TRPG General Chat

lisardggY

11:03 AM

@BESW Agreed.

BESW

I'm writing up an answer.

BESW

11:25 AM

0

A: What can I do to paper to make it look aged?

Don’t think “age,” think “history of abuse.” Aging a document is about mimicking the history of that piece of paper. Before you start aging it, you need to have at least a general notion of what history you want to imply. Start with the kind of paper. Cheap printer paper is modern and almost im...

doppelgreener

first thing i thought of when you said wiggle your butt vigorously

BESW

That works.

Metool

@Lord_Gareth Hail unto thee, O Shattered One.

Lord_Gareth

@Metool Kill meeee

Metool

[fires little easy-to-dodge plasma balls]

doppelgreener

11:37 AM

@BESW Metool's edit overwrote some of your content, might want to fix that up

BESW

I think I got it.

Metool

Wait, waht.

Really?

BESW

We edited at the same time.

Metool

Ah.

BESW

I chose to accept your edit and then add mine back in, rather than reject yours and then add it in myself.

doppelgreener

11:38 AM

2 people hit edit, then, after that, they each submit.

Metool

@BESW I thank you for the 2 rep.

lisardggY

@Metool You're a step away from not receiving those anymore.

Might as well enjoy it while you can.

BESW

Exactly.

Metool

[goes on undownvote hunt]

Is it fair to edit out one offending line from an otherwise excellent answer?

> Bottom line: the spirit of the rules is that a mortal being cannot live forever through mortal magic. It is impossible. And the game should be played as such. Anything else is the worst kind of munchkinism.

lisardggY

@Metool Define "offending". Edits should be non-trivial.

Metool

11:48 AM

[ponders taking it to meta]

[goes to search meta]

lisardggY

@Metool It's a grey area. Edits should be non-trivial on one hand, and not change the meaning of the text too much on the other hand. It looks like the poster here is making a very deliberate statement, even if it is not constructive and somewhat offensive, or at least confrontational. I don't know if that's a good enough reason to remove it.

BESW

Someone else should give the "link-only answers are not good answers" comment to this guy, now that I've answered the question.

Metool

@lisardggY Alright, I suppose I can just leave my downvote, since that's what they're for.

lisardggY

@BESW I'm on it.

BESW

Thanks.

Aaron

12:06 PM

Mornin

BESW

Hey.

Metool

@Aaron Greetings? How's things?

Aaron

@Metool Tired.

Didn't really get to rest much this weekend

Metool

[pat]

Aaron

We were supposed to go to dinner with my GFs family but when they picked us up. (Notice they waited to tell us until we were already on the way. Douchnozzles) That we were supposed to help them pick fruit trees before we ate. It wasn't a bad time but I had been hoping to relax at least one day this weekend.

How was your weekend?

lisardggY

12:11 PM

It seems so far away already.

(Especially since my weekend is Fri-Sat, not Sat-Sun, and it's already after 3pm on Monday)

Lord_Gareth

@Aaron I have my first day off tomorrow. Sat and Sunday were both living hells from which there was no waking, both at home and at work. I wish I was kidding.

Lord_Gareth

12:26 PM

> FAQ/Errata

Do you count as your own ally?

You count as your own ally unless otherwise stated or if doing so would make no sense or be impossible. Thus, "your allies" almost always means the same as "you and your allies."

That right there is Paizo's idea of clarifying a rule

BESW

Hey, stranger, we don't like no edge cases 'round these parts.

3

Lord_Gareth

Y'know what Legend did? "You are always your own ally." Then when they didn't want an ability to work on you, they phrased it like this - "Allies (other than you) [...]"

WHAT IS THAT SORCERY? [/sarcasm]

Aaron

@Lord_Gareth That raises more questions than anything. If you take that as written would that mean any spell/ability that effects you AND your allies effects you twice?

lisardggY

@Aaron That's an infinite oregano sort of interpretation. For me it's perfectly clear that unless your'e trying to interpret a spell that goes something like "You give an ally temporary HP at the expense of your own", which would fall under "making no sense", than it answers the common question of whether area-effect buffs affect you as well as your allies.

Metool

@lisardggY Infinite oregano sounds like an interesting case.

lisardggY

12:31 PM

@Metool archive.wired.com/culture/lifestyle/commentary/alttext/2008/06/…

4

Metool

@lisardggY Never not star.

BESW

Heh.

Yeah, it's less that "you and your allies" is now unclear, as that it hasn't done anything to clarify places where "your allies" may include "you" because the errata hinges on a weasel phrase: "almost always."

It still leaves specific cases up to the GM's judgement, making the errata effectively worthless.

Lord_Gareth

@lisardggY The thing is - and this is very important to understand - there are no parts of D20 RAW that even remotely make sense. Who defines 'make sense', in this context? The spell affecting you twice 'makes sense' if you compare it to other aspects of PF RAW.

It doesn't make sense if you check it against common standards of communication in English but neither does the rest of the game.

lisardggY

@Lord_Gareth It might be just me and the people I've played with, but we've found that 95% of the rules make sense, or can make sense with a shared assumption of good faith.

Affecting you twice? Doesn't make sense. A spell that has an explicit effect on you and one on an ally? Doesn't make sense. A group effect? Ah, that's where it gets a bit vague, and that's what the FAQ came to clear up. And it did.

BESW

[pats @Lord_Gareth gently with an eight-foot pole and offers Cookie Onna Long Stick]

Lord_Gareth

12:36 PM

@lisardggY I've normally found that when you dig into a shared assumption of good faith what you find are the reflexive houserules that groups develop in order to defend themselves from D20. They're like antibodies.

BESW

You leave my aunt's body out of this.

Lord_Gareth

@BESW [Separates Cookie from Long Stick, mocks its emotional pain as he slowly devours it]

BESW

[films for network TV documentary]

lisardggY

@Lord_Gareth The exact same thing can be said about natural languages. There are no formal definitions and unambiguous rules, but loose understandings that are always renegotiated reflexively as part of conversation and culture. And yet communication works, because these sort of constantly evolving assumptions and renegotiations are part of it.

doppelgreener

@lisardggY 95% is the optimum success rate on a d20 roll. COINCIDENCE?????

Magician

12:39 PM

@lisardggY I will now point at the vast majority of the internet as a counter-claim to your last statement.

lisardggY

@doppelgreener Exactly. "I try to to understand this d20 rule." *roll* "Curses, a natural 1! It's ambiguous!"

Lord_Gareth

@Magician Pretty much this.

And understand that we're speaking of a case where the spell or ability uses the phrase "you and your allies".

Because now according to the FAQ that unpacks to "You and you and your allies"

lisardggY

@Magician I disagree. 95% of meaning gets through. It's just that the noticeable arguments are around the other 5%. When someone says "If you go to Google and search for whatever and click the first hit it says that X, and X is stupid!", the misunderstandings are around whether X was really said and what it meant, but did you notice how much information was conveyed properly?

doppelgreener

> Wiio's Law #2: If a message can be interpreted in several ways, it will be interpreted in a manner that maximizes the damage.

lisardggY

@Lord_Gareth Only if you run a context-free search-and-replace. We are not machines.

Magician

12:41 PM

Getting people to understand you is hard. Getting people to understand you from text alone, without the ability to clarify and answer questions is much harder. Ambiguous rules are frustrating.

doppelgreener

> Wiio's Law #3: There is always someone who knows better than you what you meant with your message.

Metool

@Lord_Gareth Weaselword "almost always"

yes

this is not better

doppelgreener

Wiio's laws

Wiio's laws are "humoristically formulated serious observations about how human communication usually fails except by accident" made by Professor Osmo Antero Wiio in 1978. The fundamental Wiio's law states that "Communication usually fails, except by accident". The full set of laws is as follows: Communication usually fails, except by accident. If communication can fail, it will. If communication cannot fail, it still most usually fails. If communication seems to succeed in the intended way, there's a misunderstanding. If you are content with your message, communication certainly fails. If a message...

Wiio's Laws, barring #6, are like a brief essay on why RPG texts are doomed to failure.

BESW

@doppelgreener No, #6 is the It Works In My Group Fallacy.

Lord_Gareth

@Magician Oh man, the Legend devs know this one from broke. So much suffering in trying to get things to function with perfect clarity, so utterly worth it.

TL;DR @lisardggY the majority of Pathfinder's rules are not worded correctly when compared to how legalistic and exception-based the ruleset is, leading to scenarios where the developers blatantly and publicly fail to understand their own rules.

Like with some of their Advanced Class Guide content, where it lets you pick out abilities from another class - and all of those abilities count levels in that class.

"These Slayer talents would be awesome if I actually had any Slayer levels."

BESW

12:49 PM

Basically this is a RAW/RAI argument in slightly more philosophical clothing.

trogdor

it actually sounds like some people didn't even know what the RAI was

and then tried to float unsucessfully on RAW

by changing it

lisardggY

@BESW It's basically saying that neither RAW nor RAI are a way to play a game, but should be two complementary approaches to understanding it.

trogdor

yeah

I count on RAW to tell me what I should think RAI even was

along with my own judgement and other rules I have already read

Magician

The reason ambiguous rules are frustrating is because the game designers, presumably, knew their game better than me. Certainly for the first few dozen playthroughs. Even being a fairly experienced game player and an amateur game designer, I'd much rather refer to the original designer's authority, because, presumably, they have already spent countless hours thinking about it. And making guesses as to what the author intended is not that much better than outright changing it.

Lord_Gareth

@trogdor This right here is where I'm actually getting at. A well-designed RAW communicates not just your ideas, but your game's intentions, to your audience.

trogdor

12:53 PM

@Lord_Gareth that's what I thought you were trying to say :)

Lord_Gareth

Pathfinder has this giant problem where their RAW tries to say one thing, and then the developers try to say another.

And they try to FAQ the RAW into saying what they want it to say without understanding why it isn't communicating their idea for them.

It's like when they "clarified" unarmed strikes by saying that non-monks can only make them with fists, and monks can use fists, feet, elbows, and knees. This was in response to questions about TWFing with unarmed strikes, as well as the existence of Master Si Mai Wang.

Except it clarified absolutely nothing. They didn't comment on if you have one unarmed strike or several.

Not to mention causing new problems with new, innocent players who are now confused as to why their headbutts and karate chops are illegal.

A lot of roleplaying vets find that idea silly. You houserule it and move on, right?

trogdor

I myself have had issues with how certain rules have been written out, and the disparity between that and what I personally thought, from experience, the RAI was

Lord_Gareth

But the newbies trust Paizo

doppelgreener

@Lord_Gareth i am laughing and this is terrible and i am still laughing because it is hilarious

Lord_Gareth

They have this fundamental trust that Paizo doesn't just know what they're doing but that Paizo's opinions on how gameplay should break down at the table will, universally and without qualification, enhance their fun.

lisardggY

1:01 PM

@Lord_Gareth Or, to phrase it another way, the assumption is that the rules are not the game, they are rules for you to use for your game.

doppelgreener

@Lord_Gareth also legsweeps

also finger strikes

Lord_Gareth

@lisardggY Maybe better for this discussion - the game is at your table. The system is in the books.

doppelgreener

also open-palm strikes

Lord_Gareth

But many of Paizo's customers equate system with game

Which is not helped by Paizo's policy that FAQ = System

So FAQ = System = Game

BESW

@Lord_Gareth This sentence isn't parsing for me.

Metool

1:03 PM

@BESW "Paizo doesn't just know what they're doing, Paizo's opinions will also..."

lisardggY

@Lord_Gareth But insisting on clearer RAW as a necessity is basically accepting the premise that System = Game, and insisting that the System must be better for the Game to be better, rather than breaking this connection.

Lord_Gareth

@BESW To phrase it differently, they trust Paizo when Paizo says there's a correct way to play.

doppelgreener

> They have this fundamental trust that not only does Paizo know what they're doing, but also that Paizo's opinions on how gameplay should break down at the table will, universally and without qualification, enhance their fun.

Lord_Gareth

@lisardggY The disconnect between System & Game does not justify slipshod design in the former. Creating a clearer, more tightly designed system helps new players and makes it easier for vets to play with the toys you've handed them.

Which kinda goes back to my blog post about system mastery?

It's easier to create houserules if the base rules are understandable in the first place.

lisardggY

@Lord_Gareth It does, I agree. But when System != Game, breaks in the system don't break the game.

Aaron

1:06 PM

Seeing as PF is one of the most popular systems it had to have done something right.

Lord_Gareth

@Aaron It feasted on the corpse of its great enemy, thus stealing its power and market share.

BESW

Mmm, I think there's a point being missed. oWoD is awful, but the designers freely admit they were stoned out of their gourds and had no idea what they were doing.

lisardggY

@Aaron Gareth's objections nonwithstanding, I feel it streamlined a lot of 3.5's rules and made several other good, important changes.

BESW

Whereas Paizo is claiming an understanding of the system/game interface, and an authority to interpret, which they really shouldn't be.

3

Lord_Gareth

@BESW This! Very much this.

Aaron

1:08 PM

So @Lord_Gareth Your issue isn't with PF as much as it is with Paizo?

lisardggY

Maybe it's because I live all the way on the other side of the world where I'm not exposed to a lot of marketing material, but why should I give a damn about what Paizo is claiming?

BESW

Gareth isn't making broad claims about the system/game interface. He's making specific claims about Paizo's relationship with the system/game interface.

Lord_Gareth

@lisardggY Also, what I believe I'm driving at here is the paradigm you're suggesting supplements - or replaces - the system as a method of resolving in-game conflict with democratic resolution of in-game conflict. That is, many groups trust the system to resolve challenges in the game world.

And as a result breaks in the system do cause a break in the game.

Joshua Aslan Smith

I feel like no good will come of the murderhobo question

that just came up

BESW

@lisardggY If you aren't exposed to the Paizo claims, then you aren't part of the demographic he's talking about and your experience not being told what to do by Paizo is not relevant to his analysis of people who have been told what to do by Paizo?

Lord_Gareth

1:09 PM

@Aaron Having been designing for PF for the last year or so, I have many, many issues with Pathfinder itself. These do however pale in comparison to how much I hate Paizo.

@lisardggY You shouldn't. But Paizo thinks you should. Paizo treats Pathfinder as a unified community in which it has authority and primacy, rather than a system it writes or even a product it sells.

Aaron

I'm just gonna go back to lurking.

lisardggY

There are two distinct issues here, one related to PF, one to Paizo.

@BESW Because so far, "People who play PF" and "People who depend on Paizo to tell them how to play" have not been described as separate groups.

Lord_Gareth

I did say, and I doth quote:

lisardggY

What I'm going for is that the default population here is people who can interpret rules, and the minority is people for whom Paizo's mixed message can screw up a game.

Lord_Gareth

> But the newbies trust Paizo

Joshua Aslan Smith

1:16 PM

I have enjoyed reading this discussion

[waves hand]

fight on

Lord_Gareth

...The Throne finds your use of meme amusing, tiny blasphemer.

Joshua Aslan Smith

haha

To put this is some wider context and also invoke the antagonist system to PF, I learned to play and GM 4e only using the online tools

The system was rigorous enough that I could hand it to you and you could figure it out, and even make assumptions about what a poorly written item actually should do because of how strong the rest of the system is.

Lord_Gareth

@lisardggY Whereas my statements about the PF community are from observing its online presence and, maybe more importantly, the experiences of others through the FAQs and Pathfinder Society. PFS is a very major component of Paizo's customer base and thus, by definition, Pathfinder's players.

PF has a lot of players that get messed up by the system.

And, at least online and in sanctioned play, they vastly outnumber those who are willing to change the system to make it function

lisardggY

PFS is a different matter. By definition, organized play takes away a lot of freedom to interpret rules.

Joshua Aslan Smith

I tend to organized play as the "actual rules"

lisardggY

1:21 PM

Creating, in effect, a condition which approximates (even if it doesn't completely acheive) System = Game.

I agree that many of the problems that vex you so are a lot more problematic in organized play.

Joshua Aslan Smith

5e's release was all love and roses and "play it the way you want to" but I knew that when the organized play guide came out rolled stats were not going to be a thing

BESW

[yawn] I'm going to bed. Rough day today, long day tomorrow.

Metool

@Mourdos Heya! So remind me where you were on the Pathfinder game?

Joshua Aslan Smith

@besw GOODNIGHT

BESW

Be safe, and stay out of trouble.

lisardggY

1:22 PM

@BESW G'night.

Joshua Aslan Smith

@besw I fully expect "edge cases" to come up in our western game now

Lord_Gareth

@lisardggY But the general PF community treats PFS with authority. Which is hilarious, because PFS has a crapton of houserules.

trogdor

night

Lord_Gareth

I've run into that when designing for a 3pp, actually, where people object to something I made because of a rule that later turns out to be PFS only.

trogdor

I shall be retiring as well

Metool

1:23 PM

Take average hit points, rounding up. Crafting isn't a thing. Etcetera.

@Lord_Gareth Oh, really?

Lord_Gareth

@Metool Aye. Folks are mostly good at remembering things like how crafting isn't a thing or how in normal games you have persistent items.

But the little-details changes stalk me like the undead pygmies from The Mummy Returns.

Metool

What are those, for example?

BESW

lisardggY

Again, this is a very cultural/regional thing. Since there was never any organized play for any game around here, and PFS only started showing up in the last couple of months, the community has different expectations from the game.

BESW

(Sorry, I couldn't resist. Bed now! I swear!)

Lord_Gareth

1:25 PM

@Metool F'rinstance, PFS scenarios describing expanded uses for Profession (soldier) that people then assume are part of the base game.

Mourdos

@Metool What would you like to know about which pathfinder game (I'm tired from a LARP weekend and my brain is fuzzy)

Metool

pathfinder game

Game Signup docs.google.com/document/d/…

@Lord_Gareth ... Actually, another reason the ring of tactical precision exists, I suppose.

lisardggY

Gotta head out now, too. Have a wedding to go to. And another one on Wednesday. *sigh*.

Gonna be a rough week.

Lord_Gareth

Mods are asleep post ponies!

lisardggY

As a parting shot, I'll just say that with the situation you describe, you can either try to get Paizo to hold to ever more stringent, and probably impossible levels of precision in their rules, or you can get Paizo to better communicate the disconnect between the System and the Game. Your guess is as good as mine, and probably better, which one is more likely.

Mourdos

1:29 PM

I think you do that every time you speak :-)

Joshua Aslan Smith

I will fight your ponies

lisardggY

G'night, and don't fight any fights you don't have to.

Metool

Joshua Aslan Smith

Lord_Gareth

@lisardggY I've seen those levels of precision designed in a usable way. 4e did it, Legend did it. It's part of why I'm so frustrated with Paizo, esp. re: Legend since Rule of Cool did it for free.

Joshua Aslan Smith

1:34 PM

That adam west gif is pretty amazing

@Lord_Gareth you keep making me need to take a look at legend again

I was scared away by how 3e/3.5e it looked at face value

Lord_Gareth

You would think, given a basic belief in justice and human decency, that the people asking for your money might have higher standards.

But lolno.

@JoshuaAslanSmith Expand on this.

Joshua Aslan Smith

I think I just breezed through character creation

let me relook to job my memory

ah yes, there is BAB

and lots of data heavy tables

Lord_Gareth

Mm. Yeah, I can see where that impression got given.

Some of Legend's aspects are legacy content that's been altered to be functional in the new paradigm. BAB is such an example, as are ability scores. I'm hearing rumors that RoC is going to take those out back and shoot them, actually.

Joshua Aslan Smith

hmm yeah

Im okay with ability scores to a degree

Lord_Gareth

The class tables look like that because of how the Track system works.

Joshua Aslan Smith

1:39 PM

but BAB quite frankly frightens me

and As soon as I saw the BAB table I started looking for a THACO table

Metool

@JoshuaAslanSmith Curious as to why.

Lord_Gareth

Pft.

Joshua Aslan Smith

@Metool needlessly complicating attack to-hit

Lord_Gareth

@JoshuaAslanSmith I think if you dig into the math you'll be pleasantly surprised quite a bit.

Joshua Aslan Smith

but more importantly it comes off as a conscious choice to associate with 3e/3.5e

So I start to question what else it might be taking from, or inspired by, those editions

Lord_Gareth

1:42 PM

@JoshuaAslanSmith That is not fair. The book is free; reading it would tell you for yourself. You're judging a system's paradigm based on legacy content from d20's OGL.

Joshua Aslan Smith

I think it perfectly fair given I have only finite time and have to choose how I spend it.

I may give it a second chance given your support for it

but its perfectly reasonable to be driven away by a things similarity to something else I distinctly dislike

Aaron

hey is there a mod on?

doppelgreener

@Aaron it's possible, depending

Aaron

Someone posted their skype name and can't delete it now. Not major important but they would probably rather it be deleted

Metool

Joshua Aslan Smith

1:45 PM

they should flag it for moderator attention and put the reason for their flagging as such

Aaron

@JoshuaAslanSmith ok

Mourdos

I love that the map is blank from our view

Zachiel

@Metool oh, LoL. Like a real metool? Easy to dodge my... my... whatever.

doppelgreener

3

A: burninate new-gm tag

The low-hanging fruit has been... SSD made a great point: there are usages of new-gm where it isn't a meta tag, but it just gets overwhelmingly used as one. I've gone through [new-gm] and eliminated it from the questions using it as a meta tag. I've targeted questions where it's been used as ...

Zachiel

@JoshuaAslanSmith Legend has only even score bonuses and even ability scores. So it makes sense to use directly the modifier instead of the score. 0 is the average. How great is this insead of 10 being the average?

Joshua Aslan Smith

2:17 PM

@heyIcanchan so I cant decide if you are legit asking me to give you a reference or just sorta trolling my comment

MadMAxJr

3:24 PM

Really. A question on character sheets....?

"One for your system that you and your DM find readable" DONE.

Joshua Aslan Smith

its 100 percent not answerable

i dont even get why the question is being asked

MadMAxJr

5:08 PM

@waxeagle I should make it this week. Last week was troublesome to say the least.

MadMAxJr

5:22 PM

What's this? DMG delayed to Dec 9?

wax eagle

5:34 PM

@MadMAxJr cool

@MadMAxJr looks like, I think that's only like a 2 wk delay though. And if it's for editing/rules fixes, i'm good with that

Joshua Aslan Smith

5:56 PM

that art page

so crazy

is it time we fold 5e back into main rpg chat?

@brianballsun-stanton

RobertF

6:19 PM

I can see how Kickstarter is like crack - I keep checking to see if the Lone Wolf RPG campaign is going to hit its stretch goals - one more day to go! Check out the Battle Systems Fantasy Dungeon Terrain (#16 on the list): kicktraq.com/hotlist/games/tabletop%20games

MadMAxJr

I've been burned enough on promising kickstarters.

I may need to ascend to lichdom to see the end of Star Citizen and Kingdom Death: Monster

RobertF

Wasn't there a question a while back about RPGs taking place in an Eastern European setting? This fits the bill: kicktraq.com/projects/804120043/slumbering-ursine-dunes

I wonder why some publishers choose Kickstarter vs. a P500 type strategy, where the printing presses roll once 500 orders are in? I suspect the urgency of meeting the KS funding goals by a deadline raises more $ than a simple P500 list.

MadMAxJr

Not sure what all entails P500, but Kickstarter gives them a website to show what they have so far, what they want, what it costs to get there, and what they're willing to give you as an incentive to get their idea off the ground. Some tools for managing the rewards and data-collection after the fact. Also zero obligation if goals are not met.

Kickstarter is setup in almost a wordpress-like format. Want to update about how the fund drive is going? Type into the box, paste some pictures, post.

Measure the responses in the user comments area.

RobertF

6:38 PM

KS is certainly a clever idea. I imagine the KS website took minimal programming effort, right?

MadMAxJr

Zero idea. I don't build sites with that level of exposure.

I build clunky UI setting pages meant to be used by admins.

Phil

6:56 PM

opinions on the increasing use of 'TLDR' in questions?

Zachiel

@JoshuaAslanSmith Has HeyICanChan shown in chat recently? If not, I doubt he gets pinged.

Same for Brian Ballsun-Stanton

Joshua Aslan Smith

probably not

@zachiel its less of a deal if chan sees my comment

might post a meta abotu folding 5e back into main chat

I feel like the fires have subsided

and that if people still wanna have it out, Not a bar is always open

MadMAxJr

7:15 PM

Potatothulu will enforce order, insanity, and crispy potato chips.

3

Metool

7:31 PM

@Phil brb checking if it's in any major dictionary

@Phil Related, Meta question on TL;DR.

Phil

I know what it means...its more the fact that I find it REALLY annoying when its used. It implies that someone isn't going to take the effort to read the whole question

RobertF

@Metool - Could you please summarize the gist of the Meta question on TL;DR?

Joshua Aslan Smith

golfclap

Metool

@Phil And with a long enough question (or answer), you can be certain some people won't. And while that's not ideal, the summary might still help people who miss the point of the textwall preceding the term.

Phil

Use the word summary then

Metool

7:43 PM

Take it to meta, perhaps.

Phil

nah, I deeply suspect its just me

needed to vent :p

MadMAxJr

Offensive/annoying is LMGTFY.

Metool

8:24 PM

Welp. I've got a Patapon sighting in D&D.

2

MadMAxJr

8:44 PM

Minons!

Phil

8:56 PM

Yes oh master? bows down

MadMAxJr

That's what Metool's picture looks like to me.

Armored versions of the little minions from Despicable Me.

Tarmikos11

9:08 PM

Pon pon pata pon.

The hard drive on my laptop died.

Zachiel

@Tarmikos11 I feel you. Mine broke with a [snip]load of fantasy avatars I couln't retrieve in time.

Tarmikos11

Thankfully, in my case. I didn't have anything totally unreplacable.

Some minecraft maps, game progress, things of that nature that I don't really care about.

There was D&D, Pathfinder, and WH40k books that I can get again, but, that aside...

[sighs]

BESW

10:02 PM

Someone is apparently genuinely irritated that I drew a cute Cthulhu and defiled the name. Welp, know what I'm doing next free moment...

Tweeted by UrsulaV on September 15, 2014 at 5:11 PM

mxyzplk

10:41 PM

@Aaron yeah, where?

doppelgreener

11:39 PM

@MadMAxJr yeah, a friend of mine is kind of upset with KS because of how much the projects fail and burn the backers

she's used to the world of investment, where you do the exact same thing, but then you get paid back later.

Frankly I'd like to do it that way too! Give me a KS-like platform where I can be an investor who gets a financial return on investment.

Adeptus

11:55 PM

@doppelgreener Like a Kickstarter for an apartment block, or something? Investment levels: $1 - we'll add you to the mailing list; $200,000 (limit 30) - you get an apartment

2