TRPG General Chat

2:36 AM

... I feel like this could do with just a little bit more fleshing out... rpg.stackexchange.com/a/118916/12193

Ok... so I was thinking about something the last few days - Degrading equipment.

@Ben @kviiri has played a bit of SW.

The main problem with this is just the sheer amount of bookkeeping involved to track all of it.

@Ben I think a Fate-style condition track might work well for that.

I think that would be a good way to handle it

@Shalvenay While I have many shortcomings, I am teachable. Now and again. Thank you, amigo. Una cerveza, para usted

2:40 AM

But what causes the equipment to degrade?

So, instead, I thought of this: on a roll of a 1 or a 2 to attack, they "break" their weapon (all following attacks are at a deficit until it is repaired). Additionally, when they are hit by a critical, they can choose to negate the critical hit, and instead "break" their armour, with a following deficit until it is repaired.

Is it every session it goes down by one?

Oh

Your weapon has three or four progressive conditions like "blunted," "wobbly grip," "chipped," and "broken." You can mark off the next condition in line to get a bonus (or an automatic success, depending on your play style) after the roll, and you have to take dedicated scenes to recover from the conditions.

@BESW I heard of that one... it was the "cost of living" style thing wasn't it? The only problem with that is that won't work with shorter games

@BESW Ohh

I like that

Ben, if you are using 5e, why not borrow the wand mechanic? Roll a 1d20, and if you get a 1 it breaks, or loses a "HP" of durability. (The latter makes it like D1's game engine, almost perfectly. See Jarulf's Guide Version 1.62).

2:42 AM

And if something really bad happens to you, the GM can also force you to mark off the next condition on the list as part of the fallout.

@KorvinStarmast Yeah that was the "bookkeeping" issue I was talking about before. Keeping track of everyone's equipment to such a degree would be really annoying

But the crit fail = break mechanic was something I was thinking of using, since that's a lot simpler.

Of course, crit-based mechanics are... well, random. And basing something so dramatic as breaking your signature weapon on pure randomization is very playstyle-specific.

Whereas the condition track could integrate with the randomization nicely--for example, mark off the next condition on your track to ignore the critical failure for that roll.

Well 5e doesn't exactly have "crit fails"

"You roll a natural 1. You can either fail the attack catastrophically but your weapon's fine, or you can succeed on the attack but your weapon gets damaged."

[shrug] It's an adaptable system, you get the basic idea. Match triggers to system and narrative as appropriate.

@BESW That's another way to avoid another die roll. On any attack that rolls a 1, reduce durability.

2:47 AM

There's always the Lady Blackbird approach.

I like the idea of a crit fail mechanic. It's simple, easy, and can be applied to the binary approach or the stepped approach.

@Ben No, do not do "crit fail = break" since that isn't something a player can track, and then choose to spend resources on to heal/remedy between raids/adventures.

That is back to the save or suck stuff ... not popular anymore

In Lady Blackbird, super important objects like characters and ships get conditions with checkboxes next to them. Stuff like "Need Fuel" or "Lost" or "Busted & Leaking" or "Angry."

The GM determines when the narrative says one of them should be checked or unchecked.

OK, I am having a weird and surreal Diablo/D&D conflation. I better sign off, or I'll need more whiskey. best wishes to you all.

It's not a progressive worsening or anything, just pure "reminder that these are the sorts of problems you're gonna have."

2:50 AM

@KorvinStarmast Well in the Diablo campaign I want to have the villagers serve more of a purpose than just banter. So, if weapons get broken, Griswold (the blacksmith) can repair/replace them. And since they are the "heroes coming to save Tristram", it can be at no cost.

Don't need to make it more complicated than it needs

I guess the question is, how complicated does it need to be?

I think of this kind of mechanic as being fuel for dramatic choices and interesting character scenes.

Other people might think of it as existing because this sort of thing happens in real life, so it should be modeled in the game.

Other groups might see it as part of a resource management subgame.

This situation is purely to increase the interaction with the villagers, or force a reason to go back to town. So the mechanic doesn't need to be overly complex.

At the end of an encounter, the party can go "well, my sword's busted. is there anything else people need to go back to town for? I can keep going, but I'm at -2 until I get this fixed/replaced"

Oh. Then I suggest not really bothering with breakability mechanics. The PCs will just find ways to repair stuff themselves.

If you want to increase NPC interaction and player investment in village scenes, mechanize NPC and village relationships.

@BESW How do you mean?

Well, Bubblegumshoe does it really well.

Shalvenay

2:57 AM

@KorvinStarmast no problem :)

@BESW Oh. well, no. Lol. That'd be up to the GM, obviously, and in this particular setting, with the characters involved, that situation is highly unlikely.

Your friendship with Griswold the blacksmith is rated at 2. You can spend points out of the pool to get advantage on a roll, or to declare that something is true, when it's reasonable that your friendship with him would be a benefit--maybe he taught you how to get the pebbles out of a horse's hoof, or he gave you a fancy hunting knife, or he can get you an introduction to the local knight you need to ask some questions.

You can only replenish the points in your relationship by spending scenes focused on your friendship with Griswold--maybe in the bar drinking with him, or recommending his services to visiting travelers. If you stay too long at 0 points in your relationship with him, he may start making trouble for you until you repair the friendship.

And tbh, there are many different optional mechanics can be added to mix up the game - equipment damage, corruption mechanics, rare loot, mana potions (WIP), as well as a few others, I don't think there'd be many situations where building relationships with the NPCs is a main thing.

@BESW Oh no I meant the PCs repairing stuff themselves.

The storyline is pretty simple: You have travelled to Tristram from (location based on character mini-backstory) because you heard of the problems in the Cathedral. The villagers say "go into the Cathedral and kill the baddies". You go into the Cathedral, and work your way through, killing all the baddies.

Mmm. Just sayin', if you want to encourage a specific kind of play, create mechanics which actually encourage that play. Don't rely on tangentially related mechanics for which the only response you can think of is the kind of play you want to encourage.

Because players WILL surprise you.

There's no need to be coy or subtle, it'll usually backfire.

I would be pretty upset if my weapons kept breaking because I was supposed to talk to the blacksmith every once in a while

XD

3:07 AM

I've had players who'd say "I've got a bag of holding, right? I fill it with swords."

@trogdor That's back to front. The idea is you're meant to go talk to the blacksmith once in a while because your equipment broke.

And other players who'd go "Hah! I found a class variant that lets me summon a weapon of pure magic when I need it. No breaking for me."

@trogdor And haven't found a better one to replace it with

And still others who'd buy a dozen scrolls of mend.

@BESW Well, there's the first hitch. The (base) variation of the game is using preset characters. The Warrior, the Rogue, the Mage, etc.

Shalvenay

3:09 AM

besides, if things go wrong with your weapon, isn't that what immediate action drills are for?

Finally got to play fate for the first time tonight!

@nitsua60 what did you think?!

@nitsua60 Oooer.

There's also re-training as a possibility as well. So the restriction to one piece of equipment is incredibly lax.

I liked it in a lot of the ways I suspected I would; I still wonder how a long-form adventure/party would feel, as opposed to the one-shot that emerged tonight.

3:12 AM

@Ben you said you wanted the mechanic specifically to get the players to go back to town and interact with NPCs

(Accelerated, actually, and I'm not sure we even played with all the rules there.)

@trogdor And this is one of. Not the only one.

@Ben So, again, breaking equipment seems like a very round-about way to get people to interact with NPCs, with unnecessary failure points and basically relying on the players not surprising you with their reaction to the mechanic.

So I don't feel like I read that situation backward

@Ben It's the only reason you've given us.

19 mins ago, by Ben

This situation is purely to increase the interaction with the villagers, or force a reason to go back to town. So the mechanic doesn't need to be overly complex.

3:13 AM

@Ben mk

Other reasons would be healing/resting, identifying equipment, as well as side quests.

Have your players indicated they want more of the "maintenance & materiel" game?

@nitsua60 You are one of the only people that has experienced any real part of the game so far. Lol

The other being Korvin

@nitsua60 I might play Bunions & Baedekers, though.

Interestingly Legend of Zelda Breath of the Wild has a weapon durability mechanic but they specifically did not end up putting a repair mechanic in because they did not want the players to be constantly going back into town / to NPCs

3:17 AM

@nitsua60 nice, it's a great system for the sake of flexibility of action

And like I said, these mechanics are entirely optional. You can use one, or all, or none, if you wanted to. These are simply ways to mix up the straight forward "Empty the dungeon" storyline

@BESW @Rubiksmoose I played John McClane, was the only PC to take any consequence (I got up to the second, whichever that was), and the only use I put the rifle (stolen from a guard I cold-cocked while pretending to deliver a pizza) to was jamming down the accelerator pedal of an intentionally-runaway car.

I think maybe I get it.

@nitsua60 that is amazing lol

@Ben fair enough

@nitsua60 Hee.

3:18 AM

@Ben Aah, I see. Then there are referents I'm completely unaware of.

@BESW My first consequence was taking a round in the shoulder. GM asked me which one. "The good one." Because my high concept was "grin and bear it."

Nice! Leaning into the consequence because you control it.

@nitsua60 I think you are a natural at Fate then XD

@trogdor I was super-bummed that I never got to use my stunt, though.

What stunt?

Through the roof: when entering a scene vertically take +3.

3:20 AM

Niiice.

Also, if you have recurring trouble with that, try only making one when you are about to use one

That is something that I struggle with myself, and I should probably hold back on making too many stunts myself

@nitsua60 I like "vertically", because it's not restricted to up or down. Haha

> Ho ho ho. If you leave a mocking message for an enemy to find later, you can use Provoke to attack them when they find it, and they cannot use stress tracks to absorb the stress.

@trogdor That makes sense. I didn't know you could do that. (We were told to make one at the start, and I figured it'd be easy enough to find something to fall off of.)

Lol

3:23 AM

@nitsua60 Depends on the game style. We've found it's much nicer to leave half your character sheet empty and fill it in during play.

@nitsua60 ah fair enough there

It was your first game too so

It's not a big deal that you were only very good instead of amazing :P

@trogdor Don't worry--if I ever get to playing it at 5am Sat morning, my time, I'll stumble toward "mediocre" =)

MEDIOCRE

The conceit for the one-off was "pick a 'good guy' who's going to be part of a team-up Avengers-style."

You picked the best guy

3:27 AM

It is one of my favorite Christmas movies... =)

John McClane works so well with Fate

@nitsua60 for the longest time I never saw it

And then I think about 2 years ago near Christmas I finally did

I saw Fate everywhere XD

I think a lot of people (who haven't seen it) don't realize that it's a tight movie. Barely a wasted frame, never mind shot.

A master class in writing and editing, if you ask me.

@nitsua60 Think that is a large part of why it works so well in translation

I still have not seen any of the sequels but they are not quite as good I imagine

If in part because they wouldn't be as original

Not to say they would be bad though

The second and third are okay.

I wouldn't mind seeing them for sure

But they don't seem high priority compared to #1

3:40 AM

@BESW Yeah, I've got soft spots for those. But the original is on that list of movies for me that if I walk through a room it's on in, I don't leave that room 'til it's done.

I like the third better than the second, for sure.

The second feels... kinda superfluous, I guess. The third feels like it's got new things to say and new ways to say things.

@BESW But I like the second for Holly. And Dennis Franz reprising the role of "Al." (Functionally.)

=)

True, though, that 3 felt like a real movie, rather than just "Die Hard Again With Some Different Actors and Action Scenes. But He'll Still Fall Through the Ceiling, So Don't Worry: You Still Get That Stunt."

Lol

So 2 is very similar to 1 then?

Yeah, it's Die Hard But In An Airport This Time.

Ah to be back before 9/11 (sorry if that's still too soon for anyone)

3:47 AM

But Still No Shoes, 'Cause That's Quickly Become A Signature.

In many ways it's just a remake.

@trogdor seriously: I used to leave my apartment in DC 30 minutes before my flight was to depart and have no worries about missing it.

While 3 is more like an actual sequel to the first film.

@nitsua60 I never had that exact experience because my dad was in the Air Force

@nitsua60 Also I've got a real soft spot for how 3 uses "When Johnny Comes Marching Home Again," the way 1 used "Ode to Joy."

3:49 AM

He is downnright pushy about being at the airport far before we could ever miss any flight that possibly exists

@BESW That's when the dump trucks are parading, right?

@nitsua60 One of the scenes, yes.

(No, it's most of the "organized with German efficiency scenes" now that I remember.)

Right.

Entering the building top-side, hooking up the chains to the bobcats, laying out bridges....

3:51 AM

Just like how "Ode to Joy" was recurring in 1 as Gruber's leitmotif.

Basically, making sure we didn't have to write much dialog for the minions and henchlady.

@BESW oh I loved that XD

I think if I run a Fate one-off it may be "characters who've played opposite/alongside Alan Rickman" getting together.

[blink]

I like the idea of Robin Hood, John McClane, Harry Potter, Emma Thompson's character from Love, Actually, and any of the Galaxy Quest characters teaming up.

3

3:54 AM

...and the Mad Hatter?

@nitsua60 dibs on Nearly Headless Nick

@BESW (I haven't seen the new Alice. I don't want it to replace the video for "Don't Come Around Here No More" in my mental filing cabinet.)

Heh.

Sweeny Todd, Ian McKellan as Tsar Nicholas II, President Zaphod Beeblebrox...

@nitsua60 Guy from Galaxy Quest. Constantly having an existential crisis about whether or not he's important enough to the plot to survive.

I've got to admit: I fall head over heels in love with Emma Thompson every time she confronts him in the auditorium, then composes herself and turns to the kids.

3:57 AM

But all I want to do is play the characters that Alan Rickman played. (dibs on Marvin)

An all-Rickman party would be... intense.

See also: all Samuel L. Jackson characters.

@BESW All-Rickman: The RPG

Ah, the Rickman-Playing Game.

2

If we allowed that we would be flooded by people wanting to play Snape

@BESW All-The-Rickman

3:59 AM

@BESW aw man much better than mine

@trogdor We'd have to set up a one-Snape-per-universe rule.

@trogdor So you ban Snape from the RPG, but also play games of Everyone Is Snape. Double-headers =)

@Rubiksmoose That just means we get lots of alternate-universe Snapes.

"I'm going to play the Snape who's a teacher at Sunnydale High."

@BESW I think that could actually be amazing.

@BESW oh God no

Worst possible world

@trogdor My Little Pony Snape?

4:02 AM

@BESW I'm going to play the Snape who's a judge on a Food Network show.

@Rubiksmoose do not attempt to bribe me

XD

@nitsua60 Good job. you made me actually laugh uncontrollably.

@trogdor [reads in Alan Rickman voice]

@nitsua60 I would actually pay money to see that show

@Rubiksmoose oh no, what have I done now

It's an unstoppable monster

@Rubiksmoose the term, I'll have you know, is lolfigsl

@nitsua60 hahaha

4:06 AM

what's the "figsl"

Next game I'll play the Snape who made one high-profile mistake with a potion and has been demoted to teaching elementary school band.

@nitsua60 I hope he doesn't get fired from that. I don't know if that position has severus payments.

@trogdor You don't understand. This is Professor Flintheart in Season 6:

@BESW oh wow. I did watch but maybe stopped after a couple of seasons lol. I should have known though

(He's really more of a Scrooge in context--well, the little pony on the left is the Scrooge, but Flintheart's the nasty teacher from her childhood who helps her get that way.)

4:09 AM

Fulll House Snape?

@BESW do not attempt to bribe me (in front of all these witnesses)

@trogdor [slips you $2.13] "do it"

(it is all the cash I have on my person lol)

Xanadu Snape.

@BESW oh dear goodness. I've never seen it. But I've heard stories.

@Rubiksmoose They're probably true.

4:11 AM

@Rubiksmoose do you mean s/Saget/Snape? 'Cause that's gold.

@nitsua60 That has to be it. Yup.

Magical Girl Anime Snape.

@Rubiksmoose Sailor Snape?

@nitsua60 I was just trying to think what heavenly body he would be in fact.

Snape, of course =)

XD

Well, with that absolute nugget of an idea, I must retire to my bed.

4:15 AM

ttfn

This could make for some seriously interesting dream material if my brain ever worked in such a logical manner.

ttyl

This has gotten seriously out of hand

Good job everyone

5:21 AM

I don't like it...

6:05 AM

@Ben I play Savage Worlds a lot if you still have a question

Q: How can aiming be used effectively in Savage Worlds?

0

So, following a recent session of our Savage Worlds campaign, we were made aware of the ability to "Aim" (standard action, nothing to do with super powers or edges, etc.). From the explanation, if a player does not move, they can aim to get a bonus to hit and/or damage; but they must (apparently...

savage-worlds

6:27 AM

@Ben does that answer help?

6:37 AM

@Wibbs That does, yeah. My only suggestion is (if you can) get a quote of the actual wording of the rule?

@Ben Better?

Awesome :) Thankyou!

I've just added a note about the type of enemy faced as well. Wolves are not going to react tactically to being aimed at for example

Yeah, this whole situation came from a fight where nothing was happening: everyone was either missing, or not getting enough damage to do anything more than just cause the Shaken condition. So it was just a case of Shake > unshaken > shake > unshaken.... and so on.

So one player decided they were going to aim instead, to try and get a raise (it was just because of bad damage rolls), but the way the GM worded it made it sound like the most useless manoeuvre. Haha

6:54 AM

@Ben ah, yeah I've seen that before :). When combat becomes simply 'attempt to hit' - miss, 'attempt to hit' - miss over and over again, you know there's a problem. Tests of Will, Agility and Smarts Tricks, Pushes, Aiming, Called Shots etc etc are the life-blood of a good Savage Worlds combat encounter

7:12 AM

@Ben That's not how you make a martini. Not unless it's for a time-traveling James Bond.

It is well known how much I love Blades in the Dark, so this is an odd hack, since it's more of an assertion of my specific tastes than deep rules tweak. But as a result, it's probably *more* of a hack as a result, because opinions. http://walkingmind.evilhat.com/2018/03/21/bonds-in-the-dark/

Tweeted by rdonoghue on March 21, 2018 at 1:58 PM

7:38 AM

Time to review a proof.

Tweeted by fredhicks on March 19, 2018 at 7:53 PM

7:49 AM

BIRD #5,845 Vulturine Guineafowl (Acryllium vulturinum)

Tweeted by _everybird_ on December 3, 2017 at 2:12 AM

Coptic unicorn. (9th century, from the Monastery of the Archangel Michael, Fayyum oasis, @MorganLibrary 🦄 #medievaltwitter #Coptic

Tweeted by PiersatPenn on November 12, 2017 at 6:16 PM

Watercolour Sketchbook. Border Guard - Badgers dig in deep and stay put. They watch the borderlands for witch incursions and other supernatural attacks. Gwelf is a haunted land. #Gwelf

Tweeted by larrymacdougall on November 25, 2017 at 4:14 PM

8:08 AM

@BESW this reminds me of the Redwall series

Or Mouseguard.

8:40 AM

@Ben I've played SW, in the form of Deadlands:Reloaded (which extends upon the SW rules with Deadlands-specific material).

9:42 AM

What's our policy regarding questions tagged with an edition but openly stating that any DnD version's materials will suffice for an answer? I mean this one in particular.

VTC unclear and comment asking for clarification.

(Especially since it's not so much an edition question as a setting question.)

9:58 AM

VtC'd but not sure what kind of clarification I want to ask. Restricting to one setting or all settings?

10:14 AM

Hi, regarding my efreeti question being discussed here as unclear: I am looking for information on which to base my own ruling. I play 3.5e, as the question says, but information from any edition would be useful.

I only have access to the 3 core rulebooks, but I know there's a wealth of other sources out there; however, regarding setting, I would say "whatever the core MM describes." At the same time, if there's information relevant to what I'm asking about in a specific setting, I'd like to know it too.

I'd welcome pointers on how to clear up, rephrase, (or even narrow down if necessary) the question to make it on-topic.

@Angew Hi! So, the key here is probably that you're asking us for help with the solution you've decided on, rather than telling us what the problem is so that we can provide whatever kind of information an answerer's experience tells them will be useful.

If you can describe the problem you're facing, then issues about edition and setting will be more clear because there's context.

What is happening in your game that led you to come ask this question?

(In the Stack parlance, what I'm seeing is a potential XY problem.‌)

@BESW What I'm after is to understand how efreet work wrt. wishing and thus what is/is not possible in a plot involving an efreeti.

As the question stands, I wouldn't vote to close it, but I agree with you that it's probably not the best form the question can take; it has to be artificially narrow. If you edit it to give the context of why you're asking, then it can be narrow along a more useful axis than edition.

10:29 AM

Is the way I described the context in my last message useful, or still unclear in the same way?

@Angew That sounds like you're unsure how to incorporate efreet in your campaign and are looking for guidance on how wishes can make campaigns interesting and what pitfalls to avoid.

Is that correct?

If you frame the question along those lines --what you want to do and where you're confused/unclear/concerned-- rather than asking just for existing game text about efreet, then answerers can use whatever text useful they think is useful... and also bring in their personal experience with efreet in campaigns!

@BESW Thanks for the guidance.

In that context, answers can be voted on for usefulness against the backdrop of your situation, rather than against the open-ended backdrop of "stuff about efreet" (which changes across settings even more than across editions). You get more personally customized insight by taking advantage of our users' experience-based expertise.

While it's not about the pitfalls of whises in general, more about what an efreeti can[not] do with its wish-granting powers, I will edit the question to outline the plot I have in mind and tie it in with the unclarities. Thanks.

Hope it helps!

10:42 AM

@Angew For the record, I think it's ok to allow supplementary material from other editions, but for the purpose of easily defining correctness of the answer, it's the best to limit the "core" of the question to a single edition.

And thank you for your contributions to the site.

:)

@Angew If it helps, we encourage people to be fairly selfish in focusing on just getting a solution for their exact specific situation. If you want to give us more information on what's going on that you need a solution for, it maximizes our ability to advise you on how to handle that situation, beyond what we could do with giving some general advice on what Efreetis can vaguely do around the couple of points you raised.

Good answers provide "why" and "how" in their explanations so that even the most narrowly focused question will get answers that are useful to others because they teach techniques and perspectives rather than just dictating what to do.

10:58 AM

@AcmeCat Hi!

Welcome to chat! If you can't type right now, it's probably because the chat part of the network hasn't noticed your rep increase yet. Sometimes it takes a little while for rep increases to percolate through all the different parts of the Stack Exchange network.

@doppelgreener Thanks. RL in the way now, but I'll return to the Q in an hour or so.

No worries. It'll still be there when you have time.

And if it gets closed, well. The next time you edit it, the question automagically gets thrown onto the "hey, see if you want to vote to reopen this!" queue for users with the rep to do that sort of thing.

@doppelgreener the idea is we get more variety, specificity, and detail right?

11:20 AM

@trogdor right. we get more detailed solutions with more detailed and specific advice. we get to really get into the meat of the issue, which makes such answers more helpful to anyone dealing with something even passingly familiar. through assembling many such specific answers we get a site that's a rich repository of learning.

mk

I figured that was about the reasoning

our aim would approximately be, be the kind of library that BESW's librarian bag-of-holding lich would shush people nonlethally to death over.

11:42 AM

Yay, I'm getting a friend's 7th Sea book for checking today ^^

He promised me I could borrow it as long as I like as long as I'd try to master a game with it for him.

I'm a sucker for history, and the theme park history of 7th Sea gives me ample opportunities to frame all kinds of cool stuff in a format that's interesting for the others as well.

'Crawling Lady Hare' by contemporary British sculptor Sophie Ryder #womensart

Tweeted by womensart1 on March 22, 2018 at 7:11 AM

@kviiri Piratey stuff, right? Be sure to stick in a Barataria Bay with a Jean Lafitte!

goodguy5

Morning nerds

@BESW It's piratey, but less than the name would suggest. The friend who introduced me to it summarized it as combining all the interesting stuff of European history from the Late Medieval to Early Modern eras. I'm not actually sure if there's an equivalent of a Caribbean in there...

So there's a Germany-equivalent torn by a religious war between Not-Protestants and Not-Catholics, a France-equivalent with an ongoing revolution, a Spain-equivalent with a tyrannical Inquisition largely in charge of life, a Russia-equivalent struggling to adapt to the Enlightenment ideals as if under Catherine or Peter...

And an Italy-equivalent that's a wealthy but dangerous mess of city states playing a deadly game of intrigue against each other.

Even if I found the approach of "let's make a fantasy version of Europe that's so blatantly similar to Europe that you might as well call it Europe" funny at first, it's also a rather... pragmatic one.

People instantly have an idea about what's what in different places but it's still possible to not constrain oneself too much in real life geography :)

12:18 PM

@doppelgreener lol

12:30 PM

@BESW I think that the warlock in 5e does that; Pact of the Blade (the class variant summoning magic sword ...)

@KorvinStarmast you can also cast mending at-will if you know it, which trivializes this whole thing

@BESW Griswold sounds like a terrible friend.

@BESW Looks like an ibex (the Coptic unicorn)

12:51 PM

Aug 11 '17 at 18:31, by nitsua60

E1: 3 clubs.
E2: pass
[adventurers enter]
E3: I *wish* we could just get through one game of bridge without being interrupted!
[adventurers banished to randomly-chosen planes]
E1: it's still your bid.
E3: oh, sorry. I'll go 3 notrump.
E4: [sighs] pass.

howdy howdy

Howdy!

(howdy)(howdy)

ahoy

@BESW @KorvinStarmast The Mystic in 5e also does that, but with pure energy weapons.

1:01 PM

@nitsua60 They should hire a troll to guard their game I guess

@BESW @trogdor @doppelgreener et al.: I often felt, when playing John McClane last night, that rather than straightforwardly doing a thing I'd have rathered to be doing a "support" thing. Like rather than attacking Megatron it'd have made sense to break open the nozzles on the gas tanks so that one of my teammates could shove Megatron into a flaming lake of gasoline. It didn't feel like Fate Accelerated really had much to handle that.

Does Fate Core have something where you create scene elements?

Is that what "invokes" and "compels" are about?

@nitsua60 What events had to transpire to get McClane to fight Megatron?

@SPavel inquiring minds wants to know!

and my money is on John McClane

@nitsua60 You can spend a Fate point to declare a fact about a scene or the setting, as far as I can remember. It's separate from invoking aspects but similar in the sense it uses a Fate point.

The usual Fate fellowship probably can answer in greater depth.

@SPavel It was my first fate game, and it was a one-off because half our table didn't show for ToA last night. We were told to pick a 'good guy' to play in an Avengers-style team-up.

Naturally, I put my money on McClane.

1:05 PM

@nitsua60 I pick Mr. Rogers

There is no gooder guy

(See also conversation starting here.)

@SPavel Ooh... that would have been awesome.

@nitsua60 Create an Advantage should cover that afaik

in both FAE and core

@nitsua60 MacGyver would've been my pick, but we're both in the MC territory :)

@Szega That sounds about right. Guess I should take a look at the rules =)

@nitsua60 That often helps :)

1:07 PM

@kviiri Too much of a goody-goody for my tastes =)

@nitsua60 His soul is as golden as his mullet.

Batman vs MacGyver - the ultimate prepared man facing off against the ultimate improviser, who will win?

@SPavel Worst case? The film studio. Best case? The film studio and the audience.

@nitsua60 That's Create Advantage.

Oh yeah, I read that a bit carelessly. Definitely Create Advantage.

1:20 PM

@BESW @doppelgreener I've edited wishful efreet the question. Can you please advise me if it was in the direction it should have been?

Also Overcome if you're removing an obstacle (Overcome the energy shields to shut them down), or declaring a story detail. You can Compel opponents to have things happen that are to their detriment, or to make decisions to your benefit, and you can Invoke aspects or use Free Invocations to give people +2's.

You can also invoke aspects of your opposition.

@doppelgreener Can I Compel Megatron to have Starscream choose that moment to betray him

Or is that an Aspect

@Angew Looks great. Thanks for that. I gave it a small change to better express want I think you meant, check and see if that was accurate?

Huh, apparently Hasbro was originally against the name Megatron because it 'sounded too frightening"

1:26 PM

@doppelgreener Accurate indeed, thanks.

@SPavel You use Compels to have people make decisions that complicate their lives ("you'll totally start a fight with the guy goading you into it"), or to have things happen to them which are detrimental to them and complicated their lives ("what if this was the exact moment their commanding officer walked in on them, so both of them got in major trouble?").

@doppelgreener The second one seems like a good fit for "Starscream is Starscream"

They're called Decision Compels and Event Compels respectively. Decision Compels are offered to the person making the decision, Event Compels are offered to whoever the event makes life more complicated for. Compels always have teeth, they always do something seriously bad for the person being compelled. If they don't, they're Weaksauce Compels. You gotta turn those up until someone goes "oooh..."

close as unclear? I don't understand what those rulesets are.

But... A compel to have one person decide to do X, which is detrimental to another person, is tricky.

1:32 PM

@Szega Only if the Sorcerer has the mending cantrip. ;) In Diablo I, the weapon repair capability was with the Warrior .... so I am not sure what Ben is using to emulate that feel.

@SPavel In Diablo II, Griswold became a difficult to deal with blacksmith ... 8^D

Mending is an awesome cantrip for burglaries.

@KorvinStarmast I'm not aware of all the limitations he has imposed, but most classes can take mending. And if you know this is an issue, you will, most likely

@Szega We didn't get a PC with mending until we were about level 14 and a new player joined the group.

all primary casters except the warlock, high elves, anyone with the magic initiate feat

Break the glass case, swipe whatever is inside, mend the case, and leave the gendarmes wondering how the heck did the thief not leave behind as much as a dirty fingerprint.

1:34 PM

@NautArch Mystic is UA, and the magical blade (which in my brain is like the Protoss in StarCraft) had some "unclearness" that I discussed with a few folks at GiTP 5e forums. Not sure if we have a question on that here, but it's an interesting feature that they are working the bugs out of, I suspect.

@NautArch If you know it rarely comes up, thats different. And most campaigns/DMs handwave it

my cleric has it and has only used it once (lv3 now), and all he got is that he looked a bit less like a hobo (mended his torn clothes)

@Szega I sure needed it when my maul broke. Thankfully I had a greatsword backup, but had to wait a while until the DM presented someone with Mending.

But our cleric who has it now fixed my halberd after I broke it (fumble break)

One reason I liked the 4e idea of separate Utility ability picks is because pretty much any non-combat spell varies a lot between useless and game-breakingly important depending on how much the GM is interested in the domain of that particular spell.

@NautArch Broke your weapon on a nat1? Kinda harsh, isn't it?

@Szega We follow up nat 1s with percentage. I think I was in the low 90s for both. High 90s cause much bigger issues. 100% is autodeath.

1:41 PM

@Szega It's funny you mentioned mending. My first ever 5e character, KorvinStarmast, who died, chose mending. I was in the 1e grindy / low resources at low level mindset when I chose it. I still like it as a utility spell, for points like what you mentioned. But I have come to appreciate guidance more.

A 97 caused me to lose some ability points. Greater Restorations allowed me to recover some, but not all.

Eg. a spell granting easy meals or clean water is worthless if the campaign is set in mostly civilized settings with both available easily.

insert the usual rant about critical fails here

Cult of Natural 1 accepts your sacrifice.

@kviiri I know, we've been through that conversation :)

@NautArch I remember, mon ami :) hence the abridgement

@nitsua60 Btw, crazy idea to try out: Play a Fate adventure game session with only aspects, fate points, and compels.

1:47 PM

Heh, I love the ToH question. I am tempted to suggest that the "convince the efreet to leave the room with you, then ask the wishes" but I need to read TotYP again to compare ToH to the original ToH that I found the other day when I was looking for my old AD&D 2e PHB.

re: utility spell picks in 4e, it isn't as well-executed though, because many utility powers are actually just combat powers categorized rather arbitrarily as utilities.