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00:00 - 07:0007:00 - 00:00

ssb
7:00 AM
my first thought was "written test"
 
Anonymous
Ohh
 
ああ、そうねえ
 
Anonymous
My study buddy wanted me to take the JLPT this year with them, but they decided not to take it until next year
 
Anonymous
So I'm probably not going to, because the only reason I was going to is because my friend wanted to make me :-)
 
英語でwritten test なのを、日本語ではよく『ライティング・テスト』という・・・
分詞が・・・
なので、『記述あるの?』を『ライティングあるの?』とか言ったりする
@snailboat 試験料いくらくらい?TOEFLとかIELTSって、一回25,000円くらいするよ
 
7:07 AM
まず「今日はどういう作業を(するんですか?)」「うわ、(作業をするのは)聞いてません(笑)」だと思ったけど、問題は「どういった」だ。
 
@DariusJahandarie どういう作業をするんですか、と、どういった作業をするんですか、は、おなじですね
 
あっ、本当ですか
「どういった」聞いたことない…
 
ssb
isn't the JLPT ~$60?
 
マークシートですか?
 
Anonymous
@Choko Oh, that's expensive! I guess since the JLPT only tests listening and reading it's cheaper.
 
7:09 AM
記述問題あるの?
 
Anonymous
Yes I looked it up and it said $60
 
ssb
but one of the problems with the JLPT is that it's only offered once per year in America and only in a few locations
so travel costs can be quite high for some people
 
Anonymous
I saw どういった earlier today
 
Anonymous
I'm playing a detective game on DS
 
Anonymous
It said 「こちらにかかってくるのは どういった 電話が多いんですか?」
 
Anonymous
7:11 AM
I made a note of it because I am more used to seeing どういう than どういった and I wanted to think about it later
 
Huh! And it's reasonably popular in BCCWJ. I wonder how I've never noticed this until now.
 
Anonymous
I think どういう is more common but どういった is also said
 
行かねば~
ノシ~~~
 
ssb
for some reason the phrase どういった状態 is popping up in my head
 
Anonymous
See you, @Choko!
 
ssb
7:13 AM
must be a sentence in anki
いのししー
 
バイバイ
 
Anonymous
When I see いのしし I think of 猪口才
 
Anonymous
Because when I go to write it I think "いのしし" hehe
 
Anonymous
(I know there's no real reason I need to know how to write 猪口才, but learning how to write things seems to help me remember them a lot better)
 
ssb
When I see user @Choko I think of 猪口
 
Anonymous
7:15 AM
Hehe, do you really :-)
 
ssb
now I do
 
Anonymous
Some 当て字 is pretty strange if you think about it
 
Anonymous
Like 素敵
 
ssb
that one confused me a lot
 
Anonymous
I was thinking about asking a question about どういう and どういった
 
Anonymous
7:18 AM
Right now I'm feeling kind of discouraged from using the site
 
Anonymous
So I'm probably not going to
 
ssb
why so discouraged?
 
Anonymous
Dealing with the troll got too stressful for me so I thought I'd take a little break
 
Anonymous
But then I showed back up anyway because I didn't want to leave things on the site that needed moderator-ing
 
ssb
You should be allowed to designate a moderator pro tempore
 
Anonymous
7:22 AM
There were lots of personal attacks in the trolling
 
Anonymous
Not just on me, but on other users too
 
Anonymous
It's sad to me to see someone with that kind of mental problem
 
ssb
it is sad. but at least it seems it's subsided
 
Anonymous
I deleted three troll questions earlier today
 
ssb
oh, there were even more?
 
Anonymous
7:27 AM
Well, they were at a minimum three very bad questions.
 
Anonymous
I think the user in question was capable of answering them for themselves
 
Anonymous
But wanted to ask them to waste everyone's time
 
ssb
Yeah, I just took a look at the recently deleted
 
Is that 4k rep+?
 
ssb
7:30 AM
I believe so
 
Anonymous
Where is that?
 
ssb
the recently deleted?
 
Anonymous
I know moderators can search for deleted:1 and sort by recent
 
I guess I should post an answer or something to get this last 30 rep lol
 
Anonymous
And there's a "recently self-deleted posts" page too
 
ssb
7:31 AM
Review > Tools > Recent Occurrences
 
Anonymous
I don't know if both of those are for moderators only
 
ssb
it shows recently deleted and undeleted
 
Anonymous
A-ha!
 
Oh, hah.
Man, some of the UI on SE is honestly awful...
 
Anonymous
So you can see the posts I recently undeleted, too :-)
 
Anonymous
7:32 AM
Yeah.
 
Those are tabs?!
 
ssb
@snailboat yes
@DariusJahandarie yes
 
Anonymous
Yesses all around!
 
ssb
yes!
 
Anonymous
The detective game I've been playing is 探偵神宮寺三郎 DS 赤い蝶
 
Anonymous
7:34 AM
I think it's what you call a visual novel, in that the game is 100% text and there doesn't appear to be any way to actually lose the game
 
ssb
I haven't heard of that one!
Ohh, OK
I've never been into the visual novel genre
 
Anonymous
Oh, I don't know much about it
 
Anonymous
I've always been under the impression that a lot of visual novels are kind of um, you know.
 
Anonymous
But this feels kind of like a detective novel
 
Anonymous
Played straight, not funny like 逆転裁判 or anything
 
ssb
7:35 AM
visual novels are all over the place as far as I know
I do love me some Phoenix Wright, though
and Professor Layton
 
Anonymous
This is a pretty good game for the amount of Japanese I know
 
Anonymous
It's challenging enough in terms of vocabulary that I keep learning new things, but not especially difficult or frustrating, so I can just keep playing it without my brain overloading :-)
 
Anonymous
@ssb Really, though, hallucinogenic gas? Please.
 
Anonymous
Layton is fun but it has the worst plot twists ;-)
 
Anonymous
I enjoyed 逆転裁判 and 逆転検事!
 
Anonymous
7:38 AM
Do those count as visual novels?
 
ssb
I just recently discovered there are Professor Layton novels in Japanese!
 
Anonymous
Neat!
 
ssb
I think since you can lose they're not really visual novels but I don't really know
 
Anonymous
I feel like I should reproduce the lists of counters from Downing's book (on counters) somewhere, since I don't actually own a copy of the book (but my library does)
 
Anonymous
And it's expensive
 
Anonymous
7:43 AM
She did a bunch of surveys to figure out which counters people really use or claim to use
 
Anonymous
And made several charts ranking them in terms of usefulness and such
 
ssb
oh, that would be interesting!
 
Anonymous
Then she came up with a list of 26 counters she calls the "core inventory"
 
Anonymous
and 47 she calls the "expanded inventory"
 
Anonymous
The core group she says is used by basically all speakers
 
Anonymous
7:44 AM
And the expanded group is the set of all counters used by the majority of the people she surveyed
 
ssb
I bet I could think of close to 26 common counters
But I'd be interested in that data
what is the book called?
 
Anonymous
Numeral Classifier Systems: The Case of Japanese (by Pamela Downing)
 
Anonymous
It talks about the syntax and semantics of counters, and gives frequency lists and so forth
 
Anonymous
And also talks about their historical development and changes
 
Anonymous
She gives a frequency list based on fiction, and another based on newspapers
 
Anonymous
7:47 AM
And then another list based on the # of survey respondents claiming to use them
 
Anonymous
基 is kind of a weird counter
 
Anonymous
I was looking at the entry yesterday in the counter dictionary on my 電子辞書
 
Anonymous
I learned it as a counter for elevators
 
ssb
I don't know if I've seen it used
 
Anonymous
I guess it's not especially common
 
Anonymous
7:51 AM
But more than half of the survey respondents said they use it
 
Anonymous
The same number who said they use 膳
 
Anonymous
It seems like there are about a zillion rare counters
 
Anonymous
I guess when you see someone else use counters like 門 or 基 it usually doesn't matter if you know them because it's usually obvious from context what they mean
 
Anonymous
And if you want to count cannons or elevators yourself you can probably get away with using a generic counter
 
Anonymous
When I was looking at the entry for 基, I had trouble figuring out what all of the things it's used to count had in common
 
Anonymous
7:59 AM
That's why I was saying it seemed weird, although I'm sure there's some logic to it
 
Anonymous
Downing says "large, stationary objects"
 
@snailboat @snailboat If you need time, by all means take it. SE isn't a job, even for moderators. But please don't feel discouraged by trolls. I think you're doing a fine job and are a fair to all. Except for trolls, I'd imagine most of the regular users here feel about the same. So cheer up!
2
 
Anonymous
Ah, thank you for the message :-)
 
8:20 AM
@snailboat the first time I saw "ヲ" in "Real life" was while watching "Baby Kangaroo's Birthday Surprise" last weekend. I recognised it easily enough, though.
 
@snailboat Pamela Downing?
 
Anonymous
8:41 AM
Yes, sorry, I'm on my phone so I can't edit the message to fix it right now (EDIT: fixed!)
 
Anonymous
My brain doesn't seem to be functioning particularly well tonight :-)
 
Anonymous
I don't think ヲ is especially common but I don't think I would ever suggest that it shouldn't be learned
 
Anonymous
I think I see it often enough
 
It is pretty common to be recognisable I think.
in fact even ヱ and co. are common enough (although officially unused) to be learned
 
Anonymous
Tae Kim's site used to leave it off the chart which troubled me, but he added it back at some point
 
Anonymous
8:46 AM
I don't know any particular site to recommend to beginners
 
many years ago I used to learn using learn-japanese.info which did not change from that time and it was quite useful for a total beginner
 
 
2 hours later…
10:25 AM
k... I'm a bit confused... why is this answer flagged? japanese.stackexchange.com/a/18485/29
Yes, it was written by a troll, yes it has an essentially irrelevent comic included... but it also seems to answer the (very very basic) question fairly concisely.
 
ssb
10:48 AM
Probably only because of the troll account
 
11:43 AM
@snailboat What does that sentence mean?
@snailboat I saw 膳 used as a counter for 箸 once, in a tabloid article about China's poisonous splittable chopsticks
 
 
1 hour later…
Tim
12:52 PM
@jkerian It might have been me, if so, then yes because of the troll a/c. (Basic or not both the Q&A look bogus: It looks like is a fairly straight forward question combined with an unusual word to stimulate unnecessary activity or confusion among well intending users(?). I would have flagged it because looked like troll activity.)
 
ssb
Usually the unusual words had sexual connotations with the troll
 
Tim
I can't remember but I do recall forming that impression
@ssb You may understand it better than me. There was some of that but there also seemed to be just a lot noise being made to distract earnest users, with a lot of suspect/sub standard Q&A from brand new or relatively new members.
 
ssb
Yeah, if this is the troll then it certainly seems he's getting lazier
 
Tim
My own thought as a user was (and still is) to just ignore them, deny them the attention they seek and help the Mods deal with the issue.
Which means we probably should not discuss here. but BTW
@snailboat
I quite agree with @Dono's sentiments earlier.
 
1:22 PM
@snailboat I don't know if the link works, but if it does, you can query the database like this: data.stackexchange.com/japanese/query/edit/221909
 
 
2 hours later…
Anonymous
3:07 PM
@3to5businessdays What part of it don't you understand?
 
10:10 PM
@Earthliŋ Wow, that's awesome.
Looks like both upvotes and downvotes have been increasing by quite a bit. data.stackexchange.com/japanese/query/edit/222184
 
Ayo @DariusJahandarie are you there?
 
Could you tell me if you here the 花 in the 花町 here?
It's a fast song, but even slowed down I can't here it.
It's like 5 seconds after the time I linked it to you.
@:58 or so.
 
Sure, give me a moment to find some headphones.
Honestly that is entirely incomprehensible for me
It does indeed sound like there are only two mora before 人 to me though.
 
10:31 PM
mora?
And yeah it's incomprehensible to me too, I was reading lyrics along with it and had it slowed to 50%. Hmph.
 
It sounds like マジ人 or something like that to me, not 花町人, but honestly, I'd ask a native speaker.
 
Anonymous
I don't hear /ha/ but I hear a pickup with at least an /a/ before /matihito/ (which is on the beat)
 
Anonymous
And it's following /n/ from abandon so it could be the second half of /hana/
 
And the last line ended with an ん...
Haha.
I'll keep listening for the pickup.
 
Anonymous
I can't make it out clearly
 
10:36 PM
I really just here …んまち… This is so infuriating.
 
Anonymous
@Anthony Well, I wasn't able to hear the lyrics as written
 
Oh. Well I mean Up to that point I've been able to believe them, parsing it at .5 speed.
 
Anonymous
The vocals are pretty heavily processed
 
Yeah.
 
10:53 PM
Assuming I didn't screw up anything, here's a graph of up/down votes over time: data.stackexchange.com/japanese/query/edit/222184#graph
 
Anonymous
It just gives me a one-column table that says "UpMod" "UpMod" "UpMod" ...
 
Anonymous
How do I make it generate a graph?
 
Ah, it's not changing the URL
One moment
 
Anonymous
Ah, that looks quite similar to the charts in the mod tools :-)
 
:P
I kind of wonder why they lock off those charts but then give everyone database access
 
Anonymous
10:57 PM
Nice huge recent downvote spike
 
Hmm, maybe I should plot # of answers in a month which have received at least one downvote
 
Anonymous
@DariusJahandarie The mysteries of Stack Exchange.
 
I guess I should normalize it by the number of total answers if I want to get an actual gauge on if negativity has increased
Too bad this doesn't just hook into ggplot
 
11:27 PM
Again assuming that I didn't make any mistakes, it seems there as been a slight increase lately, but not by too much,
So either we are slightly more negative, or the questions and answers are getting slightly worse.
Oddly it has become considerably less variable lately.
Hmm, I guess I should be filtering out deleted questions/answers, since it probably doesn't do that.
 
Anonymous
@DariusJahandarie It shouldn't include any deleted questions or answers
 
Anonymous
58
Q: Can some metadata about deleted posts be included in Data.SE?

RachelI like to use Data.SE to view usage stats for some of the sites, however deleted posts are not included on Data.SE and I think this skews the numbers quite a bit, particularly on sites with a lot of deletions. Would it be possible to include some limited data about deleted posts in Data.SE to ma...

 
Right you are.
 
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