@PeterTurner ... The Book of Mormon.

@TRiG yep, it would have to be up there, right next to the D&C

@TRiG yah, and the Best of the Watchtower 1975-1978

@AffableGeek: In reading my answer do you see the problem with answering that question decently?

@Caleb I do - and so that's why I tried to give a framework

I'm feeling like that is a framework that many users would use, so it's kind of a test case.

Wasn't intending one when I raised the question

But, once you point out the issue ... :) I'm curious what your thoughts are on that framework.

If it's any consolation, I actually thought you gave a really good answer, and +1'd it.

It doesn't do my own position justice. What bothered me is I felt like I couldn't.

And that might be some sort of litmus test for question frameworks. Can they be answered with a true and completion rendition of a specific doctrinal position without violating their right to be on a question and exist with other answers.

What would help do your position justice?

For example, I believe that the entire Health/Wealth "gospel" is a crass perversion of Scripture, deluding people with worldly answers and sending them down the wide way to hell.

And I mean that in all sincerity. I like to understand what issues I'm neglecting in making that theological statement

And I'm not alone in thinking along those lines. But in the context of C.SE answers, it's a little hard to come out and say that on a question that is just asking for "christian" or "biblical" answers. I believe that is the Christian position, but it's much more specific than that.

And I was really glad to see that in there. (Indeed, while this was not intended be a pointed question, in some ways, I was looking to see how a Propsperity Gospeller would respond to that.) I like to know the counter arguments to my claims.

I kind of wanted to make this claim in this question:christianity.stackexchange.com/questions/9883/…

That's what I was afraid of. If you're looking for for the PG response to these claims about suffering, I think your asking entirely the wrong question.

But, I figured that would open a whole 'nother can of worms.

Because the "right" answer to your question is resoundingly "YES", but what you actually want to know is what the "no" guys come up with.

In that case, just ask for their opinion. "what do prosperity gospel preachers teach about christian suffering such as shown in passage x y and z?"

That would seem like a very leading question to me, though...

I actually can't answer that question, and what you really want is the discussion generated in opposition to the view I hold. This format doesn't work well for that kind of discussion. Address your question at the position you want to get.

@AffableGeek Sure it is. I'm not sure how else to do it though.

(That NPOV adheres to good questions, too!)

This is why questions looking for absolute truth just don't work here. Ask what reformed doctrine of suffering is and you'll get a straight answer. Ask what Catholics think about suffering, you'll get a straight answer. Ask what Mormons view on suffering is (hey I should ask that, I don't actually know) ... you get my point. Ask what Christians SHOULD think about suffering, everything goes haywire.

Hmmm... This sort of gets to the heart of the matter - I actively want to encourage discussion within a set of parameters. I think that does work here. I'm limiting scope (show consistency across Scripture or doctrinal perspective) and at the same time not saying "Choose A or B." I learned the lesson about attack questions a while back, and I don't want to fall back into that.

At the same, this is an important question.

I'm also not saying your -1 is the end of the world :) I'm just looking to clarify precedent

I know that you hold me to a higher standard :)

@AffableGeek Neutral? No actually I'd take in the other way. Neutral is the one thing that doesn't work. It's specifically in defining our differences that there is room for a site like C.SE.

@AffableGeek Yes I do :) And I'd like to keep this discussion going, but I think I'm going to have to bow out for the moment. I need to get some sleep, I have work and a sermon to finish to morrow and I'm preaching this Sunday. Can we pick this up again later?

So, dispassionate is fairly neutral, and I use that word a fair amount. A dispassionate place is a good place to ask open-ended questions. I would think we would not want to limit those at all.

meant to say dispassionate is fairly close to neutral

Fair enough - get some rest my friend. I was thinking it was pretty late for you anyway...

One thing before you go - you post your sermons?

@AffableGeek No not usually, but what good would it do you if I did? They aren't in English ;)

@AffableGeek İyi geceler.