TRPG General Chat

trogdor

12:00 AM

@Ash I don't think I ever read as fast as I think you do but I used to read pretty fast

Either that or I lost major track of time while reading

Not really sure honestly

user15026

Maybe both :)

trogdor

It's entirely possible

I wish reading grabbed me the same way now as it used to

I think among other things I've become a little More picky about the material

BESW

Read Murderbot! And for something every different I could loan you Neither Wolf Nor Dog.

And, you know. Try Broken Earth and The Hundred Thousand Kingdoms and Trail of Lightning and Clockwork Boys and Binti and...

trogdor

Lol

I really want to try an unkindness of ghosts

BESW

Oh, yes. I keep having to take breaks because it's kind of intense.

trogdor

12:09 AM

I might just end up tearing through that

Just because of the promise of something I didn't even know I was missing

The topic is pretty heavy though to be fair

Slavery is bad enough, but adding in,... Discrimination based off of not only race but sex, neuroatypicality, and whatever I've missed,....

Or just don't Know yet because it's not in the premise

BESW

I haven't gotten to anything "more" than that yet, but the depiction is brutally unflinching, in large part because it's so sympathetic.

trogdor

But for me, those things might draw me in as much as they repel, and the promise of the protagonist in it is a big thing for me

@BESW sympathetic to whom?

Or is that sort of spoiler territory?

BESW

The targets. In part because a sympathetic portrayal of people who are marginalized and violently discriminated against, must also include helping us understand why marginalized people so often also discriminate against each other.

trogdor

@BESW ok

I asked because I didn't know if you meant it was sympathetic to,.. the oppressors

Like not in a necessarily justification way but in a,... I don't know like understanding that they don't Know better or something

I know that's a strange angle to take from the limited information but I just wanted to double check

BESW

Not yet? But I kind of suspect that it's going to come down with a moral along the lines of "if we write off monstrous actions as simply the actions of monsters, we'll never fix anything."

trogdor

12:23 AM

Yeah I mean

BESW

But maybe I've just been reading too much Jemisin lately.

trogdor

I don't mean to imply they deserve no sympathy but

I think they deserve it second at best

BESW

One of her constant themes is that ANYONE can turn to monstrous actions, and pretending only monstrous people can do monstrous things is the first step toward becoming monstrous ourselves because we won't be watching our own behavior.

Oh, for non-fiction I'd recommend, in addition to Neither Wolf Nor Dog, try Hidden Figures. It was a great read.

So much more complex than the film.

trogdor

I don't feel entirely generous towards people who would treat me badly due to my differences, and it doesn't really make it better just because there are other things they discriminate based on than the one that hits me in particular

@BESW ooh the NASA ladies who did most of the math and didn't get credit for it right?

BESW

Yup.

@trogdor Some things are unforgivable, yeah. Just, we need to still see them as human or we'll be in danger of doing unforgiveable things too.

trogdor

12:28 AM

@BESW I wasn't coming from that angle in particular but yes

I think there is definitely a limit to what I could forgive Even assuming I could still buy into that moral concept if I was the victim of something that bad

BESW

@trogdor The book covers more people than the movie did, in more detail and with a lot more nuance. The film does a bunch of typical Hollywood stuff like "squash decades into months" and "replace systemic racism with a few nasty individuals," and its scope is just too small to talk meaningfully about how massively influential the space race was on the black community's upward mobility.

trogdor

Currently I have the luxury of not being the victim of literally unforgivable stuff

Though that doesn't mean it's easy to forgive everything

I definitely struggle with that a lot

BESW

I think that's something everybody works on their entire lives.

trogdor

Seems like a fair assumption

I do think I take offense at,... Different things than most people though

And then when people are oblivious to that it stresses me out

BESW

12:43 AM

I'm trying to learn to express my frustrations early and clearly, which helps a lot in keeping them from becoming Actual Problems.

trogdor

The thing is, for some people I know, I learned early that they take even a diplomatic approach very personally

BESW

Yuuup.

trogdor

I don't feel like I can even attempt to talk to them about it

BESW

I'm also practicing letting other peoples' problems be their problems, and focus on doing my best to behave like the person I want to be.

trogdor

@BESW that's very hard to do for me

Also, sometimes they make it my problem

BESW

12:48 AM

[nods like a bobblehead]

trogdor

Or at least try very hard to

X(

Family is especially bad for that

People who you care about and are stuck with are not the best combo for these problems

BESW

I know someone who says "Family knows where all your sore spots are."

trogdor

Mm

I'm not sure they conciously Know

But they definitely Know how to step all over them

user15026

1:06 AM

@BESW hidden figures was so good. The movie was decent but the book does them so much more justice.

user15026

I want to read an unkindness of ghosts but I think it will destroy me

BESW

On the other hand, the film had Janelle Monáe.

user15026

Which I will never say no to.

user15026

Janelle is awesome

trogdor

1:26 AM

@Ash tis fair, no need to subject yourself to something that seems like too much for you

user15026

Sometimes I like teh challenge of reading a hard thing but right now, I think it is mostly romance novels and fluff that I need more. Perhaps someday, tohugh

trogdor

I just reslish a book attempt with a sci fi story trying to tackle what it tries to tackle

Most especially an autistic point of view protagonist

There are other books I can look at for that but an unkindness of ghosts is the one that I am most interested in checking out right now

KorvinStarmast

1:48 AM

@Shalvenay whoops, looks like I was afk and missed you. sorry.

Joel Harmon

3:29 AM

... Am I the only one who finds the "validate this pregen's spell list" questions a bit weird?

I mean, it seems the easiest part about that validation is counting spells; the more tedious part should be verifying the spells are all of the proper level/class.

Xirema

4:33 AM

@JoelHarmon I can assure you that you're not the only one who finds them weird. The reason I find the tools useful though (and why I've been making those posts) is that I tend to work with tools that very quickly lookup Spell Level/Class restrictions, but virtually none of my tools know how to validate "uhm, a level 10 Sorcerer can't have 5 5th level spells!"

Ben

Aftermoon

Ehm… yes.

Xirema

It's also just a kind of unintuitive answer. If I'm trying to plan out a character, I want to be able to at-a-glance know what kind of power level I can give my character.

Also, for the midnight crowd: I created a google docs of the charts for each of the 8 "Memorized Spellcaster" classes that 5e features: docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/…

I'll be using that as I make those posts later on, so if there's any mistakes in there, it might be good to call them out.

Ben

@Xirema The one thing I need is a method of listing off my spells for the Druid class. They (can) change daily so it's a matter of rubbing them out, then listing them down again. Could just put tape on the character sheet and a fine-tip pen, would make it easier

The other thing they need is a "Feats" section. They do have a couple on the character sheets, but for someone like me - I like to list down the descriptions as well (so we don't have to remember/refer to the rulebook each time)… and it fills up fact. Again can just use the back of the sheet... But I like to stick to the format haha

trogdor

5:13 AM

@Ben oh yeah I've had that Same issue

Pretty much any character sheet that doesn't give space to the stuff with meaty description annoys me

Ben

Pet peeves haha

trogdor

Yes

XD

kviiri

5:56 AM

@trogdor The biggest credit for my good relationship with my parents goes to "being socially clumsy enough to not understand passive aggressive remarks before being mature enough to love them regardless" :)

Helwar

6:12 AM

@Xirema minor pet peeve: why did you leave empty the first column and row? I feel wrong looking at them being unused :P

(I guess because you like how it looks if you do it like this)

trogdor

6:22 AM

@kviiri mm the thing that tests me the most is when they blatantly ignore the social lessons they took pains to teach me

It doesn't mean I hate them, but it does rile me up something fierce sometimes

But on the other hand I also have them to thank for those lessons in the first place

kviiri

6:48 AM

It was quite the cultural shock when I met my SO's family for the first time. My parents always were about overt correctness, so pretty much everything flew if it was tactful in overt tone. Which often meant condescending passive aggressive remarks.

Her family otoh is all about correctness of intent. Chewing someone out with strong language is a sign of trust and affection as long as the reason is valid.

Ben

My biggest problem currently is actually my housemate. He berates his daughter for everything "You're doing it wrong... Go back and do it again, properly... What did I ask you to do... You didn't do what I asked..." almost constantly. HIs favourite word is "No."

I want to step in, but my issues is that I only see what goes on 2 hours in the day - 6-8pm

So I don't have the full picture

kviiri

Where her family is from, the customary greeting for a friend one hasn't seen in a while translates roughly as "wait, you're still alive too!?"

The riffing is stereotypically a part of the regional culture :)

Ben

7:06 AM

They sound either Irish/Scottish, Cockney British, or Australian. Haha

I wonder if that's coincidental... :P

kviiri

Probably not all that coincidental. They're from Pori which has a very industrial history like Cockneys and lots of maritime influences like Australia

I don't know enough about Irish or Scottish culture to comment on that, although I do recall hearing something about there being surprisingly many Irish sailors back in the age of sail

trogdor

8:06 AM

@Ben jeez that's not great

Ben

Not particularly. He says he's not always like that (I.e the rest of the day), and if it is just how it is at the end of the day, then fine I guess. Everyone's tired, bedtime all that.

But still

nitsua60

8:22 AM

@Ben There are certainly some days I've been happy just to get to the end of the day without swearing at the kids. (I've long since given up on the goal of not swearing around the kids.)

trogdor

8:39 AM

@Ben yeah, but still is how I will leave it

I feel like condemning the guy but I have never met him and have no way of knowing how true that is

I will say that even assuming full truth in that,... that's still not something I can condone,... constant no no no do that over do that over would suck to get from your parent all the time

if I was subject to that as a kid,... I don't know just how it would have changed who I have turned out to be

Joel Harmon

11:26 AM

@Xirema I believe you. I just strongly tend to prefer books over online resources, to the point that my computer has a current stack of 11 manuals next to it which I use to answer questions rather than looking stuff up online. It's certainly my own bias, and I didn't intend to offend anyone based on their choice of tools.

@Ben Get three index cards and label them "offense", "defense", and "utility". Split your spells per level in half, and fill in that number on each card. Then simply have two of these out at a time. Round down for odd numbers, and use those single slots to customize your day to day.

@Xirema I find this a bit weird. If you've traded away all your level 1 slots, you can't use them to cast spells anymore (sorcerer and paladin have other uses for them). I suppose I don't typically see a given level down by more than one or two spells known.

KorvinStarmast

12:57 PM

I love the pseudo-hysics question about 12 daggers, 12 chains, and one lightning bolt. It reminds me of some of the hacks we tried back in the old days, just after electricity was invented. :)

Transcript for