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2:35 AM
Q: What is Arnold Hotel Font™?

Gunslinger711This is in the spirit of the What is a Word/Phrase™ series started by JLee with a special brand of Phrase™ and Word™ puzzles. If a font shares a specific commonality with another font, it's an Arnold Hotel Font™. Use the following examples below to find the commonality. And, if you want to...

3:11 AM
@jafe Should be _CATHERINE_, def "a woman," "gems" indicates a hidden word
3:28 AM
@PiIsNot3 yeah, that's it
I hope this one doesn't break any rules
CCCC: One top liar warping the truth first! (9)
4:08 AM
i'm searching the dictionary to see if "factorial" has meanings i don't know about but doesn't look like that's the case
you can just say "operation" >:) @jafe
@PiIsNot3 deduction 1: &lit
@OmegaKrypton Ok, if it is an &lit, then what is it describing?
the liar
Are you sure?
I hope you guys won't be too mad at me when the answer is revealed...
I have a few ideas for how this clue could work, none of which I'm particularly happy with
4:16 AM
@jafe You've got it I think, with factorial with "!" as the def. FACT = truth first. O(ne top) RIAL* (liar warping)
ah yeah that's right, looks like it
@Alconja Yes, that's right, it wasn't an &lit
@jafe ^
I don't think there's anything wrong with it, besides the unused "the" - you were making it sound like it was breaking some sort of major rule
@Deusovi I was intending for "the truth" = FACT, and I guess I was just protecting myself from being too clever heh
@PiIsNot3 so beautifully evil.
4:20 AM
@OmegaKrypton (bows, then slinks off into the night)
So do I go? Wouldn't have got it without jafe speaking up (and it seems they basically had it but for the def clue), but strictly speaking I "got" the full solution first...
I think our usual rule is "whoever gets the full solution goes next"
@PiIsNot3 nice
@msh210 Thanks, I try my best :)
4:39 AM
Q: Forgot Login Password

Ravi MakwanaI'm always forgetting my login password. When I try to login computer says your password is incorrect So I did something so I will never forget my password What I did? This is my first Puzzling at Stackexchange

ahh the exclamation point!
that was pretty clever
your turn @Alconja :)
Too bad you're all just too darn smart to fool :)
well, some of us fell for it (won't name any names though)
1 hour later…
5:54 AM
Apologies for the delay. Was only half here and didn't have anything prepared...
CCCC: Father on fire after retweet. Again, both sides taken in by his cutting last words. (8,4)
Q: The falling broom handle

Jaap ScherphuisAs the reaction to my previous physics puzzle was somewhat mixed, I'll try again. I found this in an online physics book. You hold a broom as shown in the following picture: The head of the broom is resting on the ground, and you are holding the handle end a couple of feet off the ground. You...

6:23 AM
@Alconja PA+R_T(HI(-s))A_N+SHOT
PA (father), RT AN (retweet again, both sides) containing HI (his, cutting), SHOT (on(?) fire)
def is "last words"
in other news, i cannot count to 8 and tried to answer with 7 letters originally
@jafe You're close enough that I'll give it to you. Intention was: PA (father) RT (retweet) + HI(A(gai)N)S + HOT (on fire, after)
with "cutting last words" as the def.
yeah my version has the "taken in" working the wrong way
CCCC: Thanos perhaps central to big cinematic finale; it became the highest-grossing film of all time (7)
this one's more up my alley, it only requires being able to count to 7
One Two Three Four Five Six Seven Is it my turn now?
@Deusovi correct!
6:36 AM
@Deusovi was going to post that, but had to google to see if thanos was titanian (haven't seen the films)
also haven't, just made a guess because it was pretty clearly right
Talking about self-confirming answers ...
CCCC: My bad back almost repelled a partner in bed (7)
2 hours later…
9:01 AM
Q: Twelve Labours - #04 Erymanthian Bar

StivThis puzzle is part of the ‘Twelve Labours’ series. Previous instalments can be found here: Prologue | 01 | 02 | 03 Now one crate lighter, Hercules made his way back up the road to the Erymanthian Bar. Outside, a chalkboard proclaimed the sporting fixtures for the coming week that would be s...

1 hour later…
10:02 AM
CCCC is Cryptic Clue Chat Chains! Latest clue is ⤴/⤵ there! Join the fun! See Deusovi's Cryptic Clue Guide and GPR's Archive & Statistics of past clues.
@user58 Done. (And: :-(. )
10:18 AM
should we add a yajilin tag? 9Qs atm
2 hours later…
12:03 PM
Q: On which day the pond will fill half?

SPnL Q. A pond has flowers in it each day the flowers in the pond get doubled if the pond gets full-on 20th day, on which day the pond will fill half? How?

12:23 PM
Q: Used to Stop a Fight?

hexomino In whole, you may see me on a farm or on The Moon. Remove my rear part, you may see me in a prison or in the supermarket. Remove my middle part, you may see me on my whole or on your head. Remove my middle part again, you may see me on a ship or on a stage. Remove m...

2 hours later…
1:54 PM
@Deusovi lumba (?) + go
2:34 PM
Hints posted :)
2:52 PM
@Deusovi ZOS< (My bad, back) + (a)BOUT (almost, repelled A) = ZOSBOUT (partner in bed, though I don't know how you know my Significant Other's name. I don't think I've mentioned it on SE)
(Yes, that's a joke.)
2 hours later…
4:26 PM
Q: "bees" -> "hive" in 5 letter changes or fewer. Real word each time

BombBurperExample of "warm" -> "cold": warm worm word cord cold notice that its a real word each time

5:01 PM
2021 helpful flags.
I missed 2019 ...
take a shot at the CCCC
deus has another puzzler ;(
... you had me confused for a minute.
Was another PSE user called Avi, quite prominent back in 2014 or so.
5:17 PM
Weird, I don't see them on the roster of users
perhaps they deleted their account
one-upped by somebody I've never even met
i literally had seen this question before I ever even joined PSE
don't know why or where, but holy moly that is crazy
@Avi Clicking through on the HNQ from Stack Overflow?
probably, but it was so long ago
I might not even have joined SE back then
5:32 PM
Your profile says you've been an SO member since before that question was asked.
i don't know how it's possible though
I got like 3 "year badges" from like
first 2 weeks of joining
probably they tracked my IP or something (?)
My bad back almost repelled a partner in bed
still thinking over the CCCC
but confused because lumbago doesn't seem to fit?
for "almost repelled a" it could be about - a = "bout" or nearly - a = "nerly"
5:50 PM
I'm bored, so here's a CC to practice for CCCCs: Too many error
wait no
bad back could be reversed, so "good"
or, "my bad" = apology -> reversed is antagonize?
so confused, I'll get this eventually >;c
I don't think that's generally what "reversed" means in CCs, but... I don't really have any idea what I'm talking about. So there's that.
you're right
I messed it up, but i'll get it eventually
learning process
6:21 PM
my bad = plea
my bad back = aelp
almost repelled = hate
my bad back almost repelled = h + aelp + ate
my bad back almost repelled a = h + a - a + elp + ate = helpate
my bad back almost repelled a partner in bed = helpmate (synonym for spouse)?
oh wait, no
"in bed" probably means a container
HELPMATE is 8 letters.
b e l o v e d
but i can't figure out why
It looks like you're wanting "in bed" to mean inserting into BED and wanting the definition to be "a partner in bed". Can't both be right unless it's an &lit which it probably isn't.
oh, right
6:37 PM
(And almost certainly isn't if the answer is BELOVED because the clue as a whole doesn't look like it defines anything as vague as BELOVED. Unless there's some more specific reference to a movie, or the Toni Morrison novel, or something.)
My guess, for what it's worth, is that the definition part is probably either "My" (in which case the word will be an exclamation similar to "gosh" or goodness me") or "My bad" (in which case the word will be something someone might say to admit fault).
Q: What do you think if you see some plants?

balazs.comFind the common association to the following word that satisfies the given clues and your feeling.

6:52 PM
I gave it an attempt
because if it's not dead obvious
then it's way too broad to identify a clear answer
yeah, that same person has shared a lot of questionable things of a similar type
so is it legal for "my bad back" to be compared to the rest of the clue
if your word "dab ym" was equal to "almost repelled a partner in bed" would that be valid
I'm not sure what exactly you mean.
7:01 PM
so like
if there was a word that meant "my bad"
and then you reverse it
and the letters are equivalently clued by "almost repelled a partner in bed"
then, would that be valid
No; one part of the clue must be the definition of the final answer.
that's what i mean
"my bad" being the definition
It's not just the same string in two different ways, it's specifically wordplay and definition
7:12 PM
it's either got to be "my bad back" or "partner in bed"
i'm surmising the first though
oh wait no
it could be either
@Avi I'm looking forward to see if someone can answer your terrifying riddle.
it's actually not that bad
last two hints basically gave it away
the whole point is a bunch of misdirection from making things "terrifying"
I wonder whether "a partner" is B.
7:49 PM
I'd be super happy if somebody would go ahead and solve my riddle though :x
it's been soooo long
once somebody gets it I'll post an actual mapping for what each hint meant
I'm out of ideas...
as people have guessed already
it's related to a certain subject
@Avi could you maybe
not put just a few words
into each message?
it's becoming a little annoying
because it makes it harder
to look back
through chat history
it's not like anybody looks back through chat history
I do, quite frequently.
8:01 PM
you don't exist
Been through Greek gods, Paris Metro stations, games, movies, trains and what have you. If it doesn't come to me in my sleep I'll just wait and see if someone else gets it.
@GarethMcCaughan I did notice it, but I thought it was puzzling.se stylee. :-)
it's trains
as I noted in my rot13 response to you :x
I get it, but what about trains? That's my headache.
Well, see hint 3. What might a locomotive be running away from that is about trains?
But I like the vibe of the riddle. You would be surprised if you knew the associations i've gone through.
8:06 PM
@Avi I agree with @GarethMcCaughan, coming back from making a cup of tea to find 33 missed messages is a tad alarming
@Dmihawk Here's a cryptic clue for you: Voluminous chat meat. Meanwhile, I'll keep puzzling over the CCCC
is that an actual cryptic?
I'm struggling to wrap my head around CCs (I'm not a native English speaker). Would this be a valid CC? Not a boy but gangster when offline (4)
@Avi then I need the number of letters please
8:09 PM
oh right (4)
@Wolff There's an excellent guide to writing CCs. You can probably check against that for correctness.
@Avi I'm reading it! Can you answer my first fragile attempt at a CC?
Probably not - I'm pretty bad at answering them myself xd
Try anyway. now that I've spent so much time thinking about your riddle :-)
8:16 PM
I'd guess thug
because it's a man + gangster, and I think the offline part is irrelevant? Probably I'm missing something important, though.
CC's can't have irrelevant parts (just FYI)
oh, deleting messages doesn't stop taking up space in chat. That's unfortunate.
@Dmihawk But there can be a word to indicate the split?
Or not indicate, but tie the definition and the wordplay together?
how do you mean split? as in, between the def + wp?
8:18 PM
You usually don't want to indicate a split. Instead, you want the clue to flow together.
the def is always* at the start or the end, the wp is the remainder
* ddefs are an exception to this
"My bad back almost repelled a partner in bed" is the current CCCC. As you can see, the "my bad" and "partner in bed" parts are both potential defs
OK, in my attempt above the word "but" isn't part of either the def or the wp. Is that wrong? Should I instead just say: Not a boy, gangster when offline (4) ?
"but" is is fine, just acting as a connector
punctuation is commonly used to hide where the connection is
OK. Makes sense.
8:21 PM
so if "but" is your connector, you might have written "Not a boy but gangster, when offline"
and now people will think "when offline" is the wp
Ah. Would it be correct to put a comma there in English normally?
(I'm Danish btw)
Is it just indicating a pause?
It's permissible, though unexpected. That's what makes it tricky :)
it depends on the context of the statement really, English gets silly with commas sometimes
Anyway, I thought this would be ridiculously easy.
My CC I mean.
If you solve the current CCCC, you have a chance to turn your CC into a CCCC :)
8:23 PM
not a boy could mean girl, or older male
trying to get "gangster when offline" to build the def though
i can just give it away? Might be thinking this wrong anyway.
if you're happy to spoil it, we can analyse the construction and perhaps look at any required corrections?
I could just be missing something obvious though...
Well, the def is "not a boy" = girl.
And the wordplay is simply G (common abbrevations for gangster) + IRL (when offline)
since when did gangster mean G
ah yup, I can see that. So let's start with getting the 'G' from gangster
8:27 PM
Pretty common to use "g" for gangster. Like in "og" - original gangster.
The 'Use First Letter Only' section contains words that would hint at only using the first letter
Gangster leader without internet is not a boy
Lol, I could use "originally gangster" it seems. Just kidding.
in fact, having "original gangster" could arguably have hinted at the 'G'
That would be fun.
8:29 PM
actually that works
Do I need to hint that offline must be in slang?
I'm not sure if "when offline" -> IRL fits within cryptic rules (I've only just started solving CC's myself), one of the more experienced solvers in here could probably answer that
"on the streets" would probably not translate to "IRL" though, right?
No, not really
because otherwise you could say OG on the streets, and it would be evil as heck
because OG would have to be rearranged as well as on the streets
8:32 PM
In the guide there is an example where "French programming style" means FR + AGILE.
but that's from form to abbreviation or abbreviation to form
No hint about "French" being abbreviated. Is it beacuse it's a standard of some sort?
FR is definitely standard
same with "one" = I
and "hundred" = C
But not "gangster" ... hmmm, guess you need to be part of the culture to understand when to hint it and when it's not needed.
gangster might be standard - I just don't talk about gangsters in daily life, so I wouldn't know the abbreviation
8:34 PM
Hehe, me neither, but it's a hip hop thing.
the common vocabulary is fairly fluid and occasionally clues will pop up that most of us don't recognise. I'm familiar with "OG", but my immediate association from the word gangster doesn't lead me there
So the corrected CC could maybe be: Not a boy but original gangster, when offline (4)
Except you don't like "when offline"...
I think it's a nice use of it, I'm just unsure of the validity
(CCCC) Maybe "my bad" means something akin to "mistake", not "apology"
So there you have it: ekatsim
8:50 PM
for "almost repelled a" it could be about - a = "bout", nearly - a = "nerly", near - a = "ner", or around - a = "round"
I was thinking more flaw, err, lapse, slip, sin for "my bad" in terms of mistake
reversed is walf :( rre :( espal :( pils ? nis ?
most of them don't seem to work
@Wolff "gangster" isn't really used for "G" outside of the abbreviation "OG", I think? At least, not commonly enough to be justified. (Partial abbreviations aren't allowed - "aeronautics" can't be A even though it's the first A in NASA.)
"Fr." for the French language is pretty common, though
also, I wouldn't use "but" in that way - if there is something between definition and wordplay, it must indicate the relationship between the two parts. Like, "[wordplay] leads to [def]" is fine.
honestly deusovi I hate you so much for making me think dirty things, but I love your puzzles
@Avi “honestly deusovi I hate you” FTFY
glad you're enjoying the clue!
@Deusovi fair enough. If people here don't think "G" when they think "gangster" that's proof enough. But I've often heard youngsters here (in Denmark) say "What's up G!" which they have learned from West Coast hip hop.
9:03 PM
Oh really? That's fine then.
I wasn't familiar with the usage myself, but I'm perfectly happy to see slang in cryptics. (Better than obscure regionalisms, which appear far more often.)
@Deusovi I am too, but since I've just heard about CCs it's pretty hard.
This list mentions AL as “gangster” (as in Al Capone), but not G
@PiIsNot3 XD I see
That list is sometimes pretty questionable in its decisions on what to include and what not to
it's good for giving ideas if you need to clue a specific string, but you should rely on your own judgement to include things not on it, or rule out some things that are (like the many numbers)
Anyway, that single word doesn't matter to me - I'm just trying to understand the rules. Is it wordplay or wordgame?
9:11 PM
can be both - but the required components are a definition part and a wordplay part
Huh? I'm not sure what you mean by that last question.
technically the whole thing is a wordgame - "a game involving the making, guessing, or selection of words"
Wordplay is the usual term, I don’t think I’ve ever heard anyone use “word game”
Ah, I see now that in my language (Danish) we distinguish between play freely without rules and play a game with rules. Two different words.
Oh, makes sense.
I'm not sure I would really call them a game? But there are definitely rules.
I think of cryptic clues as an art form, like limericks. There are rules that you have to follow for something to be a cryptic clue, but experimentation and creativity are encouraged.
9:15 PM
(Still just trying to understand) Would the rules be able to define for an algorithm so it could determine if it was a valid CC? Or are you supposed to "bend the rules" to make it all more fun?
@Deusovi I think that I understand.
No, I don't think there's a perfect algorithm that will say something is a valid cryptic clue 100% of the time. (First of all, it's very hard to parse language, and second of all, people have slightly different ideas on what counts as valid.)
@Deusovi To add on to that said, the best CCs are often the ones that sound very natural on the surface, like something you’d actually say in a conversation. But, of course, they’re actually clueing a particular word.
"Bending the rules" is encouraged in a sense, but discouraged in a different sense. Like, there are some very clear rules that you should definitely follow: putting your definition in the middle would invalidate a clue. And so would having an anagram clue that's missing a letter.
are you allowed to provide hints in a CCCC
or do you just wait until 10 weeks later when somebody finally gets it?
Usually it's closer to six to eight weeks
9:19 PM
But the types of wordplay you can do can vary, and cleverness with different types of wordplay and interesting grammatical parsings is definitely encouraged.
@Avi If it’s been a couple of days, then the creator will usually give a clue
@Avi it's semi-traditional to give hints every 24h or so
ok, cool :) I'll be looking forward to it
Actually, you may not have to wait, I think I have something
9:21 PM
!!!! <= more surprised because I spend longer on this
@Deusovi Is it SPOONER? (OOPS)< + NE(-a)R
That's correct!
oh my god
And yes, it is a pretty naughty term
i guess my mind wasn't dirty enough
9:23 PM
oh, I wasn't aware that it was used in a naughty way
nice one
"a partner in bed"? How else did you think it was used
"partner" did indeed mean "romantic partner", but "in bed" should be taken completely literally
you and a business partner at a cheap hotel
when I heard "spooner", that one reverend was all that came to my mind
9:25 PM
reverend insanity?
"spooning" is a word for a specific cuddling position, and doesn't necessarily have sexual implications
oh, well, in any case, time to wait for the next one
I guess it could be like that, I’ve never heard or used that term before until now, so what do I know?
(this clue was written a while back, for a contest to clue the word SPOONER - most people used the Reverend, so I thought it would be fun to write a clue that didn't)
well, in any case, you're up now!
CCCC: Not end ends not end, not end ends end (4)
I’ve been waiting a while to post that one
9:28 PM
what a terrifying one
oh no
so the start ends the start, and the start ends the end?
and the definition is either "end", "ends end", or "not end"
@Avi Sounds like like your terrifying riddle. :-)
those seem like the most likely options, yeah
Unless it's neither of those
9:34 PM
@Avi Yeah, under typical CC rules, that’s where the definitions go. The only question is which side...
@Deusovi Can I ask something about your CCCC?
@Avi conceivably "not"
oh, good point
"almost repelled a" gives "NE(-a)R" - because "near" is a synonym for "almost".
9:36 PM
nice clue @Deusovi!
But could it as well have been "(-a)LMOST"? (if that made sense)
@PiIsNot3 I'm guessing NONO for your "oh no" problem
That would also be an option (if it had made sense with the rest of the wordplay).
9:37 PM
(As to the dirtiness, to me "spooning" pretty much implies not sex.)
@Wolff Yeah, that’s the tricky part about CCs, you’re allowed to use synonyms for extractions and deletions
@PiIsNot3 and reversals
@Avi You have to provide a complete wordplay though!
So in my first attempt at CC I can say: "original gangster" to get a "G(-angster)" but I could also have said "original thug"?
what do you mean
9:38 PM
@Avi How do you get NONO from the wordplay part, I mean
@Wolff Yes, both are valid
@Wolff it's less common to use a synonym for an initial or final letter, methinks
generally, you don't want to use synonyms the less you extract from a word
so "Not end ends not end, not end ends end" is a definition (Not) and wordplay (end ends not end, not end ends end)
because it makes it more unfair for the solver
Let's say the definition for Not is NO
9:39 PM
@Avi OK, but how is the proposed wordplay part parsed?
@Deusovi an anagram is the whole word but still
@Avi the definition part must define the whole solution, which here is four letters long
I'm breaking it into two parts here
("original thug" could have been any letter if you synonymized "thug" - I'm not sure whether I'd say it's invalid per se, but I would definitely say you shouldn't do that)
@msh210 yeah, "using less of a word" is one reason to not synonymize, but not the only one
ok you're right
@Avi that's not a thing you can do - the definition and wordplay must both lead you to the full answer (entirely separately)
9:41 PM
@Deusovi I can see that. I guess the more obvious the definition is, the more "mean" the wordplay can be...
Yeah, there's definitely some consideration of that when writing clues
Not end ends not end, not end ends end - we'll use the comma as the boundary
right end is definition
wait no
somebody else help :( I can't do it
For the record, I tried creating a similar clue with only the words “about” and “out(s),” but it didn’t turn out nearly as nice as this one
@Avi It might help you to think instead of typing.
@Avi Maybe if you post every word of the CC on separate lines? ;-P
9:44 PM
@Wolff That might work but I already gave up
@Avi I think a good place to start would be to figure out what exactly “not,” “end,” and “ends” indicate
ends are boundaries, NONOs cross ("end") the boundary
I have a guess, but it uses some pretty mean wordplay and I'm not sure how to make it entirely work out
@Avi that's not a definition
@Avi I mean, for the wordplay part
For example, if I said “The end”, what letter could you get out of it?
the last letter, I guess
9:47 PM
@Avi So that would be...
"not end" has T as the last letter of not
@Avi Yeah, that’s one valid way of reading it. But is it the only way?
It really does help to know your wordplay indicators when working with CCs, that way you can explore multiple different possibilities
Can "Not end ends" be "end"?
@Wolff In what way?
"Not end" means "next word without last letter"?
9:50 PM
@Wolff True, that’s completely valid!
But again, does it fit with the rest of the clue? That’s the hard part
(I should probably take a break, don’t wanna accidentally give away too much)
yeah, you are saying a lot right now, and your clue has only been up there for about 20 minutes
Yeah yeah, I'm learning one atom at a time.
Blame my affinity for teaching stuff to others
I'm too confused to get all the hints.
is "edge" a valid definition for "end"?
9:54 PM
@Avi yes
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