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3:20 AM
 
 
4 hours later…
7:12 AM
@SeanAllred They found a typo, probably a missing ‘m’, and “fixed” the PDF.
 
 
2 hours later…
9:14 AM
hi there
am using this:
%%% tex.SX (97180) - How to get column alignment in tabularx?
\usepackage{array}
\newcolumntype{Z}{>{\centering\let\newline\\\arraybackslash\hspace{0pt}}X}
and would like to use (that is, integrate into the above) sth like that:
{>{\hsize=1.5\hsize}X>{\hsize=0.5\hsize}X}
(which is taken from David's tabularx manual)
how?
here's the quick-n-dirty questions:
0
Q: tabularx preamble tweaks // column widths

nutty about nattyam using this: %%% http://tex.stackexchange.com/a/97188/27721 \usepackage{array} \newcolumntype{Z}{>{\centering\let\newline\\\arraybackslash\hspace{0pt}}X} and would like to use (that is, integrate into the above) sth like that: {>{\hsize=1.5\hsize}X>{\hsize=0.5\hsize}X} (which is taken fro...

 
@nuttyaboutnatty well you've specified centre alignment there. What alignment do you want?
 
\begin{tabularx}{\textwidth}{@{}*{1}{p{\mylengthydate}}*{1}{X}*{1}{Z}@{}}
 
@nuttyaboutnatty why use *{1}{...} instead of ... ?
 
redundancy
doesn't harm, does it?
 
@nuttyaboutnatty makes it harder to read and slower, but not actual harm.
 
9:26 AM
(rationale: so that I can always use that same syntax, even if it's *{2} or *{3} etc)
in this case,
first column hosts a left-aligned date
middle column: left-aligned text
 
@nuttyaboutnatty do you use \@for\tmp:=H\do{\tmp}\@for\tmp:=e\do{\tmp}\@for\tmp:=l\do{\tmp}\@for\tmp:=l\do{‌​\tmp}\@for\tmp:=o\do{\tmp} to write Hello for similar reasons?
 
right column: (more-or-less) centred figure
 
@nuttyaboutnatty why not use \begin{tabular}{lcc}
 
first column has specified width
 
@nuttyaboutnatty why?
 
9:30 AM
should be fixed
why not?
afk, back a bit later
 
@nuttyaboutnatty because usually it just makes it look worse. Either you specify a width that is too narrow and cramp the text or too wide and introduce ugly space, and if you specify exactly the right width then that's the space l would have used.
 
9:44 AM
New package on CTAN: bewerbung I had the very same idea, but with another form of database.
 
10:17 AM
Not the same idea, actually.
 
Actually a good question
0
Q: Binary operation with subscript

GausslerIt is common in mathematics to write tensor products like U\otimes_K V, if the sclalar field is called K. I wonder if this is the right way to notate this? \otimes is usually a binary operator, but does TeX still see it this way when I add a subscript to it? Should I perhaps write something like...

if a subscript is added to a construction, does that affect the math type (or whatever the term is) and is it testable?
 
@daleif No, it doesn't affect the math type.
 
@egreg thought so.
 
11:09 AM
@SeanAllred Well, many languages started out without any space between words (Greek, Sanskrit), and some still do (Thai), maybe they’re trying to start a tradition to write English like that.
@SeanAllred It’s not that hard to read, actually.
 
I am so tempted to create a package named nsfw with a different acronym meaning just to troll people. :)
4
 
 
1 hour later…
12:27 PM
@ArthurReutenauer I sure hope that tradition isn't coming back. English isn't an inflected language – at least not in the same way as Latin and Greek :) There were very apparent markers for end-of-word and end-of-sentence (and indeed, sometimes a dot was placed between words to make it easier – not often, but sometimes).
@PauloCereda Nothing is stopping you:
➜  ~  texdoc nsfw
Sorry, no documentation found for nsfw.
If you are unsure about the name, try searching CTAN's TeX catalogue at
ctan.org/search.html#byDescription.
 
@SeanAllred oooh
 
@SeanAllred GALLIAESTOMNISDIVISAINPARTESTRESQVARVMVNAMINCOLVNTBELGAE…
 
@egreg Gaul is divided into three parts, etc.
@egreg (I studied Latin for six years – a little rusty, but the endings still make it easier than the equivalent in English)
 
12:43 PM
@SeanAllred I did it for seven years. But also a few years before you. ;-)
 
@egreg I imagine so ;)
I remember being in Latin IV in high school, the only kid in that class, next to the Latin III and Latin II kids in the same classroom/time-slot. Those were fun times. :)
Basically just sat their and read through the Iliad when I wasn't goofing off. Very nice, actually. A little wordy, but nice.
 
@SeanAllred I can still remember all declensions. And also the special locative cases, like domi bellique.
@SeanAllred The Iliad in Latin?
 
@egreg Whoops, the Aeneid.
For some reason those two words get mixed up in my head.
Too many vowels.
 
PROTASIS (1.1-7)
Arma virumque cano, Troiae qui primus ab oris
Italiam fato profugus Laviniaque venit
litora, multum ille et terris iactatus et alto
vi superum, saevae memorem Iunonis ob iram,
multa quoque et bello passus, dum conderet urbem
inferretque deos Latio; genus unde Latinum
Albanique patres atque altae moenia Romae.
 
@egreg Hahaha – I was just humming that :)
 
12:47 PM
@SeanAllred My older brother had to learn reading it in metric.
@SeanAllred He also studied Greek.
 
@egreg Same here. It was a lot of fun :) I always had an interest in metrics, though (in any language)
 
@SeanAllred I doubt that makes much of a difference, to be honest. I’m pretty sure you can get used to it.
 
Gotta run though – off to work :)
@ArthurReutenauer Certainly :)
 
@SeanAllred Have a nice day. :P I ended grading papers. :)
 
@egreg @SeanAllred I recently took to learning Ancient Greek, from a book that uses the same techniques as for teaching living languages, and comes with recordings. It’s really cool.
@SeanAllred Have a nice day!
 
12:50 PM
@SeanAllred Have a quacky day! :)
 
@cfr Maybe contact Sašo Živanović. The current version is from 10.7.15. So this seems to be quite active...
 
@ArthurReutenauer How do they handle pronunciation?
 
cfr
1:13 PM
@LaRiFaRi SZ is working on a new version but the beta isn't ready yet... :(.
 
@JosephWright They use a reconstituted pronunciation as it’s thought to have been spoken in the 4th century BC. That implies for example that χ is not pronounced the way Knuth would want it to be, but as an aspirated [k]. And φ is an aspirated [p].
 
@ArthurReutenauer β and δ?
 
@JosephWright They also put a lot of emphasis on the accents, that reflected tones at that time.
[b] and [d],of course - I don’t know when it became [v] and [ð], but clearly later.
 
@ArthurReutenauer My assumption but thought I'd check
 
@DavidCarlisle I've found some strange behaviour of \includegraphics in LuaTeX's dvi mode:
0
A: using --lua option to compile latex file to html fails when including png file with tex4ht and make4ht

michal.h21This error probably doesn't have anything in common with tex4ht. Try to compile following file with dvilualatex: \documentclass{article} \usepackage[]{graphicx} \begin{document} \includegraphics{someimage.png} \end{document} The error message is the same. It seems that \includegraphics tries t...

 
1:25 PM
@JosephWright Actually there’s an upper bound (or rather “later bound”) for when β started being pronounced as [v], since the same shape (в) was used to note [v] when the Cyrillic alphabet was devised in the 9th century AD.
 
@JosephWright the error shows only when the image exists
 
@michal.h21 Just worked out that was probably what you meant
 
@michal.h21 I doubt many people have ever tested that:-) I'll look at the question.......
 
@DavidCarlisle I have a feeling I know what is going on
 
@DavidCarlisle I suspect not many people use that combination, as png images aren't normally supported in dvi...
 
1:34 PM
@DavidCarlisle @michal.h21 The problem isn't really the LaTeX code
We have an explicit extension so LaTeX (graphics) will look for a bounding box in DVI mode on the assumption that this is an EPS file
 
@PauloCereda Here’s another duck fact for you: duck is “and“ in Swedish, which is very close to “ande” that means spirit or soul. As it happens, the phrase “den heliga Anden”, meaning the Holy Ghost, can also be understood as the Holy Duck.
 
With an 8-bit engine, all of the lines of the .png can be read safely but none of course contain the bounding box so we get the controlled error
With LuaTeX, however, the first line is not valid as UTF-8 so the engine itself errors before the TeX code gets a look in
The only obvious fix is to hard-code that files with some extensions should be treated as 'bad', or alternatively that EPS files have to end .eps
 
@PauloCereda Note that there is a difference in pronunciation (evidently not reflected in spelling): Swedish - like Norwegian - has a tonal system, meaning that “anden” will be pronounced with a different intonation depending on whether it means “the spirit” or “the duck”.
 
@JosephWright @michal.h21 yes although having that default is optional and for luatex probably should be off, with latex it reads the png and reports no bounding box, but for dvilualatex typically you get fatal utf8 decoding error.....
 
@ArthurReutenauer ooooh
 
1:39 PM
@DavidCarlisle 'that default'?
 
@JosephWright oh you justy said that (I was catching up)
 
@JosephWright but this must be related to graphicx drivers, as with dvipdfmx it works well, as well in pdf mode
 
@JosephWright default ...read is \def\Gread@eps
 
@michal.h21 Not really other than only dvips mode looks for a bounding box
 
@JosephWright so maybe luatex should have it's own mode, as it can use image library for reading image bounding box, for instance :)
 
1:45 PM
@michal.h21 dvipdfm has \@namedef{Gin@rule@.png}#1{{bmp}{.xbb}{#1}} so it has an explicit rule for png that tells it not to look in the png file for size info, dvips doesn't so it just falls back to trying the EPS reader
 
@michal.h21 LuaTeX in DVI mode is rather a niche thing. Moreover, unless you particularly fancy writing a driver I'm not sure who might do it!
@michal.h21 I am meaning to write some graphics inclusion code for expl3 which would need to cover this area, but I suspect I'll take the position that file names should have either no extension or a 'proper' one, so name.png with dvips will lead to an error in all cases :-)
 
\documentclass{article}
\usepackage{graphicx}
\DeclareGraphicsRule{.png}{bmp}{.bb}{}
\begin{document}
\includegraphics{ug.png}
\end{document}
@JosephWright @michal.h21 ^^
@JosephWright original lax rules aimed to be nice to metapost which as I recall made files called xxx.1, xxx.2 etc so weird extension == EPS
 
@JosephWright I feared that you would say that :D
@DavidCarlisle this seems like something what could be used
 
@michal.h21 or @JosephWright or this vvvv
\documentclass{article}
\usepackage{graphicx}
%\DeclareGraphicsRule{.png}{bmp}{.bb}{}
\makeatletter
\expandafter\let\csname Gin@rule@*\endcsname\@undefined
\makeatother

\begin{document}
\includegraphics{ug.png}
\end{document}
@JosephWright, @michal.h21 first says .png can be included but you need to specify a size, second just removes the default rule to try EPS so you get unknown type error for png
 
@DavidCarlisle this actually works with tex4ht
 
1:55 PM
@michal.h21 working code? strange:-)
 
My TUGboat has arrived! Yay!
 
@DavidCarlisle when I try DeclareGraphicsRule{.png}{bmp}{.xbb}{} and create .xbb file for the image with ebb -x, it even uses correct image size :)
 
@michal.h21 That was the idea for that rule system:-)
 
@DavidCarlisle sometimes it is a good idea to ask a advice from someone that try to understand everything from the manual :) this is really nice :)
 
hi cricket fans
any help with this one much appreciated :-)
1
Q: How to get alignment finally "right" with tabularx and an image?

nutty about nattyTwo things I'm struggling with in the following MWE: "looooooooooonger text" doesn't fit: don't want the middle and right column to be equally spaced: the maple may move over a little to the right (but should not shift vertically by this operation). I've had several messy attempts at getting th...

 
2:13 PM
@PauloCereda Cool
@DavidCarlisle Might nobble you to work on l3graphics :-)
 
@JosephWright let me just finish xor first
 
@DavidCarlisle Indeed: I will let you off then
@DavidCarlisle I can probably manage the graphics stuff myself if needed :)
 
@JosephWright did you like my metatable?
 
@DavidCarlisle Hadn't looked in detail: clever!
@DavidCarlisle Cleverer than luatexbase, in fact
 
@JosephWright don't know why but I felt lua must have some way of hiding a function call in array syntax, google did the rest lua manual not bad really:-)
 
2:21 PM
@DavidCarlisle I think we can make a case for this code (despite reservations expressed on LaTeX-L)
@DavidCarlisle I've got PIL for 5.2 not keep meaning to buy the latest one
@DavidCarlisle I'd say it's a good model for 'Programming LaTeX3'
 
@JosephWright it's getting to the point where we could put the remaining bits from the lutexbase emulation and luasupport into ltluatex and rename the result luatexbase version n+1 and most existing users of that (eg fontspec) would just work
 
@DavidCarlisle I did wonder if this might happen :-)
@DavidCarlisle As long as we cover plain then that's fine by me
@DavidCarlisle I did have a feeling what we were really going to do was take over luatexbase, given the way things for the format code have gone (.ini file stuff)
 
@JosephWright as you commented on a commit latex (and latex_error()) don't work too well as engine neutral names, and luaotfload needs to refer to something and luatexbase is probably as good a name as any...
 
@DavidCarlisle If we go that way I still favour a split between stuff in the kernel and stuff that is 'extra'
@DavidCarlisle Do you want to raise with the existing team for that code or should I? What about luatex.sty and things like \newattribute versus \newluatexattribute?
 
@JosephWright yes but anything that is used by luaotfload isn't very "extra" as its pretty much used every time (so that just about only leaves out the catcodetable stack)
 
2:29 PM
@DavidCarlisle Multiple name?
 
@JosephWright If you notice I had to fudge that in last version of doctest I think we just have to support luatexbase as far as possible and at places where luatex.sty differs just let it go, a new luatex.sty could always force compatibility where needed.
 
@DavidCarlisle You can tell Chris about this plan :-)
@DavidCarlisle Certainly
 
@JosephWright multiple name for?
 
@DavidCarlisle So DocStrip most of 'our' luatexbase into a file loadable for the kernel and add appropriate 'extras' for plain?
@DavidCarlisle Like I said, things like \newattribute/\newluatexattribute
@DavidCarlisle Do you think they'll mind us dropping support for ancient LuaTeX versions?
 
@JosephWright just \newattribute (I think) in some core although probably we need to have some compatibility name duplication option for luatebase and primitive names, to be decided....
@JosephWright no:-)
 
2:32 PM
@DavidCarlisle Agreed
 
@JosephWright yes something like (but not necessary exactly like) the ltluatex.tex. there I kept pretty close to etex.src could move closer to latex's allocation but plain wouldn't have a headline ltnews kind of update so harder to drop things like local allocation and other etex.src goodies. It's OK I think.
 
@DavidCarlisle OK, so one .dtx? DocStrip out some code for the kernel and some into a package which does 'everything' on plain and 'extras only' on LaTeX?
 
@JosephWright yes
 
@DavidCarlisle I've no idea what happens about plain on newer engines: I guess 'suck it and see'
@DavidCarlisle Will you rearrange or should I?
@DavidCarlisle Still have to write at least one talk for TUG2015
 
@JosephWright I'd like to push some of it into an update to etex.src it's a nonsense that that is loaded with the wrong ranges and then you have to patch the macros.
 
2:36 PM
@DavidCarlisle Sensible and I think not likely to cause an issue: will you raise with Peter B.?
 
@JosephWright I could (but possibly not tonight, unless late: end of school production
 
@DavidCarlisle Leave it with me, then :-)
 
@JosephWright yes, I hadn't realised that it was updated a few years ago with some luatex-specific support (to stop it loading hyphenation) so it not supporting luatex ranges is nonsense.
@JosephWright Probably can't do much before 10 or so, so drop me a line here or email if you want me to pick up, otherwise I'll see where we are tomorrow.
\RequirePackage{ltluatex}
\RequirePackage{emu-luatexbase}

\documentclass{article}
\listfiles
\usepackage{fontspec}

\begin{document}

\end{document}
@JosephWright It would be good if we could make ^^ not make this vvv
 *File List*
ltluatex.sty
emu-luatexbase.sty
 article.cls    2014/09/29 v1.4h Standard LaTeX document class
  size10.clo    2014/09/29 v1.4h Standard LaTeX file (size option)
fontspec.sty    2015/03/14 v2.4c Font selection for XeLaTeX and LuaLaTeX
   expl3.sty    2015/06/15 v5630 L3 programming layer (loader)
expl3-code.tex    2015/06/15 v5630 L3 programming layer
l3unicode-data.def    2015/06/25 v5640 L3 Unicode data
l3pdfmode.def    2015/05/21 v5613 L3 Experimental driver: PDF mode
  xparse.sty    2015/06/15 v5630 L3 Experimental document command parser
 
3:10 PM
@DavidCarlisle Isn't a lot of that @WillRobertson's fault decision
2
Yay, worked out strikeout!
 
@JosephWright oh no yay!
 
@DavidCarlisle A lot of that comes from graphicx, which comes from xunicode
% \paragraph{\pkg{xunicode}}
% Ross Moore's \pkg{xunicode} package is now automatically loaded for
% users of both \XeLaTeX\ and \LuaLaTeX.
% This package provides backwards compatibility with \LaTeX's methods for ccessing extra
% characters and accents (for example, |\%|, |\$|, |\textbullet|, |\"u|, and
% so on), plus many more Unicode characters.
@DavidCarlisle Only one thing for it: finish LaTeX3 and have all of this sort of thing in-house :-)
 
@JosephWright Sorry to bother you. This is the second time in the past few days that I see "Community" voting to close (and effectively closing) as duplicate (an example here: tex.stackexchange.com/q/255332/3954). Is this a new feature? What criteria applies in these cases? I mean, when "Community" jumps in to close a post?
 
@GonzaloMedina Happens if the OP themselves votes as a dupe when they don't have the rep to close: Community does the job for them (as it has mod powers)
@GonzaloMedina After a first dupe vote the OP will get the option to agree
 
@JosephWright yes
 
3:24 PM
@GonzaloMedina Probably @werner can point to a Meta post about this
@DavidCarlisle Talk to Will at TUG2015?
 
@JosephWright I see. Thanks.
 
@JosephWright plus Heiko's lua-loader stuff and other bits and pieces
 
@DavidCarlisle Try just loading graphicx :-)
@DavidCarlisle graphicx => graphics => pdftex.def => various clever things
 
@JosephWright I know:(
 
@DavidCarlisle Like I said earlier, I've been thinking about l3graphics
@DavidCarlisle I've very keen we pull the drivers back in-house, as I've already done for the box part in expl3
@DavidCarlisle Heiko's code is all very good, you know
@DavidCarlisle Heiko's code gets loaded so the pdfTeX primitives not present in LuaTeX can be emulated and things can work using \pdf@.... For an L3 version we can sort that
 
3:28 PM
@JosephWright yes but.... thousands of lines of defensive catcode regime checks on dozens of files for what is essentially an empty document, there must be a way to get this to be more maintainable so we can run sandboxed tests using otf fonts but not the entire contrib tex tree:
 
@DavidCarlisle Like I say, we'll need to talk to Will. I guess a split of the current fontspec code into a core part (perhaps as part of expl3) and an interface layer (providing the current workings)
@DavidCarlisle If you only want luaoftload (to extend the \font primitive) then its much more managable
 
@JosephWright true
 
 *File List*
ltluatex.sty
emu-luatexbase.sty
 article.cls    2014/09/29 v1.4h Standard LaTeX document class
  size10.clo    2014/09/29 v1.4h Standard LaTeX file (size option)
luaotfload.sty    2014/08/10 v2.5-4 OpenType layout system
 ***********
Actually, don't even need the .sty
\RequirePackage{ltluatex}
\RequirePackage{emu-luatexbase}

\documentclass{article}
\listfiles
\directlua{require("luaotfload-main")}

\begin{document}

\end{document}
@DavidCarlisle ^^^
 
@JosephWright yes the plaintest.tex file is similar. Thus confirming that it's all Will's fault with fontspec.
@JosephWright ah true. emu-luatexbase is almost all lua as well/
 
@DavidCarlisle Indeed: we can probably get luaoftload.sty adjusted a bit if we alter the kernel and actually remove any deps
@DavidCarlisle And not going to be long-lived
 
3:41 PM
@JosephWright I wish that were true of some of my other packages.
 
@DavidCarlisle What \listfiles doesn't show you is how many Lua files there are to luaotfload :-)
 
@JosephWright for files with a zzz.provides_module, we could fix that...
 
@DavidCarlisle Yes, occurs to me too
@DavidCarlisle Also will fit in nicely with my MD5 plan
 
s/MD5/evil/
 
@DavidCarlisle Probably we should fix that (easy enough I think)
@DavidCarlisle You don't even know what it is yet :-)
 
3:48 PM
@JosephWright just going by general character assessment?
 
@DavidCarlisle :-)
 
@JosephWright this question needs a "use the xor float position control file" answer....
2
Q: Float environment before or on the page of its first reference

ju.I know, it's an old topic and I already know about the general functionality of float environments in LaTeX. I want to give it as much freedom as possible and generally like the way of placing floats. But I have one restriction in writing my thesis: The figure or table must be placed before or o...

 
@DavidCarlisle Yes, I just need to convince you and Frank to actually get it production-ready
 
@JosephWright I don't think I've really looked at that code since M arrived and now got to go to his last ever primary school event. doesn't time fly....
 
@DavidCarlisle Certainly seems that way: my nephew is nearly three and it's not five minutes since I spent the whole night in a corridor waiting for my sister to give birth
@DavidCarlisle The code reflects that: I think we basically need to rewrite the code from scratch and keep the ideas
 
3:56 PM
@JosephWright seems usual L3 policy
 
@DavidCarlisle It does still work, but that's because I'm afraid if I break it badly we'll never get it working again
@DavidCarlisle By 'L3 policy' I guess you mean 'what Joseph has done'
 
back later...
 
@DavidCarlisle Ciao
 
@JosephWright Why not CRC32? :)
 
@PauloCereda And encrypting with ROT13
 
4:07 PM
@egreg :)
@egreg I am actually being serious on why the L3 tem opted MD5 instead of CRC32. :)
 
4:20 PM
@JosephWright is this a bug or is my expectation wrong:
\documentclass{article}
\usepackage{expl3}
\begin{document}

\ExplSyntaxOn
\keys_define:nn {foo} {
  bar / baz .code:n =
    \tl_show:N \l_keys_key_tl % expect `baz'
    \tl_show:N \l_keys_path_tl % expect `foo/bar/baz'
}
\keys_set:nn {foo} {bar/baz}
\ExplSyntaxOff

% I get:
% > \l_keys_key_tl=macro:
% ->bar/baz.
% <recently read> }

% l.11 \keys_set:nn {foo} {bar/baz}

% > \l_keys_path_tl=macro:
% ->foo/bar/baz.
% <recently read> }

% l.11 \keys_set:nn {foo} {bar/baz}

\end{document}
 
@clemens Isn't the key called bar/baz?
 
@egreg not according to the description in interface3: »The name of the key is the part of the path after the last /, and thus is not unique.«
 
Hi, I have a quick question. How can I change the font of the page number in table of content?
how can I make the numbers the same font?
Thanks!
 
@xslittlegrass There's tocloft.sty for that.
 
@egreg Is there a place can I find all the toggles for tocloft package?
I'm quick new to latex
 
@egreg OK, thanks! That's a ton of options! I will try to read it now to find the toggle for the number.
 
@xslittlegrass Don't be afraid to ask, but I think it's better if you learn how to browse manuals.
@clemens Hmm, that's strange.
 
@PauloCereda pdfTeX has \pdfmdfivesum, the same is easy-ish to set up in Lua so it is just a case of getting something into XeTeX
 
@JosephWright Ah cool, I was wondering why MD5 was chosen. :)
 
@clemens I'll take a look: I'm already working through a load of keys things for @UlrikeFischer this evening!
@egreg The key model is similar to pgfkeys so not really
@PauloCereda Thus far we've not opted for anything in that sense: I just have some ideas
@PauloCereda For the Unicode data extraction business I wanted something quick
 
4:41 PM
@egreg Yes, thanks for the encouragement. Most of the time I just google the question and copy the code. I tried many times to read the manuals and understand the code, but I guess I'm missing a general picture of latex, and the details of all kinds of packages are drowning. But I will keep trying.
 
@PauloCereda There is a slight issue due to line endings, but I hope we can solve that
 
@JosephWright That's what brought me to CRC32 too. :) arara 4.0 uses CRC32 in the database methods because it's probably the fastest and simplest algorithm available; I could also change it to MD5, but I decided to bite the bullet and leave things as they are. :) Both methods have collisions, but I think that, for my specific case, they are good enough. :)
 
@PauloCereda How easy would it be to set up in TeX macros?
 
@JosephWright Dunno, I will report later on. :)
@JosephWright: don't take my comment the wrong way please, I was just curious because I was looking for speed as well. :)
 
@PauloCereda In TeX, speed = primitive :-)
 
4:45 PM
@JosephWright ooooh <3
 
@clemens Problem identified: fix in the next L3 release, probably today or tomorrow
 
5:11 PM
@PauloCereda I guess I'll have to explain the plan soon
 
@JosephWright Is it evil? :)
 
@JosephWright cool, thanks :)
 
5:59 PM
@PauloCereda I hope not
@PauloCereda I'm thinking of extending \listfiles, essentially, to allow us to check that the files listed have not been edited or whatever
2
Q: Mac OS changes that affect lots of answers

Alan MunnThose us who are Mac users may be aware that the next version of OS X will change major aspects of the the way users can interact with the underlying Unix infrastructure of the OS. In particular, access to /usr/ will essentially be eliminated, even with admin privileges. As a result, starting fro...

 
@JosephWright oh interesting. :) Do you guys plan on discussing this offline or in some list?
 
@AlanMunn My feeling is we'll need to edit with two sections: before and after El Capitan
@PauloCereda At present, it's just me :-)
 
@JosephWright :)
@JosephWright Agreed.
 
@PauloCereda It's not actually that complex other than the question of how to deal with line endings
 
@JosephWright We could have two identical files, except for the line ending?
 
6:02 PM
@PauloCereda Yes, which for TeX doesn't matter but for an MD5 sum does (if you do it on a file basis)
 
@JosephWright Indeed.
 
@PauloCereda You can get around this by 'catching' the file first as tokens, as then the line ends are normalised
@PauloCereda BTW, Unicodeland slides finished
Have decided to mainly use live demo stuff, so I might address the capital-Eszett business and keep @Johannes_B happy
Next: 'Through the \parshape'
 
@JosephWright wooo
 
@PauloCereda Current live demo for case changing:
% !TeX program = LuaLaTeX
\RequirePackage{xparse}
\ExplSyntaxOn
\DeclareExpandableDocumentCommand \ExplUpperCase { s m }
  { \IfBooleanTF #1 \tl_upper_case:nn \tl_upper_case:n {#2} }
\DeclareExpandableDocumentCommand \ExplLowerCase { s m }
  { \IfBooleanTF #1 \tl_lower_case:nn \tl_lower_case:n {#2} }
\DeclareExpandableDocumentCommand \ExplMixedCase { s m }
  { \IfBooleanTF #1 \tl_mixed_case:nn \tl_mixed_case:n {#2} }
\DeclareExpandableDocumentCommand \ExplFoldCase { m }
  { \str_fold_case:n {#1} }
 
@JosephWright YES!
 
6:07 PM
@PauloCereda There's a lot of work hidden in that
@PauloCereda I'm keeping the graphic under embargo until the day :-)
 
@JosephWright :)
 
Hi how do I show a backquote in inline code markdown?
 
5
A: Formatting Sand-Box

WernerTypesetting backslashes, backticks and spaces:   \ \ \\ \  ` `` ` ``` `` `` ``` ` \` \`   Use HTML formatting mixed with markdown for spaces. 1. &nbsp; 2. \\ 3. `\` 4. `\\` 5. <code>\&nbsp;</code> 6. ` 7. `` 8. <code>`</code> 9. ``` `` 10. <code>``</code> 11. ``` ` 12. <code>\\`</code> 13. ...

 
@JosephWright Thanks. I was trying to find that question...
 
@AlanMunn Search sandbox on meta :-)
 
6:13 PM
@JosephWright Hmm, but <code></code> doesn't seem to work (at least not in the preview)
 
@AlanMunn Don't trust preview for this sort of thing
 
@JosephWright Ok.
 
@AlanMunn -- i've found that going into the edit window of the relevant answer almost always gives me the necessary information. (and blessings on the "cancel" button! sure wish one had a way to look at the actual input content of comments.)
 
@AlanMunn Look now :-)
 
@JosephWright Your fix didn't work, and my second attempt neither..
 
6:20 PM
@AlanMunn Looks right here now
@AlanMunn Try reloading
 
@JosephWright Ok. So the problem was that I didn't use <code> for the close quote example as well.
@JosephWright Thanks
 
@AlanMunn Yes: I think once you have one unpaired backtick in a par all other code has to use the long-winded markup too
 
I wanted to go to Darmstadt. I'd be packing my stuff today. :(
 
7:02 PM
@PauloCereda :-(
 
@JosephWright: ^^ :(
 
7:43 PM
@JosephWright @StefanKottwitz You are the moderators with more experience: latex-community.org/forum/…
 
7:55 PM
@Johannes_B Not keen on it
 
oooooooooh:
> TeXdoc.net is sponsored by DANTE e.V.: The German speaking TeX Users Group.
<3
 
@PauloCereda Yup
 
@JosephWright What do we sponsor? :)
 
@PauloCereda 'we'?
 
@JosephWright We the TeX.sx people. :)
I'm kidding. :)
I want to sponsor something. :)
 
8:01 PM
@PauloCereda Well TeX-sx is a member of TUG
 
@PauloCereda DANTE e.V. sponsors the server hosting costs since this year
 
@StefanKottwitz They are good people :-)
@StefanKottwitz Or perhaps 'we' are: I am in DANTE
 
@StefanKottwitz Cool. :) How to you like the suggestion: <code class="highlight">TeXdoc.net</code> is sponsored by...
@JosephWright boo. <3
 
@PauloCereda Earlier I asked on meta, if StackExchange would like to sponsor a bit TeXample.net or so, but no result
60
Q: Cooperation of TeX Stack Exchange and TeXample.net

Stefan KottwitzWhile thinking about promoting our site and attracting more users, I was looking for the hottest topic with highest possible impact. Looking at the tags with the most questions currently we see that tikz-pgf leads by far: tikz-pgf: 1447 questions fonts: 764 questions. mathmode: 733 questions ...

 
@JosephWright I want to be in DANTE, but they talk in German!
 
8:05 PM
@PauloCereda Ja
 
@StefanKottwitz Those corporate bastards. :)
@JosephWright in Portuguese (mind the accent!) means already. :)
 
@PauloCereda It's a commerce here after all :-)
 
@StefanKottwitz I am here for teh duckz. :)
I bought three ducks from UK!
 
@PauloCereda I'll ask my Brazilian student for pronunciation
 
@JosephWright The J letter sounds like gee. :)
The Google pronounciation is boring albeit correct. :)
@ChristianHupfer: it's so ironic that enhanced jigsaw makes my TeXworks preview displays the lines. :P
 
8:10 PM
@JosephWright Btw. since the move of www.tex.ac.uk my server slowed down :-o still investigating maybe the established domain is under enduring frequent outside spam bot load
 
@StefanKottwitz Eeek
@StefanKottwitz There has been a reasonable amount of spam e-mail: perhaps the old server was a bit 'open'
@StefanKottwitz Let me know if I need to ask UK-TUG for tangible support
 
@StefanKottwitz Don't forget to enhance the TeXdoc.net thingy please. I have serious code OCD. :P
 
@JosephWright If you would browse around golatex.de and latex-community.org/forum a bit, is the performance ok now? I did some things. (got valid complaints earlier)
 
@StefanKottwitz Looks OK
 
@PauloCereda I mention texdoc.net a 1000 times in my new book! It's handy to give links to the manual (always together with the local texdoc pkg hint) for detailed things
 
8:17 PM
@StefanKottwitz oooooooooooooh <3
 
@PauloCereda and there are big plans soon! (some involve you :-P )
 
@StefanKottwitz yay I am gonna go to Germany ooh!
 
@PauloCereda I tried to lure you here!
 
@StefanKottwitz I know. <3
 
@PauloCereda so I have to come to SP or Rio :-) good plan for the European winter
 
8:23 PM
@StefanKottwitz Then you will arrive in my summer. :)
 
@JosephWright thanks! I cannot evaluate with my slow home internet
 
@StefanKottwitz How is the book going?
 
@JosephWright It's hard, 2 chapters to do
@JosephWright One contains chemistry (Science chapter), the next one LaTeX 3 (Advanced LaTeX and other engines) :-o
 
@StefanKottwitz Cool
 
@JosephWright I'm still brooding about some LaTeX3 examples which are convincing, kind of great Ah! effect
to show there's a great thing ahead
 
8:30 PM
@PauloCereda TeXWorks is Apple based, isn't it?
 
like useful thing with regex or so
@ChristianHupfer No, TeXshop is
 
@ChristianHupfer No, it's an independent cross-platform TeX editor. :)
 
@PauloCereda: I am disappointed you're using such an editor. I thought you're constantly using this vile editor :-P
 
8:47 PM
@ChristianHupfer :)
 
cfr
8:58 PM
@GonzaloMedina Do you think this is a bug?
4
Q: Elementary forest question: meaning of calign, parent anchor and child anchor

cfrConsider the following example: \documentclass[tikz,border=5pt]{standalone} \usepackage{forest} \begin{document} \begin{forest} for tree={ draw, } [center,calign=center [first, parent anchor=west, calign=child edge [ABC, child anchor=west] ] ] \end{forest} \end{document...

 
@JosephWright Me neither.
 
New user in editing spree. :)
 
@egreg Tags needed?
 
@JosephWright Adding everywhere.
 
@egreg Saw that: not sure we need such a tag
 
9:00 PM
@JosephWright: Write to him: "Hör damit auf, überall "german" als Tag zu verwenden!" ;-)
 
@JosephWright Yes, my thought too. But at least can he be told about not flooding the main page with old questions?
 
@JodkaLemon Got a minute?
 
@egreg Well we need to separate all those questions from the Greek ones...
 
@PauloCereda: Das böse German ;-)
 
@egreg Is it wrong tagged? Or is the activity page maybe too sensible with small changes?
 
9:02 PM
@StefanKottwitz No wrong tagging, assuming we want that tag; just too many.
 
@egreg So not his or her fault, but a design thing
 
@StefanKottwitz Well the tag itself isn't necessarily bad, IMO, but at the same time, large scale tagging sprees aren't too helpful, especially when the tag itself isn't being added due to some major tagging issue raised on meta, for example.
 
@StefanKottwitz Yes.
 
@StefanKottwitz Yes, but it means a bit of care is needed with any editing
@StefanKottwitz Of course, you only find that out with experience :-)
 
@JosephWright Sure, I did not evaluate the specific thing. It's just, that even good small activities lead to "disaster" on activity page
true good maintaining activities have to be hidden by doing a few each day :-)
 
9:12 PM
Thinking about redefining (toggle by option) the figure and (table) environment in the appendix to not float. Good idea? opinions?
 
9:22 PM
@JosephWright Hey, yes, I just read your discussion. I am sorry. I just thought it might make sense to see whether the questions are language specific and tag them. Didn't know it would raise a problem.
 
@JodkaLemon Doesn't: just wanted to say that edits hit the front page so take it a few at a time :-)
 
Yes, I meant that. Didn't know it was a problem to tag in this amount.
 
Seen this error for the very first time in my life:
\GenericError {               }{LaTeX Error: Counter too large}{See the LaTeX
manual or LaTeX Companion for explanation.}{You've lost some text.  Try typing
 <return>  to proceed.\MessageBreak If that doesn't work, type  X <return>  to
quit.} Heading on Level\xspace 0 (chapter)
 
@Johannes_B More than 26 items in a second level enumerate?
@Johannes_B Or more than 26 sections numbered with letters?
 
@JosephWright actually I was thinking of earlier times, ldb, xparse et al went through several iterations...
 
9:33 PM
@DavidCarlisle :-)
@DavidCarlisle Have been doing L3 stuff all evening: if you want to do ltluatex changes feel free. Otherwise I'll take a look tomorrow.
 
@JosephWright might have a look, or might not, bit late to start now:-)
 
9:46 PM
@egreg That one :-) Needed listof-pages with multiple pages and placed it in the appendix: \foreach \x in {1,...,100} {\blinddocument\captionof{table}{caption \x}\captionof{figure}{caption \x}}
 
10:23 PM
@StefanKottwitz: Ack!
 
10:53 PM
@StefanKottwitz: I took the liberty of moving our sponsorship to the top page, changed the text a bit and added a lovely German flag. :)
 
11:17 PM
@ChristianHupfer Makes me think of how much I laughed when I first came across this url: german-hacker.de ?
 
11:35 PM
@ChristianHupfer Das böse Ente. :)
 

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