English Language Learners

Anonymous

9:00 PM

My brother, though, still does low-level stuff, even in 2015.

Damkerng T.

Ahh

Anonymous

There's still a market for those skills!

Anonymous

Maybe not for drawing lines on Hercules graphics, but . . . :-)

Anonymous

Like, for example, working on virtualization software

Damkerng T.

I daresay that most programmers today don't care much about the optimality.

Anonymous

9:00 PM

I think that's been true for a while.

Damkerng T.

@snailboat Hey, that's really, really cool!

Anonymous

That's what my brother does.

Anonymous

We talk about it sometimes, but there's a lot of stuff I don't really know about modern hardware

Anonymous

I think the set of people who can keep up with the low-level details on a lot of modern hardware is actually fairly small

Damkerng T.

I think the hardware in server farms will allow more possibilities.

Virtualization is very useful, in many ways.

Anonymous

9:05 PM

He works with all sorts of hardware

Anonymous

Like, boxes with terabytes of memory and hundreds of cores

Damkerng T.

Eww... That's ridiculously awesome!

Anonymous

I'm still amazed I have 8GB of memory in my own computer :-)

Damkerng T.

I still find 8GB DDR too expensive!

Oh, I remember that Clarke mentioned something about petabyte.

(Or it was Asimov. Now I'm not sure.)

I think it was about human brain's capacity.

Anonymous

Anonymous

9:15 PM

This probably wasn't actually very fun to type on, but it looks so neat! :-)

Anonymous

I've never seen one of those

Anonymous

I think that people growing up in the UK had them.

user116848

Good morning!

Damkerng T.

@snailboat Oh, you have that?! Cool!

It was something I could only see in books.

Morning @Farooq!

Anonymous

@DamkerngT. Noo, I just saw it on Wikipedia and thought it looked neat :-)

Damkerng T.

9:18 PM

> phonearena.com/news/…

Anonymous

I think they had them in the UK

Damkerng T.

One of our ELL questions pointed me to that article.

Anonymous

Damkerng T.

@snailboat Oh, it's new!?

Anonymous

This is what we had when I was little.

Damkerng T.

9:19 PM

That's what I wanted to have when I was young. :D

Anonymous

My brother doesn't ever get rid of anything, so he still has my family's C64.

Anonymous

We had this, too:

Anonymous

Damkerng T.

Oh, I can't remember where my first PC is.

Ah, that user image won't display!

Anonymous

@DamkerngT. I don't entirely understand the point of that sort of watch

Anonymous

9:20 PM

Oh, no!

Anonymous

They were a C64 and a C128.

Damkerng T.

A-ha!

Anonymous

I assume that for most people who wear watches, they're more of a fashion statement than something useful

Damkerng T.

@snailboat Me either! For me, a cool watch is a watch that works without battery. Just walk around, and it will work!

Anonymous

But keeping track of your heart rate while you exercise is neat.

Damkerng T.

9:21 PM

nods

Anonymous

I know watches can, in theory, be status symbols

Anonymous

But I never really understood that sort of thing.

user116848

I don't wear any :-)

Damkerng T.

@snailboat I used to wear one to show my status, too.

user116848

I don't like to show status :-)

Damkerng T.

9:25 PM

I know. I was young and foolish. :-)

user116848

Haha!

user116848

So sometimes asking time can be a good conversation starter too for some folks.

user116848

It looks weird though.

Damkerng T.

Oh, it didn't matter whether someone would ask the time or not. I could just move my hand around and people could see my wristwatch under my sleeve.

user116848

Oh man, I came at a time when other chats are inactive (ELU).

Damkerng T.

9:29 PM

Ahh

Anonymous

Carrying around anything unusual is a conversation starter.

Anonymous

Like, a musical instrument.

user116848

@DamkerngT. Oh yeah, that must feel good eh? :-)

user116848

@snailboat Funny :)

Damkerng T.

@Farooq Kind of. :-)

user116848

9:31 PM

@snailboat So do you carry your musical instrument sometimes?

Damkerng T.

Anonymous

@Farooq I have carried lots of instruments around over the years.

Damkerng T.

For the sake of my old memory, that's my good old watch. :-)

user116848

@snailboat You mean outside home?

Anonymous

Sure.

Damkerng T.

9:32 PM

@snailboat Oh, must be a good topic for conversation.

user116848

@DamkerngT. Nice watch dude.

Anonymous

That does look super fancy.

Damkerng T.

@Farooq Not the most expensive watch people used, but looked great enough when I was young.

user116848

@snailboat So why carry them outside home? To play in a park or something?

Damkerng T.

@snailboat Indeed!

What I really like it personally is that it runs on shaking!

user116848

9:33 PM

@DamkerngT. Yes, it looks fancy.

Anonymous

There's a million reasons you might take an instrument somewhere. And I don't have a car :-)

Anonymous

One of those reasons: to play music with other people!

Damkerng T.

@snailboat That's a really good reason!

user116848

Yeah, I don't drive as well. I see.

Damkerng T.

As for me, I used to carry lots of badminton rackets around in my big bag. :-)

Anonymous

9:34 PM

If you know you'll be waiting at a bus stop, you can take your cheapest guitar with you and practice scale fingerings and such

user116848

In public? Nice!

Anonymous

Sure.

Anonymous

It's not like playing guitar is something you need to be embarrassed about.

Damkerng T.

@snailboat Hah! Too bad I can't do that with my rackets. Or people would think I'm crazy!

Anonymous

@DamkerngT. Hee.

Anonymous

9:36 PM

Some drummers carry sticks with them everywhere.

Anonymous

Some drummers will treat practically any solid object as drums to hit :-)

Damkerng T.

Oh, that's cool. I always want to know how to play drums.

lol

user116848

@snailboat Yeah, I know. Like a tree bark etc. :-)

Anonymous

It's fun. And it's one of the few instruments you can play that'll work up a sweat

Anonymous

You learn to coordinate all four limbs!

user116848

9:39 PM

So, nice discussions going on today!

Damkerng T.

A real set of drums was hard to find for me, and the courses were quite expensive.

Anonymous

I always like talking about music :-)

user116848

I am into electronic music these days.

Damkerng T.

Anonymous

@DamkerngT. Drums can definitely be expensive. You can get a starter set to learn on for a few hundred, though.

Anonymous

9:41 PM

These days, electronic drums are a great option. You can practice without driving the people around you crazy :-)

Damkerng T.

So, the only kind of drum I only know how to play is that drum.

Anonymous

A-ha!

Damkerng T.

@snailboat Oh, but it would feel different, I guess. From sitting behind the real set!

Anonymous

I don't know how to play a klong yao

Damkerng T.

Oh, you know klong yao!

Anonymous

9:42 PM

@DamkerngT. They do feel kind of different

Damkerng T.

It's definitely unlike typical drums.

And we play it with our bare hands. No sticks.

Anonymous

Like conga drums!

Damkerng T.

Perhaps!

Anonymous

I like electronic music

Damkerng T.

I'm kinda a little excited, knowing that you know it's a klong yao. :D

Anonymous

9:45 PM

Hee

Anonymous

Do you have one?

Damkerng T.

@snailboat I like almost all kinds of music.

Anonymous

Me too.

Anonymous

I'll probably be doing some electronic music later this year for a soundtrack

Damkerng T.

@snailboat No, but I did a lot of volunteer summer camps, and that was what we would have in our camps.

user116848

9:46 PM

@snailboat Oh, nice. Can we hear it snail? :-)

Anonymous

@DamkerngT. Ohh, I see

Anonymous

I like all sorts of instruments.

Damkerng T.

looking forward to hearing the soundtrack. :-)

Anonymous

My Nord Lead 3 has been feeling neglected lately.

Damkerng T.

Nord Lead 3... looking it up...

Anonymous

9:48 PM

It's my favorite synthesizer. :-)

Damkerng T.

A-ha!

Anonymous

Damkerng T.

Wow! It's 5 stars on Amazon!

Cool!

Oh, it's expensive!

@snailboat What a cool instrument you have!

Anonymous

Of course, any instrument is all about the sound, but

Anonymous

If you look, one of the neatest things is the ring of LEDs around each knob

Anonymous

9:51 PM

See, on most synthesizers, you have a physical knob that points in a specific direction.

Anonymous

But if you load a patch from memory, then the knobs no longer reflect the current state of the machine.

Damkerng T.

Oh, these knobs are LEDs!

Anonymous

With this, since the direction of the knob is indicated with an LED,

Anonymous

When you load a patch, all of the knobs automatically change to point to the correct direction :-)

Damkerng T.

A-ha!

Cool!

Anonymous

9:52 PM

They do other neat things, too, like you can see both ends of a range at the same time on the knobs

Damkerng T.

Oh, that's impossible with physical knobs.

Anonymous

I like Nord's entire line.

Anonymous

If I were to replace my stage piano, I think I'd get a Nord Piano―but it's very expensive

Damkerng T.

They make pianos too?

Wow!

Anonymous

Their flagship keyboard is the Nord Stage 2

Anonymous

9:55 PM

Which is similar, but with multiple synthesizer modules incorporated

Damkerng T.

Stage 2, Lead 3. That sounds like a product line.

Anonymous

amazon.com/Nord-HA88-88-Key-Hammer-Digital/dp/B000AQHO62/…

Anonymous

See, it's expensive …

Damkerng T.

nords... Oops, nods

Anonymous

Hee

Anonymous

9:56 PM

But if I got that, I could probably sell my Nord Electro 2

Anonymous

So it wouldn't cost quite as much

Damkerng T.

@snailboat Oh, that piece is even more expensive!

Anonymous

It's their most expensive keyboard.

Anonymous

But it incorporates all sorts of stuff.

Anonymous

The organ section in it, as I understand it, is similar to the Nord Electro 2 that I have, but more advanced

Anonymous

9:58 PM

And my stage piano is now 20 years old

Anonymous

So it's tempting … :-)

Damkerng T.

Hehe!

Anonymous

It's covered with scratches.

Anonymous

And stickers.

user116848

So Amazon sells pianos now as well? I didn't know.

user116848

10:01 PM

And they are damn expensive!

Anonymous

Wow! They're up to Nord Electro 5 now. My Electro 2 is ancient! :-)

Anonymous

@Farooq Amazon sells everything, more or less.

Damkerng T.

Oh, they keep inventing!

Anonymous

I still like my Electro 2, though.

Anonymous

Nords are great, though.

Anonymous

10:02 PM

They're this really brilliant red color.

Anonymous

See how pretty this is? :-)

user116848

Pretty!

Damkerng T.

@snailboat It's stunning!

user116848

When I first started chatting here, I used to ask grammar questions and then immediately say "Okay, TTFN :-)" It looks weird I guess.

user116848

10:07 PM

Now I talk anything but grammar :-)

Damkerng T.

@Farooq Anything is fine. Grammar is fine, too. :-)

user116848

@DamkerngT. Hehe!

Anonymous

I'm usually happy to talk about any of my interests. I have several of those.

Anonymous

One of those is syntax! :-)

Damkerng T.

inspecting the Nord...

user116848

10:09 PM

Yeah, you guys know how to discuss grammar. I know that much :-)

Damkerng T.

@Farooq snailboats really knows; I just go intuitively. :D

user116848

Haha!

Anonymous

I just wing it.

Anonymous

"Hmm? Verbs? Let's see, I know something about those..."

Anonymous

But learners always seem to ask difficult questions.

Anonymous

10:11 PM

Sometimes people in here ask stuff, and I just don't answer because I have no clue!

Damkerng T.

We are keen to ask about marginal sentences. :-)

user116848

Yes I know. I asked many conditional questions here :-)

Anonymous

I'm always happy when people bring up a topic I actually do know something about :-)

Anonymous

The worst is when we start talking about modal auxiliaries.

Anonymous

I'm always happy to leave that stuff to other people.

Anonymous

10:12 PM

(I'm always happy because I'm always happy to do so many things!)

Damkerng T.

@snailboat That makes you a happy person. :-)

Anonymous

On the other hand, I'm always sad when I get a comment which indicates to me that the OP didn't understand my answer

user116848

I like to have many different interests as well. It keeps a person busy and happy.

Anonymous

I just got one of those.

user116848

Bummer!

user116848

10:16 PM

That's the main reason I avoid giving answers on the main site nowadays.

user116848

I hate bummer moments :-)

Damkerng T.

@snailboat Oh, no!

user116848

But the downside is that I have not many points here.

Anonymous

There's not really much downside to that.

Anonymous

Points don't buy you anything except downvotes and bounties.

Anonymous

10:19 PM

Well, you need a certain minimum to do things like comment.

user116848

@snailboat I second that. Woo hoo!

Damkerng T.

@snailboat And a misdirection that our answers are correct ones. :-)

Anonymous

But you have a lot more than you need to do that.

user116848

Yeah, I know.

Anonymous

@DamkerngT. Yeah, people probably do unfortunately consider high reputation a sign of authority

Damkerng T.

10:20 PM

That's the problem. (IMO)

Anonymous

But you can get a lot of reputation points simply by participating a lot

Anonymous

You don't have to write good answers

user116848

@snailboat Um...like?

Anonymous

@Farooq Are you asking me for examples of users with high reputation won from bad answers?

Anonymous

Because if so, I'd rather not name names.

user116848

10:23 PM

No, I mean how to gain points apart from making good answers?

Damkerng T.

@Farooq By answering a lot of questions.

user116848

Because even editing stuff only gets you so far as a 1000 points iirc.

user116848

@DamkerngT. Yeah, that's the only way I can think of.

user116848

So I'll start giving answers once I am though with my studies. But that will take years :-)

Anonymous

@Farooq By getting upvotes for bad answers.

Anonymous

10:26 PM

Bad answers tend to get less upvotes.

Anonymous

But you can make up for that by writing more of them.

user116848

@snailboat Ahh

Anonymous

Questions work too, but that's slower

Anonymous

Plus, people who get downvoted below 0 tend to get pity upvotes

Anonymous

Which works out to a net gain

Damkerng T.

10:28 PM

Oh, that, too!

Anonymous

So even if you end up averaging around a zero score on your answers, you can slowly build reputation

Anonymous

If an answer is +3 / -3, resulting in a score of 0, that person gets +24 reputation

Damkerng T.

And when things went south, you could delete your answers any time.

Anonymous

Even users whose output is bad enough to get them suspended tend to build up in reputation over time.

Damkerng T.

nods

Anonymous

10:30 PM

Since I'm a moderator on Japanese.SE, I have to make decisions about suspending people for consistently low quality contributions

Anonymous

And I notice these people rising in reputation even when their scores average zero (or less!)

Anonymous

So the way I see it, reputation is mainly a sign that you've participated in the site.

Damkerng T.

But learners wouldn't know that.

I've tried Japanese.SE for a bit, and it gave me an entirely different experience.

I mean, I read answers in a language I know about the language I don't know.

So I really have no idea which answer is the correct one.

And those answers are written in a language I know!

Imagine if those answers were written entirely in Japanese

I think I would be even more clueless!

So, naturally, I would tend to trust the answers from high rep. users.

Anonymous

It helps that there are native speakers and linguists who comment or downvote when things are wrong, but this behavior isn't entirely welcome—people don't want criticism

Anonymous

Japanese.SE isn't a perfect site

Anonymous

10:38 PM

I think it tends to have a more academic tone than 知恵袋 though, which I like

user116848

"Pearls of wisdom" huh? :-)

Damkerng T.

@snailboat I can't tell much but I can feel that its answers seem to be better than ELL's.

Anonymous

Literally it means "wisdom bag"

user116848

Bad Google translator, bad.

Anonymous

But it sounds funny if you put it that way in English... :-)

user116848

10:40 PM

heh

Anonymous

It's the name of Yahoo! Answers in Japan

Anonymous

Chiebukuro

Anonymous

I keep the sections there on English and Japanese questions bookmarked

Anonymous

m.chiebukuro.yahoo.co.jp/list/d2078297840

Anonymous

Lots of these questions would get closed on ELL...

Anonymous

10:44 PM

A lot of them are just straight-up zero effort translation requests

Anonymous

On the other hand, ELL has lots of bad questions.

Anonymous

0

Q: Usage Of "Fall"

I have a question about the usage of the verb "fall". According to this dictionary definition and example usages for "fall": 7a: to happen at a specified time ex: Christmas falls on a Friday this year. ex: The worst weather of the year fell during his vacation. The firs...

Anonymous

> Could the second usage example sentence in the dictionary be wrong?

Anonymous

Well...

StoneyB

11:28 PM

It's a pity you can't just write "No" in a comment

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