
by us?
 
There's a core group of 4 users who stick very close together and see it as your job to teach them and have formed a circlejerk really (are there other names for this?)
I came here once in 2014, "got scared off" by the community, came back (by accident, not remembering) a year later and similar things happened.
 
SE got troll groupies?
 
What is the point of this chatroom if not teaching each other new things?
 
@AlecTeal was one of them mick?
 
No but despite that I don't want to expand on it.
I don't want a convo about it, I'm already seen as splitting the community :P
@Wardy there are a few groups, especially in the chat. As time goes on they get more and more established - I suppose this happens anywhere though.
 
6:21 PM
There are guys in here i quite like a regular discussion with, it's nice knowing they will be here if I login
 
Groups are fine (and mostly positive) as long as they're not unwelcoming to others.
 
So I was like "I don't want your politics, I don't want to learn your customs, I don't care about your views on what pointers are - I want to discuss cool stuff!"
 
Yeh i'm much the same
I ome here to chat about my game dev technical problems
if i don't get that I just go looking elsewhere
It's happened a few times
 
Same.
I don't want to talk about having a separate channel for it either BTW.
 
I find this community a bit hit and miss times because of certain peoples preferred lines of discussions
 
Would rather this chat be on topic only
@Lokkij That sort of thing is exactly why i want to be here
 
@Wardy I don't mind the social stuff, also there are different levels of ability in here. This is why I want > 1 chat.
 
@Wardy I figured this would be the perfect moment to insert a good, game(dev)-related article. :D
 
@AlecTeal ah I see what you mean
 
@Wardy did you get the invite?
 
6:26 PM
the "lets get down to business" room and then the "lets just chill" room
@AlecTeal looks like it :)
 
Also @Lokkij you'd think, but it depends on the time of day. Also that's quite accessible (from the look if it) there are some "nasty" problems with hard to chew papers that also count!
 
o/
 
user4704
@AlecTeal I'm not going to freeze the room again, but I will rename it if there's no consensus to split the chat rooms.
 
No one wants to split @JoshPetrie
 
user4704
6:29 PM
What you are doing is.
 
user4704
Regardless of whether or not you intend that.
 
What I am doing? You mean teaching Aracthor about stack variables without exceptions?
I'm surprised the community still stands.
 
user4704
You created a room that is part of GDSE and named it in a fashion that looks like it's the site's room for game engine discussion.
 
user4704
That's not something one person gets to do, that's something the GDSE community should decide.
 
You created a meta about it without my consent giving the impression I somehow endorse it that misses the purpose despite me taking a long time to explain it to you.
 
user4704
6:31 PM
I don't need your consent.
 
user4704
Anybody can create a topic on meta to discuss the site.
 
user4704
This is part of the site.
 
I've asked a community mod to intervene, please do the same. I'd really like someone impartial in on this @JoshPetrie
There's a conflict of interest when someone against it from day one is the person who presents the case to the community, and gets to ultimately do the response. But as an act of good faith, I shall put "NOT AFFILIATED WITH GDSE" in the topic.
 
user4704
Well, I tried to be as impartial as I could in the posting.
 
user4704
But our original intent was to just close the room after the two week trial period.
 
6:35 PM
@JoshPetrie as you know, mods can communicate privately with users, you could have used that facility. You could have waited until I could actually post, you could have told me you were doing it. you could have started a chat with me....
 
user4704
I'm sorry, I told you several times in our initial conversation that you should post this on meta.
 
I've changed the title anyway, I'll pin a link to this chat room, please get a community moderator involved. @JoshPetrie
I declined and gave reasons each time. This is not the place for it either Josh.
 
user4704
This is absolutely the place
 
user4704
You are ON THE SITE.
 
See another reason we need a second chat, where can people talk on topic why we're doing this?
 
user4704
6:37 PM
You need to follow the rules of the SE network and the conventions of the sub-site you're on.
 
user4704
You can't just ignore them and decline to participate in the site's community and policy-making process and then refuse to accept the decisions of that process.
 
I'm going to withdraw from this now but could you please ask a community mod to step in @JoshPetrie (or @Noctrine )
@JoshPetrie last comment: as I told you before if you don't like it talk on the main meta about getting the "create chat room button" removed.
 
user4704
The create chat button has a purpose.
 
user4704
That purpose is not to unilaterally create permanent chat rooms that appear to be alternatives the site's primary chat room.
 
See also the gaming site, there's a bunch of other chatrooms beside the bridge for specific games
 
6:40 PM
@JoshPetrie I've added a pinned comment saying this is not the main room. Again, good faith, please get that community mod.
 
Lol what type of argument is this
 
user4704
@AlecTeal One was paged a while ago.
 
@TheMuffinCoder a weird one
 
Lol I'm so confused
LOL how long has been going on
I'm going to read this from the beginning, seems humorous
 
@JoshPetrie Random thought though, if a chat room can be created with any name and becomes popular maybe the code in the site should make it permanent
most chat rooms are created then just die out from no use after a while
 
6:47 PM
@Wardy that's done by virtue of them not getting killed
I.e. a room is permanent until it's killed, it's killed when they're not used
 
user4704
Yeah.
 
So arent all rooms temporary?
 
user4704
Yup.
 
So how is what Alec is doing against the site rules in some way?
 
No such thing as permanence in system =p
 
user4704
6:48 PM
It's not against the rules.
 
user4704
If it was, this would have been over two weeks ago.
 
Oh ok ... so whats the debate about? (i feel like i missed some important detail)
 
user4704
Whether or not we should have two chat rooms.
 
And about not going ahead with it while meta is deciding
 
user4704
The part of it that relates to Alec's room is that it was the most-recent catalyst.
 
user4704
6:50 PM
And that his room as currently set up (and named) appears to be an already-sanctioned on-topic room.
 
Surely the response to that is "sure go create one, if it's popular then it'll be done, if not then it wont?"
 
user4704
Yes, that's what we said two weeks ago.
 
user4704
"We'll give this two weeks, and then we'll do something about it ("we" being the moderators)."
 
@JoshPetrie whats a sactioned room as opposed to any other room?
 
user4704
What we decided to do about it was post on meta.
 
user4704
6:51 PM
@Wardy A room on a game development site that says "game technology and internals talk here."
 
Can we stop this drama? Seriously, mountain out of a molehill.
 
arent all rooms under the sactioned guise until closed?
 
How do I invite a user to a chat? I don't see a button on the user's profile
 
Lol I love how I always come when there's drama! :D
Pretty interesting :P
 
Seriously flagger?
 
user4704
6:52 PM
@Wardy I'm not parsing that?
 
Sorry i'm not being argumentative ... just trying to determine the distinction between "sactioned" and "just any room"
 
user4704
What do you mean?
 
user4704
Oh.
 
Hey guy's I don't understand, you guys want a even more specific room (separate one)? There aren't even a lot of people here for that :P
 
6:53 PM
Also, TIL: You can only mark flags as invalid every few seconds
@TheMuffinCoder no, mostly alec wants one
Despite him not actually being an active member of this chatroom, which is the weirdest thing about it to me
 
lol then why not just ignore him then continue with that debate and stuff? :P
 
But I don't want you guys in it. <--partially in jest.
 
if all rooms are "sactioned" until the room owner closes them is the meta discussion really just a question of "can i create a room with a given name" rather than "let make a big deal about breaking up a chat room"
 
LOL
That sounds so harsh
"But I don't want you guys in it." :(
I'm sorry I'm a newbie programmer
 
2 mins ago, by Lasse
How do I invite a user to a chat? I don't see a button on the user's profile
 
6:54 PM
@TheMuffinCoder yeh that was what i was going to point out next
 
please
 
@Lasse click their name in the transcript and you'll see an "invite user to"
 
I mean on the site
 
user4704
@Wardy That would be a fair separate discussion; I think the issue of whether or not to split the room is worth having the meta post about.
 
Link it and name them in a comment.
 
user4704
6:54 PM
As we tried it before
 
Am I coming across argumentative?
 
user4704
And it would be nice to have the documentation.
 
Please don't make a separate room, I want to be in the chat with the cool kids so I can leech of their knowledge =^.^=
 
I really dont mean to
 
user4704
I don't think you are.
 
6:55 PM
ok cool :)
 
@TheMuffinCoder Don't worry, we're not going anywhere :D
 
Thx Lokkij! :D
Hey I'm also wondering
 
@JoshPetrie so if i created a room and called it "Unity Game Development" surely thats just a normal sactioned chat room?
 
Why doesn't Alec teal just go and make this separate room already
 
I did.
 
6:56 PM
Lol can i see
 
@TheMuffinCoder he did lol
 
I wanna visit :P
I'll bring cookies
 
user4704
@Wardy You could, I'd have the same questions about it.
 
As you can see none of you lot are in it. It's where I talk to people who have never participated in this chat room (so new blood, not stolen old blood)
 
user4704
But in addition to the name I see the "sanctioning" as basically having passed the community's vote for a thing that should exist and should be kept, and moderated, and so on.
 
6:58 PM
I guess the user needs to be an active chat user for being able to invite him to the chat form the main site?
 
:( I get warned about being serious even after nothing saying anything
No cookies for U Alec (>")>🍪
 
@Lasse just drop them a comment saying "wanna continue this in chat"
 
user4704
@Lasse They need a chat account to have been created, and they need the relevant reputation, I think.
 
user4704
(20 cross-site)
 
He's got 100. The issue is not gamedev related so I'm not inviting him here
 
user4704
6:59 PM
There's a super-involved process you can go through to get somebody into a room without them having 20, but it's tedious.
 
user4704
And you can only do it for a room you own, I think?
 
user4704
I never got it to work right.
 
Lol I don't see the need for more chatrooms :P Most of them are all empty to the point where the users could just pm each other instead
 
lol
 
Fixed
 
7:03 PM
@JoshPetrie what, setting them to explicit write access? Yeah that's roomowner/mod
 
user4704
Yea.
 
user4704
But the last time I tried doing that it didn't seem to work (or the user got bored and wandered away from the computer while I was screwing around).
 
@JoshPetrie ah that helps clarify
I guess then my thinking is that sactioned should mean (in the spirit of the community) for a room: Any room deemed popular enough to survive a long period of time without being removed for inactivity
 
YEAH I FINALLY FIXED IT
 
in such a situation that room is then "owned by" anyone with high enough rep
 
7:06 PM
I have a thing that spits out code from parsed C++ (via libclang, I am not insane)
 
user4704
@Wardy I'd consider that acceptable too, since that's sort of the community de-facto voting on meta to do it.
 
And I was having an issue with nameless structs/unions and such, finally worked it out
 
user4704
But that has to actually happen; it can't happen artificially.
 
Hmmm ok
 
user4704
@KevinvanderVelden What issue?
 
7:07 PM
I wouldn't even raise a meta on it ... if it was me I would just create a room and see what happens
 
@KevinvanderVelden linkme! I've never EVER done parsing C++ stuff because I thought it'd be too complex (even with a library) and usually go the other way.
@Wardy - SAME!
 
@JoshPetrie I basically wanted a list of all useable variables in a class, which with unions explodes
 
user4704
@Wardy That's fine, but after a certain point it has to either go to meta or accept death.
 
From nanovg:
struct NVGcolor {
	union {
		float rgba[4];
		struct {
			float r,g,b,a;
		};
	};
};
 
@JoshPetrie seems reasonable to me
 
7:09 PM
It thought that it was one set of usable variables (rgba, r, g, b, a) versus 2 sets (rgba and (r, g, b, a) )
So the python bindings it spit out required 5 arguments to create an NVGcolor, versus either 1 or 4
@AlecTeal it's a fairly new thing that compilers started thinking "You know, we might wanna provide a library for this shit", I use libclang via the python bindings myself
(Via cygwin)
 
user4704
7:25 PM
How reasonable is libclang these days? I poked at it a few years back but it was still pretty inscrutable.
 
user4704
(I was working on a project using the LLVM APIs recently though, and they're pretty good.)
 
I use the python bindings which are... okay
They have an iteration layer over it versus the visitor api that clang provides
And from that I basically have a mapping of cursor "kind" to a class
I basically have this is a mapping pastebin.com/PrJ7u6B3
 
user4704
7:42 PM
Huh, I finally got the MacVim dictation bug to reproduce in insert mode
 
8:11 PM
Hmm memory leaks
Always fun!
 
user92578
lol yes
 
Hmm, python isn't calling my tp_dealloc function
 
user92578
I used to have a leak detector hooked up but I think it broke a while ago
 
user92578
Now I bet Im leaking like the insert funny metaphora
 
Pip
uh huh
 
8:46 PM
Hmm crap, static value initialisation order is undefined, right
That means template < typename T > const String TypeToString< T* >::Value = TypeToString< T >::Value + L" *"; is undefined :(
 
hmmm ok you can do some really wierd shit with normals
 
user4704
@KevinvanderVelden Across TUs, yes.
 
 
@JoshPetrie yeah it's different translation units
@Wardy fission!
UUh, fusion! Almost the same thing
 
pretty cool huh
i created my very own big bang
next up ... a universe
if i generate a perfect sphere mesh around {0,0,0} then would it be safe to say that the normals for that mesh should be the normalised value for the vert to which the normal is associated?
in other words is this correct ...
for (int i = 0; i < mesh.vertexCount; i++)
    mesh.normals[i] = mesh.vertices[i].normalized;
 
9:03 PM
dang it
Having some collision problems trying to negociate corners in diagonals
Oh wait, that's not even accurate
Even straight lines fuck up!
Hm, I think it might be a problem with the case of a 0 pixel margin
if the right side is exactly 32 pixels from the left, it still counts it as being from the next tile
 
ah thx
so my understanding of normals is correct then
so ... that means my math is correct and thus my code is correct for the normals
that leaves me with another question
 
Why isn't it working? =p
 
How do I determine the amount of light on an object as unity seems to think my generated planet is pretty much always dark ... very dark!
 
Unity is not designed for cosmic scale
 
9:11 PM
yeh tell me about it
 
its odd
if i gen no normals at all it does this thing where the planet is light on 1 side
 
Not really odd
 
when i gen what I believe are the correct normals it goes completely dark
 
Just because you don't gen normals doesn't mean that unity doesn't have normals
Probably (0,0,0), which get normlized to (1,0,0) (or whatever, 1 axis positive or negative 1)
Which is then basically "if the light is to the left: lit, otherwise not lit"
 
9:14 PM
yeh thats the thing though
its not about the light
the light is currently to the right of my planet and the level of light changes as i rotate the planet not moving either the light or the planet
if i don't set any normals and try to debug the values vs tells me there are none
so no idea what the hell its doing
 
user4704
Try rendering them instead.
 
user4704
Like, using the normal values as the output of your fragment shader?
 
ive been using unity's debug.drawline
if i calculate them correctly drawline appears to output nothing
maybe thats my problem ... perhaps I haven't calculated them right or something?
 
user4704
Are you drawing them directly?
 
yeh
its only for debug reasons ... not for actually output
 
user4704
9:23 PM
(because normals will usually be normalized, eg., length 1, so you have to draw them by doing line(point on sphere, point on sphere + normal) for example
 
im basically drawing a line between the vertex location and the vertex location + the normal
 
user4704
k
 
for (int i = 0; i < mesh.vertexCount; i++)
    Debug.DrawLine(transform.position + mesh.vertices[i], transform.position + mesh.vertices[i] + mesh.normals[i], Color.red);
reansform.position gives the world pos for the current gameobject all mesh coords are relative to that
so if the transform pos is (0,1,0) and i have a vert at (0,0,0) im drawing a line from (0,1,0) to (0,1,0) + normal
vert pos in world space is pos + transform pos is what i meant
because all my meshes for this game object are portions of a perfect sphere I have my normals being calculated as:
mesh.normals[i] = mesh.vertices[i].normalized;
 
user4704
And normals[i] looks like a sane value?
 
Temporary just to confirm i'm going the right way and this should work fine for a perfect sphere
let me debug one out
hmmm great
now VS can't find any unity instances
jeez
hmmm ok currently they are all {0,0,0} that explains a lot
hmmm that's interesting
its not actually setting the normals
wierd
Got it
thx @JoshPetrie ... just needed a pointer to look at the right thing
 
user4704
9:53 PM
np
 
woo, collision detection works okay
 
Pip
nice!
What engine and/or framework, or are you rolling your own?
(Just 'cause I haven't seen you around before :P)
 
lol ... well that was ... interesting huh @Pip
 
Pip
Uh huh :P
So how are you, Wardy?
 
hmmm got this odd seam in my planets :(
 
Pip
10:08 PM
That sucks :/
 
but im generating some awesome jigsaw puzzles lol
 
Pip
:D
I'm planning to start working on my prototype tonight after I go out w/ some friends
 
prototype?
 
Pip
I've been putting it off because I'm enjoying some games atm but I need something to do
Yeah, making a 2D sandbox questing game
Basically terraria-style graphics with questing as the main mechanic
some grindy quests like "collect the stuff" some kill quests like "kill x amount of this monster" or "kill this boss", etc
I'll probably need some more quests at some point
 
 
Pip
10:10 PM
but whatever, it's a prototype in design atm
nice
bbiab, going out to dinnner
cya Wardy
 
later
 

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