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12:29 AM
@BESW I did really enjoy the evil party interludes we had, those were fun
Also, always a good exuse for making and playing a new character
 
@BESW Except you'd lose humans' (nearly) unique racial feature.
They cross-breed with anything.
 
Nah, it'd just make more sense.
 
@nitsua60 good toss it
It's so dumb
 
(Horses and dragons being the other species that share the trait.)
 
Although I don't necessarily hate half elves in every edition
So maybe I spoke too soon
 
12:34 AM
@Powerdork did you ever get the answer(s) you were looking for?
 
@nitsua60 if you are counting horses you have to count owls and or bears too
 
@trogdor That wasn't breeding. [rummages]
 
@nitsua60 I know, a wizard did it
 
@trogdor nope
25
A: Does Cloak of Displacement hide your character's location or do others see two bodies?

nitsua60In the Realms, at least, your true location is not visible. The cloak of displacement is at least patterned after, if not made from, the hide of a displacer beast. (See the illustration on DMG p.158.) Displacer beasts made their first appearance in Realms-lore in the book Darkwell, by Douglas N...

=D
 
@nitsua60 oh this must be an edition thing
 
12:37 AM
So there's the lore-explanation for them. But, of course, we all know it was some mad 70s injection-molder who really created the first owlbear:
98
A: What's the inspiration for the owlbear?

BESWIt's based on a toy. And that's all most sources will give you, because they're drawing from an article (Ed Greenwood's "Ecology of the Rust Monster" in Dragon #88, later quoted by another article of the same name in issue #346) which is actually about the rust monster, and only passingly mentio...

(I know you know that @trogdor, but I figure we're due for our yearly reminder to new chatizens that @BESW doesn't just contribute excellent chat, but excellent answers, too.)
 
oooh, that's getting close to a Great Answer Badger.
 
@BESW Yeah, it is!
You must have a bunch of those, no?
 
Same here. But they're definitely ones I'm proud of/happy to see highly-voted, so there's that. (As opposed to so many of those "simple rules lookup" answers that get the +25 badge just because they're for a popular game.)
 
@BESW 'tis one more than me
 
12:49 AM
@nitsua60 how dare you imply that I know something, for shame upon you sir
 
1:42 AM
@nitsua60 I've only supplied two double-digit-upvoted answers in the last year, so.
 
2:09 AM
@BESW I now certify this answer as Great.
Huh I guess that I have no gold bling related to answers at all. Not surprising really though. Just means I need to step up my answering game eh? :)
 
@Rubiksmoose Gold from answers is pretty tough. It's a numbers game. You need to not only write a really good answer, it needs to be on a question that gets enough traffic for the purpose.
Wow, though: I just learned I've got the most-viewed question on the whole site. And it's one I posted because I was annoyed =\
 
@nitsua60 Guesses what it is before clicking...
Oh no I was wrong.
 
@Rubiksmoose "Who let the dogs out?"
It's an unreasonable number of views, frankly.
 
@nitsua60 I thought it was going to be this one: rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/84836/…
oh wow that is crazy number of views. But hey, a very helpful post. Invlovling a not inisgnificant amount of legwork
 
@Rubiksmoose That's another one I posted while annoyed. Stack: not sure your social engineering is working, here....
 
2:25 AM
@nitsua60 Yeah I remember you saying that. lol. Social engineer better SE.
 
I now have a magic number of golden badgers.
 
Dawn in Estonia, momma is making some noise. Wonder if breakfast/shift change is coming soon....
 
So I'm not sure what SE is trying to tell me here...
 
Cervalces scotti was a giant moose from the Pleistocene epoch of North America. They were 2.5 metres tall & died out 11,500 years ago. (Credit: sinammonite)
 
So, I have a question and an answer I don't know if it is correct - should I post my possible answer as an answer or part of the question?
(I don't even know how to search for this question in meta, thus I'm asking here)
 
2:30 AM
@HellSaint If it is a complete answer you might as well post it as an answer. I've seen better success doing that than posting a potential answer in the question itself.
 
@HellSaint Separate answer, if you ask me.
 
But if you can't support the answer (it's just speculation), it's not going to be a very good answer regardless of its correctness.
 
Yeah if it can make a good (but possibly incorrect answer) post it. Otherwise just let the community do the answering.
 
Thanks, I'll try to write it down and see if I have enough to support it.
 
Hmm... I'm not finding it on meta either, even though I feel like we've got something on it.
 
2:33 AM
I know we've got meta questions about self-answering, but I can't think of any specifically dealing with this case.
 
9
Q: Edit the question or answer your own question?

ThanuirAs far as I know, it is okay to answer your own questions. It is also recommended to show your progress with a question, and this is easily accomplished by editing the question itself and incorporating the progress there. When should I answer my own question and when should I edit the outcome in...

@HellSaint related, but not quite your situation
 
hey there @bruglesco, welcome to the RPG.SE lair :)
 
[wave] What's new?
 
@Shalvenay Hi and thanks for the welcome
 
how're things going?
 
2:42 AM
@Rubiksmoose WHY AM I STILL FALSE?! What's your beef with me SE huh?
 
@BESW ohh Hi to you too
Things are good
I'm surprised your chat lets me talk
I assumed they were all locked under 20 rep
 
Yes, but the chat is unlocked globally once you've hit 20 rep anywhere.
 
I'm still locked out of some
But I just found that some are not
weird - bug maybe
 
I'm gonna guess that the ones you're locked out of are Stack Overflow, and the ones you can get into are Stack Exchange?
 
yep - I just figured that out
 
2:46 AM
There's two separate chat infrastructures, one for each of those systems. Each chat infrastructure aggregates your user accounts for that particular system.
 
So only one site still blocks me
 
SO's just that special.
(I tend to forget it exists.)
So, what brings you to RPG chat?
 
Everyone knows that Stack Overflow is just a cheap knockoff of Stack Exchange anyways.
 
curiosity
 
@bruglesco We are a curious bunch in more ways than one.
 
2:48 AM
Excellent. You're welcome to lurk or chat as you like, of course. The General Chat's conversational topics can get pretty free-ranging, but if somebody wants to get back to talking about RPGs that's always the priority.
 
That sounds reasonable
Do you focus primarily on Table-top or do you delve into the digital as well.
Most of the Q&A stuff that pops onto my feed tends to be DnD so its hard to tell for sure. (because that's just a measure of popularity)
 
Computer games are dealt with over on Arqade; this site is specifically for tabletop games. However, we also cover the use of digital platforms to play "tabletop" RPGs over long distances.
D&D is definitely the elephant nobody can stop talking about, yeah. RPG.SE has introduced me to many other excellent games/systems, though. Been a real eye-opener.
 
gotcha Thanks
 
This site also occasionally delves into online platforms like and some things which are arguably more party games like . We tend to run an "I know it when I see it" perspective on topicality re: what counts as an RPG.
 
@bruglesco and chat, specifically, often discusses crpgs quite a bit
 
3:04 AM
We do sometimes bring up rpg video games here in reference to making or playing a tabletop version of it
And video games in general, while off topic, can be discussed a little if no one is looking for tabletop rpg type talking currently
 
hey there by the way @nitsua60 and @goodguy5
 
If there is any question or doubt about on or off topic discussion though, we have a Not a Bar to shunt stuff to for rampant off topicness
 
Oh hey der
 
@Shalvenay hiya. (and g'night)
=)
 
@nitsua60 lol, dream of wooly things
 
3:17 AM
@nitsua60 crpg?
 
Computer RPG.
As compared to TableTop RPGs, TTRPGs.
 
what falls into that category
certainly not Skyrim
 
I think it technically does
 
@bruglesco Neverwinter Nights, for instance (which I am playing as we speak)
 
Very broadly speaking, yes. In computer gaming circles it often means any game with a choice-based character progression system.
 
3:19 AM
ohh okay
 
@BESW Yeah this
It's a very broad category really
 
As always with this sort of thing, the harder we try to define the edges of a category the more fuzzy it becomes.
 
I recently put Buldurs Gate on my phone
 
In my experience, the idiomatic use of "RPG" tends to learn toward a description of play mechanics for computer games, and a description of play experience for tabletop games.
 
It's a very squirrelly term
 
3:25 AM
I think the cognitive dissonance between those distinct uses of the same term is probably one of the best explanations for the 4e hate.
 
Mmm
Maybe so
 
4e hate?
 
There is a significant subset among people who like D&D that hates the 4th edition of it for,.... Changing a lot of things
 
what edition was out in the 80s?
 
Basic came out in '77, Second Edition in '87.
 
3:27 AM
@BESW yes
that's probably a very good explanation for it indeed
 
Anyway I'm off to bed. Nice to meet you all. GN
 
ttfn
 
Many people sited thier disgust with 4th edition was due to "being too much like an MMO"
Thankfully not too many people here are spouting that one
 
 
4 hours later…
7:35 AM
@trogdor Switch to Anima. Should have all the flashy anime-style supermoves with all the fun of a system that was born from.... Rolemaster
 
8:06 AM
@Derpy I have a friend who started playing Anima, got fed up with the character generation so he automatized it, and within a few weeks he had created an AI expert system to do character optimization for him.
May 16 '17 at 12:47, by kviiri
I have a friend who recently started playing Anima. Now he's writing an AI expert system for character optimization in it.
It's probably sentient by now.
 
8:40 AM
BTW, @MikeQ, here's a good story about alternate selves: "And Then There Were (N-One)," by Sarah Pinsker in Uncanny Magazine.
 
 
1 hour later…
9:51 AM
I wish I'd never waded in to the TWF / Dueling fighting style questions. I feel like I could write a dissertation on the subject now. :(
 
@kviiri I once played Rolemaster. I still remember the "Fun" I had with the "ten thousands tables of pain and doom"
If Anima is even close to that.... No thanks :P
 
 
2 hours later…
11:51 AM
Morning, Nerds
 
@BESW (No love for 1e?)
=)
 
Honestly I can't keep straight which one that is. There's OD&D and AD&D and Basic, and it seems like Expert and Master and Immortal and all that falls under the Basic umbrella, and then there's 2e, and I don't know if 1e is something different or if it's another term for one of those.
 
Interesting thing that I noticed today: the 5e hand crossbow is categorized as Light. I wonder why that is, given that the property is only used (afaik) for two-weapon fighting which requires a light melee weapon, not a ranged one.
24
Q: What function does the "light" weapon property serve on the hand crossbow?

GMNoobIn the equipment section of the D&D basic rules, it lists "light" as a weapon property of the hand crossbow. The "light" property offers the following attributes: Light. A light weapon is small and easy to handle, making it ideal for use when fighting with two weapons. See the rules for two...

apparently we had a question on it
 
iirc
0eD&D (includes the weird basic, expert, etc)
AD&D (1st edition)
AD&D (2nd edition)
3.0
3.5
4 (I think Pathfinder released around the same time as 4?)
5
ah, 4th released june 2008
Pathfinder was published august 2009
 
12:19 PM
Yea, IIRC Pathfinder was intended as a sort of "alternative 4e"
 
12:30 PM
More like "If you're sad there's no more 3.5 material being printed, have we got news for you."
 
Well... you're both right, afaik

"There's still a large 3.5 market and wizards stopped printing stuff for it. We could bring out basically 3.75 and make it more accessible"
I loved the Pathfinder CRB
 
Cynical Redux Bootleg?
 
I mean.... yea
 
I came back to Guam from the mainland about the time of the 4e/Pathfinder sea change, and my entire 3.5 D&D group on the mainland moved to Pathfinder and other OGL properties. I continued to use 3.5 for a while, then went to 4e, then DFRPG and from there expanded into all kinds of systems.
I visited my mainland group about nine years later... they considered Numenera a revolutionary story game.
So in one night I ran them two games: Roll For Shoes and Cthulhu Dark.
 
progress is weird
 
12:45 PM
Amateurgress is nonsense.
 
12:57 PM
DFRPG is one of my favorites.

Cthulu Dark, though?
 
What about it?
 
What is that? I only know CoC
 
It is fun 8)
 
It's a lightweight (one page front and back for the basic rules) horror system designed for one-shot cosmic fear gaming.
There's a big book expanding on the principles and giving advice now, but the links to the free original rules are in the tag wiki.
Characters are very simple; the only mechanical qualities are your profession (lets you roll an extra die sometimes) and your Insight score (how close you are to going mad from the revelation).
The really cool bit is, failure is almost never an option--and it's rare even when it's possible.
You will succeed at just about anything it's humanly possible to attempt (except attacking the monster directly--that'll kill ya); the dice are there to tell you how well you succeed (and whether your sanity is in jeopardy).
This, combined with the curve on Insight gain, is very effective at escalating tension. In a game like Call of Cthulhu, failure is because of the dice: you could have succeeded, so the situation is frustrating rather than terrifying.
But in Cthulhu Dark your guaranteed success at any action it's reasonable to take is just barely enough to maybe gain a temporary reprieve or escape with some of your mind intact.
So the threats have real weight, rather than the danger coming from randomization.
 
oh wow cool
 
1:07 PM
Morning :)
 
Hello
 
(And it's designed for cosmic fear storytelling, but it's happily unattached to the actual Mythos setting. I like to use Doctor Who stories where I can replace the Doctor with the Investigators so there's nobody who knows what's going on.)
 
Hi!
 
[wave]
 
1:11 PM
I've seen very few RPG systems which actually succeed at supporting any sense of cosmic fear. Cthulhu Dark, Lovecraftesque, A Penny For My Thoughts (even the standard non-horror version, I think, taps into that aesthetic).
Systems like Call of Cthulhu's BRP engine actively fight cosmic panic.
All horror games live or die on the willingness of the participants to play into the horror, but it's more of an uphill battle with some engines.
 
It's not an RPG, by any stretch, but my wife and I really enjoy Eldritch Horror.
 
Cthulhu Dark's Insight mechanic, for example, starts off fast. It's very easy to rack up a few points of Insight very quickly, setting the tone and making sure everybody's on edge. But the more Insight you get, the more slowly you accumulate more, so the final scenes have characters teetering on the edge of madness and sabotaging the investigation to gain a little leeway: the tension builds and stretches.
But the real genius lies in the system's insistence that every time your character gains a point of Insight, you must role-play how your character freaks out. This gives catharsis, a momentary release in which dread (which would otherwise become unsustainable and the party's willingness to engage with the dread would get fatigued) is replaced by moments of terror and gore (to use the Nightmares of Mine terminology).
And if you do finally go mad, that usually comes at the peak of the game's tension and is integrated into (or instigates) the denouement.
A Penny For My Thoughts controls the building tension by using guiding questions and the certain knowledge baked into the premise that the revelation will be personally harrowing--likely both gore and terror--but the penny mechanic means each person's story is doled out in drips and drops, tantalizing with dread by withholding the ability to rush to the conclusion.
(And, of course, the penny mechanic also means everybody's an active participant in everyone else's story with all the active engagement and investment that means.)
Speaking of dread, I'm going to sleep now. ttfn
 
ttfn
 
sleep well :)
 
@Tiggerous I've heard good things of it. I wasn't really a fan of Arkham Horror or Mansions of Madness, though.
 
1:25 PM
A friend of mine made this super light rpg, Slapdash.
 
Slapdash is a cool name
 
Basically, you list three things your the best at in the world, and three things your the worst at in the world.

And you get three tokens. (we use pennies)

I'm struggling to remember the actual mechanics without pulling it up, but basically, you spend the points to get more success on things.

The way you get points back is to bungle. Which adds a complication to the story
 
Agreed. It is pithy and has punch and sounds fun.
 
I've tried to get him to post it somewhere, but so far he only has it in emails and such
Character creation is about 5 minutes, and then the joint world building takes about the same amount of time.
 
Just got my first ever accepted answer :D.
 
1:30 PM
<clapping>
 
@Tiggerous Yay!
 
@Tiggerous :D
 
I've been doing some on-off design work on a lightweight tactical combat system designed to flow better than DnD when large amounts of mooks are involved and involve a lot of position and movement based powers
 
@Tiggerous It was a well-done answer as well.
 
@Rubiksmoose Well, I got a bit sick of it somewhere in the middle, but I think it all came together in the end. I learnt a lot myself as I went too - so everyone's a winner.
 
1:35 PM
One of the ideas I've had that there would be no wasted actions, everything always has an effect that varies in potency
 
@kviiri The key for lots of mooks in 5e is to treat them as a mob
 
@Tiggerous I've been there before lol. But yeah also I often learn a lot while writing answers. The most interesting ones are the ones that you are certain the answer is X but you start writing it and realize that you are totally wrong and it is Y instead.
 
@goodguy5 Yeah but it doesn't feel as good
 
to whom?
 
Fighting something like a swarm feels like fighting a single monster
because mechanically, it is
 
1:36 PM
that's why you hide it
Roll a bunch of dice, and only look at one of them
Granted, it's a bit of a kludge, but still
 
Hey I broke 3k rep!
Kind of stalled out at 2900 for a while
 
Congrats!
 
I hope these signal problems for eaglecam go away before the egg hatches
 
@SirCinnamon Nice :)
 
@SirCinnamon Yea, I worry about those too. Especially if they're a sign of the camera being about to.. resign before the D-day.
 
1:39 PM
@kviiri The egg starts to crack and the screen goes black, no signal
I will fly to estonia myself and find the nest
 
@goodguy5 I've been thinking about something like, when you do Normal Basic Attack against a mook, you slay it with a flat 1/2 chance. The other 1/2, the mook is stunned - can't act next turn and is automatically taken out by a second attack by anyone, no roll required
 
@kviiri a neat way to do minions
 
@kviiri No attack roll to either attack?
 
Different classes would have better attacks optimized for different kinds of purposes: taking out single targets faster, performing finishers on stunned mooks or stuns as an AoE, having better kill probability in certain cases or so.
@SirCinnamon The 1/2 is the attack roll
 
How do saves work on mooks?
 
1:41 PM
@kviiri Guaranteed stun or kill though
 
@SirCinnamon yep
@goodguy5 I've also been thinking that any minions attacking a PC would roll a single d8 and if the result is at most the amount of minions, the PC gets hit. I don't know how to represent PC hit points though
 
*If the result is less than or equal to the number of attacking minions
 
In more mathematical terms
Yep
 
(Sorry, I had trouble reading it your way)
 
No prob
 
1:44 PM
what do you mean represent PC hit points?
is this still a 6-stat system?
 
@goodguy5 Nope
 
@kviiri then instead....?
 
@goodguy5 I mean, whether I want to use a DnD-esque model or something more realistic or dramatic
 
@kviiri The way you portray stats says a lot about how you portray vitality.
 
@goodguy5 Haven't really thought about it much but currently I'd go with class + powers (as in 4e) only. Pick your class, pick some subset of powers available to that class, proceed to bash in skulls.
 
1:46 PM
not quite as far as "dictates", but "heavily influences"
 
I think that connection is not as important as many other things.
 
Is anybody else seeing this on their profiles?
 
@Rubiksmoose Wow, you've surpassed me in rep. Congrats!
but no, I'm not
 
@kviiri I mean, in the grand scheme of things, no. But I think that connection is very real. And furthermore, it SAYS something about the theme of the game.
 
@goodguy5 Every design choice does
 
1:49 PM
@Rubiksmoose the devs are doing some work on the top bar, bits are disappearing and coming back on various sites
 
@Rubiksmoose no
@kviiri right, that's my point.
 
@kviiri oh really? oh wow. I can only assume that is a result of me being one with the 5e rep mine lol.
@doppelgreener I feel like it is making some sort of existential statement about me, but I'm not sure what it is. :)
 
I don't think the combat engine really needs a stat system of the 6-stat vein to work like I want it to, and if I want to include it for some other reason, I'd... probably not use the 6-stat one.
 
@doppelgreener good to know! I'll just be false until SE decides that I have proven my trueness I guess.
 
@kviiri I 100% agree
I can't remember, does torchbearer use stats?
Will, Health, Nature
 
2:00 PM
@Rubiksmoose it is a pretty terrifying prospect for a person to evaluate to false
 
yea, I can't think of any typecasting algorithms that would have (Boolean)Person == false
Gingers, maybe, if you subscribe to the "Gingers have no souls"
 
I think it's not an answer
 
2:16 PM
I don't think it is an answer.
In some ways it could be argued to be a frame challenging answer, but I don't think that's an appropriate response on a question like this.
 
@Rubiksmoose Definitely not an answer. More like a comment
People often comment to suggest alternate ways of finding answers
 
David, I've almost stopped being confused by your avatar
 
hahaha. Almost
 
Yeah I agree with all you.
@goodguy5 I actually adapted surprisingly quickly somehow.
 
well, it wasn't your icon lol
 
2:19 PM
In this answer, do you all think I should list every buff spell, or were the three examples good enough (those are the three I have used on shield guardians in the past)?
 
@DavidCoffron Every buff spell seems like a lot and unnecessary IMO
 
@Rubiksmoose Surprisingly there aren't that many (for wizards), but that's what I figured
 
Do we have a broad question about opportunity attacks and forced movement?
I saw the levitate question and thought "that must be a duplicate", but couldn't find one
 
2:41 PM
A question to the hivemind. Would asking which nWoD setting works best with 2 players and a Story-teller be on-topic, or would it fall foul of a recommendation question? I'm leaning towards thinking it would be closed, but wanted a second opinion
 
I think it's a recurring theme.
 
@Wibbs I'm not sure, but you might have better luck comparing specifically two editions, including scalability and robustness for numbers of players.
but really, it seems like a better thing to discuss here
 
@goodguy5 Ok, so anyone here familiar with nWoD?
:)
 
what I think is on topic
"Is nWoD v.X good with two PCs and 1 storyteller?"
"Is nWoD v.Y good with two PCs and 1 storyteller?"
 
@Wibbs what is the n, my google search came up with World of Darkness
 
2:46 PM
I'm only tangentially familiar with one edition and I don't know which edition it was. it was a larp
New
 
oh haha
 
How are answers like this (rpg.stackexchange.com/a/120945/43856) seem by the community usually? While this is the correct answer (for the time being), it doesn't actually answer the question.
 
@HellSaint we were wondering about that earlier.
most of us felt it was a nonanswer
 
@DavidCoffron New World of Darkness, which has been rebranded as Chronicles of Darkness, as opposed to Old World of Darkness
@goodguy5 Yeah, that would work. It just seems incredibly artificial to have to split it out and as n different questions, one for each line of products
 
2:50 PM
yes. it would feel bad, but I think that's the only way to ask a properly on-topic stack question....
except maybe
"How can I play nWoD with 2 players and 1 storyteller"
you MAY get an answer like "3rd edition has a grea blah blah"
 
@goodguy5 Yep, just had that thought as well. Question coming up
 
@goodguy5 Could you not ask "Which version of nWOD is best for 2 players and 1 storyteller" (as long as you give an explanation of what you mean by best)
 
it's tricky... some times that's viewed as "shopping" or "opinion based".
 
@goodguy5 fwiw, if we feel that way we should flag it as not an answer to signal to the mods that we do. (I flagged it)
@DavidCoffron that is 100% going to be a shopping question IMO.
 
Opinion-basedness is a rather difficult issue to resolve from time to time, don't y'all agree
@CaptainBohemian Hi and welcome! I don't recall seeing you here before.
 
2:58 PM
Opinions are pretty easy to resolve once you realize that mine is always the correct one.
 
@kviiri I was here several months ago.
 
@CaptainBohemian Okay, sorry for not remembering you :) What's up?
 
There's a lot of overlap, no stress :)
 
@Tiggerous I'm not even sure there's a good question in there
 
@kviiri nothing up. I still feel so sleepy even having sleeping for probably 7 hours making multiple dreams. I don't know why I am still so sleepy. Too sleepy to think well.
 
@goodguy5 It seems to be asking "What are some level 8 appropriate magic items for casters"
 
this is one of those situations where I want the question to be different than it is.

"How can I deal with players badgering me for OP items because they're used to a magic item economy?"
 
@goodguy5 That would also be a fine question
 
"give them cursed items and laugh at them"
 
3:12 PM
@CaptainBohemian I feel the exact same way.
 
@CaptainBohemian I feel the same, except I know why I am still so sleepy (Stayed up too late and my daughter woke me up too early)
 
@goodguy5 I really like that question, as you articulated it.
 
@Tiggerous here or in the comment?
 
Here.
Anyway, afk, might check in on my phone.
 
@GreySage I slept in the afternoon, rather than the night. I usually sleep at arbitrary time I feel sleepy rather than night.
 
3:18 PM
@goodguy5 If you wrote that as a frame-challenge answer, it would be 100% valid and 100% a good point
 
I don't remember what that means
 
@CaptainBohemian Hmh, sleep and sleepiness is strange that way
 
@kviiri I have the problem of race of mind, so can't always sleep at night.
 
@mxyzplk was it bad to leave an answer on this question. I see you held it. I figured a process answer would be okay as it addresses the question without opening the "too broad" area of the question (where many magic item homebrews work)
 
hello
 
3:29 PM
hi
 
I'm the asker of said question ^ ^
 
oh hey there!
 
I kind of agree with the problems everyone pointed out in the question, and woul like to change it reflecting them
(hey goodguy5!)
 
@Helwar welcome to the chat. The issue I have with your question is the multi-faceted approach (it was very difficult to figure out what you were asking). What exactly do you want from the question
 
but I don't know if it's better to reword it, make it a little less verbose and start over correctly... I realize i have written this as is during my work hours when i had a moment to write, so definitively it is rambling
i should have reread it a couple of time before posting
 
3:33 PM
@Helwar It's ok, that's why we have peer review
 
The hardest things to edit are your own thoughts
 
Are you asking: How to increase the power of these marbles? What is level-appropriate? How to balance homebrew magic items? How to decrease the power of [magic item here]? or something else entirely
 
will it be ok if I leave it as is for a couple of hours? can't take the time now to make a complete edit, and would like to do it properly, whe nI get home :)
 
@Helwar that's always fine, that's why it is On Hold. Held until you can fix it
 
it'll be on hold until you get back ^_^
 
3:34 PM
@DavidCoffron your answer is exactly what I wanted :)
 
@Helwar Probably should drop in here and mention your edit, so someone can vote to reopen if it is good (in case it was edited after hold already, then it won't automatically be jumped to the queue)
 
Thing is there were many things that yould be ok to me, finding an existing item or making a new one or whatever... But I realize now that SE don't work like that, that's too open
 
@Helwar You may want to consider what @goodguy5 suggested, because a lot of questions on SE tend to have the "XY problem". You have a problem X (your players are asking for items that you don't want/need to give them) and you're asking how to do Y (implement specific magic items) even if Y isn't the best solution.
 
I rambled a lot, really. I'll fix it in a couple of hours and hope to do a better job! :)
 
And we'd love to talk more about it with you now or after work
Most of us are at work anyway :D
 
3:37 PM
@goodguy5 shhh. my boss might overhear ;)
 
@MikeQ yeah, I know that just giving in is not the best solution... but it's what I did and what's done is done :S
 
@Helwar When I run games where my player's want magic items, it can be difficult to balance encounters. The easiest way is to just build the same encounters, but give the monsters magic items too. Unfortunately, when the players win, they get those magic items and it just snowballs from there. As such, you have to use other methods to rebalance encounters. I think that is part of the reason for the removal of magic items as core balance factors.
 
The "don't answer in comments" part is very difficult not to do though. I KNOW that rule, and still did it, dunno why O_o
 
@Helwar That wasn't directed at you. While we do prefer you answer clarifying questions in edits as well as the comments, leaving it in the comment is fine (it will be removed eventually once the question is freshened up). It is to remind answerers not to leave partial answers down there.
P.S. I think it was directed at me, when I mentioned the balance issues
 
@DavidCoffron "the monsters have magic items" is not the same as "the monsters have magic item effects"
There are several critters that have magic weapon effects that die when they do
 
3:42 PM
@goodguy5 That would fall under "other methods to rebalance encounters"
(essentially you are homebrewing monsters at that point, just with useful guidelines supposed by comparing the effects to magic items for balance reasons)
 
@DavidCoffron Either give the PCs non-mechanical advantage items (make them utility or RP items) or give the mobs the effect of magic items without the item (these hobgoblins happen to have 1 higher AC than normal)
 
^
 
@DavidCoffron I am very much of fan of modifying or reskinning monsters when I need to
 
I tend to prefer buffing the monsters with more creative advantages (as I like spending WAY to much prep time sometimes). But I do sometimes just slap on a magic item as a trait
In any case, slapping on that trait and then checking the new CR would be a good way of deciding how much CR your party can handle (thanks to their magic items)
(If only CR were easier to calculate, and were more accurate, for obscure traits)
 
I do mostly homebrew monsters and up to this moment i haven't had a problem with them... But the moment I homebrew a magic item I screw it :)
 
3:47 PM
@goodguy5 just say no. (badgering question in re OP items...)
 
@GreySage that was my approach with the magic items: utility before power.... I think that's what made my players felt like they didn't have "anything useful", because these 2 players think about battles mostly
 
@Helwar Even if they are focused on combat, you can give things like Boots that let them cast Dimension Door 3/day, or things that help without letting them kill stuff faster.
 
Yes but just because your players ask for something doesn't mean you have to give them exactly what they ask for
 
@MikeQ no, but they were insistent, adamant almost. And we know each other, I knew they where feeling "robbed" of their fun...
we agreed at the start that the campaign would be "down to earth", but that was like a year and a half ago
 
@DavidCoffron yeah it just runs the risk of being invalidated later depending on which way the op jumps.
And the comment was me deleting hellsaints comment basically saying a lot of what your answer did (dog item prices et al)
Dmg, darn autocorrect
 
3:57 PM
@Helwar Do you have Xanathar's Guide to Everything?
 
@Helwar If feeling powerful is the only way they can imagine having fun, then you should experiment in new ways to make the game more fun
 
@KorvinStarmast i have access to one (someone can lend it to me (
 
This reminds me of a player who would ask for RAW overrulings, and would keep playing the "My other DM lets me do it" card. The problem is that they just kept asking for more and more.
My point is - Will giving the players powerful items actually solve the underlying problem?
 
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