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12:10 PM
@TorbenGundtofte-Bruun Thoughts on this question? I closed it as a list question, but it has 2 reopen votes:
2
Q: Fairy tales with empowered women

Kelsey RiderI notice that just about all young children's stories (fairy tales, etc) depict women in a subordinate role. This hit me while reading Cinderella: her ultimate goal in life is to be the prettiest so that she can marry the rich stud and make babies. More generally, females are absent, or if presen...

 
@Beofett I saw the close votes it had before, and deliberately did not act on them. I think the community is reaching a size where such decisions may be reached by community votes alone, without moderator intervention.
I agree it's a borderline question - it asks for a list of sources or recommendations. That makes it a poor question on our site.
On the other hand, the topic is very relevant and interesting. "We" (I mean the community, not specifically you and I) should work to rephrase the question to make it squarely on-topic.
 
12:24 PM
Would you agree that we should change the single existing answer into a community wiki, based on this specific meta discussion?
I'd do it without hesitation (see also the linked meta topics in my comment to the question we're discussing) but i'd like to get your opinion first.
 
@TorbenGundtofte-Bruun I really dislike CW, but I agree that this might be one of the few good uses for them. This question really has potential to be very important.
 
 
3 hours later…
3:40 PM
I vote open, because I'm interested in the answers, but yes, it's not a good fit for the format.
@TorbenGundtofte-Bruun One thing I'd like to change (other than "stud" and "screwing", which I already toned down a bit because I'm worried it's an argument waiting to happed), is to make the title a question, but I'm worried that that'll just enhance the "listyness". Any suggestions?
 
3:59 PM
This has also inspired me to go a-hunting through Podcastle.
 
4:52 PM
@deworde Perhaps "What are some stories for children that have strong female role models?"
 
 
3 hours later…
7:44 PM
Do people really still see this as a problem? Since 1990 at least, empowered female roles are everywhere, from Dora the Explorer, Ni Hao Kai Lan, Mulan, and Brave for younger kids, up to Hermione from Harry Potter, Hunger Games, The Host, etc. for teens.
Even the sappiest of love stories, like Twilight, feature extremely powerful women. Yes, Bella has a pathological dependency on Edward, but he's equally smitten, and she's the one who saves everyone in the end. You would never see that in a vampire story in the 1950's.
Even modern damsel in distress movies don't feature fainting helpless victims, but women who fight back despite being severely overpowered.
What's getting harder to find are stories that portray love and motherhood as worthy pursuits in and of themselves.
 
@KarlBielefeldt You're right; I think the general trend has been to portray female characters in a much stronger light. I also think the OP's example of Cinderella is valid, though.
Much of the "children's literature" out there is horribly dated
Many parents still consider the Disney "Classics" to be a central backbone to children's literature. I have to admit we have a ton of old stories on our bookshelf, and many of them portray some outdated thoughts
I've thrown away/given away quite a few books because they perpetuate some really horrible role modeling, and not just for stereotypical gender roles
Just thinking of the movies my son watches, even the more modern ones, I can see why there may be cause for concern.
Movies like Cars and Monsters, Inc., two of my son's favorites, admittedly show the female characters as little more than secondary love interests.
That being said, I agree with you that the list of currently available titles that show strong female roles may be untenably large, and (hopefully) will continue to grow
 
I still wouldn't call the women in Cars and Monsters, Inc. subordinate, subservient, or lacking in independence or self-reliance. They just don't happen to be the main characters in the movie.
 
@KarlBielefeldt agreed. Perhaps the question should be reworded to remove the references to the outdated stereotypes that are (again, hopefully) no longer considered the standard...
It would seem the intended focus is more along " I would rather raise them to be self-reliant and independent, and ready to embrace desires other than cooking and finding a boyfriend."
I've got to leave chat for a while, but I'm going to link to the transcript of this conversation and suggest that the question be reworded. Given my apparently premature closing of the question, I am reluctant to suggest a radical edit without opening it to further discussion.
 
8:13 PM
@Beofett I wasn't really looking to get the question reworded. I just wanted to spark some discussion.
 
 
4 hours later…
11:49 PM
@KarlBielefeldt Your comments weren't the only ones that suggested to me that perhaps the question could be improved.
Besides, one of the things I'd like to do to help this site grow is encourage participation outside of simply asking questions and posting answers. That's why I've been trying to entice people into meta with bounties, and why I am hoping some people will join us here in chat to discuss this question some more.
 

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