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@ThatBrazilianPony You'll never need to update again!
 
1:25 AM
@Mokubai No because it has the same retarded fingerprint sensor location as the S8
 
@CircusCat I'm finding it reasonably usable, if occasionally sub-optimal. You can easily swipe it as you pick the phone up but if you don't want to pick the phone up then you have to fall back to entering a PIN.
It's a pity if that's your only reason for not getting it.
 
Bob
@Mokubai Do you have a note8?
 
@Mokubai My fingers are too short to reach the sensor at all on the S8, let alone the Note 8
But yeah it's a nice phone otherwise.
 
@Bob yeah wanted a new shiney toy
@CircusCat ah, yeah. It's definitely not small hand friendly, though being narrower makes it quite comfy
 
I also tend to hold phones with my little finger supporting the bottom of the phone
 
1:38 AM
@CircusCat Is your little finger all bendy now?
 
@MichaelFrank No
 
Bob
@Mokubai what'd you upgrade from?
 
@ThatBrazilianPony omg the Windows 98 one is super accurate, screen flickers and all
 
@Bob S6 Edge+
So another large-ish phone
 
Bob
ah
I'm on a S7E right now, probably waiting for the 2018 gen :P
@allquixotic think I'm gonna give Cavil another shot
 
1:42 AM
hah
 
Bob
speaking of. can a mod unfreeze the bot room? @JourneymanGeek? chat.stackexchange.com/rooms/40974/bot-overflow
 
@Bob done
 
@allquixotic Great for office pranks!
 
Bob
@JourneymanGeek thanks
really wish they'd allow ROs to unfreeze rooms :P
 
(I might be a little out of it, or AFK today. I seem to have come down with a flu)
 
Bob
1:44 AM
o.O
:(
 
@Bob glad I skipped the 7 series, the glass was too rounded at the edge for my liking. It looked like a shiney cornered button.
 
Bob
@Mokubai took a while but I eventually got used to the edge :P
by all reports it's better than the 6 series, though
it's almost like they've gotten into a bit of a Windows cycle
 
@JourneymanGeek Beware of the sudden rep spikes
 
Bob
6 was the big design change, 7 was the polish
8's another big design change... I'm guessing 9 will be polish
 
@ThatBrazilianPony I'm out of actifed ;p
also, rep spikes? what rep spokes?
 
1:53 AM
Uh it's a spike because... rep... decreases.... over time... I guess... ?
I have no idea what I'm talking about
 
Bob
@cavil:~/dev$ ls
cavil.pcap                    rebuild.sh
chromedriver-build            reloadpjs.sh
chromium                      reload.sh
chromium-latest-linux         restartpjs.sh
cron.sh                       restart.sh
firefox                       run-headless.sh
ghost                         screenlog.0
phantomjs                     selenium-server-standalone-3.4.0.jar
phantomjs-2.1.1-linux-x86_64  slimerjs
phantomjs.sh                  SO-ChatBot
pjs-old                       so-chatbot-driver
hmmmmmmmmm
I can't remember how this works :P
 
@Bob give me unrefined any day then ;P I really disliked the S7 series...
 
I find the body and form factor of the S8 quite a bit nicer than the S7. But the latter is still a lot better than the 6.
The S6 and S3 are both phones I had but returned/sold because I didn't like them.
The S2, S4, S5, and S7 are the ones I kept. Though the 5 didn't really last long
 
Bob
Loaded stackexchange.com/users/login
Logging in...
Toto, I've a feeling we're not in Kansas anymore. (not supposed to reach this) {
 Error: A request to switch to a frame could not be satisfied because the frame could not be found.
gfdi.
 
2:16 AM
@Bob change in login process?
 
Bob
@allquixotic looks more or less the same through that point
with a manual run through
 
People confuse me at times: superuser.com/questions/1251966/… "As i said,"reinstall macOS", " but the question specifically mentions macOS Sierra
 
> ...the new camera notch that covers the screen's content.
##wat
 
> Apple’s iPhone X notch is an odd design choice
No, "The Verge", I think the word you're looking for is stupid
 
2:24 AM
@Ramhound Oh boy! Popcorn time!
@ThatBrazilianPony As long as apps can choose not to use that part of the screen, I'm okay with the design.
 
any idea how much space is taken up by the wide variety of wifi drivers that may be bundled with win10?
 
@MichaelFrank - no worries, I am done with question.
 
@MichaelFrank They can't, apparently. Apple app design guidelines forbid things like this:
You have to use the left option.
 
They look identical?
 
The top bar is slightly different, black background all the way on the right
IMO the right looks better :/
 
2:28 AM
> but Apple’s own developer guidelines appear to forbid it:

Don't mask or call special attention to key display features. Don't attempt to hide the device's rounded corners, sensor housing, or indicator for accessing the Home screen by placing black bars at the top and bottom of the screen. Don't use visual adornments like brackets, bezels, shapes, or instructional text to call special attention to these areas either.
It's like there's an ongoing bet at Apple about how much crazy stuff they can pull and people still buy their phones.
 
Its been a while but wouldn't a mac let you network install at least a known good OS?
 
@ThatBrazilianPony AKA WE PAID SOME IDIOT A LOT OF MONEY FOR THIS DESIGN SO YOU BETTER USE IT
 
@MichaelFrank also, every phone is a big slab of screen with a button
 
@ThatBrazilianPony this is why I got the iPhone 8 Plus, not the iPhone X.
 
Let's remove the headphone jack! Next year: Let's remove part of the screen! Next year: let's remove $random!
 
2:32 AM
Spin the wheel! Spin the wheel! Spin the wheel! Spin the wheel!

*spiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiin*

Ability to make phone calls!
 
I hear removing the case and having the phone consist of a dangling mass of electronic components is the hip new design philosophy
 
I'm actually toying with using the jelly as my primary phone...
 
You mean this @BenN
 
2:34 AM
There we go, just change the "adafruit" text and star to the Apple logo and call it the iPhone Next
 
Oh oh oh! I just remembered! I got off a call from a user earlier who is sending in their laptop to me for some software reconfigurations... They very helpfully let me know that their username, password, and RSA PIN are on a post-it note inside the laptop. :|
 
The RSA token pin which is a time token?
HAHA
 
No, the PIN to unlock their RSA soft token.
 
The last one is @rahuldottech ;P
 
so they have a software authenticator, gotcha
 
2:44 AM
@Ramhound Yea... so they've basically put the keys to the kingdom in with their laptop and sent it in a courier.
 
The only thing missing is their cellphone for SMS auth
 
That is almost as worse as sending you their actual physical RSA token or perhaps worse then sending you the token code when they sent it you
I hate itunes
SO I am trying to restore my icloud backup
but it doesn't let me pick which backup to use
Son of a Gun
All because I wiped Safari and in the process lost my open tabs
lol
 
3:08 AM
So I wipe my phone, and I get to the step of restoring the phone, and then it proceeds to attempt to send me a text but here is the kicker, I can't receive text messages in it's current state: APPLE FAIL
 
Bob
hm. @allquixotic firefox 55 works fine (prev: 56a1). geckodriver 0.19 works fine (prev: 0.17). there's no webdriverio update. selenium standalone 3.5.3 breaks (prev: 3.4.0)
 
This is all because you can't do any idevice recovery with Windows...
 
Move SIM to other phone... "Apple cannot activate this device without a SIM Card"
What? I recover iDevices all the time with Windows.
Do you mean from a backup? Or to factory?
 
Well I accidently wiped my open tabs in Safari so restoring a backup from this morning
( didn't use the phone basically today )
So I am talking about the verification process of authorizing access to your icloud account
 
Bob
yea 3.5.0 breaks too
 
3:12 AM
If I had a Mac I would get my verification pins sent to that also (provided it's synced to my account)
unless I am missing something?
 
Bob
!!info
 
@Bob I awoke on Wed, 20 Sep 2017 03:13:14 GMT (that's about 26 seconds ago), haven't done anything yet!
 
Bob
Ok let's see how long he stays up for.
 
@Bob so selenium server 3.4.0, geckodriver 0.19 and FF 55?
headless?
 
Bob
@allquixotic yup
looks like there's issues with webdriverio and 3.5.x at the moment
not entirely unexpected; 3.5.x is very new (3.5.0 was 20 days ago?)
but geckodriver 0.19 recommends 3.5 :P
I should probably check if chrome has added those options
!!listcommands
 
3:22 AM
@Bob help, afk, awsm, ban, color, convert, define, die, doge, domain, eval, export, findcommand, forget, forgetseen, github, google, hang, imdb, import, info, inhistory, jquery, learn, listcommands, listen, live, mdn, meme, moustache, mustache, norris, nudge, parse, refresh, spec, stat, stats, tell, timer, todo, unban, undo, unonebox, user, weather, wiki, xkcd, youtube, zalgo, 65wat, ;), ;p, \/s*, after5, ahh, ahhfire, apumpkin, areyoukidding, baaaaat, bababababat, bankey, baroo, bearhello
beatingbloodoutofarockwithahalberd, bespecific, biird, boberror, brainf__k, bunny, caaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
 
Bob
@CircusCat do you want to merge your commands into cavil, or nah?
 
Ha... This website is clever. It detects the adblocker and displays a warning, but when I go to block the warning element the whole page disappears.
 
3:43 AM
@MichaelFrank - So I just restored my phone from a icloud backup, but now my photos are in the cloud not on my phone, how do I tell ios to download those phots?
 
@MichaelFrank disable scripts?
 
A very good morning to all you folks :)
@ThatBrazilianPony LMAO
OMG
@ChatBotJohnCavil OUR OVERLORD IS BACK
##rcelebrate
 
!!rcelebrate
wait for it...
uhm...
*cough*
@ChatBotJohnCavil bro, wut?
 
You killed kenny Cavil? Again?
 
3:50 AM
Yeah, it's dead :(
 
@BenN *HE!
he's human god!
 
Bob
4:04 AM
what did you do
:<
03:46:09.588 INFO - Session 210b25f5-a6a5-44dd-b9d6-fbe6be26c34e deleted due to client timeout
1505879169598   Marionette      INFO    New connections will no longer be accepted
@_@
...
dammit. 30min timeout. thanks, selenium. webdriver.server.session.timeout
 
Bob
!!info
!!listcommands
hm.
!!info
 
4:21 AM
@Bob I awoke on Wed, 20 Sep 2017 04:21:01 GMT (that's about 8 seconds ago), haven't done anything yet!
 
!!rcelebrate
 
Bob
There we go.
 
finally
!!are you alive?
 
@rahuldottech No way
 
Bob
4:21 AM
browserTimeout is now at 31536000 (~365 days) while session timeout is now 0 (hopefully indefinite)
 
Can you import Circus Cat's configuration?
 
Bob
@bwDraco Only if @CircusCat wants to.
Anyway, right now it's a trial run.
If it stays up for 24h straight, then we might be good to go.
I might need to tweak the client timeouts again, idk
will check again in an hour or so
 
!!will you let us down again?
 
@rahuldottech Probably
 
Bob
4:26 AM
@rahuldottech ...maybe you should stop asking him questions :D
@JourneymanGeek how's the driving? :P
 
@Bob no clases available till november unless someone cancels ;p
 
Bob
@JourneymanGeek oof, that's a long waiting period
 
Bob
does it have to be classes?
 
ya
Its pretty much impossible to pass here otherwise
 
4:29 AM
pass what?
 
The driving test ;p
 
for a car?
 
@Ramhound yes
 
Drivers Ed must be really different in other parts of the world cause it sure wasn't required when I got my license
Yeah, so I sort of gathered you were learning to drive for a reason :-)
 
4:33 AM
I think my dad wants a less grumpy backup driver ;p
 
Alright, so I didn't literally know until you confirmed it just then, figured it was for a truck or something...don't judge me I am tired!
and I am kicking myself for restoring my phone.
 
Yea, we don't have to take a class to gain a license here, but if you do the course you get 6 months off your restriction period.
 
ANywaym if he can do it... youtube.com/watch?v=BWAK0J8Uhzk
 
Bob
@Ramhound AFAIK the US has very relaxed licence/testing requirements compared to the rest of the anglosphere
@MichaelFrank ditto, class not required but it takes some extra time off the required logbook hours
 
More difficult than drive on the correct side of the road, and stop when legally required, cause well never had more challenges then that.
 
Bob
4:36 AM
@Ramhound yea, you're generally expected to know what signs mean, how to signal, ... here :P
 
oh I can do most of those
Other than actually driving, I am probably more familiar with how a car works than most people who learnt to drive ;)
 
Bob
@JourneymanGeek it's only very slightly about how a car works and more about how traffic works
 
@Bob everyone else on the road is cray cray
and everyone who has a licence has no idea how to drive
And THERE'S PARTS OF YOUR CAR YOU CANNOT SEE
also. squirrels.
 
@Bob - How hard is it. Green = GO, Yellow = Speed Up, Red = Use caution but then proceed through the intersection.
 
... yellow isn't speed up
"grey - go, other grey - get ready to stop, that other grey - stop"
 
4:39 AM
yellow isn't slow down either :$
 
Bob
@JourneymanGeek but what do you do if it's grey?
 
@Bob the needful
(Yes, dogs can see colour, but this is funnier)
 
OMG
First I thought @JourneymanGeek didn't understand sarcasm then I missed the "I see everything in gray" joke
I then realize the reason my phone isn't downloading photos is because of low power mode
 
apparently its all yellow...
 
Look at the stars, look how they shine fooooor youuuuuuu...
 
4:51 AM
@MichaelFrank lol, that came outta nowhere :P
 
Bob
@JourneymanGeek they. uh. look the same to me :/
 
awwwwkward
 
Bob
@rahuldottech hm?
 
@Bob nothing, just this movie I'm watching...
 
Bob
!!ping
 
5:05 AM
@Bob pong
 
5:20 AM
@Bob of course they do...
 
Bob
@JourneymanGeek lol. if I squint...
but it's hard for me to tell some shades of red/green apart, unless they're next to each other
 
Bob
A tongue in cheek answer to the question in the title would be; "that's where the asteroids are." — Michael Richardson 16 hours ago
 
> ~
~|~
 
Bob
5:45 AM
@Ramhound AFAIK screentogif is legitimate and has no need nor desire to spam. But that question does look a lot like spam-bait, especially given that answer...
 
Bob
!!info
 
@Bob I awoke on Wed, 20 Sep 2017 04:21:01 GMT (that's about 1 hour ago), got invoked 6 times
 
Bob
Still going!
 
6:04 AM
▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀
▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀
▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀
▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀
I should learn chess
@DavidPostill How's your new job coming along?
 
@rahuldottech Still training so can't be sure yet ...
 
@DavidPostill Oh, well, have fun:)
 
7:06 AM
lol
 
7:51 AM
this is amazing
goddamn, this guy is a good speaker
 
Bob
8:09 AM
!!info
 
@Bob I awoke on Wed, 20 Sep 2017 04:21:01 GMT (that's about 3 hours ago), got invoked 7 times, teleported 44 goats
 
Bob
@allquixotic Ok I think I'm gonna call him fixed :)
 
morning
traffic is awful today
 
Bob
8:37 AM
24 hours ago, by Burgi
i can listen to the radio and enjoy my own thoughts
:D
 
yes, and i did
i was enjoying a programme about how harmonised singing is not unique across all human cultures
 
Bob
keywords vaguely matching the question without ever actually answering it, and lots of links to their site
 
report it in charcoal HQ
i got shouted at the other week for linking spam in here
grrrrr!!!!!! WP and its damn auto-update
 
9:06 AM
@Burgi You don't disable WP auto-updates? I would...
 
I thought they had been
 
@Burgi how dare they!
 
So, I'll just throw a question over here. My apologies if I interrupted an ongoing conversation.

I studied software engineer and worked primarily as a software engineer for most of my career. Would it be wise to start learning sysadmining and maybe find a career to do that in the next 2-3 years (hopeful expectations)
 
+Solidak I am interested too in your question.
 
you'll have to take a bit of a pay cut to change disciplines
 
9:15 AM
I know sysadmins and software engineers are in shortage in Estonia...
 
@Burgi See, that's the problem. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think that web/mobile developers get paid higher than sysadmins, unless you're a sysadmin for a really decent company.
@Boris_yo, for real? I think Estonia was big on tech and startups?
 
its more the lack of experience that will force the paycut
 
@Solidak Oh yeah. Companies are desperate and go that far that they "steal" employees from competing companies by incentivizing better employment terms and import foreign employees by issuing working visa. That's one of government's campaigns too.
 
because you'll have to take a junior role
 
Was in CCNA course that was too intensive to cram all the material in 4 months. In fact they didn't even finished it properly. That's what peer told me...
Was one guy there, an ace, who what it seemed knew everything. I was later told he was doing course second time...
 
9:21 AM
@Boris_yo they are in shortage everywhere
 
CCNA > CCNP > CCIE (very few in an entire world, usually at the top in organizations)
 
Oh yeah. But, I guess that sysadmins don't have the equivalent of Udacity/Udemy/Coursera for getting certified online knowledge and would have to do courses like that.
 
and about 3/4 of what is produced by universities are not actually competent developers/admins
 
@tereško I know there is a demand for them everywhere but they are definitely in shortage in Estonia.
 
@Boris_yo at my current workplace, it took them 1.5 years to find a new frontend developer
 
9:23 AM
I work in Berlin. Every 2nd person you meet here is a mobile/web developer.
 
@tereško Due to outdated information that must be constantly updated?
 
@Solidak there's apparently much more jobs in development
 
@Boris_yo no, mostly due to people not actually studying, but just coasting through the university
from my entire graduating class there were maybe 4 decent developers
 
@tereško You have a lecture then you study and "close" the material at home. Is it different there?
 
@JourneymanGeek Indeed. But, I've been working in mobile development for around 3 years now, and honestly I feel a bit pigeon-holed. I think the system administration appeals a bit more to me, but I feel that making the transition would take 2-3 years for learning alone before I can even get a junior position job. Let alone all the certifications I have to pay for. So, I just wanna be dead-sure before making the jump
 
9:25 AM
look at DevOps roles
 
hah. 2-3 years. An optimist ;)
 
@JourneymanGeek Excuse my ignorance :))
 
@Boris_yo ... or there is a lecture taht you can't pay attention because of the raging hangover and later you go to dorms to watch a movie and get high
 
2-3 years to learn what you don't know
 
@Burgi I was thinking of it. Unfortunately, it feels more like management roles. toptal.com/devops/what-the-hell-is-devops
 
9:26 AM
what do you think sysadmin is?
 
@Solidak its worth remembering the traditional sysadmin is quite blue collar...
 
@tereško Lack of dedication and perseverance...
 
some of the best sysadmins I've had the previledge of knowing, were not traditional IT guys
 
hence, why the output from university pipeline has so few competent developers (and I suspect, that the same applies to sysadmins)
 
and these days we're drifting off from nuts and bolts syadminning to running systems as code AKA devops, even in companies which run their own infrascture.
 
9:28 AM
But wouldn't a DevOps dude even need to know stuff like networking?
Also, I honestly have no idea where to even start with DevOps... I gotta hit the subreddits...
 
so... there's two definition of devops
firstly is the idealised one....
this talks about it - essentially you break down the walls between sysadmins and devs and have them work together
In reality, its a dev as a sysadmin (and never vice versa) and that annoys our cousins at serverfault to know end
That said, it does not hurt to understand the platforms you code on.
 
@Solidak I'm someone who's done system admin....
 
or you can take a junior engineer role at a small/medium company and learn sysadmin that way "oh you know about computers therefore you'll be great at sysadmin and networking...."
 
@Solidak depends on the place tbh, I've seen Devs and Devops who just know their little bit and nothing outside of it, and I've seen people who know entire infrastructure
@JourneymanGeek I stared doing it from the sysadm side
Was shocking how little some Devs know
 
^ that I have observed at work
 
9:37 AM
^ True that
 
we use linux on our work machines and 5 out of 8 developers do not know how to do anything in linux
 
Stackoverflow.com -> copy/paste -> L33T
 
in my experience devs end up doing tech support because of the "oh you know about computers therefore you'll be great at sysadmin and networking...."
 
hah
and then eventually some joker goes "You can change light bulbs right?"
 
lols
 
9:39 AM
... and mind you, I am a PHP developer - when I see an admin, who know less about sysadmin shit than me, I tend to get really scared
or, well, operating systems and networks in general
 
@JourneymanGeek or "where do we order chairs from?"
@Solidak you think we are joking?
 
da, Precisely.
@Solidak this totally happened at my last job
 
@Burgi Jeez...you serious
?
 
yes
 
LOL!
 
9:41 AM
as I mentioned above - hiring a competent IT professional is kinda hard
 
I didn't know it was that bad...
 
@Burgi you do not ask me that question unless you want to get me a herman miller aeon...
 
when i last worked in tech support we got tickets to fix lights and office furniture all the time
 
Solution: hire a janitor
 
we should have a MSU question asking for the craziest support ticket stories
the best one i heard from a friend was that they got a ticket from a senior manager about a fly trapped in their office
 
9:45 AM
So, did they close the ticket?
LOL
 
@Burgi my favourite one was "EVERYTHING IS BROKEN!" then 2 minutes later "ITS FINE! CLOSE TICKET PLEASE!"
 
apparently the manager had the thought process: flies are bugs, computers have bugs ergo this is an IT issue
 
@JourneymanGeek that's quite common on the developer side too
 
oh and the ones where the mains are switched off
 
Perfect logic
 
9:46 AM
"What did you do?" "Mains were off"
Oh, and the utterly mysterious ones where shit just works randomly.
 
At my company, sometimes we get client requests asking which language to use for their next mobile app: Swift or Java.
 
Preliminary shirt design done!
 
i once had to drive 80 miles in the horrible SMART car to wiggle a printer cable because the customer went freaking nuts on the phone
 
> i f'ing pay you to f'ing deal with this shit
 
9:49 AM
@rahuldottech why www
 
@Burgi I wish you tell me that you met him later with a baseball bat in the parking lot
 
@Burgi sounds like one of those people, who are scared of technology
 
https:// looks weird on there
@Avery because otherwise people don't realise it's a URL
 
makes sense
 
9:50 AM
@tereško Yes. Scared to touch cable like it's a snake...
 
only real TLDs are .com/biz/org/net/gov
 
we hit him with the emergency call out fee and 3 hours engineer time (the time it took me to drive there and return to the office)
 
@rahuldottech tbh no one's gonna go there anyway from seeing it in a tee shirt
 
@djsmiley2k it's for me to wear during hackathons and stuff
So yeah, they might
Plus, it looks cool
 
@Burgi there's a few pieces of kit at the school which only worked when I was around
 
9:52 AM
Because I'm honestly surprised that I managed to get that domain name, rahul is a very common name in India
 
People got amused that I was like shrug I have no idea what I did, but it works.
 
I think we jumped on a different topic. Much appreciated guys.

I'll stick around here more often.
 
I actually documented these when I left. For all the good it'll do
 
> 1: Put a small terrier near the malfunctioning device
2: ?????
3: Profit
 
I don't suppose anyone has a handy unused and extra netflix gift card lying around?
 

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