The Comms Room

MDMarra

3:00 PM

@Chopper3 FCoE gear was still way more expensive than iSCSI last time I looked at it

(which was probably a year ago, tbh)

Chopper3

oh it is today

slhck

@MDMarra Haha, if there only was a preferred vendor. We have no IT department, and only some provider that does our internet and stuff.

I have a few offers here and just wanted to check if these sound reasonable or if there are any culprits

MDMarra

@slhck Well, call Dell/HP/IBM, I'm sure they'd love nothing more than the prospect of a new customer

got ya

slhck

So, we (25 people office) run Lotus Domino to organize mails. We plan to virtualize it, probably through ESXI

Bart Silverstrim

...domino?

...

O_o

Dan

3:02 PM

@slhck I.....what?

Bart Silverstrim

So...your parties at the office...do they consist of like, hitting each other with bats or some other form of self-torture too?

slhck

Haha … yeah, what can I say

We do the occasional flagellation too

Just kidding

Dan

@slhck Have you considered virtualisation through the gratuitous use of high explosive?

Bart Silverstrim

If you want ESXi, go to VMWare's site, look for their compatibility guide.

They'll list what servers are spec'd to work.

Go from there.

slhck

@BartSilverstrim We have some specific offers already, I wouldn't mind sharing these with you if you guys want to have look

They say everything's ESXI compatible

Bart Silverstrim

3:04 PM

They might be.

Or you can double check with VMWare.

ErikA

@slhck Pretty much any server sold by the "big three" will work just fine for a small-office ESXi server. Whether or not it's a "good deal" is entirely dependent on your situation.

Bart Silverstrim

It should work, probably would work, but depends on how much you want to risk it or if they'll take it back if there's an issue.

slhck

@ErikA I might call one of those just to check, thanks for the tip

@BartSilverstrim Pretty certain they'd take it back if it doesn't work for any reason

Bart Silverstrim

Then do you want to trust them with remnants of your mail server on their hard disks :-)

slhck

So, it's not gonna be a super expensive super fast server, but one of the main questions would be: Go for 2x600GB SAS or rather take "normal" drives? (given that there's enough RAM and CPU power already)

Bart Silverstrim

3:07 PM

RAID 10 it.

ErikA

@slhck What, exactly, is a "normal" drive?

Bart Silverstrim

Get more drives and RAID 10.

And probably SAS.

If you're going to put other machines on it...

slhck

@ErikA Well, 1TB SATA drives, probably 7200rpm

Kenny Rasschaert

Is there a quick and dirty way to get a named dns server to act as a slave and just replicate ALL zone files of his big daddy? I'd rather not have to specify all the zones in the slave config file.

ErikA

@KennyRasschaert See the topic in the upper-right corner? ;)

slhck

3:10 PM

@BartSilverstrim Yeah, there might be other machines sooner or later. I just don't want to end up with a HDD bottleneck, that's for sure

Bart Silverstrim

RAID 10 with hardware controller, SAS drives...

Depending on how bound you are to the HD it's hard to say if it will be a bottleneck and at what point.

MDMarra

@ErikA Who is the third member of the Big Three? IBM?

Bart Silverstrim

IBM/Dell/HP, I'd assume.

ErikA

@MDMarra Yup. That's how I generally group them anyway.

slhck

@BartSilverstrim Well, given that we currently max out a Pentium D with 4GB, anything could happen :P

Bart Silverstrim

3:12 PM

New server, get 32gig of RAM.

With room for more.

ErikA

@MDMarra Though Oracle (nee Sun) does make some decent x86 hardware. It's much more expensive than the others though.

MDMarra

@ErikA Sun hardware is crazy $$ for x86 kit.

I can see if you really have a need for SPARC

But x86 Sun gear is like lighting a trashcan full of money on fire

slhck

Sounds fair enough. They're suggesting a 6-core 3.3 GHz Xeon, I guess that should work as well.

Kenny Rasschaert

@ErikA Time to pack things up and go home. Not only should I have asked on the main site. It already has been. serverfault.com/questions/221238

MDMarra

@slhck Obviously your workload is unique (every workload is), but in most cases, you become RAM bound long before you become CPU bound

And RAM is cheap

slhck

3:14 PM

Yeah, that's true.

Dan

I still hate the idea of over committing RAM, despite what VMWare say

Bart Silverstrim

Contact the vendors. Look at the support list. Decide if you want that or to listen to sales people.

pauska

@Dan vsphere is pretty happy about screaming "alert alert alert" when you're overcomitting, so god knows why they plug it so much

Dan

@pauska Cos it increases density, and density sells :D

ErikA

@MDMarra We used Sun x86 gear at my old gig exclusively until the merger. Before that, they had very agressive pricing for .edu customers, making their equipment ~25% cheaper than the rest.

@MDMarra But after the Oracle merger, they canned the special .edu pricing program. So then we switched to HP.

MDMarra

3:19 PM

We have a couple Standard One licenses that we run on SPARC Solaris. I cry every time I see the pricing on it and its maintenance (it's managed by another team) when I think of how much other shit we could buy with that $$.

slhck

By the way, anyone have experience with Lotus Domino on Windows vs. Linux hosts?

Would that make a difference, apart from price issues?

ErikA

@slhck Domino on anything is nothing but pain and misery.

6

slhck

@ErikA I already know that, but there's no alternative.

ErikA

@slhck There are always alternatives. It just depends on how much you're willing to pay to get out from under the oppression of Domino.

slhck

@ErikA Well, I don't know too much about how to make such a transition (even, where to?), and … there's the thing about having no real IT department.

Bart Silverstrim

3:24 PM

Depends on how tied you are to it.

Are you using scheduling, group functions, etc. or just email?

MDMarra

@slhck We switched about 5,000 mailboxes from Domino to Exchange about 4 years ago. Never looked back.

slhck

They have a customer/knowledge database tied to it. Calendars as well.

ErikA

-2

A: Standardizing windows 7 development environment

? GPU published applications System Center Essentials application management. 2 nmumbers bigger (mostly targeting lare environments). Not sure it makes sense, though - I dont like my machine being force isntalled with stuff like that.

Oh TomTom.

MDMarra

The consultants that helped do it were expensive, but the ROI was pretty quick with the cost difference.

Bart Silverstrim

Customer and knowledge base tied to it...if it can be tied to Exchange/AD easily, look at SBS.

slhck

3:26 PM

Hm. If we only ran a Domain.

MDMarra

@slhck Yeah, no Active Directory makes that a pretty big barrier.

Bart Silverstrim

what is it running now?

...are you running like 25 workstations individually in a workgroup?

@ErikA Some days are more touretty than others.

slhck

@BartSilverstrim Yeah, just regular desktop machines, with their SMB shares from a NAS, and the Lotus clients hooked to the Domino server.

ErikA

@BartSilverstrim This is probably the worst I've seen out of him.

Bart Silverstrim

Sounds like you should invest in a small overhaul to me.

But that's me.

slhck

3:28 PM

@BartSilverstrim … no, that's not only you ;)

Bart Silverstrim

Management will be simpler if you use SBS and centralize your accounts there.

That would take care of your email too.

Take your old server, turn it into another DC, and have a virtual one besides for replication.

MDMarra

@BartSilverstrim Can you have more than 1 DC with SBS?

Bart Silverstrim

@MDMarra Not sure.

MDMarra

I thought there were all kinds of wacky restrictions with it

ErikA

Ooh, TomTom hit EvanAnderson with a -1. Fight!

Bart Silverstrim

3:30 PM

I would think you could.

slhck

Hm. It sounds like what I've wanted for them for years now, but I don't think they're gonna make that step. With no one knowledgeable enough to actually plan the whole thing to begin with …

Bart Silverstrim

@MDMarra yes, you can. blogs.technet.com/b/sbs/archive/2007/10/04/…

slhck

So here's an offer I've got

Bart Silverstrim

That's silly. They wrote it in Klingon.

slhck

Can I work with this? I'm not the one making the final decision here, just asking around for alternatives / suggestions.

@BartSilverstrim … right?

I actually wrote them about mentioning specific components, model numbers, etc. They wouldn't tell me.

Dan

3:35 PM

@slhck I wouldn't buy from them based on that alone

slhck

Hm. Would probably make sense to pester them again about more details.

Bart Silverstrim

Sales people shouldn't have an issue sharing the information. If they're hiding something I'd be suspicious.

slhck

Mh, that figures

MDMarra

@PeterGrace - Just saw your pic on the /about page. It looks like a school picture where your parents cheaped out and wouldn't let you get the laser background.

Believe me, I know the pain of being the only kid without laser.

Peter Grace

@MDmarra haha, thanks. I took that photo here in the sysadmin office

except I photoshopped out the doorway

(Poorly?)

feel free to add a laser background if you want.

MDMarra

3:45 PM

You should have photoshopped in the laser background

Peter Grace

hahaha

I see what we're going to do today.

MDMarra

Haha, my skills are limited to mspaint

They're exceptional, don't get me wrong. Just not suited for laser background

Peter Grace

Give me a min, I've got this.

blah, I guess I better fix the stuff I'm working on first

Dan

I don't believe you can see the beam on red lasers. Just saying, like

MDMarra

@PeterGrace got it

ErikA

3:48 PM

@Dan That's why you need a fog machine.

Dan

@MDMarra BWaha!

@ErikA Absolutely!

MDMarra

By the way, the awesome white corona that you seem to have is what happens when you open the image in paint and use black with the bucket tool

I didn't do anything special to make your aura show

Bart Silverstrim

@MDMarra ...no.

It looks like it's snowing on him.

Dan

MDMarra

Snowing?

It's fucking lasers, man.

Bart Silverstrim

3:51 PM

I loved dexter's lab.

surfasb

@coredump I can't disagree. I am changing it right now.

Peter Grace

@MDMarra NAILED IT

MDMarra

I thought so

ITHedgeHog

Damn my left mouse button on my mouse pad just died...

Bart Silverstrim

Need a bigger gerbil.

Peter Grace

4:06 PM

That's as much time as I'm going to devote to that.

MDMarra

nice

Dan

Good effort

Peter Grace

it was getting difficult trying to clone the lasers properly in the fine edge

so I said, ya know, funnier this way anyway.

Bart Silverstrim

You need lasers coming from your eyes.

MORE COWBELL

2

ITHedgeHog

MOAR COWBELL. MOAR BACON. MOAR COFFEE

syneticon-dj

4:24 PM

@slhck why in the world did you specify a self-build in a Supermicro housing?

slhck

@syneticondj I didn't specify anything there, this is what I got as an offer

I'm just a regular computer user, I know only little about servers

syneticon-dj

whatever you get there would be vastly inferior to any HP, Lenovo, IBM or Dell offer in terms of service and engineering quality

voretaq7

@PeterGrace gah - it's like grade school photo day all over again!

slhck

Would there be huge price differences? @syneticondj

Bart Silverstrim

You'd be buying a server...

syneticon-dj

4:27 PM

The options like memory and HDDs will cost plenty with all brands except for maybe IBM which has reasonable pricing within their ExpressSeller program

Bart Silverstrim

and if you bought from Dell or the other big ones, you can get a support contract for parts to be sent to you ASAP in case of failure.

slhck

@BartSilverstrim Hm … that would be really nice to have though.

syneticon-dj

Other than the option stuff, pricing is quite similar among vendors

slhck

After all, this is the most critical machine we'd have.

MDMarra

@syneticondj I've actually gotten really good prices out of Dell. Never order anything from the website. Always call a sales person and give them a sob story regarding money and they'll all shave like 20% off

Bart Silverstrim

4:28 PM

If you want to duct tape things together that's your risk to take. If you want to have a company that will send repair people to swap a drive or whatever part when you scream, you pay more, but have them take care of it.

slhck

Well given that we have nobody to take care of it, this sounds like the better plan

voretaq7

@syneticondj You can get decent supermicro hardware through good resellers without getting raped on price or risking your machine falling apart before you can put it in the rack. Like @MDMarra says you can do well with Dell too

Bart Silverstrim

Again...start reassessing your 25 person office, standardize your hardware, and you can get better deals with a sales person assigned to you.

syneticon-dj

Mhh. "Repair people" is a strong word for what you get in the low price segment

Bart Silverstrim

Yeah, well, better for some without an IT department than nothing.

syneticon-dj

4:29 PM

@voretaq7 I never liked supermicro stuff any time I've come to see it

voretaq7

@syneticondj It's a strong word for what you get in the high end of the pricing pool too sometimes. I've had the displeasure of some uniquely bad IBM field engineers.

@syneticondj My current environment is all SuperMicro through Iron Systems - Never had a problem and the one time we needed service (HD Failure) the parts were here within the 4 hour service window. 's all I ask from my hardware vendors :-)

ITHedgeHog

I had a dell rep turn up one at 2am high on crack.

I didn't let him change the motherboard, I did it myself....

voretaq7

@ITHedgeHog well their ad chimp was a pothead :)

ITHedgeHog

lol

Bart Silverstrim

He showed up. Better than most cable installers.

voretaq7

4:34 PM

@syneticondj I think IXSystems machines are supermicro-based these days too (they look it)

Dan

Holy cow, 1640

Laters!

wfaulk

boobies FTW youtube.com/watch?v=v241TF-cSzU

voretaq7

@wfaulk cut off grow back cut off grow back cut off grow back because because because because THEY'RE EATING MEEEEEEE!

Ethabelle

5:02 PM

Hallo ^__^!

Bart Silverstrim

Hi @ethabelle.

Good mood this morning?

Ethabelle

@BartSilverstrim Yees! How are you?

@BartSilverstrim Have a good weekend ^^?

Bart Silverstrim

Not bad.

Chopper3

I had the BEST weekend 'cos a saw the amazing muppet film

AdrianK

Muppets rocked. Took the girlfriend out to see it last night. Nearly the only ones in the theatre but not quite, dammit.

Chopper3

5:12 PM

My face ached from grinning

voretaq7

@AdrianK mmmmmmUppets.

AdrianK

My voice is a bit hoarse from laughing my fool ass off. Thankfully the Lady enjoys Muppets as much as she enjoys her art films.

Bart Silverstrim

@Ethabelle & co - you're all way too chipper for a Monday the 13th...

AdrianK

You East Coasters are way too damn awake for this hour...

MDMarra

Fuck it. Just ordered an iPhone out-of-pocket and told our phone guy that I'll be returning my free Blackberry within a week.

RIM is just so far behind everyone else

AdrianK

5:22 PM

@MDMarra Love my iPhone. There's a few things that it won't do that I miss from my Droid1, but just a few.

MDMarra

I had a 3G back in the day, but gave it up for a free curve

I thought not paying for a plan would make it easy to swallow how shitty BBOS is

I made it about 3 years

I get a steep discount through sprint, though. So my monthly plan is only like $63

AdrianK

@MDMarra Nice. VZW's a bit steeper than most, but I have a now-unavailable unlimited plan and 450 minutes for $93.

MDMarra

I got the Sprint 450 minute + unlimted text/data

Ethabelle

@BartSilverstrim Monday busy-ness. :3

MDMarra

I think the normal price is ~80

Bart Silverstrim

5:29 PM

@Ethabelle Whenever I see you online it makes me want to go to NYC to visit Bubba Gump's.

Ethabelle

@BartSilverstrim Why is that?

AdrianK

@mdmarra I'm a little less fanboi about Google than I was a few years ago when I signed up, but I do most of my texting through Google Voice.

Bart Silverstrim

Just because you have one in Chicago that we visited while there.

Ethabelle

@BartSilverstrim I don't think I've ever been.. is it all shrimp :P?

Bart Silverstrim

Chicago was a stop on the way back from the mall of america.

They had one there too.

Not all shrimp. But a lot :-)

There's one in Times Square.

Bubba Gumps is on that pier where they have those fireworks and such.

Just an association. You're in Chicago, reminds me of that trip and the nearest BG's is in NYC. :-)

It was fun because we went to the BG in Mall of America, and while in Chicago I was wearing their t-shirt so the hostess seated us sooner :-)

They ask you trivia about the movie too.

Ethabelle

5:35 PM

@BartSilverstrim Aah. Navy Pier. Don't go there often, try to avoid Michigan Ave, lol. That's awesome though, sounds like a lot of fun ^__^

Bart Silverstrim

It was!

As I always complain, it was extremely hot though.

:-)

But we didn't care. Fireworks. Fun.

Great dinner.

The little guy was getting tired as we walked. I put him on my shoulders to carry him halfway to the hotel.

It was a fun way to spend the day.

You should go sometime and try it.

bit on the expensive side though.

tombull89

You know when you have a really awesome weekend? I just had the opposite.

It's just as well I'm not going out tomorrow for anything because there would be a lot of blood spilt.

Hi, ServerFault!

Bart Silverstrim

Servers down?

84104

@BartSilverstrim Which? serverfault loads for me.

tombull89

Oh, no, work wise fine. Lots of swapping screens and riding a Genie Vertical lift.

One word: "Friends"

84104

5:42 PM

@tombull89 I think you have an extra r in there.

tombull89

@84104 wha...wh-oh. chuckle

Bart Silverstrim

@84104 referring to why tombull's weekend sucked.

84104

@BartSilverstrim Context: I didn't pay attention to it.

Bah, and that makes for some ambiguous language too.

tombull89

In our group we have a "no dating inside the group" rule - just because it always ends badly. That rule has been epically broken...so we'll have to see how it goes.

84104

@tombull89 I expect 3000 words in iambic pentameter by next Tuesday.

tombull89

5:45 PM

deep breath

okay this is what I had to use today:

Goes up ~10m and wobbles a bit.

84104

@tombull89 Exciting, but not all in a good way. What caused that?

Bart Silverstrim

@tombull89 Oh...you broke THAT rule...

tombull89

@84104 had to go up and sort out a projector mounting issue.

84104

@tombull89 I don't like projectors very much, but they are better than printers.

Actually, these days they're about as boring as monitors. (Boring in this case is good.)

tombull89

@84104 haha, this was a beasty Epson that has to throw a good 10 meters to the hall wall.

AdrianK

5:51 PM

@BartSilverstrim Ouch. Yeah, that one usually ends badly.

SmallClanger

@tombull89 Reminds me of the phrase: "This projector has a throw of about 3m, but you can get 6 out of it if you clear the back wall of the car park..."

Chris S

7:01 PM

@voretaq7 serverfault.com/suggested-edits/5257 <-- That was awfully minor...

voretaq7

@ChrisS yeah but the original language made me make a funny face

(and approving that edit was easier than fixing it myself)

Chris S

It still made sense though... I just clicked "DENY!" and it errored that you approved it already.

Meh either way

Someone needs to send John a message about copying content out of Wikipedia to the tag wiki's without attribution.

voretaq7

@ChrisS can I use flaming hot pokers?

<- has a really low standard for approving edits to recent posts.
I get more "Yeah, no." about them as the posts get older.

Chris S

I'm somewhat picky, and really picky about older posts.

coredump

7:27 PM

@surfasb lol you lies

Chris S

7:40 PM

AdrianK

Not sure I could go up there sober.

Chris S

I've been in the model on the left, working on the underside of an atrium room. The roof was 86' (26m) off the ground.

I worked commercial mechanical and plumbing construction while I was in college. The new guys get the jobs nobody else wants, like being in a lift that requires a full body harness with dual lanyards.

voretaq7

@ChrisS oh now it could be worse.

You could be working in a country with no safety regulations (no harness/tethers)

WORKER IS REPLACEABLE! DO NOT DAMAGE EQUIPMENT!

Chris S

Worker wasn't going to fall out of equipment anyway.... but yeah, there's no way I'd get in that thing without the harness. =]

voretaq7

There's no way I'd get in that thing period. I've had the unique pleasure of being in one that got out of balance and wouldn't let me come down.
Fuck. That. Shit.

Chris S

7:50 PM

They should always go down, even if the tilt is set.

Besides, your own fault for operating it on a playable surface. =P

voretaq7

@ChrisS It wouldn't let me retract the arm to back away from the lighting truss - I was not going "straight down" into stage lights :)

and because it was upset about its balance it wouldn't let me drive it back to get away from the lights :P

Chris S

You survived, what are you complaining about?

=D

voretaq7

"I PROTECT YOU FROM DANGEROUS TIPPING! (electrocution not my problem - you figure it out!)"

@ChrisS the 20 minutes of wrestling with the stupid thing before I managed to bump it into a position where it wasn't trying to kill me anymore!

All safety features should have a breaker you can pop to override them.

Label it "I want to kill myself" or something.

Chris S

@voretaq7 Eh, considering the "average" intelligence (or lack thereof) of most construction workers, not so sure an override button is a good idea...

2

Hrm... MSA P2012 with 12x2TB disks; ~20TB of storage... And only ~$9k

Might have to jump on that. =]

voretaq7

@ChrisS Uncle Chuck Says: "If you kill off all the stupid ones the species will get smarter."

2

That's Evolution. :-)

AdrianK

8:02 PM

@voretaq7 Which, however, quickly begets you lawyers. Rinse, Repeat.

voretaq7

@AdrianK Lawyers aren't very smart - kill them off too.

Chris S

I know quite a few lawyers, it's funny how all of them hate the ambulance chasers too.

Zoredache

@voretaq7 that only works if you can kill them off faster then they breed, and they tend to breed pretty young these days.

AdrianK

@ChrisS OTOH, you gotta make those Bentley payments somehow.

And a good divorce lawyer is worth their weight in gold if you have to go down that road.

Chris S

All the "rich" lawyers I know have made their money off medium and large corporations who didn't listen to their in-house lawyers and screwed up... Seems fair enough to me. The two lawyers in my office, neither are rich, but make an honest wage from what they do (personal lawyers: wills, trusts, estate planning, bankruptcy, etc)

Iain

8:14 PM

How much rep do you need to edit stuff on meta ?

tombull89

@ChrisS oh Jeeze. With the one I was on you don't need a harness, but for the 20m I think you do.

MDMarra

So, I just flagged something and hit submit by accident 1/2 way through my flag reason

Any one of you diamonds want to take care of it? :)

It was about this:serverfault.com/questions/354951/loss-of-vga-on-dell-r210-ii which has 3 votes to send to SU but it should be outright closed, since it's so terrible

Chris S

Iain got to it a second before me.

Iain

sorted

MDMarra

Appreciated

Iain

8:26 PM

things like that are easy

AdrianK

@MDMarra Damn tricksy submit button.

MDMarra

Yup

Chopper3

8:45 PM

Apple shares went over $500 today - wow

Chris S

@Chopper3 Might be time to sell short since I don't have any.... Should have picked it up last week when it was still around $470

Chopper3

still staggering, I got mine in '98 - it's my pension really

Basil

9:15 PM

Just had a presentation about cisco servers. With netapp taped to them.

MikeyB

And so it begins:
"On a seperate note, what would it take to have you folks do some mysql/apache/performance tuning on my webserver? About a month ago I moved from a 32 bit server to a reasonably decent 64 bit server, lots more ram, dual 8-core processors etc and while it's working, I don't believe it's running optimally. I suspect that the various config files are just not optimized for 64 bit and all the ram we added."

MDMarra

@Basil You mean IBM servers with a Cisco Green faceplate?

MikeyB

Hey fsckers. Oh, some good fodder on the star wall.

Basil

@MDMarra I thought it was EMC hardware

84104

@MikeyB The answer is $.

MDMarra

9:16 PM

Could be. I haven't bought any actual Cisco servers, but their NAC appliances are rebadged IBM boxes

At least they were a year or so ago

MikeyB

@84104 That's always the answer.

Basil

My understanding is their C class blades are EMC hardware

MDMarra

0

Q: FTP in Windows Server 2008

I am trying to set up FTP on my Windows Server 2008 machine and have a question. In Role Services, instead of "FTP Server" I have "FTP Publishing Service". What is the difference between the two and how can I install FTP Server on my machine? Thanks.

Why do people still use FTP

84104

@MDMarra Instead of http on windows?

MDMarra

@84104 There's FTPS, or VPN+SMB, or anything not plaintext

anyhow

im outa here

MikeyB

9:35 PM

Anonymous quick file drops (our build system uploads logs via ftp to a central location)
Read-only file serving (ftp.kernel.org, download.software.ibm.com, etc).
Sometimes you don't need the hammer.

Zoredache

@MDMarra Hopefully only things needing to support legacy crap.

Chris S

10:00 PM

@MDMarra I've got a few network devices around that use it. We don't use it externally, but there's two network scanners, the phone system does FTP backups... I think that's about it actually.

AdrianK

10:16 PM

Is it too far out of line to point out that using FTP in 2012 is a sign that you don't know what you're doing?

And FFS, nobody should do it on a production box that is tied into your authentication domain.

84104

Wait, we're talking about authenticated ftp? That's like running telnet.

AdrianK

I'm no Windows guy, but if it's in Role Services you have to be doing this as one of the users on the box, right?

84104

@AdrianK You'd need some sort of admin access. Domain Admin is most likely, but could also be delegated.

Zypher

@AdrianK yes, there are still some services that it really really doesn't matter ... hell i still use tftp in places as well as strait ftp

phones are a big one

AdrianK

@84104 I rather thought that one can't actually do much with a 'nobody' user like one configures for FTP in a *nix env.

Zypher

10:24 PM

switch config backups are another

ftp is still a valid tool in the toolbox

84104

@AdrianK I think we're talking about different things. I was talking about setting up the Server as and FTP server.

AdrianK

@Zypher We use TFTP for initial boot-up in in LTSP. But it's all read-only and chroot'd.

MikeyB

@AdrianK As it should be!

Zoredache

@Zypher but tftp doesn't have authentication it in. With tftp it is completely clear, that you are doing something without authentication. ftp gives people the wrong impression that there is a user/password challenge, and thus it has security.

Zypher

@AdrianK right, those things still have thier uses ... like its a tool in the toolbox

@Zoredache i agree but a blanket NEVER USE FTP EVAR!!!ONEON!!! is a silly stance to take ... it has it's uses

AdrianK

10:26 PM

IMHO, it's a very poor question. Perhaps it's my own bias, but it strikes that the OP has a hammer and is looking to fix his problem by pounding the nails he knows.

84104

@Zoredache I know it's possible to kerberize ftp, but I never bothered. Between sftp and http(s) I didn't have much call for it.

AdrianK

Unless it's wrapped in a point to point VPN tunnel with endpoints on the source and destination machines, I'd be a little hinky about allowing that on my network.

I suppose it might be acceptable if it were VLAN'd on its own private subnet with nothing else going on. But that's about it.

84104

There is nothing to indicate that he wants anything other than an anonymous download offer. It could even be for encrypted files. I suspect this isn't the case, but nothing right now says it can't be.
I think I've confused my logic enough. He's probably a fool, but I can't actually *prove* it.

-_- Markdown.

AdrianK

@84104 I've probably worked in non-profits too long. I tend to go with "Ijit until proven Innocent".

84104

@AdrianK ljit?

AdrianK

10:41 PM

@84104 An annoying and incompetent person. Like the people that potter along at 12-under the speed limit in the passing lane with their turn signal blinking for several miles.

84104

@AdrianK Hurray I've learned a new way to insult people!

syneticon-dj

I am missing Kara Marfia from the mod list recently. Anybody an idea if she simply has resigned before the election or if there is some impeachment procedure I know nothing about (yet)?

AdrianK

Them: My printer doesn't work! Me: Is it on? Them: I don't know how to do that!

All y'all seem to have a very complex little community. Must more complicated and you're going to need to start offering a StackExchange certification.

Mark Henderson

@syneticondj She was inactive for an extended period of time

There is a 6-month inactive policy, then I assume SE contact you and ask if you intend to continue as a mod

syneticon-dj

I understood mods were elected for a "lifetime"

Mark Henderson

10:54 PM

@syneticondj Unless you leave the site

@AdrianK theoatmeal.com/comics/printers

syneticon-dj

that's what I meant

but inactivity is not leaving, is it?

AdrianK

@MarkHenderson Nice. I'd forgotten about that one.

syneticon-dj

It is just all the pieces falling together too nicely - the inactive mods meta post, the election with all the people calling for three new positions and her resignation

Mark Henderson

@syneticondj I'm trying so hard to find the link to the official statement that an inactive moderator for 6 months is removed, but I can't find it

@syneticondj I can see the mod stats, and I can tell you that Kara hasn't done any moderation in over 6 months. Nothing personal against her, Im guessing life just got in the way

Plus she was never elected

Zoredache

@syneticondj It is a conspiracy...

syneticon-dj

10:59 PM

It is not that I think that she has been wrongfully removed. I just would like to know if there is a documented procedure for this or if it is just an ad-hoc decision.

Zoredache

@syneticondj btw Kara was not elected, she was appointed.

Arguably she was an interim, moderator appointed at the site startup.

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