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5:45 AM
I have now edited the question to make it understood better. This now therefore doesnt answer it. — expern 1 hour ago
I have edited the question to make it understood better and therefore this doesnt answer the question as it is now put.NOT working the land is more like a choivas gavro. — expern 2 hours ago
This is why I tell everyone to include all their assumptions in the question!
 
5:58 AM
@expern, it still answers the question. There is one that cannot be understood, which shows that we do it because HaShem commanded us, not because it makes sense otherwise. — Seth J 3 mins ago
@expern, showing that your assumption is incorrect does not make this a bad answer; this still answers the question. — Seth J 1 min ago
@DoubleAA Chillax. It's all good. TZT.
 
@SethJ Any idea what the difference is between חק and חקה?
(That's chok and chukkah since I don't feel like typing vowels.)
@msh210 too ^^^ or anyone else with ideas
It occurred to me because this answer describes the value of chukim, but para adumma is in the category of chukkot ("zot chukkat hatroah" being feminine)
 
6:19 AM
This could be nice for mods
@DoubleAA
ping
see who needs to be merged
I don't know if you're allowed to use this data or not though
92
Q: Interesting queries on Data Explorer

ChichirayLet's collect some interesting queries for the Stack Exchange Data Explorer here. How many upvotes do I have for each tag? (how long before tag badges?) SELECT TOP 20 TagName, COUNT(*) AS UpVotes FROM Tags INNER JOIN PostTags ON PostTags.TagId = Tags.id INNER JOIN Posts ON Pos...

 
@ShmuelBrin It lists users with the same email address?
 
@DoubleAA yes
same hash
So there are two curiousers
 
@ShmuelBrin I knew that one already. He never registered his account.
I think he lost access to one and kept going
 
a few rays
@DoubleAA he did that a few times
though he seemed to have given up
I would like to see who has the most points/post
 
@ShmuelBrin Note that mods can't merge users anymore. The user has to submit a request through SE in the contact us section at the bottom.
 
6:27 AM
@DoubleAA Not I.
 
@DoubleAA makes sense
 
@ShmuelBrin They changed that a couple months ago.
@msh210 You think it's on topic?
I'm nogea badaver and submit to others' judgement.
 
@DoubleAA If you can motivate it JeLLily. Which I think you should be able to.
Glad you're here, @DoubleAA: I have an interesting story for you. (The story is for anyone, but I think you, specifically, may find it interesting).
 
@msh210 ok...
 
I was using an ArtScroll chumash last week and when the baalk'ria got to "שָׁטוּ הָעָם וְלָקְטוּ וְטָחֲנוּ בָרֵחַיִם אוֹ דָכוּ בַּמְּדֹכָה וּבִשְּׁלוּ בַּפָּרוּר וְעָשׂוּ אֹתוֹ עֻגוֹת" he pronounced the first word "sha-TU".
Now, I know a little grammar, and I know the past tense of "shat" is "SHA-tu".
 
6:32 AM
@msh210 The two versions show up all around Tanach with no apparent pattern. Masculine: חק חקים חקיו חקם חקי chok chukkim chukkav chukkam chukkai. Feminine: חקה חקת חקותם חקותי chukkah chukkat chukkotam chukkotai.
 
The past of "sho-TE" ("is an idiot") is "sha-TU".
 
@msh210 Please tell me they corrected it.
 
And ArtScroll had "SHA-tu" also. So I called out "SHA-tu". It changes the meaning.
 
@msh210 Did he hear?
 
The baal k'ria paused a moment. I figured he hadn't heard me, so I repeated the correction. He paused again and then repeated the pasuk, again saying "sha-TU".
So I let him go on. What could I do?
After the k'ria he comes over to me and shows me that in his newfangled fancy tikun it has "sha-TU". He tells me he'd always read it "SHA-tu" but that that year he noticed the tikun's version so made a mental note to read "sha-TU".
I figured his tikun was wrong but decidedto check Minchas Shay to be sure.
 
6:35 AM
@msh210 Which Tikkun was it? Ish Matzliach? Simanim?
 
Minchas Shay says that the m'sora on that word is "sha-TU", that it's an exception!
@DoubleAA I didn't notice.
 
@msh210 Most peculiar.
 
@DoubleAA Yeah!
The Mosad Harav Kuk (I think it is) -version Minchas Shay has a footnote citing someone or other who gives some phonological explanation for the odd stress (something about a g'ronis following in "haam").
But, yeah, most peculiar. And then how many people came up to me after davening, and I had to explain I was grammatically right but nonetheless wrong!
 
Breuer doesn't note any manuscript variants otzar.org/wotzar/book.aspx?154885&lang=eng
pg 36 still in the free part
Though that could be because the manuscripts didn't necessarily denote the accent of Tlisha with a second marking.
 
@DoubleAA it could indeed (a priori. I'm unfamiliar with R'MB's work)
 
6:46 AM
That's Leningrad Codex. We don't have Aleppo
The middle dot on the Tet is to a note on the side saying שטו appears only once in Tanach (which is true).
 
@DoubleAA Yeah, MS noted that also IIRC ("les").
...actually I have it here, lemme see instead of relying on my "IIRC".
...no, it's not on the shelf. :-/ Never mind.
 
Anyway, we see it doesn't note the accent. I wonder who started using the double symbol for that?
 
@DoubleAA Even many 20th-century chumashim don't have it.
 
@msh210 True. Doesn't tell us about all earlier ones though.
 
@DoubleAA true
@msh210 Incidentally, I don't understand his mention of "v'saru". That's future, so should be mil'ra anyway, no?
 
6:57 AM
@msh210 Did you check what he says in Yirmiyahu 11?
Also, did you see what the printer labeled the 5th book of the Torah as in the headers of the pages??
 
@DoubleAA No, I didn't have it handy at the time. I can now.
@DoubleAA Hm? Where?
 
@msh210 It doesn't seem to be in this hebrewbook. I didn't see it yet so I don't guarantee it's relevance.
 
@DoubleAA it's on the first word of 11:10. Translation to follow be"H....
@DoubleAA heh
the pasuk is שָׁבוּ עַל עֲו‍ֹנֹת אֲבוֹתָם הָרִאשֹׁנִים etc
which 'should' be SHA-vu
My navi has sha-VU (but is not very reliable)
and MS says: One S'faradi book says "mil'el" in the margin. And an old book says "mil'el, but 'shatu haam v'lak'tu' is mil'ra". See MS on B'haalos'cha.
 
Well you have certainly piqued my interest. I'll see what I can find over Shabbat.
 
 
5 hours later…
12:20 PM
Thanks for the read, @msh210 and @double aa. I thought my morning was going to be boring.
(It's definitely nerdy, but not boring!)
@double aa I have no idea if there is or is not any significant difference between חק/חקה. Do no commentators speak about it, even the grammarians?
I can try to reach out to my old professors, but I've been getting no responses to my queries lately.
 
 
1 hour later…
1:40 PM
@DoubleAA I do not understand your analogy about a sopher stam and people who put on tefillin
 
@Daniel One knows what to do themselves in order to fulfill the mitzva, and one knows all the gemaras, rishonim, shutim that determine practice and can use that knowledge to handle different non-standard situations.
Most orthodox jewish males can tie their tefillin on their arm, but how many can tie the knot on the tefillin?
 
@DoubleAA So what is the equivalent of tying the knot on the tefillin when it comes to Niddah?
 
@Daniel Knowing what to do if there the women made a counting mistake/had a medical procedure done/might have a chatzitza/might have a veset/all the other questions that people turn to experts for because they don't know.
Obligatory reference (Chullin 9a) ואמר רב יהודה אמר רב תלמיד חכם צריך שילמוד ג' דברים כתב שחיטה ומילה ורב חנניא בר שלמיא משמיה דרב אמר אף קשר של תפילין וברכת חתנים וציצית ואידך הני שכיחן
So I guess it's a machloket if everyone knows how to tie tefillin knots
 
@DoubleAA Ok got it
 
2:43 PM
@msh210, Your story was an emotional rollercoaster for me. Beha'alotecha is my bar mitzva parsha, so it was the first parasha I learned to lein and the only one I really [think I] know well in total. I've leined it or parts of it many times since my bar mitzva. And I've always leined "shaTU." Now, my tikkun, purchased when I was 13 and still in use, is probably not the best in the world, and it differs from other, I think more authoritative, texts sometimes ...
 
@IsaacMoses HAPPY BIRTHDAY ISAAC MOSES!!! (+/- 2 weeks)
6
 
... (e.g. it has chataf patachs in the words "rivevot" and "kemit-onenim" where most other texts I've seen have shvas). So, when I read your grammatical objection and @DoubleAA's applause, I was afraid that I'd been reading this wrong all along. Then, when I read the rest of the story and your subsequent research, my confidence was restored.
@DoubleAA Thanks. May you, msh210, his ba'al kreiya, and everyone else here enjoy siy'ata dishemaya in receiving, implementing, understanding, and promulgating the correct mesora for leining and everything else.
 
Amen
 
@msh210, I shall share your finding, by your name if you don't mind, with a rebbe from my kids' school who sits behind me in shul, who is interested in dikduk and leining, and whose teenaged son shares this parsha with me and therefore splits the leining annually with me.
 
@IsaacMoses Amen; you too.
@IsaacMoses By all means.
 
2:56 PM
@IsaacMoses Amen, VeChen LeMar!
 
 
1 hour later…
4:20 PM
Shog9 on May 31, 2013

Community management at Stack Exchange is an… Interesting job. Parts sociologist, cat-wrangler, therapist, software analyst and cheerleader, this small band of dedicated people work daily to make sure each individual community has the tools and support you need to be as awesome as you are. Of course, we don’t do it alone: from the very start, Stack Exchange attracted some amazingly helpful and insightful folk who’ve donated their time and effort to help out – and I’m pleased to announce that we’re adding one of them, Tim Post, to our full-time staff of Community Managers. …

 

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