TRPG General Chat

GcL

1:17 AM

@NautArch How else are you going to get directions?!

The Oracle

1:58 AM

1

Q: Context for flags changing between being raised and handled

I recently raised a flag for a question deletion and repost. In my flag I suggested the repost be deleted and the original reopened. My reasoning was that when I raised the flag the repost had exactly one comment, pointing out the it was a repost. While the original had 7 with users trying to hel...

Ben

@linksassin @Miniman was thinking someone from our timezone would be a good candidate for the new election :)

Miniman

@Ben Go for it!

Ben

I was thinking about it, but I think at this point i need to be convinced haha

GcL

@Ben You should do it!

It would also round out the number of Bens on the team.

KorvinStarmast

@GcL It would certainly increase the number of Bens, and that's a good thing (I think)

Ben

2:13 AM

And on the topic of Ben's (with a slihgt redirect from the current conversation) I am now "Uncle Ben" :D

Being a Spiderman fan, that's a bit of a thing for me haha

GcL

@Ben 'That's fun. Begin your planning for fun experiments and activities now. Also, don't get shot.

Ben

@GcL I think I'm safe on that front, since I have a niece, not a nephew :P

Miniman

@Ben Well, do you have any insights on power/responsibility?

Ben

With any level of power come equal levels of responsibility.

Miniman

@Ben [shoots him]

Ben

2:17 AM

Is that to drive home the lesson? :P

Miniman

@Ben No, it was a test to see whether there was a narrative requirement that you be shot or not.

Ben

Ah I see. So kind of a "choose your own adventure".

I would also say that if I'm trying to teach something, and the student ain't listening, I kinda get the "well I tried - so do it and see what happens" approach.

KorvinStarmast

What you need is a bigger sword

Ben

2:33 AM

Also @Adeptus chat.stackexchange.com/transcript/message/54292726#54292726

GcL

2:54 AM

@Ben Sometimes nieces need swords. I instructed mine on the proper handling of scalpels, knives, needles, and other sharps when they were 8. Shortly followed by Bunsen burners and propane torches. Young people need skills, yo.

Ben

I do worry about that. Her father is very pro-gun.

GcL

We'd be writing some code and doing redox reactions if it weren't for this pesky pandemic.

Ben

As in "lift restrictions on gun ownership"

GcL

Guns aren't really that useful.

Of all the jobs I've ever done... astonishingly few were even amenable to being accomplished with a firearm.

now, recapping syringe using only one hand or re-sheathing a knife using a single hand... that's a hella useful skill that results in a statistically significant reduction in band aid usage.

Hammers, saws, brushes, and a bit of programming are where it's at.

Ben

On the other hand, they do live on a farm and he is also a carpenter.

I can fill in the programming part

GcL

2:59 AM

Carpentry... now that's a useful set of skills!

linksassin

3:14 AM

@Ben That was a large part of the basis for why I ran last time. I'm still undecided as to if I will run this time.

Ben

3:26 AM

@linksassin In that case it raises the question - Is it a concern to have people in the quiet period, or is it just that the user base in our area just isn't big enough to have the proper impact?

linksassin

@Ben It's mostly about pace of flag handling. I don't know if you notice it but I often raise flags that take hours to resolve. If there was a mod in our timezone the issue could be resolved far faster (at least in theory).

MikeQ

Hello there!

Ben

@linksassin Yeah.

@MikeQ afternoon

MikeQ

How go your game making projects?

Ben

3:41 AM

In all honesty, I think I could use a review. Help me refocus a bit

I'm in the "oh that would be a good idea" mindset

MikeQ

Sure, go ahead

Ben

So for my corruption system, @linksassin and I came up with a tree of different effects based on 6 different "types of influence". That got a little out of hand, so I revised it, brought it back to the core idea.

I now had the idea of instead, tying it to a "primary stat" to allow for some diversity of play

MikeQ

Isn't that what you had previously? One STR path, one DEX path, etc?

Ben

Previously it was based on the differnt types of otcomes of "embracing" or "resisting". This is a bit different, in that you pick you primary stat (e.g. str), and when you gain a level in one or the other, you gain something.

So, if you embrace, you gain +1 atk and dmg. If you resist, you gain +1AC

Whereas originally it was "madness" or "temptation", which allowed people to gain feats for free, that kind of thing. It was a bit too thematic so it became difficult to build very quickly.

Link to Corruption System Doc

linksassin

@Ben Complete sidetrack suggestion. Have you considered have a "Corruption" ability score in addition to the 6 primary ones. Then tying specific things to a corruption ability check.

"Resist" and "Embrace" could be skills checks and you can only have proficiency in one of them.

Just spitballing ideas for a simpler overall system.

Ben

3:54 AM

@linksassin I can see that as a thing, but I also need to cap it off, which is why they're "totals".

MikeQ

This is kind of overcomplicated. And I think tying any of it to "primary" ability scores is a mistake.

linksassin

@Ben My thought would be that it is capped at 20 same as a regular skill. Everytime you encounter influence you can make either a Embrace or Resist roll. On a success you increase your base corruption stat by 1.

Ben

What is a "success"?

@MikeQ Yeah

@MikeQ How do you feel it's overcomplicated?

MikeQ

It kind of looks like it's lost track of whatever theme originally motivated this. Currently it's just a really complicated way of getting small bonuses. Some of which are useful (e.g. +1 attacks and damage), some look like you ran out of ideas (proficiency in a skill).

Ben

@MikeQ You're not wrong on the last point.

linksassin

4:00 AM

@Ben Success is you tried to resist and did. Or tried to embrace and did. Either way you are still in control of your fate. Failing a roll means the corruption impacts you in a way you don't want.

Ben

The original idea is that the players are going through a dungeon that is effectively polluted with demon magic, and it affects the players just passively. No one comes out unscathed, some may not come out at all; and everyone changes as they delve deeper in one way or another.

MikeQ

As written, players are basically playing blackjack with a split, and rack up bonuses until they overflow on either scale, in which case they instantly die, or something. The risk increases but the consequence is the same: gain another bonus, or die.

GcL

The DMG has recommendations on tracking insanity. I did that and honor point totals with outcomes for certain numbers of total honor or insanity points.

Ben

@MikeQ The limit is stated at the beginning, so they're aware of how far they've gone

MikeQ

But the character always must roll. And whether they Resist or Embrace, the consequence of failure is the same; so the choice between Resist or Embrace is just a matter of picking the better odds. Unless I've misread this.

Ben

4:14 AM

In this version, embracing is not a roll. They say "I embrace", and the GM goes "ok, you gain (x) Embrace points"

Linksassin is suggesting a bit of a system revamp though

MikeQ

Right, but I'm saying that whether the player has too many points in their Resist scale, or has too many points in their Embrace scale, the outcome is the same.

Ben

That they need a successful Resist roll to remove points?

MikeQ

If they have too many points in either scale, they die, yes?

Ben

When they reach the maximum in either scale, yes

MikeQ

And either scale grants the intermediate benefits, like the attack and AC bonuses.

Ben

4:20 AM

Yes

MikeQ

Ergo, the consequences are the same, and Resist vs Embrace is just a question of picking whichever choice is statistically favorable.

e.g. I could choose to Embrace until I'm just under the limit, and then Resist thereafter.

Ben

Yes.

That's how it currently works.

linksassin

I think the original intent was that resisting would allow you to remain sane while embracing would grant you corruption powers.

Ben

That's the idea, yeah.

I'm not sure where/why that changed

linksassin

The original issue we had was that Resisting was mechanically boring

MikeQ

4:26 AM

If the Resist scale led to a different set of outcomes (rewards and consequences) then that might be more interesting. I would also suggest intermediate risks for both paths.

Ben

@MikeQ Fair, I'm just not sure what they would be. And you mean a halfway point between "building points" and "death"?

MikeQ

Or, if two paths is too complex to implement, then at least Resist grants access to some resource that Embrace doesn't, and vice versa.

Maybe there's one scale, and Resist vs Embrace gives different ways of managing and using that scale.

Ben

4:44 AM

@MikeQ Is that sort of what you were aiming at @Linksassin?

linksassin

Yes. Basically I was going for a single corruption score.

Ben

Ok, cool.

linksassin

I was imagining it as an ability and Resist and Embrace being kind of like savings throws tied to it. Potentially there could also be skills tied to it as well. That get unlocked by something.

Ben

I suppose actually you do want people to get to the end of the dungeon, which is why I'm aiming to make it that players shouldn't reach the max total.

But I was a little inspired by the Dark Heresy Corruption/Insanity system, which does

Well, not a little. A lot. Lol. I want that 5o play into character development

I think I need to visualize this a bit

MikeQ

But DH's insanity system also had intermediate effects, i.e. benefits/consequences at points before the maximum value

An easier approach is to have the benefits/consequences be independent, by having them in a separate table. Then when a character reaches certain points on the scale, they get one of the entries from the table. We had something like that in our mecha DH campaign.

Ben

5:10 AM

@MikeQ Which is what I had?

MikeQ

There are benefits, but no consequences

Ben

Right

It seems i haven't written that in, but the intention was that the consequences would be narrative, rather than mechanical. E.g. you grow malignancies, or you start behaving strangely, etc.

If both are mechanical that would get very complicated very quickly.

MikeQ

Mechanical doesn't need to be numeric

Ben

Ok

MikeQ

But they do need to be enforceable. So you'd need something less vague.

Ben

5:16 AM

Yeah true.

MikeQ

Doesn't need to dictate player behavior either; maybe certain NPCs react to them differently, or they perceive certain environmental cues differently (a la Bloodborne)

But you should take some major steps back, and try to address the fundamental principles here. Think about what it means, conceptually, if an adventurer comes from the depths and has resisted the influence every time, versus if they embraced every time.

Ben

From who's perspective? The PCs or the NPCs, or both?

MikeQ

Not sure. You, as the designer?

Basically, I'm saying that your main narrative idea - going deeper into the dungeon makes you more corrupt, ok - does not line up with the thing you've constructed out of math and game mechanics.

So instead of starting at the implementation stage (e.g. having 6 paths because there are 6 ability scores), go back to to the initial design stage, and identify what you want to model with this creation.

Ben

5:31 AM

I just had a re-read of the DH Insanity/Corruption system, and i see what you're getting at.

@linksassin I'm also interested in hearing your thoughts about your idea.

linksassin

I don't really have that much more of an idea that than. Corruption is an Ability Score, Resist/Embrace are saving throws. Players can choose to be proficient in one or the other based on backstory. Then the bonuses are tied to Corruption score, which increases throughout the campaing.

Ben

The corruption score only increases?

linksassin

I do agree with Mike though that you should keep in mind what the goal of the system is.

@Ben Yes? Maybe? Depends on how often you want to change it.

Ben

Yeah. I'm seeing now that this is becoming (or has become?) a "hat on a hat" thing

linksassin

I would only increase it and only do it rarely at significant story moments.

You get benefits from increasing your corruption score, access to corruption abilities. But some things can only effect people if corruption above a certain score.

Ben

5:40 AM

Ok. Yeah. I like it.

linksassin

I seem to remember you saying something about the player with the highest corruption being transformed into something at the end of the campaign.

Ben

Makes things simple and manageable. The skeleton you saw in the basement was scary, and now that you;re 5 levels down, the only thing that is upsetting you about these death knights is how they don't go down when you chop their heads off.

@linksassin That has changed a bit. The original concept was they would become the new vessel for Diablo, cue the PvP. But I didn't really cling to that idea much

MikeQ

Conceptual question: What does it mean if an adventurer has been resisting the whole time, versus one who has been embracing? Are they completely unaffected? Do they have some demonic benefits? Do they have some non-demonic benefit? etc

Ben

Yeah.

Thanks for the input guys! I think I'll be doing some homework tonight :D

MikeQ

Game design isn't easy! Be patient and don't get lost in the implementation abyss.

linksassin

5:44 AM

Alternatively consider the Bear/Criminal system from Honey Heist. The mechanic is super simple. And points move back and forth between opposing skills. You only lose if you go off the scale at either end.

Ben

@linksassin Have not seen that one

BESW

The most important design tip I've ever gotten was "playtest as soon as you have anything with a play loop, and keep playtesting as often as you can."

@Ben Honey Heist by Grant Howitt has been in the top twenty physical games on itch.io for as long as I can remember.

Other games come and go but The Bear is eternal. Designers actually remark when one of their games temporarily ranks higher than the Bear.

linksassin

@Ben Highly recommend it. Whole system revolves around a d6 and two stats. Bear and Criminal. Every skill check is either Bear (most physical things) or Criminal (plotting, lying, stealing). Bear and Criminal add to 6. You need to roll equal to or below your stat to succeed. Certain things move a point from one stat to the other. If either reaches 6 you give in to nature, or join a life of crime.

BESW

And it's a very very popular mechanic for people to riff on, with games like Magic Swords and Gobblin' Grub.

linksassin

I think it would actually be really simple for you to adapt to a Resist/Embrace corruption system.

Ben

5:59 AM

I've downloaded them and will have a look tonight :D

BESW

8:53 AM

→ 2 messages moved to Not a bar, but plays one on TV

We've already established that's not a conversation topic everybody who frequents this chat is okay with walking in on unexpectedly.

Ben

12:07 PM

Ok, so did some homework. I re-wrote the Corruption mechanic. It's bare bones, talking about the idea of what the mechanical concept is. In a few words: Clean thing goes in, dirty thing comes out.

I also read Honey Heist (and will be playing this sometime soon), and I like the "swapping stats", but I'm not sure how that would work in this system. Maybe a successful roll allows you to move a stat one way or the other, and a failed roll forces you to move a stat toward the failed stat? (E.g. you tried to resist, and failed, move a point to make it harder to resist next time). And then when that reaches it's max, Bad Thing(TM) happens?

Someone_Evil

When you say stat do you mean ability score?

BESW

@Someone_Evil No, Honey Heist is not an ability score kind of game.

Ben

@Someone_Evil Sort of. This is part of a side-system I'm making for a campaign I'm writing up, which is based off Honey Heist.

BESW

@Ben Hmm. Consider looking at one of Honey Heist's precursors, All Outta Bubblegum.

Someone_Evil

@BESW I thought that was for their corruption mechanic for 5e

Ben

12:17 PM

Or well, I'm using Honey Heist as a mechanical influence

Nzall

What is that DNDBeyond access for Stackizens thing?

Like, can I just join that campaign, not really do anything beyond that and access nearly everything on DNDBeyond.com?

Someone_Evil

That's the idea

nitsua60

@BESW Ty.

Nzall

@Someone_Evil Okay, so I have a custom character I quickly created, and it's marked as being part of the Stackizen 3 campaign. That's enough?

Ben

Oh, something I thought we could add to the room description.

Someone_Evil

12:30 PM

@Nzall Should be. You won't be able to use this for character creation in other campaigns (IIRC), but for listings and compendium you should have it all

Nzall

okay, good to know

was really annoying to randomly be denied access to pages because I don't pay

Ben

> There are no Elephants in the room, except the occasional r🐘

cc @linksassin @MikeQ and anyone else interested: rewrite of Corruption system with some potential mechanical applications

Nzall

I got a question that I can't really ask on the main site, because A) it's not triggered by specific events, more of a ponderance I have and B) it's something I don't think has a really straightforward answer and as such might be better suited for chat

Essentially: in D&D 5e, is there an official or recommended way to make PCs feel and actually be more powerful without increasing the difficulty of the campaign itself?

With that I mean: I don't want to nerf or buff the encounters or skill checks in the campaign. I want to give the player (me) a slight edge at the start of the campaign, make them feel like they're stronger than usual, but without greatly upsetting the balance

Someone_Evil

Optimize your character for the power you want?

BESW

I don't know much about 5e, but my experience in 4e suggests that a solid solution is to identify the level you want them to feel like they're at, and modify the HP and damage of enemies to be in the same ratios to PC HP/damage at whatever level you start.

But that's a GM move not a player move.

Nzall

12:42 PM

Okay, I think I'll have to give some extra details: it's preparation for Baldur's Gate 3

nitsua60

@Nzall Are you talking about combat power specifically, or impact-on-the-world power?

Nzall

yeah, i know, CRPG, not the same

NautArch

howdy howdy!

Nzall

but I'm wondering about minor changes I can make to my main character at the start through save editing or console commands or whatever to feel that slightly bit more powerful regardless of what level i am

just preparation at this point

Because BG3 will take a while to get here

NautArch

@Nzall Nitsua60 asks an important question - is it power in-combat or out of combat?

Ben

12:44 PM

@NautArch howdy doody

Nzall

so that means that things like changing enemies won't really work

@NautArch Ideally both

NautArch

But if you really want to just be "more powerful", you can keep your encounters as-is and give them magic items early. That increases their power level, but as the encounters increase in difficulty with level, the magic item's help should level off.

Nzall

assuming by "impact on the world" power you mean things like skill checks etc

@NautArch ah, but I'm hoping for a way to keep the edge during the entire campaign. I've considered things like "you get X additional attribute points to spend during character creation" or "you get advantage on every roll regardless of circumstances" or "you get +1 on all rolls"

goodguy5

Also "why" or did you answer that?

NautArch

@Nzall How are you determining stats? That may be what you're looking for.

Nzall

12:48 PM

@NautArch Yeah, if you read above: it depends on how Baldur's Gate 3 does things

goodguy5

I mean, there's an easy way to get +1 to all of your abilities, which is higher than any other character usually gets.

play a human

But as far as minor effects, The most I'd be willing to let you get away with (on either side of the table) is a +1 or a half feat.

Again though, why?

NautArch

@Nzall What does Baldur's Gate 3 have to do with stat creation? I thought this was just for 5e? Do individual modules offer different chargen options?

BESW

For those who may have missed the implication: Baldur's Gate 3 is not an adventure module for D&D 5e. It's a computer game that uses D&D 5e rules as inspiration for its programming.

Nzall

@goodguy5 Hang on, 5e terminology noob here: is abilities STR/DEX/CON etc, or is that things like acrobatics

goodguy5

oh wait yep. I got confused. my bad

Nzall

12:50 PM

@BESW indeed. It's also not yet released, so I might be asking things too early here

Ben

@Nzall Abilities are STR/DEX/Con, yeah

goodguy5

and yes those are ability scores.

acrobatics is a skill

Ben

Skills are Perception, Sneak, etc

KorvinStarmast

@Ben I'll suggest that this isn't a great idea Can use bonus action as an action

BESW

This is a chat for tabletop RPGs, so while some of us may be familiar with Baldur's Gate, video game advice is not what most of us are gonna be thinking about when asked for help in here.

Nzall

12:51 PM

@goodguy5 As for why, I have a bit of a power fantasy streak in games and like to feel a lot stronger than the developers likely intended

@BESW Yeah, true. It's also not yet released, so I was hoping to ask the question with regards to the already released 5e rules as inspiration

NautArch

@Nzall So are you planning on homebrewing character generation based off however the game does it?

KorvinStarmast

@Ben The original idea is that the players are going through a dungeon that is effectively polluted with demon magic, and it affects the players just passively. No one comes out unscathed, some may not come out at all; and everyone changes as they delve deeper in one way or another Yeah, that's where you were when I tried to wrap my arms around a previous iteration. A very mundane way of doing something similar is in the Hidden Shrine of Tamoachan module, but it targets hit points.

Nzall

@NautArch no, I'm planning on creating my character in the game, then making slight adjustments after creation through save editing to get that edge I'd like

Ben

@KorvinStarmast Ok, you lost me there. Lol

NautArch

@Nzall Oh, then I'm not really sure what to do or say. I don't know how that game works or how it would compare to 5e. /shrug

Nzall

12:54 PM

and I was looking for early ideas on things I might want to try that won't spiral out of control

@NautArch same, since the game isn't out yet

but they already said they're gonna use most of the 5e rules

NautArch

But if you want to be more 'heroic' from the start and throughout, I'd just suggest rolling 'heroic' stats. Something like 4d6, drop lowest, reroll 1s. And roll 7 stats and drop the lowest.

Nzall

@NautArch first drop lowest, then reroll ones, or the other way around?

KorvinStarmast

@linksassin Oh, yeah, honey heist. @Ben Do a couple of run throughs. That's a fun game.

NautArch

@Nzall Reroll 1s, and then drop lowest when done.

KorvinStarmast

@Ben It's the Dexterity Benefit of Embrace in your current draft.

Nzall

12:58 PM

@NautArch Okay. Out of curiosity: would it be a huge gamebreaker if one of the dice is a D8?

NautArch

@Nzall One of the 4? Probably not, just 'moar heroic'.

Nzall

because AFAIK that could at most give me +1 or +2 higher

Ben

@KorvinStarmast Yeah, that was the last version, I've since rewritten it

NautArch

@Nzall You could probably run the stats on anydice to confirm the average. But i'm not the guy for telling you the formulas :)

Ben

25 mins ago, by Ben

cc @linksassin @MikeQ and anyone else interested: rewrite of Corruption system with some potential mechanical applications

Someone_Evil

1:00 PM

Now I want to see the maths on "roll [3d6+1d8] drop 1"

Nzall

@NautArch Okay. I remember reading somewhere about an older edition that having an 18 in a stat is "peak mortal capability", and that 25 is essentially what gods have. Is this still the case?

NautArch

@Someone_Evil and reroll 1s :)

linksassin

@Ben I don't seem to have access to that link. You might need to change the permissions

NautArch

@Nzall No. 5e caps at 20 (not including magic items/boons).

Someone_Evil

Gods and other such beings have up to 30

Ben

1:01 PM

Ah yes. whoops lol. Should be fixed now

linksassin

@Someone_Evil If we're talking weird stat generation I saw some good ones the other day. i.redd.it/3xq4rvjmtev41.jpg

5

@Ben So the overall idea is that "Afflictions" are unlocked by total influence but you need to constantly balance between resisting and embracing or you will go insane/be corrupted before you get there?

KorvinStarmast

@Nzall That sounds a bit like Original D&D. There were no nineteens in stats.

Nzall

@Someone_Evil anydice.com/program/10459 can't figure out how to do rerolling and dropping

KorvinStarmast

Had a friend you insisted that 2d6+6 was a good way to do roll ups for D&D ... how many years has that been?

linksassin

If anyone is interested. I just finished updating my splash screen for this weeks session. It's something that's been a work in progress ever since we moved to online.

Ben

1:07 PM

@linksassin No backsies XD

linksassin

@KorvinStarmast TBH It doesn't sound that bad to me.

Ben

@linksassin I'm playing that open ended atm. The idea is that players should reach the end of the dungeon in one piece, but I don't want that to really be a non-issue; ie. players just keep collecting points, cos no consequence

BESW

God Damn Them All by Lari Assmuth is a solo PbtA journaling game (with the option to play with friends) in which you play as a privateer on a voyage that is doomed to end horribly (unless you are very very lucky with dice).

Hot RPG Questions

5

Q: How to deal with a GM who favors other players

I have seen plenty of GMs write about how to deal with problem players, and I suppose I should ask about a GM who favors some players over others. It's only natural if you have a more rich backstory to get favored as a character, especially if your character is more chaotic and causes more probl...

problem-gm player-communication player-agency spotlight

BESW

Lizard in the Sun by Quinne Larsen is a solo game (LARP?) about being a lizard sunning itself on a rock.

Nzall

1:10 PM

anydice.com/program/1b704

linksassin

@Ben I would certainly be putting a decent amount of narrative focus on how the increased corruption is effecting them. I like the term "Afflictions" paint it as a bad thing even if it is mechanically a bonus.

Nzall

Can't figure out how to drop lowest

Ben

@linksassin Well, they may gain a bonus from it, but it is ultimately a bad thing.

Someone_Evil

@Nzall let's take this to EPoM

Ben

Or, as I mentioned in a note, they may also gain boons depending if they succeed on rolls

Nzall

1:12 PM

@Someone_Evil okay, meeting you there

linksassin

@Nzall This should do what you want anydice.com/program/1b705

Ben

One way I could explain it is like breathing toxic gas. You can resist by holding your breath, and not be affected by it, but then after a while, any time you smell something odd, you automatically hold your breath. Alternatively, you can embrace it and breathe it in, and it turns out that it is (somewhat) breathable, but after a while, you can't breathe oxygen properly.

The temporary boons is a reward for successful rolls, obviously, to make it more of a reward. But ultimately, you go in clean, you gonna come out dirty.

Anyway, I need to head to bed. Getting late. Ciao all!

Nzall

@Ben Have you played World of Warcraft? They recently added a game system like that for equipment where equipment can have a special effect, but the more effects you wear and the heavier they are, the more you get hindered

Ben

@Nzall I have not. Sounds like and interesting mechanic though :)

Nzall

So every effect has a corruption number associated with it between 10 and 75, and then depending on that number you have between 1 and 5 increasingly deadlier effects that are randomly applied

And then you also have a couple of ways to get corruption resistance

@Ben wowhead.com/guides/… here's a fan guide on the system

goodguy5

1:25 PM

@linksassin I really like that goofy one in the middle with adding and subtracting d8 and d10 etc

KorvinStarmast

@BESW Heh, I am very familiar with the Maritime Song (Stan Rogers) that I think informs the game's premise. (Though I've never been a lonesome man on a Halifax pier...)

It's on my Pandorra list for my Sea Songs channel.

BESW

It was written for the Record Collection 2k20 jam. If you click through to the game's sale page, the blurb tell you which song it's inspired by.

Hot RPG Questions

1:57 PM

7

Q: How to deal with Mary Sue NPCs

This question is a bit different than the one here, because the NPC is not a jerk. In fact, they're actually quite nice. However, this is not the first time the GM has done this. In our game, we have a legendary NPC on our side who just gets more and more likable and perfect the more we play. Th...

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NautArch

I never played 3.5, but are the combat rules close enough to 5e that houserules for 3.5e would still be applicable?

KorvinStarmast

@BESW There are a great many game sites I do not click on anymore since triggering the firewall block sometimes attracts unwanted attention.

@NautArch Eh, I'd be very cautious about that. Specifics?

(I mean, there is no BAB in 5e ....)

NautArch

2:17 PM

@KorvinStarmast this answer

KorvinStarmast

2:29 PM

@NautArch Not gonna vote on it. I object to adding fiddly bits, but Tommi I think did a decent job of explaining what he is recommending. I do think this makes sense if one is adding a house rule: attack is with to Hit bonus and unmodified damage on the secondary target. But I prefer Ben's answer a lot.

NautArch

@KorvinStarmast I haven't either. I don't know enough, but wasn't sure about the applicability in general.

KorvinStarmast

We had a miss mechanic (meant to discourage shooting ranged weapons in to melee) in AD&D 1e that was very similar. If I missed the intended target, the DM rolled to see if it hit a random target in an adjacent hex or square. Pure random. And the to hit was unmodded.

NautArch

There was a lot of firing through creatures in last night's game, I just gave the +2AC.

KorvinStarmast

@NautArch Yeah, the partial cover rule really simplifies it.

NautArch

Also, last night our cleric was about to cast wall of fire in the woods. THe warlock who did it last time and realized it drew attention counterspelled it :P

@KorvinStarmast Oops, meant Pathfinder, not 3.5

Has anyone played heroes & treasure?

KorvinStarmast

2:52 PM

@NautArch Right, 3.75. 8^D

NautArch

@KorvinStarmast hehe

I think I really dislike the jumping mechanics in 5e.

Rubiksmoose

@NautArch Yeah... they certainly aren't what you might call intuitive.

NautArch

@Rubiksmoose One of my players got a pair of Boots of Striding and Springing and wants to jump over enemies (he's a dwarf as well.)

But the long jump rules specifically say height isn't considered, but low obstacles need to be cleared with an acrobatics check.

The boots do a lot already, and I'm worried about bending the rules for this. I'm thinking of just saying you can, but we'll need to include height as movement.

Rubiksmoose

@NautArch oh really? I forgot about that.

KorvinStarmast

@NautArch "just saying you can" is the simplest path forward, and I recommend it. That's what those boots are all about. Doing cool stuff like that.

NautArch

3:07 PM

@KorvinStarmast It is, and it's fun, but I'm not sure I need to make them more powerful than they already are.

But that's what I'd been doing (and I had been counting height, but it was an on the fly thing)

looked more into it this morning and am now reconsidering.

Rubiksmoose

What do you see as the advantage to jumping over enemies?

Besides being cinematically awesome.

NautArch

but honestly, they need all the help in the Doomvault.

@Rubiksmoose Normally, you can't cross through an enemy space unless they're two sizes larger than you and we use flanking rules. SO they can now just potentially hop over to get the flank.

but yeah, i'm probably making a bigger deal than necessary and just let it happen.

Mostly because they're getting their butts handed to them.

Rubiksmoose

@NautArch But assuming you still have them burn movement to get over them, I think the result ends up the same as just moving around them right?

NautArch

@Rubiksmoose not if they can't actually get around them (that's why this started to come up. THere was a bottleneck they couldn't get through.)

Rubiksmoose

Ah gotcha. Yeah bottleneck would be an advantage.

Seems like a fun thing to let slide for now though IMO. It's a magic item that is already pretty situational right? And they're already struggling. If it becomes an issue later just address it then?

NautArch

3:15 PM

@Rubiksmoose Yeah, the party is definitely struggling. They are starting to learn more and I'm going to toss another bone and have the enemies surrender to show them that's an option. Maybe toss out some info about what's going in that area if they interrogate.

Especially when they just double-dipped into the healing pool they found and lost half their max HP.

Rubiksmoose

Oh snap!

That's really rough.

NautArch

Yeah, the pool is supposed to give you the effects of a short rest, but you can only use it once every tenday. If you do it again, bad juju.

Rubiksmoose

oopsie!

NautArch

But after reading BBeasts answer to their own question on dead in thay, I decided to make it a long rest, but can only be used every other day. Not sure how to get that last bit of info across. Maybe if they capture a Thayan in that section, they'll tell them.

Rubiksmoose

How about a helpful sign? XD

NautArch

3:24 PM

@Rubiksmoose heh. Don't think that'd be hanging up.

Can't wait until they find the other pool that's for healing undead.

Rubiksmoose

hah! What does it do to un-undead?

NautArch

If an undead drinks from the pool for the living, it take 4d10 radiant. If the living drink from the pool for the undead, 4d10 necrotic.

BUt if they drink from a pool in the FOrest of Death..well...

Rubiksmoose

Infinite riches and a long life. Got it.

NautArch

They still are just pushing through like a normal dungeon instead of trying to figure out how to achieve their mission.

i'll give 'em a nudge Friday.

COnsidering I just dropped two fireballs on the nearly the whole party (thanks for being in formation, guys!)

I did get to use telekinesis to drag one of them into a pool of dead oozes.

Rubiksmoose

@NautArch Is this place a resort? So many pools.

NautArch

3:33 PM

@Rubiksmoose The Forests of Slaughter are the #1 resort destination of the Doomvault!

Rubiksmoose

@NautArch You can't spell "Forests of Slaughter" without "rests of laughter"!

NautArch

Well, the ooze pool is in the ooze grotto, so maybe the Doomvault itself is the vacation destination!

Rubiksmoose

Fun for the whole family?

NautArch

@Rubiksmoose If you thay so :P

Rubiksmoose

hah!

"Come to the Doomvault! We'll fill your vacation with ooze and 'ahhhhh!'s"

[slogan works much better verbally XD]

KorvinStarmast

3:58 PM

@NautArch Is that anything like going into a spa for a mud bath?

NautArch

@KorvinStarmast just like it ! Makes your skin so smooth! Almost like bone!

KorvinStarmast

@NautArch And the weight loss is a beneficial side effect, right? Almost 0% body fat when done?

NautArch

@KorvinStarmast Very close to it! It's really amazing!

Other than the difficulty of this module, it is a lot of fun.

The Red Wizards all carry spell scrolls, but there is no wizard in the party. I may either move those to potions or osmething else.

Or change the spells to ritausl so the pact of tome warlock can get htem.

Rubiksmoose

@KorvinStarmast hahaha

Someone_Evil

@NautArch Spell scrolls have a non-copying uses, or is it just scrolls with spell on them?

KorvinStarmast

4:13 PM

@NautArch not a bad plan

NautArch

@Someone_Evil Although we do have a cleric, and i can make some cleric spells, too

KorvinStarmast

Also, @NautArch I tried not to get all maudlin

NautArch

@KorvinStarmast I'm not crying, you're crying!

KorvinStarmast

@NautArch heh, maybe some day we can resume/finish ToA. Or, maybe, those characters wander off into the Jungles of Chult and feed a hungry T Rex off screen.

Rubiksmoose

@KorvinStarmast What do they feed it? ;-)

@KorvinStarmast :'(

NautArch

4:18 PM

Hmm, i've been playing resistances wrong.

We stack them.

i'm not sure i want to stop, though.

Himitsu_no_Yami

You stack them? like 2x resist is 1/4 damage?

NautArch

@Himitsu_no_Yami yeah

ALthough, maybe not...Aura of Warding (paladin aura that resists spell damage) and resitsance to fire would make a fireball 1/4.

but i think those aren't supposed to, given this question:

13

Q: Do resistances stack?

If a creature had resistance to spells, and then cast fire resistance on it, would it take only 1/4 damage from all fire spells?

dnd-5e damage-resistance stacking

Himitsu_no_Yami

I'm looking for a low CR monster/npc with spellcasting to put players up against. any ideas?

NautArch

@Himitsu_no_Yami how low do you want to go?

Himitsu_no_Yami

@NautArch the lower the better. It's 4 level 2's

NautArch

4:25 PM

obvious choice is acolytes/apprentice wizards

Himitsu_no_Yami

That could work

KorvinStarmast

@Rubiksmoose Uh, maybe whatever beasts we can hunt and butcher ... or some fresh Yuan Ti filets?

@Himitsu_no_Yami acolyte

NautArch

@KorvinStarmast hey, i'm playing a yuan-ti now!

Himitsu_no_Yami

Is there one with any third level spells that I don't have to tweak first? I have an idea in my head but was hoping for a preexisting stat block to save me from having to do CR calculations

KorvinStarmast

@Himitsu_no_Yami Do you have volo's guide? For third level spells Priest NPC fits perfectlyh

Himitsu_no_Yami

4:29 PM

I have it on DDB and can remake on Roll20 so that sounds perfect

Someone_Evil

@Himitsu_no_Yami Which 3rd level spell? Because changeing spells can very much affect CR

KorvinStarmast

@Himitsu_no_Yami Spellcasting. The priest is a 5th-‐level spellcaster. Its spellcasting ability is Wisdom (spell save DC 13, +5 to hit with spell attacks). The priest has the following cleric spells prepared: Cantrips (at will): light, sacred flame, thaumaturgy 1st level (4 slots): cure wounds, guiding bolt, sanctuary 2nd level (3 slots): lesser restoration, spiritual weapon 3rd level (2 slots): dispel magic, spirit guardians

Himitsu_no_Yami

@Someone_Evil it's not a spell it'll cast during combat so it shouldn't affect CR. The idea is it cast the spell a little before the party encounters it and it's animate dead

KorvinStarmast

Oh, yeah, drop that in.

@Himitsu_no_Yami Remove DIspel Magic and drop in animate dead ... prolly fits.

Himitsu_no_Yami

Awesome thanks

KorvinStarmast

4:32 PM

What starts as a Medium encounter just got a little tougher if you added the zombie

NautArch

@Himitsu_no_Yami Hmm, At CR1, i'm finding 4th level casters, i'm guessing CR2 is 5th, but still looking.

You could have 2 CR1s vs the party, but probably just one CR2.

Himitsu_no_Yami

I think the idea I have in mind is 1 priest, one skeleton, and one zombie

KorvinStarmast

Priest is CR 2 and can rol the party if it gets mad and casts Spirit Guardians and they mix it up ...

So what you may want to do is go back and check how the Adjusted XP of the encounter works out with all three enemies. Hard at least ..

Himitsu_no_Yami

Hard is fine, I think I have this planned out

KorvinStarmast

If you go hard, then either zombie or skeleton. If you want "deadly" use both.

Himitsu_no_Yami

4:36 PM

DDB says deadly but I think with the lack of the third level spells from the priest it'll be fine

the idea is that he used his third level slots already

KorvinStarmast

Encounter builder in Basic rules leads us to 450 + 50 X 1.5 = 750.

Or 450 + 50 + 50 X 2 = 1100

@Himitsu_no_Yami He has two slots.

NautArch

@Himitsu_no_Yami that's a deadly encounter

KorvinStarmast

But, you are right, if no SG then the problem becomes one for the party of Action Economy versus three foes.

Or, dump SG and keep Dispel magic so that you are not tempted to SG during the battle?

NautArch

A CR2 and 2 CR 1/4 vs 4 level 2s is Deadly. 800xp is the deadly marker, and this is 1100 adjusted.

KorvinStarmast

SG for two rounds will lay out enough to wax a level 2 party ...

Himitsu_no_Yami

4:39 PM

@KorvinStarmast he has two undead, each of which costs a 3rd level slot since he's not a wizard

KorvinStarmast

@Himitsu_no_Yami I understand, I got it. Just tossing ideas out ....

Himitsu_no_Yami

I appreciate it

KorvinStarmast

If you want this fight with the two undead, this is one of those "one hard fight and a few easy ones for the day" set ups. IF anyone in the party has command and the Priest fails the save, that gives a round or two to try and take out the two undead.

But if priest no fail save, ouch.

If there's a cleric in party and they can Turn Undead, it makes the battle winnable.

Unless the undead pass their save versus T.U. Sounds like a fine battle for your party of 2d levels

And 'charm person' might be able to convince the cleric "ya know, you really don't want to fight us, right?"

Kuerten

5:22 PM

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The Oracle

0

Q: Should questions be asked from a DM or Player perspective explicitly?

I don't ask very many questions on the role play exchange but in my last question I was asked, in the comments, if this question was from a player perspective or DM perspective. I found that to be interesting since it does change the way my question is interpreted. If it is from the DM perspectiv...

1d4

4

5:59 PM

When playing at a table in D&D, using either grid/map or theatre of the mind, what is the longest range shot you've seen?

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